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People with 20 accounts can now makes hundreds of millions per day with missions


Sybily
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The system may need some balancing still, but i'm not sure i see such a huge advantage.  maybe i'm missing something.

 

They would still need 20x the storage to haul all that cargo.  From what i've seen the reward scales with the weight of the packages, so hauling more small missions isn't going to net more then hauling less larger mission.

 

And the risk still scales with the reward.  They would still be paying the collateral on every one of those missions if something goes wrong.

 

having multiple accounts definitely increases your productivity in a game like this.  But the time and effort that you have to put in goes up too.

 

I only have one alt and it's exhausting to me just logging in to get the daily reward on two accounts lol 

 

 

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First a disclaimer, I have 2 paid and 3 beta accounts...

 

This issue I don’t really have an issue with. With my five accounts I could do this I suppose, but at my level I could probably do megas for just as much (my case, not the 20 guy).

 

They are still playing, they have to cycle through all those accounts. They are still taking risk as I don’t see 180 mil a day without leaving the safe zone.

 

While they currently have advantage, they most probably are using beta accounts. I brought my three accounts for about 20 million each at the time. When the game goes release these will stop working, and not many people will have a huge amount of accounts as they will all cost money. You can’t do game balancing working on the outliner cases.

 

Where i do see this being good is Orgs. This is a MMO, and all of a sudden if you are in a good org which is willing to take the capital risk for you, and do the flying for you then you can make some money. All of a sudden a well organised Org is actually useful.

 

Oh and it’s not 120 minutes, the above example was 120 minutes of loading/unloading. They still have to do the flight which is probably four or five hrs out in the PvP zone. Happy hunting!

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This is true in pretty much every MMO - the more accounts you have the more you can do IF you have no life. The one thing is, though, that most people with money don't have time so it is not a big issue if it is a time sink - which it would be unless you have 20 computers. At that point if they are that well off they could hire 20 people for the same result. Frankly there is only so much you can actually do.

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18 minutes ago, Cheith said:

This is true in pretty much every MMO - the more accounts you have the more you can do IF you have no life. The one thing is, though, that most people with money don't have time so it is not a big issue if it is a time sink - which it would be unless you have 20 computers. At that point if they are that well off they could hire 20 people for the same result. Frankly there is only so much you can actually do.

 

Or... Just saying... OR...

 

You could be a double retiree middle age guy who is physically disabled and now get's to enjoy some time for himself where his "day job" is to have fun here on DU... 

Yeah I've made some money doing exactly what SillyBilly is crying about... But oh well, he profited off the backs of new players scamming them... So yeah "he's a moral compass of society"... in the waste bucket. 

He has the same opportunity to make money.. but he doesn't put the effort in... except constantly banter in general chat like 9 year old schoolchildren... 

Now to address you Cheith, Could I go to other games? Yes... I come from EFT / Star Citizen... Star Citizen I have pretty much every ship in the game and then some.. Am I in massive debt cause of this? No, I manage my finances and don't really have any hobbies outside of PC gaming due to my disabilities...  The game is soo underpriced for it's current value that honestly... NQ if you are reading this... up your price... 15$ a month! (I'll still be subbed with all my accounts). 

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Yeah i kind agree with your point of view BUT

I dont think you get the whole picture here ...

Ore prices went up  

BOOOM Natron 70 now 80+ lol at 150 prices ... WAS 50 -55 something

Gold went 900- 1000 plus BOOOM

Hematite 38+ Alioth BOOOM

If people doing missions then there are less people mining and ore prices are going up.

If all of us "get paid " and half are producing then this causes an inflation and then new poor working people are the ones that hurt most  as they can buy less stuff with high prices.

Same thing happened and still happens in some cases with the pandemic. All people got paid somehow but only half were producing causing inflation and prices to go up.

Now as you may know mining units are coming and this may reduce ore prices and stabilize the market. But depends on how much ore will be extracted and how many people will do it.

As far as now mining is the king of quanta unless you have 20 accounts yeah. But after all if you can only buy THIN AIR out of your hard working quantas then it is not worth the effort .

This is the reason i think many people will turn to industry and make things they need for their selfs and not buying them from markets overpriced. Because they can mine and have the ore and then turn it into something usefull.

 

YES BUT THIN AIR ?

 

Habitant

Habitants Organization

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13 hours ago, MoriarTheChosen said:

 

Or... Just saying... OR...

 

You could be a double retiree middle age guy who is physically disabled and now get's to enjoy some time for himself where his "day job" is to have fun here on DU... 

Yeah I've made some money doing exactly what SillyBilly is crying about... But oh well, he profited off the backs of new players scamming them... So yeah "he's a moral compass of society"... in the waste bucket. 

He has the same opportunity to make money.. but he doesn't put the effort in... except constantly banter in general chat like 9 year old schoolchildren... 

