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DEMETER PTS PREVIEW - Discussion Thread


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23 minutes ago, Fyrestrider said:

You’ll have to travel to each planet to keep miners going. 

Another possibility: they concentrate on the ore from one planet and trade the surplus to finance the ores that are not found there.

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27 minutes ago, Lethys said:

And no, letting players decide who can join them in a safezone is not a good idea either. This needs to be done by NQ. 

There are two possibilities that I can think of at once:

- Factions from the start of the game in the character selection
- Faction selection in the game through quests that you have to unlock.

For me, it would be important that each faction has a safe zone of planets and moons as a place of retreat. This would make the basic and starting conditions the same for everyone.

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On 10/30/2021 at 7:05 PM, ReconDo17 said:

Were you high when you wrote this, "Needs to continue to have inflation" I need some of what this guy is smoking must be a democrat only people that love inflation and hate capitalism

 

Such a polite and intelligent reply. ?

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On 11/1/2021 at 3:04 AM, Tional said:

 

First, entertaining conclusions. Just because you're bad at it, doesn't mean it's the problem. Use the area tool, find the highest spot, pick it as your final spot, have a nice day. Or use the other tools to get closer and closer to the 100% spot. It isn't that hard, but it does take some practice and/or luck. You can try again 2 days later, and you should, because that's how you get to 100% calibration. Which is why it's worth it. It's also required to get more than 0% ore from the miner.

 

Fourth, you're clearly doing something wrong. Here's an example of doing it right (second calibration):

 

image.thumb.png.86e96c9714156bdc6eae6e86337129e0.png

 

 

Have fun testing again next weekend, maybe you'll have more luck.

 

I never said I was bad at it, I said it was was very poorly designed, boring and a kin to torture.  I actually nailed down 79% on my first try.

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So far I have mainly just played with the autominers. I'm not sure what it would look like with max talents as I didn't bother to respec, but the amount of ore extracted seems pretty measly compared to the territory tax. Is the adjacency buff even worth it?

I like the overall mechanics of the autominers.

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2 hours ago, Haunty said:

Is the adjacency buff even worth it?

It gives you %10 per hex, but each hex costs you more tax, so if you are just using it for the %10, then no it’s not worth it.

 

But the way ore is distributed is a heat map, which means got pockets of ore aren’t in isolation from each hex. So if you have a very good hex for a particular hex, there is a reasonable chance that the hex’s around them are reasonable. So therefore if you mine those as well, both hex’s get the bonus from each o her are are now worth it

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36 minutes ago, Tional said:

 

Please read the patch notes.

You mean this part. That says nothing about the skills that increase efficiency and output. The talents that give you increased surface node spawn.

  • Introduced exception for calibration charge maximum count and calibration charge cooldown talents; those talents are functional even in surrogate, allowing players to use them from VR.

PTS patch notes mean nothing regarding PTU till its released on PTU

 

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Just in case you are not aware. The changes to mining in Demeter would make a complete wipe next to impossible.

With underground ores removed, the only source for T3 ores are Advanced Mining Units and Asteroids. Both the Advanced Mining unit and the DSAT requires T3 ores to be made. 

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1 hour ago, Fyrestrider said:

You mean this part. That says nothing about the skills that increase efficiency and output. The talents that give you increased surface node spawn.

  • Introduced exception for calibration charge maximum count and calibration charge cooldown talents; those talents are functional even in surrogate, allowing players to use them from VR.

PTS patch notes mean nothing regarding PTU till its released on PTU

 

More than likely this is to let players keep their extra charges and better recharge time. It would be sad to enter VR with 10 charges and come out with 5. I agree that nothing in the notes suggest that you'll be able to calibrate through VR

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15 minutes ago, Torsten said:

More than likely this is to let players keep their extra charges and better recharge time. It would be sad to enter VR with 10 charges and come out with 5. I agree that nothing in the notes suggest that you'll be able to calibrate through VR

 

While I agree with your interpretation regarding losing 5 charges, I don't agree with the rest.

 

"allowing players to use them from VR" would suggest using the charges in question, which you could only do while calibrating a mining unit.

 

That said, definitely something to test when the PTS comes back online on Friday. I setup about 10 mining units, but since we all started with only one charge, that took a while, and I didn't have a chance to play around with VR.

 

I also deliberately failed to pay the taxes on a few of the territories, so they should go 'inactive' by Friday, giving another opportunity to test things.

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22 minutes ago, Tional said:

"allowing players to use them from VR" would suggest using the charges in question, which you could only do while calibrating a mining unit.

I believe that "them" refers to the talents in question, not the charges themselves. But I agree, it's going to be interesting to test

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I am hearing scuttle about a "Space Tax" if this is true then the question begs WHAT are all these taxes for why its a simple question that most have asked here. Is it to attempt to punish those that are wealthy, I can assure you that will not work it never does? Is it to in your NQ eyes help the economy, again I can assure you it will not. We need answers to our questions, we in fact demand these answers as the future of this game and your very jobs may very well depend on it.

