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Molgor

consequences of non-regenerating planets and ressources

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I hope this is the right place for this and that it hasnt been discussed in detail before...

 

it seems to be fixed that planets and ressources in general will not regenerate, so i would like to hear opinions and maybe feedback from the developers on the following problems i see:

 

1. the pretty looking environment  will very soon look very ugly once everybody starts digging everywhere (especially for players who join in later stages). i hope that plants and grass at least will regenerate....

 

2. if i understand it correctly ressources are limited and fuel for example will be consumed by aircraft, so this would mean that there will come a point where the fuel on a planet will be depleted and new players will have no way to leave the planet (or do anything besides the absolute basics. i  imagine this would greatle decourage new players)

 

3. in an interview i heard that caves and the likes will not collapse even if they are physically unstable. So as i miner will i be able to cave out the whole planet (in theory) ?

and to continue this question will the territory be a horizontal restriction or will it be spherical? so would it include a no fly zone (for what range), what happens if you dig underground and you leave the territory zone on the surface? what happens if i dig into a restricted territory from the outside? (in my opinion a spherical or hexagonal-cube would be the most logical solution....)

Vorengard, Deacon and Ghoster like this

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1. Plants and grass will most likely generate but you have to understand that as things get dug out, most likely other things will be built on top. So a lot of the surface will not be green, because there are buildings. Stuff might look ugly but that's like going to New York city and saying that you missed out because you were born after it was constructed. Also, remember that planets are big. I beleive like 128,000 km^2 or something; it would take a while to ugly that up if your goal was just to carve up the surface to expose ugly dirt.

 

2. Just like in the real world, resources are finite. When you start out, if you're starting out late, you might not be able to mine fuel to fly a ship as all of it has been mined, or is claimed. You'll have to buy it. And there will always be resources available elsewhere because, although the amount may not be infinite, there will still be TONS. Again, planets are big. They are also numerous. And if there is a market for resources, you can bet players will mine that resource where it is available and bring it to where there is demand for it. Just like in the real world.

 

3. In theory, yes I think so. I don't see why not. As for territory though, it's been stated that they are columns, that extend from about a certain height in the sky, all the way down to the lowest point that you can reach on a planet, which isn't the center but is still deep. It's not a spherical territory, it's a column that keeps everything safe.

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You have this problem in minecraft because inventories are incredibly unrealistic and you can also destroy matter by dropping it in a fire or lava. So people tend to strip mine because there is no penalty for having tons of cobble stone in the inventory.

 

I hope they go for the more space engineers type system, that you cant really destroy matter so you either have to build warehouses full of rock or dump it back into the world, people will still trash areas but having areas that are that "mined down the bedrock" would not happen because people would need to fill in the hole with waste material because otherwise they would have to take it with them.

Celivalg and Bluedick like this

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You bring up some solid points, where I would like to see the ground regenerate, that would probably be a fairly large process. I understand what you are saying though.

It would be an interesting thing if they had both the space engineers system and an extremely low regenerative system where empty holes are filled with the standard dirt of the planet it is found on. But, maybe it will all come down to the conservation of the players themselves, I mean, it's not hard to keep a bunch of dirt on standby to refill, but then they end up with other planets mined out.

Its either an endless cycle or it is something that regenerates. 
Or we just end up with really hole filled planets... :P  

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I concur with the non regeneration pact. the planets will never be entirely uglified, as it would take too much time, but people with creative minds will probably more likely to say in one place for longer, as griefers have the tendency to be short term working people and loose interest easily.

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the problem is even if you fill in the hole again with dirt it will be a smooth dark brown surface (if i interpret what i have seen in the demos correctly).

i am not asking to smooth out the holes or fill them up or ores to regenerate, but what i would like to see is for grass and trees to regrow (or alternatively the ability to "build" plantlife ourselves)

VioletBannana likes this

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I'm just confident that there will be enough people actively pursuing constructive and useful purposes that the carving up of the surface won't end up being a significant problem.

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I Played a game called Xsyon. They had the ground gradually regenerate over time if no one had claim to it. i.e. no totem, which is what a person needed to claim land and build or terraform it. It did however have the blight syndrome at first, where people would mess up an area, then pick up and move on, to a pristine area, and blight it as well  :(

 

Deacon

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First, I would say it's safe to assume that the mods have plans for trees that re-grow, especially if they produce useful resources, because what game doesn't have trees that re-grow?

