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13 hours ago, Vargen said:

With a schematic cost of 1000 or 5000 quanta there are a huge difference between the cheap adjustor compared to the expensive container.

NQ is basically lifting part of a mechanic from EVE again but fails to understand it and so fails to implement the bigger picture.

 

As this is designed in EVE, players do not produce for a finished construct/ships, they set up industry to specialize in certain elements and bring those to market.

 

Translated to DU, when you bring adjustors to market, the output levels will be significantly higher than when you create expensive containers, and we're talking probably triple digit percentage differences here, so the cost for the schematic is effectively much lower per unit produced. At 5000 quanta, a container schematic should build 10, while an adjustor builds 10,000. In that concept, the changes would make sense, except that in DU, Industry is designed more like Factorio or Satisfactory where one industry chain starts with raw resources and produces all the intermediate items to output and end product/element

 

 

In the end, I really feel NQ does not understand the impact the change will have because they do not actually understand their own design for the mechanic and have not looked into how the actual process plays into the entire gameplay loop. And everything we are seeing tells us that this is already done and scheduled to be patched soon, all the feedback in he world is irrelevant as they are about to repeat the 0.23 mistake again.


Also, by removing schematics from markets, NQ is removing an opportunity for trade as players can no longer go and buy schematics from remote planets and offer them for sale on Alioth. Once again NQ is pulling an activity and turning it into a UI interaction only.

 

It all feels like NQ is really trying to remove any actual activity or interaction with the world itself for some reason and keep it all in the UI.

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11 minutes ago, Jake Arver said:

NQ is basically lifting part of a mechanic from EVE again but fails to understand and so fails to implement the bigger picture.

In a 1:1 compare, players do not produce for a finished construct, they set up industry to specialize in certain elements. And when you bring adjustors to market, the output levels will be significantly higher than when you create expensive containers, and we're talking probably triple digit percentage differences here, so the cost for the schematic is effectively much lower per unit produced. 

 

At 5000 quanta, a container schematic should build 10, while an adjustor builds 10,000

 

 

Another thing is that the system NQ now copies is not designed for an industry system which uses a variety of different machines, It is designed to be what determines what a single machine will output.

 


Overall, I really feel NQ does not understand the impact the change will have because they are not considering it and so have not looked into it. And everything we are seeing tells us that this is already done and scheduled to be patched soon, all the feedback in he world is irrelevant as they are about to repeat the 0.23 mistake again.

 


And by removing schematics form markets, NQ is removing an opportunity for trade as players can no longer go and buy schematics from remote planets and offer them for sale on Alioth. Once again NQ is pulling an activity and turning it into a UI interaction only.

 

It all feels like NQ is really trying to remove any actual activity or interaction with the world itself for some reason and keep it all in the UI.

 

NQ is actively trying to destroy any reason to be a single shard game, with every new "patch" they put out. Its a rather amazing accomplishment when you think about it.

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11 hours ago, Vargen said:

The same schematic will be used for all elements of the same tier and size but the production cost for different elements can vary a lot. Here are some examples of Tier 1 Medium elements using the same schematic:

You are comparing S, M and L elements which just all have M in the name.

Replace for example the container M with container S, and the adjustor M with adjustor L, to have a proper comparison. 
(all t1 items made in an M assembler with size M parts)

In DU, all items which only exist in a single size have the size name of the parts and assembler they need, like warp drive L, but all parts which exist in multple sizes, like gates, containers and adjustors, just have the size letters to differentiate between them, regardless of actual size. 
Sometimes, like with engines, it coincides.

Edit: even to that there are exceptions, like territory units.

Edited by Gottchar
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32 minutes ago, Jake Arver said:

At 5000 quanta, a container schematic should build 10, while an adjustor builds 10,000

Agreed.

 

32 minutes ago, Jake Arver said:

And by removing schematics form markets, NQ is removing an opportunity for trade as players can no longer go and buy schematics from remote planets and offer them for sale on Alioth. Once again NQ is pulling an activity and turning it into a UI interaction only.

Here you are only partially correct. While players did previously have the option to do as you have suggested, they will now instead have the option to sell their copies to other players.

 

It is most certainly not a perfect 1 for 1, and it isn't hard to see that it will annoy factory players by giving them what is functionally a level of "upkeep-play" akin to mining calibrations... We'll need to see how it goes, but NQ really should be careful here, we don't want parts of the game to turn in to a job.

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51 minutes ago, Gottchar said:

You are comparing S, M and L elements which just all have M in the name.

