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“Marketplace Heist” Response

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17 pages of demagoguery. Let's all the same turn to the primary sources. At least those that we all see and accept.
1. The first post in this thread. Quote:

Quote

An important aspect we are considering in all cases and investigations is intention. The intention behind this destruction is very clear to us. The players involved did not report this bug to us, but instead simply filled their pockets. Had this stopped with a single voxel removed it would be a different story.  This is, at its core, a violation of the EULA and against the intentions of beta. We have been as understanding as we can until this point, but there must be a line.

 

Let us be clear, we will not tolerate this kind of behaviour during any phase of the development of Dual Universe.

 

2. EULA referenced by an NQ employee. https://www.dualuniverse.game/legal/eula#article-5 

Quote:

Quote

5.2 You must refrain from engaging in any behaviour that could harm NOVAQUARK’s image and/or reputation, that could harm one or more other Users or have a negative impact on their gaming experience, or that is detrimental to the proper functioning of the Game.

 

Many people assume that NQ has banned players for gaining access. Although it is clearly and clearly visible for what reason it happened. NQ's actions do not contradict themselves or any other promises.
If the guys who got access to the market wrote with colored voxels on the wall "John was here" then nothing would have happened or the consequences would have been minimal. I think that NQ would have left this inscription as a meme and a landmark.


However, players instead began to remove not only voxels but also market modules. Where the players had in-game property and warrants. Did these players have negative experiences as a result of this action? Yes. Were they inconvenienced? Yes. Accordingly, a clear violation of clause 5.2. user agreement.


Dispute then about what? Many facts are distorted and instead of arguments people are already beginning to get personal, trying to justify their position.


Let me remind you that NQ clearly said that everything is allowed that does not prevent other players from playing. And this does not mean PVP and other game moments. All of them. When you attack a player in PVP or attack his base, your aggression is sanctioned by the game. Your opponent is a specific target. And you make decisions about the attack. There was clearly an action (albeit out of ignorance) that prevented a large number of impersonal players and made it impossible to use their items.

 

A similar question has already been raised regarding the construction of unreasonably high walls to interfere with other players. And the answer was the same. If everyone deliberately creates obstacles, there will be sanctions. Proof here. NQ-Naerais created a topic in Rules & Announcements

Quote

 

  • Environmental Walls/Creations: Use of the environmental and voxel tools allows the manipulation of terrain on owned and unowned tiles. You may build walls or other structures up to the allowed height, however, said constructions must not: 
    • Block access to market places or tutorials
    • Must abide by our Community Standards (phallic/sexual, political, religious or otherwise offensive shapes are not permitted)
    • Must not be placed with the intention of interfering with neighboring players. When players can not agree, the final decision on what is and is not acceptable is decided on a case-by-case basis by Novaquark staff.

 

Why then it seems to some that NQ are inconsistent in their actions.
For those who spray foam from the mouth and are unable to understand the first time, I will summarize.
GUYS NOT FUNNED FOR RDMS! Not for market access! They were banned for what they did next and did it INTENTIONALLY! Because 50+ times to select voxels and elements and put them in your pocket is not a random action!

 

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"that could harm one or more other Users or have a negative impact on their gaming experience, or that is detrimental to the proper functioning of the Game."

If youre going by this 1:1 attacking Players in PvP who dont consent would break that rule aswell. There are no sanctions and youre ruining someone elses day with it. This rule is so vague its useless. A removed partially disassembled market wouldnt stop players from playing in any way, there were still at least 17 markets left on alioth alone.

NQ banned because they had a absolute shit way to implement the database for unfathomable reasons which no player could have anticipated and players unintentionally deleted it. They overreacted to their own absolutely amateurish mistake. No reasonable developer would have implemented a database in that way. Thats an 10 year old approach on making a game. And youre forgetting this was out in the open for hours if not for days without any reaction from NQ, so it was not one or two players who participated is was several in the 10s, maybe 100s who knows for sure.

 

Quote
  • Must not be placed with the intention of interfering with neighboring players. When players can not agree, the final decision on what is and is not acceptable is decided on a case-by-case basis by Novaquark staff.

 

Are you saying we shouldve known by then that they would become unreasonable and limit people in their freedom or even punish people if they played the game within the games intended systems? Obviously NQ is straying away from their initial promise more and more. Crippling the game as time goes by.

 

There was absolutely no feasable indication that using the games system would have a perma ban as consequence. No prior example. No rule that wouldve made that clear (only rules that were reinterpreted and bend to an insane extend). No one in history of DU has interacted with an construct of NQ in that way, all other interaction with NQ placed structures did not have any negative consequences. Period.

