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23 hours ago, Revelcro said:

Our little corner of SLI recovered way better than most from patch .23, in fact we probably ended up stronger since it forced us to work together on a single factory and logistic operations instead of everyone on separate projects.  From what we are hearing from new members who are coming from even some of the larger guilds though we were one of the lucky ones.  Or as one of our new members mentioned last night: "I didnt leave my guild, my guild left me" (members all quite).  This game has barely survived patch .23.  Imagine how many players NQ is going to lose with the power system nerf, then the mining nerf, then atmospheric warfare so nobody but BOO and EMPIRE can keep claimed tiles on pvp planets and they push everybody else to the safe planets.

 

Good luck NQ, you are going to friggin need it.

Interesting that they do PVP this way. You would think they would have almost a comfirmation system for PVP, unless you where on World/Server that was only PVP, like WOW. However to each their own. Let me ask this, is there a profession for building different wepaons and armor for say a more hand to hand combat system in this game? New player. 

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That's just the thing though.  I didn't support this game to become "game rich".  I joined to make friends, build, craft and work towards a common goal with my org mates.  But now this game is nothing

I should start off by saying, this is specifically for the devs & NQ. I'm not trolling anyone on the thread, nor demeaning anyone else.   I have tried defending most of the updates, even

Illusion of content.   Before many felt like they had nothing to do  - they had a factory that could produce everything and they just needed to sink in hours mining to throw in the ore to ge

6 hours ago, StarCrusher said:

Interesting that they do PVP this way. You would think they would have almost a comfirmation system for PVP, unless you where on World/Server that was only PVP, like WOW. However to each their own. Let me ask this, is there a profession for building different wepaons and armor for say a more hand to hand combat system in this game? New player. 

Short answer no. But there are talents that you can train to use weapons better as well as make them better when you create them. But that is only for the weapons that are already in game. 

 

I am sure others will answer this in more detail that's just the quickie version.

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On 12/13/2020 at 8:42 AM, Daphne Jones said:

To slow down progression. It remains to be seen whether it will do that or just run the remaining players out of the game.

Though in all fairness, running many players out of the game will indeed slow down progression, so from JC's perspective, he will have achieved his objective.

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Maybe they where surprised, like so many other companies on how fast or to what level users can take things.

 

EvE: there will only be 1 or 2 titans...

Hosting providers: you can have unlimited space ...

Retail: as much as you can carry...

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On 1/1/2021 at 6:12 AM, Kurosawa said:

Maybe they where surprised, like so many other companies on how fast or to what level users can take things.

 

EvE: there will only be 1 or 2 titans...

Hosting providers: you can have unlimited space ...

Retail: as much as you can carry...

The one thing I've never seen a game dev fail at is underestimating the players.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Its a shame I expected to fly around and check out players home constructs on every tile .But nothing , no finished buildings or many ships for that matter.

This game has missed the mark big time , Give the players a spaceship to fight in the stars with and a better block building system to at least pick up the player base.

I can't even finish small base now without a migraine. 

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21 minutes ago, ScorchEm said:

Its a shame I expected to fly around and check out players home constructs on every tile .But nothing , no finished buildings or many ships for that matter.

This game has missed the mark big time , Give the players a spaceship to fight in the stars with and a better block building system to at least pick up the player base.

I can't even finish small base now without a migraine. 

There are some amazing builds in the game, but they are quite spread out. You need to use the the surrogate VR network to find most of them.

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  • 3 weeks later...

i started beta two days ago and was absolutely loving this game until i found out i cant make ANYTHING with the medium factory gear i bought without first getting a schematic for EVERY recipe. I cant even make the same pure iron that i make in my pack. Grind should have a purpose... this is like buying a dishwasher and taking it home only to find out you need a schematic for every type of fork, glass and plate you have before you can use it.

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On 12/31/2020 at 9:37 PM, GraXXoR said:

Though in all fairness, running many players out of the game will indeed slow down progression, so from JC's perspective, he will have achieved his objective.

Charge minimum 3 months for beta... piss them off in the first week. less server load and steady income. good short term strategy ;)

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1 hour ago, Lanstorm said:

i started beta two days ago and was absolutely loving this game until i found out i cant make ANYTHING with the medium factory gear i bought without first getting a schematic for EVERY recipe. I cant even make the same pure iron that i make in my pack. Grind should have a purpose... this is like buying a dishwasher and taking it home only to find out you need a schematic for every type of fork, glass and plate you have before you can use it.

The moment when your nanoformer is more advanced than the machine that has a function like melter or refiner and doesn't work without a recipe.

No seriously, the machines should be able to do at least what your nanoformer can do.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 2/1/2021 at 7:56 AM, SirJohn85 said:

The moment when your nanoformer is more advanced than the machine that has a function like melter or refiner and doesn't work without a recipe.

