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Orius

Lasers Are Overrated.

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Here's a thought: no laser weapons. You know how in Halo games it is the 24th century, and the earthlings never mastered laser weapon technology, so they still used mainly bullets and gunpowder? So here's a thought: we could have something similar to that and not have lasers but rather bullet guns. It seems more realistic this way, because the people on earth would never have time to build on laser tech because of the whole "end of the world" thing. 

 

-Rhino

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Okay, maybe we should not scrap laser weapons entirely. What if we have bullet weapons in the beginning, and as players explore the planets and the galaxy, they discover ancient weapon blueprints from a lost alien civilization (surprise - it's lasers!). They would find the blueprints from alien monuments. Then the blueprints could be reverse engineered and explode across the market, while the bullet guns are still there but would be less powerful which would encourage the player to get the more powerful laser guns. How bout that? :D

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The USDoD has working on laser weaponry for quite a bit now. The SKiD is first alerted to in the 2030s. With the re-emerging threat of ICBMs and projects such as Project Starshot before that, laser systems are here to stay. In fact, lasers might be vitial to evacuation of the solar system: high powered lasers pushing laser sail powered starship to near lightspeed.

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2 minutes ago, Atmosph3rik said:

What about Phasers? :ph34r: 

In Star Trek cannon, phasers are particle beam weapons, which to be fair isn't as popular as slug throwers (chemical or electromagnetic), lasers, or missiles. I would like to see (realistic) particle beam weapons.

 

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Laser-tech are overratedly unrealistic even though this technology have been around since 1950s? To tell you the truth, it's being used in the military "right now". Have you ever heard of LAWS-weapon-system or perhaps ABLs(Airborne Lasers)? It even exists in guns called PHASRs. Yes, these are reality! The concept is really simple. How do you produce lasers? Through optical amplifier! It's basically a cone(we call this cone a "pump" and the bore of this cone is optical or made out of mirror. otherwise, how do you expect the energy to reflect?) with mirrors on both ends(the rear-mirror is what we call a "reflector", the front-mirror is what we call an "output"). You will pump energy(electric-current, which is electromagnetic-wave, same thing! In the future, we can use nuclear-reaction for the best-effectiveness) in the cone, those energy will go to the reflector, and it will all bounce to the output-mirror producing beam of energy. Energy is light or electromagnetic-radiation(they are all the same. Even heat is a form of electromagnetic-radiation that is not from conduction). This electromagnetic-signal still have to be amplified for gain. That's why you need a Doped-Fiber to amplify that energy after the Output-Coupler. It will pass through that Doped-Glass(this glass is made out of Erbium), amplifying that signal for that final-output of electromagnetic-signal(which is amplified).

Laser.svg

The disadvantage of lasers is it takes time for it to become more concentrated. Think of it this way; Electromagnetic-waves(or light-waves) are energy. The shorter the wavelength gets, the more energy. When it hits an object, they will become more and more compressed over time ofcourse. It will take time for that energy to build up on the contact of that object. In the future, greater and greater powerful pulse of electromagnetic-energy can be emitted through advancement of technology. You don't even need time for that energy to build up! As soon as it makes contact, it will cut through almost instantly. 

 

Also, as I already said, electromagnetic-energy (or light) are wavelengths. Visible-wavelengths such as red and green (like what you see in Star Wars) are not powerful enough. These are the type of lasers that you see as toys. Very powerful short-wavelengths that are invisible to human-eye (such as x-rays and gamma-rays) is what we should use in military. These light are powerful and damaging, but you cannot see them (I guess this is an advantage also). These are invisible-lasers and they are more powerful than visible (RGB) and lower-frequency-lights(whether they are visible or not). The most powerful lasers are on the highest frequency of spectrum.

Electromagnetic+Waves.jpg 

 

In conclusion, Lasers are not overrated. They have been around since when? If I'm not mistaken, the use of Magnifying Glass have been around since years of BC! What's overrated, I think, is the use of these lasers in movies like Star Trek and Star Wars. They are just very unrealistic! In Star Wars, you have Fighters that uses Horizontal-Stabilizers as Winglets, and do they have any Flight-Tabs? No! Not only it adds to the Drag, it cannot possibly turn! This movie is a joke! I've seen the latest-movie and I remember the scene when the captain crashed the ship to an enemy ship on a developing light speed. The fk? The collision propagated a loud sound, when in fact, sound cannot be created in a vacuum! Those movies are a joke and overrated! Not the concept of lasers because they already exists!