Replace for example the container M with container S, and the adjustor M with adjustor L, to have a proper comparison. 
(all t1 items made in an M assembler with size M parts)

In DU, all items which only exist in a single size have the size name of the parts and assembler they need, like warp drive L, but all parts which exist in multple sizes, like gates, containers and adjustors, just have the size letters to differentiate between them, regardless of actual size. 
Sometimes, like with engines, it coincides.

Edit: even to that there are exceptions, like territory units.

 

Thank you @Gottchar for that insight and a good explanation!

Then I hope NQ use the right data to group the right stuff together. And hopefully change the name accordingly so that it's easy to see in the name of the item what schematic should be used.

 

And then I don't have any questions about it affect the same type of items differently.

 

But what about how high or low the cost should be?

Somehow I came up with the idea that a good number could be 10% of the average production cost for each group.

But does it really matter??

At this point, with no affecting talents or differences, it will just add equally to the production cost. In the same way that inflation does.

And would it be possible to have that cost change (for example every week) depending on the average ore prices?

 

And for different tiers I still don't know how the different cost should be to balance correctly.

 

What about the time it takes to copy?

I don't have a clue what's reasonable...

It's a cap for me how self-sufficient I can be and a cap for how much the player base as a whole can produce.

The longer it takes the more we need to rely on other players selling their copies at markets.

 

Schematics for what items?

Does no one else have an idea what items should need schematics? Or do you just not care?

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While I changed my earlier post on this there is an important thing I left out..

 

If you produce Warpcells "EVE style", you buy "Advanced Quantum Alignment Unit" and "Advanced Antimatter Cores" from another player through the market or a contract, to then add those to a machine that has the "Warp Cell" schematic inserted. You do not start with the raw materials at all, you do not run a complete production chain, and in that context the "X runs" schematics works perfectly fine.

 

NQ did not design Industry in DU that way though, it's more Factorio/Satisfactory, and so actually drives building complete chains from raw materials to end-product instead. And that is why the changes now proposed will not work in this context.

 

At the same time the above actually shows why the economy in DU does not work, it has nothing to do with players not wanting to use it, it is because the design of the game is such that it actually drives being independent from markets entirely, and that is valid for orgs especially. In EVE, players interacting, be it through markets or through contracting and even when doing so withing a company or alliance, is at the very core of how different mechanics are designed. It is far more efficient to buy sub-components from people who have specialized in these that trying to do it all.

 


And no, I am not saying NQ needs to turn DU into EVE here, I am saying NQ needs to stop trying to make DU do things in a way they did not design the core of the game to work. And these schematic changes are very much an attempt to do just that.

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2 hours ago, Taelessael said:

Here you are only partially correct. While players did previously have the option to do as you have suggested, they will now instead have the option to sell their copies to other players.

 

While I heard Deckard say that in the Q&A, I expect he for a moment spoke before thinking.

 

Through Barter sure, I can see that. But unless NQ adds ANY possible variation of a copied schematic item to what can be sold on markets, that will just not be possible. You can't sell or buy BPC on the market in EVE for the same reason.

 

What he said simple does not make practical sense, much like the time he said that territory scans would persist through the changes to MU.

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I'm Glad this thread seems to have progressed to acceptance, however this is still the most horrible idea ever. 

depending on the market to supply the rest of the schematics and paying whatever over inflated prices people come up with so they can afford the new ships is going to be horrible inflation on all things. 

Trying to explain away how other things make this ok. Does  not make this change ok. These changes no matter how the implement them will make the game less fun for the people building industry. 

no amount of trying to figure out how it works or how to work with the system changes these issue with a broken system that they have some how made worse, and NQs decision to go strait to the live server with such a massive change (because of time constraints) tells me they are trying to rush things out the door, to "Fix" the servers for release. 

so I'm guessing they plan on releasing this December to kill all the beta accounts because they think that will fix the money issues.

And yes this change does make it easier for a new player to get into industry, and yes it does help ne players join the servers, but the argument here is, how long are you a new player? how long will it take new players to want to go from making pure ingots to something more costly and this change chokes them out. 

For players that are mostly here for the industry game play this is a massive straw on the proverbial camels back. For me its the last straw. This change WILL cause me to leave the game. (Yeah I know can I have your stuff) This wont change what NQ is doing. I know NQ doesn't care about the people playing the game they just want the money. I'm fine with that its their company, they can chose what they want, but its also my money an I chose to give it to a developer that will actually listen to feedback.