No seriously, the machines should be able to do at least what your nanoformer can do.

agree. i' new to this game, and it's a big deception. they got a chance that i'm not an LUA programmer, cus i think i could make serverlagbomb just for being so frustrated. why in the hell can't we  have at least an XS smelter? now, after one week, i know that my money is wasted. going to unsuscribe right now, this schematic system is pure bullshit. i think market is a problem, but the real thing is, their server is shitty as hell, and can't support the load if everyone is building as they want. that's the real thing. you will not take more of my money . it was good until i discovered the price of the schematics.  we want a FUNCTIONAL AND FUN GAME, and you schematics system are really ruining all of this.  fi think, a license system to unlocking recipes must be better than buying every single schematics.

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Schematics are actually really nice.  They provided content and a reason to play the game again by stabilizing the markets, as well as a way to make money without mining.

 

Now, if you're a new player, sure.  Go mining.  You can make about 1mil/hour by digging in the ground, and in 1-2 hours you can setup your first refineries with basic schematics.  After a day or so you can start producing and selling something profitable - for example, let's say refiners.  Then each ore you can mine, you can shove into your factory, and sell the resulting refiners for 15% more than the ore would have cost alone.  The schematic setup is very cheap, and you can very quickly and easily start producing hundreds of refiners per day, and even buy ore from the market if you hate mining, and still make profit.  Obviously, you still have to pay attention to market demand, though, which is the second interesting part about schematics - 

 

Schematics also provide a very interesting investment/loss strategy, making it much more interesting to play on the markets.  Each schematic is an investment.  You must be able to sell enough of the product to break-even after buying that schematic, before that item goes out of demand on the market. For an AGG-S, it may take 60 days before it starts to break even, but then makes 2mil/day/industry constantly, pure profit.  For smaller, cheaper schematics, it takes far less time, of course - but you can also produce many many more of them, and flooding the market with hundreds may reduce the demand.  This makes it both extremely important, and interesting, to pick the correct item to produce for the market.

 

Now of course, when you first start, you won't be able to process all your ores, so you'll still be selling most of them.  But then, eventually, you save up some money.  You can finally buy all the required pieces to produce an AGG-S.  Congratulations, you never have to mine again.  You don't even need talents.  Because the schematic is so expensive, very few people are producing them.  Because of this, they sell at 90% profit margin.  You can buy the ores from the market, shove them into your industry, and passively make 2mil per day - on top of any ores you mine and sell to the markets.  After 60 days (a very long turnaround time due to its very large buy-in and very long processing time), you have paid for all of your schematics.

 

Or, if you prefer, maybe instead invest into L containers.  They're much cheaper to invest into, and you can make many more per day and will break-even sooner.  However, these only have a small 10-15% profit margin, and are only profitable if you have the talents to produce them.  You will have to sell these differently than the AGG, which would go straight to the market and be sold - L containers would require you to undercut, buy out others, or just settle for a very low profit margin, and you have to be careful not to oversaturate the market.  But it's a cheaper setup cost and less risk, for less profit.

 

And finally, the biggest and most important thing schematics did for us, was make sure that players actually buy from the market.  Previously it was nearly impossible to make money on the market; if you could even find a buyer, within a few days they'd have the industry setup and would produce it themselves instead, and prices were at all-time low margins for every item.  Schematics act as a gate to prevent new players from going straight to the biggest, best selling items, which in turn ensures that the biggest and best selling items, remain the best selling items because participating in that market is expensive to buy into.  

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I agree with you that the specialization and investment side of schematics adds interesting gameplay. I think the problem is that as one time barriers to entry they hurt the economy over the long term by limiting competition. Once the market can meet demand, prices will lower to the point where the recovery time on the cost of schematics becomes very long term. We already see this with many lower end tier 1 items where the demand is already saturated or they are priced so low it is not economically viable to sell them on the markets.

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  • 1 month later...
On 12/12/2020 at 8:42 PM, Kaajzr said:

Not trying to whine here or anything, only been playing for about 2 months or so and overall pretty into it, but let me see if i understand the whole schematic idea from the latest patch:

 

- basic reinforced frame L schematic  $810,000

- container L schematic  $4,320,000

- static core M schematic  $6,480,000

- dynamic core M schematic  $35,500,000

 

what exactly is the point of this besides turning people completely off the game?

Can confirm all it did is drive me away and I've been here since alpha... DU had something good going, such a shame. Peace out.

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Most of my org quit because of the schematics.  I quit after the "great schematics exploit" when nothing was done about it.  I used to LOVE industry, which is surprising.  I don't normally play with that kind of thing but I found I loved trying to build the most productive lines I could, seeing how many different projects I could keep running at once, and so on.  I would tweak for hours on my factory.  All that fun disappeared in a day by NQ disabling my entire factory and pricing schematics so only large orgs could afford a factory.  Meant I was now nothing more than than a miner who had to hustle ungodly amounts of ore - which is the most boring game-play ever.  Still a little salty about it.  😞

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Hello @Dhara

 

that's the same for me.

 

After a leave I am trying to get back into the game.

 

The largest change in mindset for me being that DU is featured as a multiplayer game.

 

I could understand that in this respect the single player experience is lacking.

 

It was fun to be able to do industry in a reasonable fashion as a solo player before introduction of schematics.

 

Even the price reduction was for me not the real deal - schematics are staying, whatever the price might be for them.

