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SHEDDING LIGHT ON A NOVAQUARK INTERNAL DISCUSSION - discussion thread


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3 hours ago, AbnRanger375 said:

I've been playing daily since the days of NQs NDAs.  Yeah, I have some talent points too but they've been zeroed a few times already.  Please, everyone, stop crying because you're too lazy to "rebuild again".  If you've been around long enough you'd already know it isn't THAT big of a deal.

 

FULL WIPE!!!!!

Talent Points (16Apr22).png

You personal opinion cannot be compared to players putting time, effort and money into the game based on promises made from NQ.

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25 minutes ago, Niemand said:

a "persistent" game that has not been released yet you dumb pos. doesnt matter what a dev said 2 or 3 years ago, you are the idiot for building your entire existence on a few words in this alpha/beta stage game

 ah, you're getting personal and insulting - not a very adult behaviour, kiddy.

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5 minutes ago, CptLoRes said:

You personal opinion cannot be compared to players putting time, effort and money into the game based on promises made from NQ.

 

Promises that isn't bound to anything but the honor of the one who pronounce it...

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3 hours ago, Zarcata said:

The professional players will regain their wealth and opportunities very quickly because they have knowledge and experience and can prepare very well. So it means there is no fair equality in a wipe, because every minute, every hour and every day the gap becomes very big again between the regular player and the new player. So it's just a matter of time until new players are in the same situation as they are now.

That's a good point the WIPE and the so called instant equality will last for about two weeks. After that we are back to the races where the RICH get RICHER the poor stay poor. This game is just like real life its not WHAT you know its WHO you know.

 

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I don't think a full wipe will really help new players anyway. I've been playing for about a month and a half and I'm not really finding I have a lack of money. You can comfortably make 50 million doing the safe zone missions within 2 or 3 weeks, even more if you go for the riskier mission chains.

 

If you full wipe, the experience existing players have will still allow them to get up to speed faster, find all the tier 4/5 ore faster and it will just return to the same state. The only real issues are the Talent points, which can be fixed with catch up mechanics and the permanent mining control.

 

The catch up mechanic for talent points could be something like a multiplier letting new players earn talent points much faster depending on their total talent points compared to the total possible talent points they could have had if they started at the very beginning. The multiplier can decrease as they get closer to the theoretical max so the longer term players still have a slight edge at the top end, taking more time to close the gap fully with a reducing catch up multiplier.

 

For mining, a few ideas could be to have quarterly reseeding of the planets mining hotspots, or perhaps have tier 4/5 ore in a tile gradually deplete when mined and once it is fully depleted, the ore can respawn in a new undiscovered tile, the latter idea being more subtle and evolving instead of a mad scanning dash.  This would prevent permanent holds on higher tier ores and allow newer players to have a chance of finding some.

 

If you were to do a partial reset you could avoid people hoarding resources by just deleting everything in all cargo containers too. But really, any sort of wipe or partial wipe isn't going to work. You need to put in place mechanics to prevent any permanent advantage. Mining locations are a permanent advantage, Talent points are a permanent advantage, sort those out and you don't need a wipe.

Edited by Remagz
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Personally, I'd prefer not to have a full wipe as I like many others have spent a lot of time creating stuff. However, I was never under any illusion that what I created would be around forever. I can get the people who have probably put far more time and money into their game would feel even more of a sting if a full wipe happened. Its tantamount to NQ running up and kicking over your sand castle.

If there was a full wipe, I'd be unhappy with it but also relish the challenge of starting over again and maybe doing things differently and with my experience that can't be taken away, create something better than I had before. For me I enjoyed my time up to this point to get where I am in the game and surely that is what counts in the grand scheme of DU? You play the game to enjoy yourself. If its just about the end goal of having lots of stuff to dominate the players that don't have lots of stuff then that doesn't make a great deal of sense to me especially as nothing is ever guaranteed in an online only persistent world game. Any game you play that is online in nature can and will go under at any time and it won't matter how many hours or euros you dumped into it. It will be gone and all that will be left is you remembering the good (or the bad) times you had in the game. 

 

I paid my money to spend time playing the game and enjoying the journey. If that journey ended tomorrow and NQ closed its doors I'd still feel like I got my moneys worth and my time was well spent in a game I enjoyed.

If I did have to choose a correct course of action moving forward for NQ. As they have already implemented decay into the world to tackle old constructs and tiles clogging up the planets. Perhaps on release everything that is in the world that is from an expired subscription that hasn't already decayed and become inactive should be wiped (including Sanctuary). Leaving only the content by the currently active playerbase. 

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Would make NO sense for NQ go full release and not wipe. They need new players, you guys already had your fun. Nobody wants to see your 50 core base, no one cares. You guys crying u gonna get wiped but you guys are like 5% of the 100% amount of players NQ needs to game for survive. And the 95% new players they gonna be happy, So your guys tears only represent 5%.

