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DevBlog: The Maneuver Tool and Disconnecting Ships - DUscussion thread

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The Maneuver Tool is an important part of that toolbox. In its current state, however, it wasn’t working quite the way we planned. As we approach the launch of the 0.23 update, we wanted to talk about changes we’ll be making to the Maneuver Tool as well as changes to issues around what happens when you’re disconnected from the game (intentionally or not) when actively flying your ship.

Read the full article in the Announcements forum or on the News page. 

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So if I DC during landing and no player is nearby I log in again and may be able to get into the seat and land carefully.

If another player flies close to me as I DC, my craft is destroyed.

 

Not the best solution, or did I understand something wrong?

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I disconnected in space and panicked, yet when I logged back in my ship was stationary.    I had visions of it floating off into space while I was logging back in.

At the end of the day this is a game so the physics and reality are one thing, but playability and enjoyment is another.    How is the tool 'not' working and and how are you planning to change it?

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I think the question that needs to be addressed is what is the range, if its in the same core. Then it should be fine, if within 100m then that would be a very different story.

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RIP my ships, i get random disconnects/crashes way too often for this change to be implemented as it is.

Also, maneuvering tool and parenting are not bug free currently so the limit seems a bit much for the current state of the game.

Edited by Lexatris
tool edit

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Yet another subtlety long awaited change from my perspective. I do have to ask though, what is the distance at which another player needs to be at in proximity to the construct in order for its physics to reactivate?

 

I imagine someone being in a PVP related situation where they are leading the chase and log out which causes their ship to stop, but how close would the tailing player need to be in order for it to return to its previous trajectory? If this distance is too short, it could cause people following behind to crash into the ship before the server and client have a chance to update. Since physics based damage is applied to the construct moving faster, this would result in the person following to have their craft likely be destroyed so what should have been a net gain possibly now a net loss or break even at best.

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If I can't maneuver tool the voxel board that Yeeted itself 10km away back to my base, then what do I do? Fix game breaking bugs before nerfing the tools we would use to compensate for those bugs.

The Alt-F4 was used to compensate for flaky mechanics. Fix your game before nerfing the tools we use to make this game bearable to play.

 

And nearly nobody travels at sublight speeds anymore, EVERYONE warps. So this nerfing of Alt-F4 only hurts those trying to not have to repair their ships over and over because of game-breaking bugs. And combined with the fact that elements will have a fixed repair amount, you are going to have people ragequitting in droves...

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1) I pursue ship in PVP.

 

2) He logs off (instantly stops).

 

3) I slow down, turn around, approach it.

 

4) He logs back in and is flying at 30,000 km/h away from me while I have 0 speed.

 

ARE YOU NUTS ?

 

Does anyone thinks about those changes at all ?

 

Please make the ship at least stop if it was shot at in the last 10 minutes (shot, not targeted, targeting can be abused in the safe zone, shooting cannot)

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My concern is the interaction with AGG. AGG turns off if the person that started it goes away to far. Will that function now go to a nearby player? What happens if im solo, can i just not use AGG by itself now? Gonna have to build a  milliion landing platforms around planets?

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The disconnect idea would be good, if the game was optimized.

The fact is when you go to a populated area you get massive lag or what ever the case maybe.

 People use the disconnect option to save from this.

I believe that this should be implemented only after optimizations of the game take place.

 

As far as the movement tool is concerned , with the problem above mentioned, the movement tool in its current state helps 

elevate this problem.

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The 50m distance limit on the maneuver tool seems really arbitrary and I don't understand the point.  Not freezing if the player isn't touching the ground is good enough, it solves all the problems mentioned.  Why also impose these weird artifical limits that do nothing but cause problems? 

For example, we have an 'elevator' that uses vertical engines to go up/down from where it starts without a shaft.  We maneuver-tool this elevator throughout our base to reach tall things or build up high - it can only fly straight up.  We will now have to redesign this if we can't reliably move it around our tiles.  

 

Moving something long-distance with a maneuver tool isn't fast or desirable except in extreme cases when it's the only option, because it takes a very long time.  Why would you remove this option?