 

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3 hours ago, PlumYeti said:

I'm Glad this thread seems to have progressed to acceptance, however this is still the most horrible idea ever.

What the heck gave you that idea? No, a lot of us just haven't bothered beyond our initial reaction. Our opinions just don't count, and actually implementation is done via magic-eight-ball... NQ: Should we do x? Magic-eight-ball says: You may rely on it. NQ might at this point stand for No Questions... 😉

 

Let's see how it is eventually implemented at launch/after-wipe. If we're still around, at this point I haven't 'played' DU for over three months. I logged in a few times (talents, checking some stuff, etc.), but not actually do something interesting...

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14 hours ago, Vargen said:

 

Thank you @Gottchar for that insight and a good explanation!

Then I hope NQ use the right data to group the right stuff together. And hopefully change the name accordingly so that it's easy to see in the name of the item what schematic should be used.

 

And then I don't have any questions about it affect the same type of items differently.

 

But what about how high or low the cost should be?

Somehow I came up with the idea that a good number could be 10% of the average production cost for each group.

But does it really matter??

At this point, with no affecting talents or differences, it will just add equally to the production cost. In the same way that inflation does.

And would it be possible to have that cost change (for example every week) depending on the average ore prices?

 

And for different tiers I still don't know how the different cost should be to balance correctly.

 

What about the time it takes to copy?

I don't have a clue what's reasonable...

It's a cap for me how self-sufficient I can be and a cap for how much the player base as a whole can produce.

The longer it takes the more we need to rely on other players selling their copies at markets.

 

Schematics for what items?

Does no one else have an idea what items should need schematics? Or do you just not care?

Just aks any of the industry players, we spent a lot of time on our spreadsheets and know our shit.

Also, in regards to production cost at least, a lot of items are pretty much in fixed groups already, due the way the material cost were set up.

intermediary part+complex parts+structural+fuctional is pretty much all elements,
(with very few exceptions, which mostly will not require schematics in the future anymore (like encampment chairs or steel panels)
The amount are always (with N being the size of the assembler)
complex parts needed = 5^(n-1)
Intermediary parts needed= 6^(n-1)
1 structural part which needs 2*7^(n-1) liters of ore (more precisely, take the 3602L for xl, and divide by 7 and round, to get smaller size)
and one functional which needs as many intermediary parts as the element, and 2/3 of the metal of the frame.

and all of the parts have similary formulars

So, erm, and if ore prices within a tier are the same, you end  up with similar numbers for a reason which you should now understand. Exception, plastic is still cheaper, so anything with more plastic (injectors or casings) will be lower then stuff without, like space engines.

If, for example t1 is 25 quanta, t2 the same, and t3 40:

 

space engine S: 2709
atmo engine s: 2315
fuel tank S: 2341
adjustor m: 2315
wing s: 2709
stab s: 2709
container xs: 2302
sliding door s: 2709
airbrake m: 2709
etc.

Especially items of a similar "field" often have very similar schematics, so yes, easy to do. They pretty much only have to think of what percentage they roughly want, and then spit out the fixed schematic price.

Space fuel is an equalizer for t2 ores, but it adapts slow. Without any other changes though, after some months, they all cost the same. Only "issue" is sulfur, which is not only a byproduct of some ore, especially silver. But also not used as much as other things, unless rocket engines (and their massive sulfur fuel tanks) get far more usage, which I guess NQ had planned originally.

The bigger issue is, that the schematics add a flat fee in general, even stronger than the old ones did. Meaning there is a massive input by the devs for any price developement. Which really shouldn’t be a thing for the player driven ecomony they still want to reach some day, and even often claim to already have.

With ore prices "clamped" due to bots, and schematic costs also being clamped, and no long term quanta investment needed, and switching out your production line even easier, prices will be more homogenous, in a dev directed way.

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Schematics should be introduced into an occupation menu as a talent tree. Also T1.

In the menu you can then unlock levels. the first level is Basic and costs 10.000 Quanta.
Let's take as an example: 
You can "skill" Basic to exotic, and after this, you can skill unlock levels A, B, C,....for more individual Continuing education /specialissation.

You could then add points that each player has available to distribute alongside the quanta costs. These are limited, so you have to decide whether you would put them all in steel or in an alloy to become a "master" there. You could also choose to put only a few points in both, but then you don't take the best bonuses.
Here it would also be important to decide for each production branch without having to specialize in previous products. (So you can specialize in advanced steel, but you don't need to specialize in basic or uncommon. This way there can be more diversity among the players who specializes in what.