 

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On 3/25/2021 at 8:32 PM, realMod said:

Hello @Dhara

 

that's the same for me.

 

After a leave I am trying to get back into the game.

 

The largest change in mindset for me being that DU is featured as a multiplayer game.

 

I could understand that in this respect the single player experience is lacking.

 

It was fun to be able to do industry in a reasonable fashion as a solo player before introduction of schematics.

 

Even the price reduction was for me not the real deal - schematics are staying, whatever the price might be for them.

 

Yes solo players have it even worse, that's for sure.  That might be my only option if I come back though.  Almost my entire org quit the game bc of schematics.  Not sure if I'm up to starting over and building it back up from scratch though.  We'll see.  Just waiting and watching for now.

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19 hours ago, Dhara said:

Yes solo players have it even worse, that's for sure.  That might be my only option if I come back though.  Almost my entire org quit the game bc of schematics.  Not sure if I'm up to starting over and building it back up from scratch though.  We'll see.  Just waiting and watching for now.

Yep, its really stupid and unfair to punish solo players. I'm gonna just wait and see if they roll with this or they fix this mistake and then I might come back.

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Same here, But well CATS and Tranquility will continue even if we were down to only 1 person. Just because of the ideal behind it but the schematics almost killed off all players and the different rules for some players killed the rest.

Always feel free to crash around our toko at sanctuary 3. the only reason we did not move to an other planet was because the schematics debacle came right in the middle of our preparations.

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Schems, to be fair, only drammaticly accelerated collapse of whole thing.

 

If you imagine for a moment that 0.23 never happened, does it (honestly) makes game anymore fundamentaly fun? No. People just be getting exausted and quiting slower and with less bitterness. Because beyond stuff NQ stolen from us (by locking away with ransom) with 0.23, there is still no good content generating mechanics. Game is pretty sterile (in some aspects -- blatant tech demo) beyond building.

 

 

 

 

 

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14 hours ago, le_souriceau said:

If you imagine for a moment that 0.23 never happened, does it (honestly) makes game anymore fundamentaly fun? No. People just be getting exausted and quiting slower and with less bitterness. Because beyond stuff NQ stolen from us (by locking away with ransom) with 0.23, there is still no good content generating mechanics. Game is pretty sterile (in some aspects -- blatant tech demo) beyond building.

so I had a lot of fun with the state before 0.23. I would have had long-term motivation. Of course, there would still be missing content, but at least the confidence would not be gone. Now I'm always afraid that NQ will make the game mechanics more annoying and time-consuming, which often prevents me from investing time in DU because I don't know how persistent it is. 

 

But that is just my opinion. 

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On 3/28/2021 at 11:05 AM, le_souriceau said:

If you imagine for a moment that 0.23 never happened, does it (honestly) makes game anymore fundamentaly fun? No. People just be getting exausted and quiting slower and with less bitterness. Because beyond stuff NQ stolen from us (by locking away with ransom) with 0.23, there is still no good content generating mechanics. Game is pretty sterile (in some aspects -- blatant tech demo) beyond building.

Yea, i agree with this. I dipped pre 0.23.

I've said it elsewhere, but I couldn't find a reason to do something beyond aesthetics and the sake of just DUing it:

- No reason to be in space outside of travel/PvP

- No reason to PvP outside of blood lust - No real economic reason to do it, and you can't get to the places that would actually hold value (planetary PvP/stations in safe zone).

- No reason to build buildings since the structures can only mechanically serve as aesthetics

- No reason to build in space outside of having a space station for the sake of SPACE!!!

- No reason to focus on specialized industry when everyone/every org can be a generalist (even with schematics)

- No reason to participate in industry when the ore is more valuable than the finished products

- No reason to use rockets, especially when you can just strap 20L atmos engines with 10 L ailerons to lift pretty much anything.

- No reason to add cosmetic elements when they just add weight & add to the repair bill

- Not enough reasons to build different specialized built ships outside of "atmos only" & "space/atmos hybrid".

       - What about space only for efficiency? Moon minerals are outshined by planetary ones & PvP doesn't have a reason outside of blood lust, maybe asteroids will help.
       - Add ship specific tools dedicated to roles like salvaging ships?

       - A ship designed to help you out mining instead of being just linked to stationary container at the surface?

 

So many mechanics, so few reasons to play/interact with any of them.

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On 12/31/2020 at 2:19 AM, Revelcro said:

Our little corner of SLI recovered way better than most from patch .23, in fact we probably ended up stronger since it forced us to work together on a single factory and logistic operations instead of everyone on separate projects.  From what we are hearing from new members who are coming from even some of the larger guilds though we were one of the lucky ones.  Or as one of our new members mentioned last night: "I didnt leave my guild, my guild left me" (members all quite).  This game has barely survived patch .23.  Imagine how many players NQ is going to lose with the power system nerf, then the mining nerf, then atmospheric warfare so nobody but BOO and EMPIRE can keep claimed tiles on pvp planets and they push everybody else to the safe planets.

 

Good luck NQ, you are going to friggin need it.

How is SLI doing as of April 1st?

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