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So as I already explained, these are technically possible! Just to give NQ some of my ideas.

 

Genesis/Requiem of Gundam Seed (in real-life, beams as powerful as these are invisible, as I already explained. For in-game-immersion, make them visible as you like, I don't care. Basic-parts are giant-reflector-dish where the energy is all directed from, and an Output-Coupler and Amplifier Assembly which are designed in 1-single-assembly):

latest?cb=20090521065901hqdefault.jpg5a73b398.jpgep47b.jpg

 

Make the doped-glass of the Amplifier (which is made out of rare-material called "Erbium". you will make this rare in the game for amplification-purpose!) crack when you beam powerful destructive laser that is of very high frequency. Make this doped-glass craft-able in the game and have limited-life-span. The material is rare anyway. What happens if you run out of Erbium? You cannot amplify without a working-doped-glass!

 

Give us Amplification of Energy in this game! Even nuclear-explosion and radiation is energy. Heat that will vaporize you is "light", you just do not see it because it's invisible because of high frequency. They are all electromagnetic-wave (which we can also call "light"). 

 

In gundam seed, we have something called a cyclops-system(it's basically an Amplifier of Energy).

latest?cb=20090517140820latest?cb=20090517141626ep35b.jpg

We can miniaturize these amplifiers and put them in a nuclear-warhead! The moment that they explode, they are of very high frequency that matter itself will vaporize to elementary-particles.

 

And for godsake, give us Nuclear-Decay in this game! It's a mass-weapon-of-destruction, but the materials required are very rare (they even have to enrich the material in adequate-amounts). The goal in the game is to not let the enemies get their hands on these materials. If they had, you got to have a nuclear-agreement with them like Iran. You can stockpile these ICBMs for mainland-security-purpose and maybe use them for last-resort. I don't see anything wrong with it as long as the materials are rare.

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So as I was saying, laser-tech is a "must" in this game. In a world that is situated 10,000 years ahead from the present, an absence of this technology will make this game look unsophisticated, as we already have this technology right now in the present (since 50 years ago!). 

 

10,000 years in the future, who knows, they can also be used for ground-based anti-air-defence.  

 

According to my imagination, a big territory can be heavily fortified with these anti-air-lasers where enemies will try to breach through this defence. It will be heavily fortified like the airbase in Vietnam during Vietnam-War. 

gallery-1457650596-2455273.jpg?resize=76

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Eternal, please. Muh brain!

 

I'll stick to railguns and self-guided projectiles. Although short range lasers are absolute lethal, my choice is excellent for sniping and forcing my opponent into the line of rail-fire.

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Guide weapons can be jammed and laser travel time will be fast and use large amounts of energy but I'm old fashion and a wall of high velocity kinetic penetrators / bullets =) will still work nicely and cant be jammed ! 

 

Phalanx 20mm Close-in Weapon System (CIWS) by EumenesOfCardia

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7 hours ago, GunDeva said:

Guide weapons can be jammed and laser travel time will be fast and use large amounts of energy but I'm old fashion and a wall of high velocity kinetic penetrators / bullets =) will still work nicely and cant be jammed ! 

 

Phalanx 20mm Close-in Weapon System (CIWS) by EumenesOfCardia

Anything can be jammed.....  :)

 

 

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I'm sorry to necro this thread, but just for the sake of ppl who read this topic and Eternals explanation about lasers, literally everything he wrote concerning Lasers is wrong, so please don't remember or even distribute it.

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I partially agree with OP - lasers are boring. They are "point and click hitscan". Impossible to dodge, easy to use.

Partially, because I can see place in game for them, as low skill low reward weapons. For countering super fast/agile/small targets, but close to useless against anything armoured.

NOT as high tier weapon. IMO higher tier should go towards "harder to use, but more rewarding". Gameplay>realism.

 

Ballistic weapons have much more variables to play wit - projectile initial velocity, acceleration/declaration, various payload (kinetic, explosive, fragmentation), bullet drop, guidance (and guidance jamming), projectiles can be shoot down, recoil, ammunition, ect.

Compared to that, lasers are just dull.