 

Screenshot (19).png

 

You could integrate the schematic system into the normal talent system through skill costs and unlocking, without having to bring countless schematics into the game.

You should concentrate on the talent system and make it more individual, so that you can better decide for your play style deeper. but this also includes that you remove some current skill dependencies. to skill advanced producte you should not need basic and uncommon skills, but you should be able to specialize through significantly higher costs for unlocking right there. then not only basic to exotic, but deeper possibilities, so that the deeper you skill, it is worthwhile. then there are also greater differences for players whether someone specializes in basic-uncommon or advanced...., because for the market all are important, not only the final game products T5.

 

 

Edited by Zarcata
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7 hours ago, Gottchar said:

Just aks any of the industry players, we spent a lot of time on our spreadsheets and know our shit.

Also, in regards to production cost at least, a lot of items are pretty much in fixed groups already, due the way the material cost were set up.

intermediary part+complex parts+structural+fuctional is pretty much all elements,
(with very few exceptions, which mostly will not require schematics in the future anymore (like encampment chairs or steel panels)
The amount are always (with N being the size of the assembler)
complex parts needed = 5^(n-1)
Intermediary parts needed= 6^(n-1)
1 structural part which needs 2*7^(n-1) liters of ore (more precisely, take the 3602L for xl, and divide by 7 and round, to get smaller size)
and one functional which needs as many intermediary parts as the element, and 2/3 of the metal of the frame.

and all of the parts have similary formulars

So, erm, and if ore prices within a tier are the same, you end  up with similar numbers for a reason which you should now understand. Exception, plastic is still cheaper, so anything with more plastic (injectors or casings) will be lower then stuff without, like space engines.

If, for example t1 is 25 quanta, t2 the same, and t3 40:

 

space engine S: 2709
atmo engine s: 2315
fuel tank S: 2341
adjustor m: 2315
wing s: 2709
stab s: 2709
container xs: 2302
sliding door s: 2709
airbrake m: 2709
etc.

Especially items of a similar "field" often have very similar schematics, so yes, easy to do. They pretty much only have to think of what percentage they roughly want, and then spit out the fixed schematic price.

Space fuel is an equalizer for t2 ores, but it adapts slow. Without any other changes though, after some months, they all cost the same. Only "issue" is sulfur, which is not only a byproduct of some ore, especially silver. But also not used as much as other things, unless rocket engines (and their massive sulfur fuel tanks) get far more usage, which I guess NQ had planned originally.

The bigger issue is, that the schematics add a flat fee in general, even stronger than the old ones did. Meaning there is a massive input by the devs for any price developement. Which really shouldn’t be a thing for the player driven ecomony they still want to reach some day, and even often claim to already have.

With ore prices "clamped" due to bots, and schematic costs also being clamped, and no long term quanta investment needed, and switching out your production line even easier, prices will be more homogenous, in a dev directed way.

 

The price will really be decided by the players only when the outer planets become PvP.


In this case we will have more easily certain embargo on certain resources at the moment T.

 

Depending on people's stocks and who controls what certain prices may go up or down.

 

They confirmed it was on the schedule, so with that in mind I think these changes should be supported.

 

=> The changes to come are not so bad by the way. Casual players will pay much less for their blueprint when they want to craft only 2 engines of a certain type.

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21 hours ago, PlumYeti said:

I'm Glad this thread seems to have progressed to acceptance, however this is still the most horrible idea ever. 

 

It's more a matter of "whatever.."

We know well enough by now that feedback is ignored and NQ will just push this through the way they want it to be anyway.

 

No amount of fair and valid arguments will make them change their mind, only once their implementation bombs and starts having a negative effect like we predict will NQ possibly act. Problem here i sthat it will be too late as they will have release the game by then and the damage will be done. ANd the concern is that it appears that the people thinking up this stuff seem blissfully unaware or ignrant of the difference between doing this in a "beta" stage (even when it really is an alpha change) or "release". For NQ it's al lthe same ..

 

The fact we're nearly at 8 pages in this discussion an not a singel response form NQ to any of this kind of tells you they really do not care about the feedback at all.

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56 minutes ago, Knight-Sevy said:

 

The price will really be decided by the players only when the outer planets become PvP.

