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Please NQ - Clean Up the Markets!


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@NQ The markets are turning into an abyss that worsens noticeably each week. Your goal was to create an economy driven by players that was centered on the markets, however the physical markets themselves are an abomination and are causing great frustration for players, both the customers at the markets as well as the industry players.

 

The number of constructs at the markets far exceeds the number of players at the markets. Some simple advertising would be one thing, but we now have a maze to navigate to even get to the elevator. There are hundreds of containers, massive ships, scam dispensers, disco lights, huge gas stations, etc. at most markets and especially the Alioth district markets.

 

The district markets in particular are a big problem. There is insufficient parking at these markets. Ships are scattered in the trees around the markets. As you attempt to take off, new ships are attempting to land, creating dangerous situations. I know many players resort to parking at the maximum container link range to avoid this risk of collision altogether. Parking on the pad, with even the smallest ship, is almost impossible due to all of the permanent detritus that liters the "landing pad". 

 

Possible Solutions

This situation is quite frustrating, but I did not come to only vent and not give some possible solutions. 

 

First, there needs to be some limitations on the length of time that a dynamic construct can be left at the market. Also, please limit the lua script that is allowed to run on my PC from a dynamic construct that is left at the market by another player. There are far too many of these constructs at the market and it creates a great deal of lag. At least allow for an option to toggle this.

 

Secondly, this entire idea of mosh pit of flesh and metal is silly in the first place. An advanced civilization on a huge mesoplanet wants to trade potentially gigantic items on the market and our best solution is that we all go to the same location, roughly the size of a pharmacy, with a parking lot the size of a grocery store? And that is to service the entire planet? 

 

The real life planet we live on uses distribution centers to distribute the load of something like this. There is already a great deal of land set aside for Aphelia. Please consider adding more parking and additional market stations in this space to spread out the load for the district markets. Consider doing the same for the other markets while there are still empty hexes available. What possible benefit is there to force all this traffic into the same physical location? Our own real life society is already leaving brick and mortar shopping behind and Noveans have decided that not only do they love it so so much, but they all want to smash into only one store on the planet?

 

Thank You

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Supposedly NQ is going to come up with something, the community discussed it numerous times, including the towers of last minute rendered doom. No idea when the solution will drop.

 

The solution was discussed about making these salvageable after a time. No idea if NQ is going with this or not .

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What if they covered the entire hex with a single landing pad, made a 3 hex purple buffer around each market and made a no fly “burn zone” a 100m or so around the central building with “elevator” pads dotted around the hex to zoom players closer to the central building instead of having them walk?

 

that would solve short term cloggage. Then just add a dash of “core unlocks after a month parked on a purple hex”

 

 

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We could try Planetary markets and each market is just an access point. Would remove the need to congregate over 1 set market? At least for now, and let player markets be strictly local since the owners would be policing their property.

 

2nd idea would be to make markets accessable at a set distance as well. Get close enough the "Remote Market" button lights up to nearest market.

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3 hours ago, GraXXoR said:

What if they covered the entire hex with a single landing pad, made a 3 hex purple buffer around each market and made a no fly “burn zone” a 100m or so around the central building with “elevator” pads dotted around the hex to zoom players closer to the central building instead of having them walk?

 

that would solve short term cloggage. Then just add a dash of “core unlocks after a month parked on a purple hex”

 

 

Simplier solution. Allow us players to make markets and market hubs, and allow us to set a timer with a minimum duration of say 24 hours to salvage anything left on our pads without permission. Then if people clutter up our shops we can grab the mess toss the constructs in a scrapyard and take care of it oursleves.

 

Problem solves itself at that point. I know i and many other players would MASSIVLY prefer to land at a player owned market or start our own over dealing with the amd with all due respect to NQ moronic pile of bullshit mess we have now. And its fewer resources and less time to impliment.

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Its an MMO.  I like seeing lots of players at market.  I also like to see ships coming and going.  The only issue is all the stuff people leave there long term.

Lots of good suggestions around.  Ships left for more than 7 days could be impounded at some specific location (one of the planets poles).  A fee is payable to retrieve the ship.

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If the player leaves the tile while still having a ship on it, or if the ship is on the tile for more than 30m, just despawn it and give the user a magic blueprint for it which can only be used on that specific tile (to avoid abuse). That way any normal everyday issues are no problem (like internet issues etc) because you can get your ship back free and easy, but there are no permanent ships anymore. Sooner or later NQ should implement some good way for people to make advertisements in a controlled way.

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With the coming nerf of linked containers the problems on markets will aggregate as we will see more container parks be placed closer to the market terminals and players will generally want/need to park closer as well because of the range limitation. One of those consequences of NQ's desire to slow down mining and having come up with the idea that the container range is the reason why we mine so fast and so it needs to be nerfed.

 

I am pretty sure NQ has not even considered this consequence yet..

 

Here's a post I made end of October after the  rather disruptive yanking apart of districts and markets.

 

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indeed, but thats not part of the issue here, its a whole different problem as in godmode you will never discover issues that mortals have, like mining 90% of the day.

 

Full markets is indeed an issue but the solution is not that easy unless NQ breaks their own rulings as in stuff will never get deleted aslong as the owner is active. and since we have no way yet to measure activity as most packs are sold not per month but in larger packs probably everyone is still within payed service.

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The idea of making parking areas very far from the terminals you buy from would be ideal. A teleportation system will bring your avatar to the terminal and then you will indicate in which parking tiles to place the purchased resources, so that you can easily return to the parking lot and through another terminal unload the parking containers in that of your ship.