I just gave you a mathematical equation to why wipe is a must

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3 hours ago, JoeBigfoot said:

I'm a old casual gamer with 4 paid accounts since the beta started and have never used any exploits or missions, just relaxed mining after work. And I'm just about to finish my base after 2 years.
And it's the first time I'm writing something here, I just have to.

 

You want a wipe, ok I can handle that.
A fresh start for everyone, good.

 

But not without my hard-earned things, for which I have invested 2 years of my life and many euros.

By that I mean quanta, talent points and ships.

 

What good is a blueprint if it takes me years to get to the quantas and afford the parts for them?
How long should I mine to restore all honeycomb to rebuild a 42xL construct?

 

And now thank you for the money and the lifetime and just start again without anything?

 

I have no problem rebuilding my base from scratch. It's tough but okay.

Give me a magic container with my stuff and I'll start over.

 

Or maybe a M-core that we can fill with some Parts from our stuff that we can take with us after the wipe.

or also limits the quantas that are retained after the wipe for my sake.

but a complete wipe... please no.

 

 

and sry for the google english 🙂

So what you're saying is you want a wipe so long as you can keep all your money, talent points and stuff.  How is that a wipe?

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3 minutes ago, J0hnnyB said:

Would make NO sense for NQ go full release and not wipe. They need new players, you guys already had your fun. Nobody wants to see your 50 core base, no one cares. You guys crying u gonna get wiped but you guys are like 5% of the 100% amount of players NQ needs to game for survive. And the 95% new players they gonna be happy, So your guys tears only represent 5%.

I just gave you a mathematical equation to why wipe is a must

If I believed that there was 20x the current 'veteran' player base out there ready to start playing within 1-2 months of launch and stick around long term I would be 100% behind a wipe.

 

Personally I think that this is a niche game and most of the people who are interested in it will have already tried it by now at some point.  So a launch will have mostly the players who are already playing or players who have stopped and decide to start again.  And it's hard to find players who have stopped and who are just waiting for a wipe-and-launch to dive back in.  If you want to say I'm wrong, they're out there and I just can't find them then I'd be delighted to be proved wrong, but just saying random numbers without any evidence is not a very convincing argument for a wipe.

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10 minutes ago, J0hnnyB said:

I just gave you a mathematical equation to why wipe is a must

 

That is just an opinion, not a mathematical equation based on any facts, just on your personal feelings

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9 minutes ago, J0hnnyB said:

Would make NO sense for NQ go full release and not wipe. They need new players, you guys already had your fun. Nobody wants to see your 50 core base, no one cares. You guys crying u gonna get wiped but you guys are like 5% of the 100% amount of players NQ needs to game for survive. And the 95% new players they gonna be happy, So your guys tears only represent 5%.

I just gave you a mathematical equation to why wipe is a must

 

I'm a new player so I'm pretty much the demographic they are wanting to hear from. I think all the established ship showrooms and buildings make the game more lived in and interesting to explore. Wiping all of this content seems pointless when the main issues can be fixed without it. I imagine they will eventually be adding new systems to the game too so this whole idea that wiping content is going to somehow please new players makes zero sense.

 

The only things bothering me as a new player are:

  • Having 5.5mill talent points when others have 75mill+ with NO CATCHUP MECHANIC so that gap is never going to reduce. Even with a wipe this will still be a problem for newer players down the line.
  • Tier 4/5 mining tiles are mainly taken and it is permanent with little chance of newer players getting their foot in the door.

Both of these things can be fixed with new mechanics, without needing a wipe. A wipe will not fix these issues for new players a year down the line if there was a wipe.

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We have been through wipe after wipe and major impactful changes in the last few years and it was never easy. I've rage quit myself a few times because of it.

 

Taking things into perspective
Having said that I can say that I'm 100% for any change needed to make DU the best it can be. Weather that means a full wipe or a partial one should depend on what that means for DU and not a few unhappy players. In the end if you want to achieve great things you have to go through the mud sometimes.

 

Reward
I remember some time in a long lost past I played a similar game. We had buildingcontests where people could win exclusive skins or decorations that were highly desired and admired. I think it might be a good idea to award everyone that has supported the development of DU with an exclusive skin or decoration.

 

Final word
Since the start of my DU journey a few years ago till today I still cannot see how it is possible to make DU fun without any form of NPC or survival element. And from the NQ video's I get the idea that even NQ doesn't know how to make it fun with it's current player only mantra. I have very little faith in this concept and I don't understand why it has to be this way other than that it's a lot of work to make. It may be a lot of work but also has a lot of reward if done right. In addition to that as a metaverse DU needs heavy social interaction features, there is none of that right now.

