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Demeter will probably Kill the game if it goes to live servers..


Hagbard
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Ok, usually i am not negative but the balance of Demeter on the PTS server has some severe problems.

 

1. Territory costs of 1m per week:
this will lead to almost nobody claiming any tiles any more outside of the sanc moon unless the territory can produce some serious income. so all "player made content" will disappear after some time

 

2. Scanning results do not get deleted and show l/h for mining units
this will lead to ALL really valuable tiles being claimed within the first 24h after demeter goes live, as it is really easy to identify  the most powerful tiles for mining units if you have containers full with scanner results.
so after day 1, the fun is over and the "mega tiles" will be claimed by those players/orgs that have all the existing scans.

 

NQ, as demeter is balanced on the PTS, it would kill the game if it goes to the live server

 

- New players some days later would not have a chance to find income opportunities despite missions.

- earning quanta will be a lot harder, so people would stop spending.. this would kill industrialists workflow.

- the imbalance between experienced players/orgs and new players would get worse and even more players would demand a wipe or simply not enjoy the game

please reconsider your decisions.

Hagbard.


 

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i'm ok with territory taxes... but would opt for incremental tax depending on the number of owned territories.
but the whole mining unit system has the problem that the tiles with the valuable l/h will be claimed in no time. so the workflow will be useless for all players joining in the future

 

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taxes for tiles are ok, but not as this level of costs. 

 

We earn quanta in the game to fund progress, not exclusively maintenance. 

 

The issue with the possible adjustments to the airbrakes is additionally a thorn in the side. It can take 80% of all spaceships out of the game in the short term. At this point, we definitely need more lead time to consider adjustments in the design.

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each major patch seems to be put together in a rush, nothing seems to be thought through, and everything thing is considered from the "end game" perspective where you have millions of quantas and you've done everything and need more troubles to stay interested.

The huge change to the industry simply sent off half of the player base out over night and they have no intent to come back. Constant screw up regarding pvp exploits and wrong decisions are pushing more people out. These new changes will simply put a nail in the coffin of a game that is in a really bad shape.

The tax on tile makes no sense whatsover. If you are a little artisan like me you do simple stuff for their beauty not for the pvp nor the greed of constantly selling. I make very little money in the game and I have 7m in my wallet. I own 4 tiles. I don't even own half of what my tiles will cost me per month. This is ridiculous.

 

The message in the video stating that tile tax numbers where not real and just place holders... That was straight up a lie.

The mining units will never cover the need one has to pay for all the taxes in the game. The mini game is completely borked. Each use of a charge is a waste of time.

 

Game designer should really stick their head out and stopped getting stubornely idiotic in their decision.

 

I agree 100% with Hagbard. This patch is the death of the game in its current state.

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10 minutes ago, Hagbard said:

this would still lead to all good mining tiles to be claimed in 24h

 

you say that like it would really happen. Tiles are pay once now and scanning was in but no one just claimed all the megga nodes! so it wouldn't happen now.

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7 minutes ago, eviltek2099 said:

you say that like it would really happen. Tiles are pay once now and scanning was in but no one just claimed all the megga nodes! so it wouldn't happen now.

because the scans are still good when it goes live...ppl have 1000's of scans and will find the best ones and start claiming immediately

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9 minutes ago, eviltek2099 said:

you say that like it would really happen. Tiles are pay once now and scanning was in but no one just claimed all the megga nodes! so it wouldn't happen now.

People claimed meganodes as they were found and then released the tiles once they were done. With so many players owning thousands of scans, that means that the juicy tiles will be found fairly quickly.

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30 minutes ago, Hagbard said:

this would still lead to all good mining tiles to be claimed in 24h

 

First off,  I also agree 1mil over week is pretty steep.   But the above statement , you have made a couple times and I'm curious: Can you breakdown some numbers for us?  I assume you have done the math on number of tiles versus the cost and the number of players, etc.   Would the solution be to level out the tiles so L/h is more equal between tiles?  What would the fix be to create a more sustainable system?  Re-fill the ore pool for unclaimed tiles every month?  Wipe all the scans we already have?  Curious to hear what you think.  Thanks. 

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2 minutes ago, FerroSC said:

First off,  I also agree 1mil over week is pretty steep.   But the above statement , you have made a couple times and I'm curious: Can you breakdown some numbers for us?  I assume you have done the math on number of tiles versus the cost and the number of players, etc.   Would the solution be to level out the tiles so L/h is more equal between tiles?  What would the fix be to create a more sustainable system?  Re-fill the ore pool for unclaimed tiles every month?  Wipe all the scans we already have?  Curious to hear what you think.  Thanks. 

i know players / orgs that have scanned full planets in this game.. and i do not know all players ;-)..
so if you have a lot of scans it is a matter of minutes to identify the one tile which is a hotspot .. so withing 24h for sure this will be done for all valuable tiles .
even if you would delete all existing scans and make players start to scan again.. it would be maybe a month before the same situation would be there..

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Given that the new system does not need to reseed the ground to reset the ore. NQ could always make it a feature of the land efficiency maps changing/resetting to new values every 3-6 months or so.  This will drastically lower the need for hefty safe zone territory taxes and give new and returning players an even chance to discover the rare territories later on in the game. ?‍♂️ 

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In my opinion every time you make substantial changes to the gameplay, some players will dislike it and some will like it. this is normal and expected..
the goal should be to create a gameplay to enable the game to grow.
i completely understand why ground mining has to go in order to lower operational costs.

we just need to find a way how this change will be beneficial for the majority of existing and new players.
when 0.23 was released, that was a needed change to the gemaply. but the majority of players felt like NQ took something away from them and thus stopped playing.
with Demeter it is essential to avoid to create a non working gameplay.
it has to be assured that the majority of existing players will find a new gameplay and that new players will have a fair chance of progression.

a possible solution would be to establish mechanics to stop dominance of individual orgs/players. so it has to be assured that no single instance can easily claim all the valuable tiles.
first delete all existing scans.
second make it harder to scan huge number of of tiles and remove the "patterns" that allow players to easily hunt down the most valuable tiles.

the other thing are the territory "taxes".. we need a mechanism that allows new players to claim territories to allow the content creation gameplay.
then we need a mechanism to stop the "dominance" of single orgs/players to easily claim a unreasonable high number of tiles ( just to claim mining tiles without actively mining them)

then we need income sources for new players to replace the previously underground mining. missions as they are today are not sufficient for this.

it is not huge changes that are required to make this work, but rushing out demeter as it is on the PTS would be fatal.
 

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13 minutes ago, Hagbard said:

the other thing are the territory "taxes".. we need a mechanism that allows new players to claim territories to allow the content creation gameplay.

Sanctuary territories are free, I have checked my scan there and it has about 600l/h of t1 ore for free. As for me that will allow content creation gameplay.

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21 minutes ago, AdmiralYolomoto said:

Sanctuary territories are free, I have checked my scan there and it has about 600l/h of t1 ore for free. As for me that will allow content creation gameplay.

so if you ar einterested in content creation you are not allowed in the big world? noted.

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maybe we could have a new Mining Territory Unit.. if you use that, you will be able to use mining units and the high tax is due for that tile.
but if you use a standard TCU, it will remove all ore pool values from the tile permanently ( or for e.g. 3 months) but it will only cost a one time fee similar to as it is today,

this would allow content creators to get tiles for their projects and only if you ever plan to mine on a territory you would use the other new MTCU. with the fine adjusted taxes / placment charges this would stop people from massivley claiming minable tiles and still allow creative gameplay

 

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