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7 hours ago, CalenLoki said:

Ballistic weapons have much more variables to play wit - projectile initial velocity, acceleration/declaration, various payload (kinetic, explosive, fragmentation), bullet drop, guidance (and guidance jamming), projectiles can be shoot down, recoil, ammunition, ect.

Compared to that, lasers are just dull.

Which won't be ingame because this is no fps. It's a hitscan mechanic that determines if you hit the target or not

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Oh. I didn't know.

But you mean infantry combat? I though more about far future construct vs construct.

Can you provide source? I'd like to learn more about their combat ideas.


EDIT. I found it something kickstarter:

"We will provide a “lock & fire” mechanism to combat, to facilitate very large battles"

But it only indicates that you won't have to aim, not that all weapons are hitscan.

I'll search some more.

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it was said in some interviews / AMAs / devblogs (can't exactly remember where) that every weapon ingame (not only AvA but also CvC) will be lock and fire. it's the same mechanic as in EVE: input your parameters like distance, velocity, radial velocity, weapon type, stats of weapon, stats of character using the weapon (ingame skill), target stats, target velocity, target trajectory and so on - dump everything in an equation - returns 2 you crit, 1 you hit, 0 you miss (or everything in between). that's it, there is no reflex fps bs involved. will search for that interview though

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Sorry to necro, assuming this topic was dead, but laser weapons are not overrated, in fact there many ways that DU could use lasers and not all of them are as a form of weapons.

 

In the form of weaponry, lasers can be used to create a plasma chanal to guide lightning to a target. Using lightning on its own is a poor weapon as it will go through the path of least resistance not where you aim, but using lasers to for,m and maintain an area of plasma a new, less resistant path can be formed to aim the lightning. This would be a good mid to late game weapon and would allow for modular weapon construction as you add more powerful lasers and Tesla coils or different material for the creation of the plasma carrier. Here are some links to a video and an article explaining more about this concept. (Hacking The Planet: Laser Guided Lightning: Lightning laser weapon developed by US Army : http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-18630622)

 

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On 4/5/2018 at 11:07 PM, Emtec3PL said:

In laser gun Apply overheating as in EVE ONLINE

This will balance it also apply ENERGY COST

 

On 3/20/2018 at 1:54 AM, CalenLoki said:

Oh. I didn't know.

But you mean infantry combat? I though more about far future construct vs construct.

Can you provide source? I'd like to learn more about their combat ideas.


EDIT. I found it something kickstarter:

"We will provide a “lock & fire” mechanism to combat, to facilitate very large battles"

But it only indicates that you won't have to aim, not that all weapons are hitscan.

I'll search some more.

the above

 

On 2/11/2018 at 10:39 AM, GunDeva said:

Guide weapons can be jammed and laser travel time will be fast and use large amounts of energy but I'm old fashion and a wall of high velocity kinetic penetrators / bullets =) will still work nicely and cant be jammed ! 

 

Phalanx 20mm Close-in Weapon System (CIWS) by EumenesOfCardia

I mean force feilds can deflect or absorb but? not jam

On 2/2/2018 at 1:52 PM, Orius said:

Here's a thought: no laser weapons. You know how in Halo games it is the 24th century, and the earthlings never mastered laser weapon technology, so they still used mainly bullets and gunpowder? So here's a thought: we could have something similar to that and not have lasers but rather bullet guns. It seems more realistic this way, because the people on earth would never have time to build on laser tech because of the whole "end of the world" thing. 

 

-Rhino

There are other weapons you will be phasing out if you ONLY HAVE BULLETS that also kills diversity

On 3/19/2018 at 2:56 PM, CalenLoki said:

I partially agree with OP - lasers are boring. They are "point and click hitscan". Impossible to dodge, easy to use.

Partially, because I can see place in game for them, as low skill low reward weapons. For countering super fast/agile/small targets, but close to useless against anything armoured.

NOT as high tier weapon. IMO higher tier should go towards "harder to use, but more rewarding". Gameplay>realism.

 

Ballistic weapons have much more variables to play wit - projectile initial velocity, acceleration/declaration, various payload (kinetic, explosive, fragmentation), bullet drop, guidance (and guidance jamming), projectiles can be shoot down, recoil, ammunition, ect.

Compared to that, lasers are just dull.

Lasers lock on as seen above

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