 

However, I have no doubt that 10 seconds after the game launches there will be some guy drawing a giant penis on the side of a mountain. This is, after all, the internet. I certainly hope the Devs have considered this outcome and know how to deal with it, because I don't think the majority of people enjoy that sort of "content".

 

I'm also concerned about the quantity of resources, especially as it related to new players, because not long after the game launches the ground around the staring zone will be filled with tunnels and large empty pits. That's not only ugly, but frustrating for finding resources. I imagine a lot of people would be lost in windy tunnels looking for resources and not realizing what they actually found themselves in.

 

But I'm not worried about there being a lack of resources in starting because demand always promotes supply. So long as there is a way for new players to make money and do useful things, then everyone will be fine. 

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The area around the ark is going to be the only safe area to build so everyone is going to want to build a house or factory or other org structures. The real problem is going to be parceling up and allocating land so it doesn't get overrun by undeleteable low quality shacks that are quickly abandoned when players move on.

 

If TCUs are allowed in the ARK area its going to be a race to see who can claim these tiles first and control "Ark City"

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How about a combination of EVE Online (30 minutes server maintenance every day) with Landmark regeneration of world? Let's assume that the server this big will need frequent breaks (every day/two/three for example), so why not to use that break to restore some of the world that has been altered/destroyed/etc? Also some things could regenerate faster than others. Just a thought :)

Vorengard likes this

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How about a combination of EVE Online (30 minutes server maintenance every day) with Landmark regeneration of world? Let's assume that the server this big will need frequent breaks (every day/two/three for example), so why not to use that break to restore some of the world that has been altered/destroyed/etc? Also some things could regenerate faster than others. Just a thought :)

 

the likely thing that will happen is that only the arkship will be instanced, but the surroundings that are not will be seamlessly blended in, thus allowing everyone to start off with the same things, and have a safe heaven (could only join on invite).

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The area around the ark is going to be the only safe area to build so everyone is going to want to build a house or factory or other org structures. The real problem is going to be parceling up and allocating land so it doesn't get overrun by undeleteable low quality shacks that are quickly abandoned when players move on.

 

If TCUs are allowed in the ARK area its going to be a race to see who can claim these tiles first and control "Ark City"

 

I wouldn't necessarily be worried about this, as vertical building is not only possible, but encouraged. I imagine the Ark-Zone quickly turning into a virtual favella of small houses, shacks, and factories all built on top of each other. That might not be everyone's cup of tea, but I think it would be very cool to see happen.

 

Or maybe there will be an incentive to build cheap skyscrapers newbros can rent out for their starter homes? I imagine if you need any kind of Item storage then having your own space close to the central market of the Arkship will be very valuable indeed. That seems like one of the best ways to encourage the large skyscrapers the Devs clearly want to see happen in this game. And I hope they manage it, because an actual player built city in an MMO would be such a cool thing to see.

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I don't think we have any idea how this might work yet.

 

As far as i know NQ hasn't said whether terrain will regenerate at all or not.

 

Someone should ask in the next AMA though.

I do seem to recall JC saying in a youtube interview that resources would be finite.

 

With space expansion being a thing this would be a driving factor.

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Terrain could also regenerate without the resources regenerating.

 

In Landmark the way the procedural resources work, if you mine a vein of ore, the terrain will regenerate in 15 minutes or so but the ore itself won't.  That specific vein of ore can still respawn later on at some point but it usually won't right away.

 

In DU planets could also have resources that respawn procedurally but are depleted.  So resources could become more scarce over time without the planet being turned into swiss cheese.  

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Terrain could also regenerate without the resources regenerating.

 

In Landmark the way the procedural resources work, if you mine a vein of ore, the terrain will regenerate in 15 minutes or so but the ore itself won't.  That specific vein of ore can still respawn later on at some point but it usually won't right away.

 

In DU planets could also have resources that respawn procedurally but are depleted.  So resources could become more scarce over time without the planet being turned into swiss cheese.  

 

 

The problem with that is if you want to build underground bases, you don't want your access tunnels regenerating on you and trapping you beneath or making your entrance impossible to find 

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