Now to address you Cheith, Could I go to other games? Yes... I come from EFT / Star Citizen... Star Citizen I have pretty much every ship in the game and then some.. Am I in massive debt cause of this? No, I manage my finances and don't really have any hobbies outside of PC gaming due to my disabilities...  The game is soo underpriced for it's current value that honestly... NQ if you are reading this... up your price... 15$ a month! (I'll still be subbed with all my accounts). 

Fair enough - no life was certainly a bad choice of words.

 

To me the multiple accounts is what it is. There is almost nothing you can realistically do about it so you may as well accept it. I was also, I guess badly, trying to make the point that not that many people are in a position to do this so it really isn't that big of an issue.

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On 6/16/2021 at 6:55 AM, Sybily said:

but they aren't doing the same thing over again, they just all sit on one ship while only having 1 account needed to fly the ship

20 accounts .... 20 missions at the same time. Is possible ... however. Before complaining you should look at what it takes to ship 20 packages of very large content. Any worthwhile mission is in pvp zone and is very large. 20x a collateral you can loose transporting through pvp (20x 2mio collateral on average).

 

1.8kt and 400kl for a single very large package. Do the math, what kind of ship can transport 20 x 1.8 kt and 20x400kl (=41 L-containers)?

 

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They aren’t really winning at DU anyway. They may be rich but their entire game play is either cycling through characters loading and unloading, or travelling through deep space, probably afk.

 

They should do away with the speed limit, move it up to the speed of light with extra power needed the closer you get naturally. Then how fast you travel between planets is how big a ship and fuel you have vs load etc. Much better than being afk watching Netflix for five hrs. 

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4 hours ago, Habitant said:

Yeah i kind agree with your point of view BUT

I dont think you get the whole picture here ...

Ore prices went up  

BOOOM Natron 70 now 80+ lol at 150 prices ... WAS 50 -55 something

Gold went 900- 1000 plus BOOOM

Hematite 38+ Alioth BOOOM

If people doing missions then there are less people mining and ore prices are going up.

If all of us "get paid " and half are producing then this causes an inflation and then new poor working people are the ones that hurt most  as they can buy less stuff with high prices.

Same thing happened and still happens in some cases with the pandemic. All people got paid somehow but only half were producing causing inflation and prices to go up.

Now as you may know mining units are coming and this may reduce ore prices and stabilize the market. But depends on how much ore will be extracted and how many people will do it.

As far as now mining is the king of quanta unless you have 20 accounts yeah. But after all if you can only buy THIN AIR out of your hard working quantas then it is not worth the effort .

This is the reason i think many people will turn to industry and make things they need for their selfs and not buying them from markets overpriced. Because they can mine and have the ore and then turn it into something usefull.

 

YES BUT THIN AIR ?

 

Habitant

Habitants Organization

 

Seems like auto miners can round out this issue ?

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3 hours ago, CoyoteNZ said:

 

They should do away with the speed limit, move it up to the speed of light with extra power needed the closer you get naturally. Then how fast you travel between planets is how big a ship and fuel you have vs load etc. Much better than being afk watching Netflix for five hrs

They already do this, bust just with the speed of light being 30000kph rather than 300000000m/s. If they did change the speed limit to the speed of light, you could cross the distance between alioth and madis in about 0.1 seconds.

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17 minutes ago, _Kiwi_ said:They already do this, bust just with the speed of light being 30000kph rather than 300000000m/s. If they did change the speed limit to the speed of light, you could cross the distance between alioth and madis in about 0.1 seconds.

Still got to accelerate and break. As I said nice non linear curve, probably exponential.

 

A four or five hour trip isn’t fun game play, they are probably afk doing something else just sucking up game bandwidth and server time. 

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On 6/18/2021 at 12:30 AM, ShippyLongstalking said:

 

 

That said, in fairness to the OP, it's more than just multiple accounts giving you an "advantage" -- multiple accounts are scaling profits geometrically without any real increase in effort or risk. 

 

 

Not increasing the risk? Each mission   he takes has collateral. At 180 million, the missions are definitely - at 9 million each - outside of the safe zone. 
 

If he fails the mission, he loses collateral from all 20 Mission failed. Moreover all 20 of his accounts get marked as mission failure in there history.

 

That to me is not only geometric profit, but geometric risk.

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10 hours ago, GraXXoR said:

Not increasing the risk? Each mission   he takes has collateral. At 180 million, the missions are definitely - at 9 million each - outside of the safe zone. 
 

If he fails the mission, he loses collateral from all 20 Mission failed. Moreover all 20 of his accounts get marked as mission failure in there history.

 

That to me is not only geometric profit, but geometric risk.

 

Sure, but he's not risking 20 ships or making 20 trips. IMO the collateral is not the primary risk, here -- it's the risk of losing your ship or the risk of spending all the hours just to get blown up. 