 

 

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27 minutes ago, Serula said:

 

 

Final word
Since the start of my DU journey a few years ago till today I still cannot see how it is possible to make DU fun without any form of NPC or survival element. And from the NQ video's I get the idea that even NQ doesn't know how to make it fun with it's current player only mantra. I have very little faith in this concept and I don't understand why it has to be this way other than that it's a lot of work to make. It may be a lot of work but also has a lot of reward if done right. In addition to that as a metaverse DU needs heavy social interaction features, there is none of that right now.

 

 

Some sort of basic npc activity would be great for giving people the confidence to start in pvp and a much needed additional gameplay loop.

 

Surely something quite basic could be introduced at the start to facilitate this? The scripting wouldn’t need to be complicated, maybe spawn them like asteroids and use a similar discovery mechanic as the DSAT. Then some basic scripting.

 

Chuck in some ship varients with different weapons, shields, speed etc, and you should have enough variation/challenge.

 

Edited by Shredder
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Do not quite understand the inclination to PvP. in principle, PvP is already included in the game as a basic framework. If you want to, you can let off steam and have fun with PvP in a huge PvP zone. What exactly should be included? Why should players who are not interested in PvP be encouraged to participate in it? Is there a lack of fancy arenas or should the solar system be made fancier, like "mists to hide in"?
We are not in a typical mmorpg with DualUniverse, where the developers take the player by the hand and tell them what to do. So, if you want PvP, you should create your own content, that's what PvE players do.

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55 minutes ago, Remagz said:

 

  • Having 5.5mill talent points when others have 75mill+ with NO CATCHUP MECHANIC so that gap is never going to reduce. Even with a wipe this will still be a problem for newer players down the line.
  • Tier 4/5 mining tiles are mainly taken and it is permanent with little chance of newer players getting their foot in the door.

 

This will always be the case and when you get 70M talent points and those with 5M complain, should you be wiped?  Your second comment has merit, they should periodically introduce new systems or planets.

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I'd prefer a wipe, but honestly, it'd just be papering over the cracks. There are fundamental problems with the game design, and other fundamental problems with the implementation of that design. I love the game and have invested a lot of time in it but honestly I think that the point has been reached where it would be better to learn some lessons from what went wrong with DU, and start from scratch with something new.

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2 hours ago, Zeddrick said:

So what you're saying is you want a wipe so long as you can keep all your money, talent points and stuff.  How is that a wipe?

if my base is deleted, the quantas maybe are shortened, the good mining spots have to be found again and it takes me another 2 years to get to the point where I am now, that's a wipe for me.
I don't want to have everything complete, but I do want a few things that will make the start easier for me.
I paid for this, stating that no more wiping takes place.

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Reading NQ's post "SHEDDING LIGHT ON A NOVAQUARK INTERNAL DISCUSSION", for me its very clear that they intend to wipe and the kind of wipe they want.


Now its just a matter of convincing as many players as possible of the benifits of said wipe. 


The removal of schematics is being thrown into the bargin, as a mean of turning more people in favor or the wipe. They propose a wipe to right all wrongs but reintroduce the former problems that schematics were supposed to solve?


So now it's a wipe and market nerf, as the newly reset economy will emerge weak, for without the need of schematics it will once again be easy to produce everything, no need for much trade or markets. 


Then, a few months after the wipe, they will come up with a new industry nerf.

 

 

Edited by DarkEvader
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1 hour ago, Knownthief said:

This will always be the case and when you get 70M talent points and those with 5M complain, should you be wiped?  Your second comment has merit, they should periodically introduce new systems or planets.

You're missing the point I was trying to make. When I have 70M talent points, others will have 140M talent points, the gap never closes. I am proposing a talent point catch up multiplier so newer players gradually catch up in talent points over time so that after 2 or 3 years they are nearly fully caught up. 

 

This seems super obvious to do....

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2 hours ago, Serula said:

Reward

 

I remember some time in a long lost past I played a similar game. We had buildingcontests where people could win exclusive skins or decorations that were highly desired and admired. I think it might be a good idea to award everyone that has supported the development of DU with an exclusive skin or decoration.

They already own many us that, from the kickstarter.

 

alpha.JPG

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21 minutes ago, Remagz said:

You're missing the point I was trying to make. When I have 70M talent points, others will have 140M talent points, the gap never closes. I am proposing a talent point catch up multiplier so newer players gradually catch up in talent points over time so that after 2 or 3 years they are nearly fully caught up. 

 

This seems super obvious to do....

Most talents should be reworked so that there are significant diminishing returns. That way the gap in terms of benefits closes the longer people play.

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39 minutes ago, MelTuc said:

I shade no tears for an online game, but I do shade ONE tear for idiots like you...

....um... you misquoted me there.  I certainly didn't say anything of the sort.  Perhaps you edited my reply badly.  Please edit it so it doesn't look like I said "So your guys tears only represent 5%." when actually it was J0hnyB who said that and I just replied to it.

 

If you're going to call someone an idiot, it's just common sense to make sure you direct that at the correct person right?

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