 

 

It now occurs to me people are apparently salty about not being able to alt+f4 to come to a stop anymore, so I guess it's just me worried about this.  But I'm good with the removed instant-stops.  Sure it'll take some fine-tuning to really get it to work, but for a vast majority of people, it solves a problem (having to accelerate back up to speed if you disconnect).  The only reason to complain about it is if you were abusing it (or are worried about PVP implications, not that PVP exists right now)

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- Unless the player was in contact with a planet ground or a static/space construct, a ship will no longer freeze in the air during the use of the Maneuver Tool. This will make it possible to lift it up to work under it, but no higher than that.

Maybe you should actually fix the AGG ships falling out of the sky before you introduce this change.  Some of us use this as a workaround to that particular bug, and this will make AGG more or less worthless. 

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The PVP scenario will need to be addressed before implementation. It’s more important than a bit of fuel saved from an instant stop. You have the ECU code. Can it not be made that the server dedicates resources for the time it takes for the construct to brake its self upon loss of player contact?

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after reading the topic, i agree with all the changes except one, the 50m range limitation.
I think this is too low and here why : the docking is not fixed.

If you are trying to dock a ship on another one but it's not working (doen't matter the reason, right or bug or anything) tthe docked ship is fixed but the other one not.

If you are on the floor, you ship will bounce till he moved out, no problem, but if like me you land your ship on a static core, the bigger ship will go threw the static core.

In my case, my M ship will go threw my static L platform, that means i will have to wait at least 10minutes to pull it back on the top on the platform as a L core is 128m long.

 

a 150m limitation could solve that problem and will not be too much in my mind.

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"disconnected from the game (intentionally or not) when actively flying your ship"

it is possible to have more information concerning this sentence it remains rather vague ?

what you need to know that your game is very unstable crashes occur at any time and for no reason in its own valid, the current advantage is that your ship stops immediately and does not move, which avoids a lot of destruction against the planet or other and to remove during the beta this option of stopping the ship you must guarantee that the players will no longer have crach and if this option is removed and that people will lose their ships at cause of unintentional crashes soon you will have no more players at all while the game is not even released.

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yeah, 50m is a bit small, at least until collision rendering is real time.
If a larger ship falls though another construct, we need more then that to extract the ship.
 

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I advise that you fix the optimization of your game before tinkering with the maneuver tool. There are too many floating bases with one or two voxels that people smash into, much less random voxels floating in the air that kill people near the mountains. Your restrictions, specifically the moving only 50 meters every 3 minutes is too restrictive to do anything near your mountians. 

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"Further, if you disconnect while another player is in range, the server already assigns the task of handling the physical properties of your ship to that nearby player. This means that your ship will continue to move in this situation. "

 

I hope this distance is 2SU (radar range)? Dishonest players will make a relog, you will have to brake, and when they return, they will again have a speed of 30K, you will not be able to catch up with them.

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Well i see lots of negative reactions to the impending changes !!! , 

However, i experience very few performance issues with lag or disconnects ( even around the markets & districts on Alioth ) so don't have any problems with the intended changes.

we never miss used the manoeuvre tool in the first place, so no grievance there, waiting 3 mins to move a construct a further 50m isn't the end of the world ( time management ) and in the case of docking ships, players should be using their piloting skills for 95% of the task anyway. 

I think the system of continued momentum from disconnect to connect is necessary for game emersion !! makes perfect sense to me, 
ALT+F4 is an abuse imo,  i understand for those who suffer performance issues the frustration this would cause though.

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to fix the other bugs like if ppl are constantly disconnecting things like this need to be addressed to see the extent of these other problems. i dont have a problem with these changes everyone should learn to fly with scrap in your nano :P

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May I make a suggestion for NQ up the chain. Take the suggestions CM’s are noting down from these feedback posts and authorise the CM’s to make a post, “following our community feed back here are the changes to the upcoming patch 0.23 and here is what we could not do because of x,y & Z. This will give us a feel good feeling that our input is having an impact on game direction.

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