 

Of course there's still risk -- but IMO it's less risky to take 1 trip vs. 20, risking only one ship, and most importantly to me, risking only one haul. Time is the most important currency in any MMO but especially DU, so anything that lets you become 20x more effective with your time seems incorrect.  

 

Do I personally think this is really such a big deal? Meh, I think they need to nuke the economy anyway and that they shouldn't worry about exploits until they are somewhat close to being feature complete....but I do get where the OP is coming from.

 

Definitely an exploit -- and mostly it makes people with one account feel rather bad that the one haul spending hours slowboating could have been twice as profitable with just one alt. In that context, I can understand how some people would feel that's pay to win. 

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I only have 5 accounts. (well, 2 accounts and a total of 5 avatars)  Him having 20 doesn’t make me feel bad at all... and difference between 1 and 5 and 5 and 20 is geometrically pretty simple.

You can spend your time worrying what other people who are spending massive amounts of money are doing or you can concentrate on enjoying the game...

 

Here's a thought experiment.. if you had 20 accounts, would you play the way he is playing, repeat logging in and out 20 times, taking 20  missions, loading them up, flying a behemoth that can carry 40kT (2kT per mission) out of the atmosphere into pvp space with only one crew on board or requiring 38Mℏ in warp cells.... reducing profit already to about 150M... Knowing that even if he is in the safe zone, any single XS core ship could just stop dead in midair in front of him and his entire ship and he are very, very expensive and time consuming TOAST?

Would you? A ship that can transport 2kT of stuff is far less of a risk and geometrically cheaper than one that can haul 40kT in a useful amount of time... especially with the 4kph anti grav limit.

I know for sure that I wouldn't even do that with my 5 accounts.

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A few things I suppose...

 

This is they type of advantage being part of a well organised org should let you do, and I suppose it’s hard to determine the difference between one person with twenty accounts and a guild with twenty members.

 

Its not as easy as get twenty accounts and I’m rich. He still needs to work up to a ship which could haul maybe 40KT in and out of atmosphere. Be able to fuel and repair it. So still a lot of play to get there, like I said more of a org advantage. 

 

The numbers are good currently, because the balancing hasn’t been done, but when they bring in energy for AGG and all the elements of a ship that size etc then the numbers will definitely change.

 

Its money, if your enjoyment of a game is your in game balance then more power to you, but I’d rather play the game than do a five hr boring trip.

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Maybe the problem isn’t that he can do a 9 million job twenty times in a row, maybe the problem is that the biggest job is 2KT, 400KL. Would you be happier if instead there was an actual job which required you to haul 40KT, 8MT? Is the upper limit of missi No too low for end game level players and ships?

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On 6/22/2021 at 11:54 PM, CoyoteNZ said:

Maybe the problem isn’t that he can do a 9 million job twenty times in a row, maybe the problem is that the biggest job is 2KT, 400KL. Would you be happier if instead there was an actual job which required you to haul 40KT, 8MT? Is the upper limit of missi No too low for end game level players and ships?

I would love this. Totally ends the whole debate and is easy enough to implement.

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On 6/20/2021 at 11:52 PM, _Kiwi_ said:

They already do this, bust just with the speed of light being 30000kph rather than 300000000m/s. If they did change the speed limit to the speed of light, you could cross the distance between alioth and madis in about 0.1 seconds.

Then crash into a pile of nothing because the brakes won’t scale haha 

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Going to be honest not sure there is a massive issue here, it is no different from 20 separate people doing a single run together.  It is just one person taking all the risk and doing all the work.  Today I was running a few packages for org mates whilst they were at work, not sure the difference.

 

On 6/22/2021 at 10:54 PM, CoyoteNZ said:

Maybe the problem isn’t that he can do a 9 million job twenty times in a row, maybe the problem is that the biggest job is 2KT, 400KL. Would you be happier if instead there was an actual job which required you to haul 40KT, 8MT? Is the upper limit of missi No too low for end game level players and ships?


I cant wait until they release energy and all these crazy mega haulers and mega factories are gone................ only then can you have something resembling balance in this game.  When you cant simply slap on another engine to solve a problem. 

 

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On 6/17/2021 at 5:37 PM, Physics said:

Too be fair I see where you are coming from, it is possible to make a billion quanta with a single ship run so if people start copying the techniques you are going to see a new meta of quanta generating along with crazy inflation. Ore bot sales etc does not even come close to these methods

MY maths works it out that to make 1 billion you need to be moving around 200KT (around 250-300 L containers).  In a single trip

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Its also funny, that mission money spam (+banning, at last, people who for almost year traded with cheap exploit-gained goods, keeping prices low) now fire ups zimbabwe-like inflation.

 

But exploit compoment was actualy more important. Dominated whole economy.

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