 

 

Last I heard they were going to release with safe zones still intact.  Anything past release is a crap shoot as no guarantee the game survives long. And how are they gonna make outer planets pvp without atmo pvp? Or do you mean the just reduce the safe zone down to the atmo of the planet. It all sounds bad anyway. The whole game needs to be in pvp zone or this "concept" will never work. EvE ans Star Citizen have all their content in pvp zones, and both have more money and eyes on them than DU.  Coincidence?

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1 hour ago, CousinSal said:

 

Last I heard they were going to release with safe zones still intact.  Anything past release is a crap shoot as no guarantee the game survives long. And how are they gonna make outer planets pvp without atmo pvp? Or do you mean the just reduce the safe zone down to the atmo of the planet. It all sounds bad anyway. The whole game needs to be in pvp zone or this "concept" will never work. EvE ans Star Citizen have all their content in pvp zones, and both have more money and eyes on them than DU.  Coincidence?

 

The failure with the population currently more than weak in the game is not to have implemented PvP at all.
 

With NQ's recent reactions, I think they've finally figured that out.
But it may be too late for the financing of the game.
 

It's now quite useless I think to yell at NQ to ask them for more complicated changes. The nerve of the industry is badly needed, maybe they also want to reduce the development of the players as much as possible to have time to really add content to the game post release.
 

==> I repeat myself, but clearly the lack of respect that there has been towards PvP players who have now waited 2 years to finally be able to play the game is the main cause of the drop in the number of players.
 

As an example for only speaks of the French-speaking side that I master:
- At the launch of the Beta I remember 14 active organizations (10 to 100 members)
- 3 totally PvE organizations
- 5 mixed PvP-PvE organizations (large organization 50/100 members and streamer organization)
- 8 TOTALLY PvP organizations
 

And I may be able to add one from EvE which ultimately never came because there was no real PvP.
 

You can imagine, 60 to 80% of theplayers in these organizations were there to do short or long term PvP on the game.
Some were expecting atmospheric PvP.
 

NQ to shit on all these people who finally left and left the game in this state of population.
 

=> The only chance for the game to work is to leave its safe zone on 3 planets. AND put everything else in PvP.
 

There is no more time anyway, if NQ survives the release, they will have 3 months maximum to create the PvP content and bring the real player population back to the game.
 

Otherwise it's dead

 

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21 minutes ago, Knight-Sevy said:

 

The failure with the population currently more than weak in the game is not to have implemented PvP at all.
 

With NQ's recent reactions, I think they've finally figured that out.
But it may be too late for the financing of the game.
 

It's now quite useless I think to yell at NQ to ask them for more complicated changes. The nerve of the industry is badly needed, maybe they also want to reduce the development of the players as much as possible to have time to really add content to the game post release.
 

==> I repeat myself, but clearly the lack of respect that there has been towards PvP players who have now waited 2 years to finally be able to play the game is the main cause of the drop in the number of players.
 

As an example for only speaks of the French-speaking side that I master:
- At the launch of the Beta I remember 14 active organizations (10 to 100 members)
- 3 totally PvE organizations
- 5 mixed PvP-PvE organizations (large organization 50/100 members and streamer organization)
- 8 TOTALLY PvP organizations
 

And I may be able to add one from EvE which ultimately never came because there was no real PvP.
 

You can imagine, 60 to 80% of theplayers in these organizations were there to do short or long term PvP on the game.
Some were expecting atmospheric PvP.
 

NQ to shit on all these people who finally left and left the game in this state of population.
 

=> The only chance for the game to work is to leave its safe zone on 3 planets. AND put everything else in PvP.
 

There is no more time anyway, if NQ survives the release, they will have 3 months maximum to create the PvP content and bring the real player population back to the game.
 

Otherwise it's dead

 

 

During alpha tons of people wanted pvp in some form. It was the main focus. DU without open world pvp Is dreadfully boring.  

 

Star citizen is a buggy mess in alpha I won't deny that. But yesterday I got a friend friend play it with me for the first time. Here is a recap of our 3 hour play session.  I picked him up in my ship and we went and did some NPC missions while he manned the turret, and made a few bucks. We then went to gear up and did some shopping.  After that a player Ingame activated a mission saying he was downed and needed a revive. So we went to that bunker and found him and revived him. But then my buddy decided he wanted to kill him and blasted him and we looted him ([filtered] move but hey player driven). My friend now was a criminal and as we were flying away someone looking to get his bounty engaged us and we had a 5min dog fight but me Being a new pilot and bad I rammed into him and we blew up.