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One thing that would have made this tax implementation go over a bit smoother is if this patch also introduced the Duties part of RDMS. At least in relation to territories. Meaning you could collect duties or sales tax from players that are not you or part of your org but have constructs on your territory. This on the surface sounds like just passing the buck but I see a big reason for the negativity against the new tax as is it punishes people for holding territory with any purpose other than mining. This would give non miners, solo players and small orgs the option to be on someone else's tile while paying a modest fee to the territory owner.

 

This also encourages/gives reason for players to group up, play together, create cities and communities. The flat tax without adding a function to make money from these types of projects hurts orgs and players creating community spaces for shops etc.  This is likely in the plans for the future but if that is the case NQ sharing this information would help the community see the logic behind your design and reduce the rage to seemingly haphazard implementation.

 

Another small way to make this less painful is add talents to org management that help mitigate territory taxes. This is a great example of giving people ways to play outside of mining, building or pvp. Many people come to this game for things outside of those three paths. Is DU still billed as civilization building MMO? 

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On 11/2/2021 at 9:20 PM, Fyrestrider said:
  • Introduced exception for calibration charge maximum count and calibration charge cooldown talents; those talents are functional even in surrogate, allowing players to use them from VR.

That sounds like NQ has now resorted to duct tape to keep the game somewhat functional .. 

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9 hours ago, Jake Arver said:

That sounds like NQ has now resorted to duct tape to keep the game somewhat functional .. 


Sounds pretty logical. Otherwise you run into the issue of your charges going from 10 -> 5 -> 10 when popping in and out of VR as well as the time to gain a new charge changing from 6 hrs -> 3.5 hrs -> 6 hrs.
 

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On 10/30/2021 at 3:08 PM, Tional said:

 

Can I have your stuff? Oh, right, I can. I just have to wait for the taxes to eat your hexes.

Enjoy my stuff... you and the other 8 players left should have a wonderful time with it for the time the game has left.  Too few players don't pay the bills at NQ.  This game was on borrowed time as it was.

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NQ: All other items in the game permit 'bootstrapping' from a clean start. With the addition of the Demeter update and based on the resources required to build each tier miner, can you describe the progression from a clean start to being able to extract exotic ore? Are you adding a new mechanic to allow collection of higher tier ore? Since asteroid trackers also require tier 3 ore, and it cannot be collected after Demeter without either prior access to tier 3 ore to build either an asteroid tracker or advanced miners to collect or and then build more miners or asteroid trackers, does this mean you have permanently decided not to ever do a server reset? 

 

If this limitation on 'bootstrapping' from a clean start was not intended, will you be reconsidering the miner recipes, possibly allowing each miner tier to be build from the next lower tier resources, kind of like ALL THE OTHER INDUSTRY UNITS IN THE GAME.

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2 hours ago, Briggenti said:

Why are tile taxes still set to $1 million per week? Was there not enough angry feedback on this to warrant a change? Is it still "just a number and will change before release"? Seeing it twice makes me worry it will be the final number.

His body language when asked the question from my experience says this is getting put out just like this. Or they would have made the adjustment for this weekend to quench the flames.

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NQ: We want your feedback!

Players:  Ore yields are too low, taxes too high. Here are several different ways to make this update viable. 

NQ: PTS Open again! With no changes to anything players were worried about not being changed.

I mean, I have to give credit where credit is due, they are freaking experts at just ignoring feedback and pushing things anyways. 

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I think we should not be able tu run callibration on Mining unit that can't dig. Otherway it may lead to use callibration charge for nothing.

 

For example. You run callibration on unit then pres start and gam tells you that unit is a bit too deep in the ground and ypou have to move it. You move it and you lose callibration (I guess)

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15 hours ago, Xarius said:

I mean, I have to give credit where credit is due, they are freaking experts at just ignoring feedback and pushing things anyways. 

This is just NQ standard procedure.

 

The only time they listen is when players start actually leaving, and then they act all surprised and are like "we are listening and are going to fix this shortly".

Followed a couple of months later by some quick-fix that always is something completely different from community suggestions, and brings lot's of unplanned collateral damage to the game. And the players that left are still gone, so the damage is done..

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It looks like claiming a new territory costs a flat 140k and it gives you 3 days tax free. It would cost you 2x+ more in calibrate charges but could be used if ore prices crash and cannot maintain 1m a week.

 

I noticed Sinnen now has limestone instead of malachite- not sure if there are any other changes.

 

I think airbrake clearance zone should be a few tiles outside of the visble area of the element so we can continue to completely cover them but would still need to be near the outside and not stacked. The requirement of having them be on the outside ruins the look of many ships and makes all ships look the same.

 

I would like the idea of making a new territory unit item. Keep current Territory units the same- scaling claiming cost and no taxes- but lock mining to those tiles. The new territory unit would cost the flat fee and allow mining but needs taxes.

 

 

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