If the parking areas were, for example, one every two tiles along the perimeter of the Ark zone, the traffic would already be greatly diluted, all the various markets could also be eliminated by centralizing everything in a single central HUB. This way there could also be many more avatars concentrated in one spot, such as a large market square, which would be visually impressive.
It is definitely neater than the hallucinating chaos it is now: 30 seconds freeze - 1 frame - 30 seconds freeze - 1 frame - 30 seconds ... absurd

PS: obviously any dynamic construct that is parked inside the Ark Zone must return outside the perimeter within X time or it will be compacted / eliminated / teleported / something!

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The simple solution is to have a parking fee on the market pad, with something like 1h for free every 24h and increasing overtime cost to prevent long time parking.

 

And to give people a place to show off/advertise make an large expo pad that is close'ish to each district market with free or cheep parking.

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19 hours ago, blazemonger said:

NQ has no idea how to solve this and has not acknowledged any of the many, many suggestions and ideas posted here and on discord over the past years about this.

They tried the usual 'quick fix' approach with the teleporting to a parking zone thing. But as usual they had not really thought it trough and implemented it in a way so that it caused more problems and confusion then it solved, and was forced to remove it again.

And this is not just some nice to have feature. But as we said (years ago) something needed for the game to solve all kinds of potential problems with unwanted parking and ad spam in territories, bases, space stations and player driven markets (in the future) etc.

 

Case in point. I have a hex close to district 6, and after 0.23 I now have several crashed and abandoned (not the core) constructs from other players littered around on my land. And with the move tool nuked, I am no longer able to remove them from my hex in any sensible way.. And as a result I have been forced to use scrap on other peoples constructs just to kill the annoying smoke generators lagging my game. I have considered making some big holes and cover them in dirt just to be a d**k. But so far I have resisted the urge.

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Almost seems like people are dumping stuff there in some kind of protest.

 

Just now I landed at market, got fatal network error trying to load all the stuff. Then it took over an hour to reload the game successfully. To top that off when I got in my ship every single element exploded at once because of some unseen junk I had inside my ship without knowing. A million bucks to repair everything and another hour. The warp drive is especially a pain in the arse. Quite an eventful trip to market.

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The amount of junk is getting insane. Some groups have animated screen set up at pretty much all markets of placed XS core constructs which are empty except for some screens and a VR station. Mountains of containers everywhere, resurrection pads spawned in the missed of the ramp up to the platform.

 

Yet NQ stay quiet as usual and seems to ignore any of the posts about this as they always have. Them separating the market from the districts has had zero effect as they  were advised it would be when they announced they would.

 

 

The easy solution here is to put the market back on the district and either remove the now barren institute area or put those back as well as removing those also has not made any difference.

 

Then just despawn any player construct on the tile the district is on which has not moved for 24 hours and have a "impound" lot in a central location where player s can reclaim a special blueprint of the construct for a fee after another 24 hours.

 

Then set up several XL screen on the districts and set up a service for orgs/players to run adverts on them by submitting these to NQ who will manage this.

 

 

There is better and fancier solutions to also include player stalls but it seems NQ has no plans to consider those for the market areas..

 

 

Also NQ, where are the player owned market terminals on the roadmap currently? In the talk since beta start you have not said a word on this.. 

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6 hours ago, blazemonger said:

The easy solution here is to put the market back on the district and either remove the now barren institute area or put those back as well as removing those also has not made any difference.

 

Then just despawn any player construct on the tile the district is on which has not moved for 24 hours and have a "impound" lot in a central location where player s can reclaim a special blueprint of the construct for a fee after another 24 hours.

Yeah. The Institute + market + transporter ring on Alioth made sense as a central point of commerce in the Universe. And was a natural place to drop beginners and ease them into the game with easy access too the entire district market ring. The current state with a market pad of to the side somewhere, and transporters that serve almost no purpose any more. Not so much..

 

And I agree. Despawning inactive constructs would by far be the easiest and quickest "somewhat ok solution" for NQ to implement. And it would not even require a separate impound location to retrieve the blueprints, since they could just have a dispenser on the pad that would return impounded blueprints back to players (with or without a fee).

And to forestall a certain quick fix that would be tempting for NQ to use. They will need to implement a impound dispenser for this solution. Since the quick fix hack of just moving blueprints straight into player inventories, would be used as an exploit to move resources from the markets for free.

 

 

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A simple fee per 24 hour period would also work. If you don't want your quanta slowly drained go move your junk. If you have no quanta left? instant salvage for any other player who wants it.

That way active players leaving advertising constructs are paying for the privilege but are still able to do so. Inactive or uncaring players lose their construct when they run out of means to pay the fee.

 

Sounds harsh, but it is a market, not a parking lot or an exhibition zone.

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19 minutes ago, CptLoRes said:

They will need to implement a impound dispenser for this solution. Since the quick fix hack of just moving blueprints straight into player inventories, would be used as an exploit to move resources from the markets for free.

 

Which is also why I'd like to see an "impound" at a separate location.. you want your stuff back? you will have pay for it and go get it..

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the gameplay was supposed to be 'emergent' from the getgo..  if these botmarkets disappeared and usermade pods took over tomorrow , eventually things will sort themselves out over a fairly short period of time, maybe a few months at most, but as long as nq forcefully  manipulates both the locations and the prices of goods no viable userbased trade on a large scale can or will exist imo.. 

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12 minutes ago, Bollox said:

the gameplay was supposed to be 'emergent' from the getgo..  if these botmarkets disappeared and usermade pods took over tomorrow 

Problem is, NQ is not even close to getting market pods ready for player use. They need to still kludge and hack them with local data handling transactions to make this work (see the M15 debacle) and so it will be a while..

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