 

Well I respawned and he went to prison. 2.5 hour sentence. Or he could mine and reduce it. So he did some mining and got out in 20min or so. After that we went bounty hunting for a criminal that lead to a space station where he was hacking to reduce his crime status. We landed our ship and went in on foot, and we killed him but also 2 of his buddies. After that when we were about to leave another ship arrived and blew our ship up so we retreated into the space station.  no ship we were stranded. Well 5min later a guy stuck in and downed my buddy but then I killed him. I then had time to revive my buddy, and he said "can we steal the ship he came in?" So we went outside the space station and were jetpacking in space. Found his ship!!! Back door was locked. So I pulled out my gun and kept shooting the door watching it take damage until it opened. Success we have a ship!! We took it and flew back to a space station to regear, get more ammo, food water and reflect on our adventure. 

 

All that in a span of 3 hours and my buddies first day. No need to build any thing, just get a space ship and go on an adventure In pvp zone that also has npcs.  It was FUN. It was organic.  It showed what SC could become someday soon. When u compare that experience to DU well...I think you get it.

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37 minutes ago, Knight-Sevy said:

The failure with the population currently more than weak in the game is not to have implemented PvP at all.

You have pvp, you can, shoot other people.

Shittily, with bugs, no proper way of organizing and whatever issue, I don’t do pvp, but I am sure there is a giant amount of reasons why people don’t pvp more actively. You can shoot though. It is, in general, in place.

Same thing for pve. 

While pve saw more things removed, and pvp more things added, they are both missing major features and instead get pointless things nobody asked for, or people even specifically asked to please not add.

So this is not an issue of "the game need more pvp", it is an issue of "the game needs a lot of things, pve and pvp". And many of the active gameplay loops and tools people suggested would help both alike anyway.

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12 minutes ago, CousinSal said:

 

 

All that in a span of 3 hours and my buddies first day. No need to build any thing, just get a space ship and go on an adventure In pvp zone that also has npcs.  It was FUN. It was organic.  It showed what SC could become someday soon. When u compare that experience to DU well...I think you get it.

 

in 3 hrs you cannot do this much in DU

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3 minutes ago, Gottchar said:

You have pvp, you can, shoot other people.

Shittily, with bugs, no proper way of organizing and whatever issue, I don’t do pvp, but I am sure there is a giant amount of reasons why people don’t pvp more actively. You can shoot though. It is, in general, in place.

Same thing for pve. 

While pve saw more things removed, and pvp more things added, they are both missing major features and instead get pointless things nobody asked for, or people even specifically asked to please not add.

So this is not an issue of "the game need more pvp", it is an issue of "the game needs a lot of things, pve and pvp". And many of the active gameplay loops and tools people suggested would help both alike anyway.

 

In star citizen they have lots of PVE. But guess what, all of it is in a pvp zone.  Segregation is not the answer.

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2 minutes ago, Aaron Cain said:

 

in 3 hrs you cannot do this much in DU

 

Can you in 3weeks? 3 months? Ever?

 

And during that 3 hours we did encounter bugs and some desync during FPS. Luckily the bugs were the smaller ones and didn't force us to restart.  But it just goes to show that they have a good foundation of FUN. SC isn't sitting there talking about economics, all this bullshit. SC is actually going to wipe again in a week. They call themselves alpha. But did I have fun during that 3 hours.  Yes I had a damn [filtered]ing good time flying around in a space ship with my buddy doing missions and pvping real players.  Fun matters.

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sounds like a decent development with actual fun during Alpha, and calling a phase by its name is also amendable.

 

DU will be released with all changes currently going and what it already is as Alpha but they call it ready.

It is nowhere near ready or competitive towards other games in the genre. It could have been but, well bad choices and delay after delay

 

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With regard to the alpha/beta/release state of the game, I keep coming back to questioning where did all those dev hours go?

 

Despite what some people think, NQ cannot really be classified as a indie company when they have two office locations (Paris & Montreal in Canada) and had about 150 employees at one time (currently 76 employees according to linkedin). Meaning that regardless of how big a budget NQ may, or may not have there should have been lots of people working on the game for all those years.

 

So what features did the 6+ (8+ depending on how you count) years of development with that many employees go into? Even now all we have are like maybe 2 of the 6 pillars functioning, and the whole game is just layers of "early test with lots of bugs. But don't worry guys, we will improve it later" functions and no real game design.

 

I mean.. The game is supposed to be a community driven MMO, and it doesn't even have proper social/chat/voice/message functionality and a UI from early 2000.

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