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4 minutes ago, carijay766 said:

If youre going by this 1:1 attacking Players in PvP who dont consent would break that rule aswell. This rule is so vague its useless.

NQ banned because they had a absolute shit way to implement the database for unfathomable reasons which no player could have anticipated and players unintentionally deleted it. No reasonable developer would have implemented a database in that way. Thats an 10 year old approach on making a game. And youre forgetting this was out in the open for hours if not for days without any reaction from NQ, so it was not one or two players who participated is was several in the 10s, maybe 100s who knows for sure.

I rely on facts and documents from the developers. You rely on speculation and your own desires. In principle, everything is clear.

5 minutes ago, carijay766 said:

And youre forgetting this was out in the open for hours if not for days without any reaction from NQ, so it was not one or two players who participated is was several in the 10s, maybe 100s who knows for sure.

Too many assumptions.

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8 minutes ago, ColonkinYT said:

I rely on facts and documents from the developers. You rely on speculation and your own desires. In principle, everything is clear.

Too many assumptions.

Where is my speculation? Where is my assumption? I rely my arguments on avaible actual evidence (not on a post that consists of a lot of lies and contradictions), may it be from NQ, what ive seen with my own eyes or seen screenshoted/documented from other sources. It was definitely more than confirmed 10 people who took a hand full of voxels from the market. I just dont know the exact numbers. If im speculating I'm making it clear.

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12 minutes ago, ColonkinYT said:

17 pages of demagoguery. Let's all the same turn to the primary sources. At least those that we all see and accept.
1. The first post in this thread. Quote:

 

2. EULA referenced by an NQ employee. https://www.dualuniverse.game/legal/eula#article-5 

Quote:

 

Many people assume that NQ has banned players for gaining access. Although it is clearly and clearly visible for what reason it happened. NQ's actions do not contradict themselves or any other promises.
If the guys who got access to the market wrote with colored voxels on the wall "John was here" then nothing would have happened or the consequences would have been minimal. I think that NQ would have left this inscription as a meme and a landmark.


However, players instead began to remove not only voxels but also market modules. Where the players had in-game property and warrants. Did these players have negative experiences as a result of this action? Yes. Were they inconvenienced? Yes. Accordingly, a clear violation of clause 5.2. user agreement.


Dispute then about what? Many facts are distorted and instead of arguments people are already beginning to get personal, trying to justify their position.


Let me remind you that NQ clearly said that everything is allowed that does not prevent other players from playing. And this does not mean PVP and other game moments. All of them. When you attack a player in PVP or attack his base, your aggression is sanctioned by the game. Your opponent is a specific target. And you make decisions about the attack. There was clearly an action (albeit out of ignorance) that prevented a large number of impersonal players and made it impossible to use their items.

 

A similar question has already been raised regarding the construction of unreasonably high walls to interfere with other players. And the answer was the same. If everyone deliberately creates obstacles, there will be sanctions. Proof here. NQ-Naerais created a topic in Rules & Announcements

 

Why then it seems to some that NQ are inconsistent in their actions.
For those who spray foam from the mouth and are unable to understand the first time, I will summarize.
GUYS NOT FUNNED FOR RDMS! Not for market access! They were banned for what they did next and did it INTENTIONALLY! Because 50+ times to select voxels and elements and put them in your pocket is not a random action!

 

That section of the EULA you quoted is so vague it essentially means that bans can be handed out for making NQ look silly. If that's the section they were banned under the person who started this thread should probably consider banning any of their non-developer player accounts, as they sure as shit have damaged NQ's image and reputation much more than Scoopy and Uber did. Scoopy and Uber also directly stated that they did not take any market terminals as to not disrupt the experience of other players

What about the player who is a solo player and got permabanned for taking Two whole voxel lamps for his house? Did that impact the community? Did any player have a hard time because those two lamps were no longer there? 

 

Also if you're going to pull an "NQ clearly said..." let me remind you that they clearly said that permission based theft is 100% the fault of the person who failed to set the correct permissions so going by what NQ said taking everything there is absolutely fine, provided it wasn't the market terminals, which neither Uber nor Scoopy took, as such the only part of the EULA under that section they could have broken is the "They made us look silly which is the most retarded thing you could be banned for, never mind a permaban. 

 

As I've said before instead of swinging the ban hammer around like a fucking toy NQ should have used this as a positive PR event. Ran with" not even our stuff is safe if the permissions are incorrectly set! " then given every player who took something a little plaque they can place ingame with "I helped rearrange market 15" or "Market 15 beta tester" written on it. 

Then it would headline as "Developers thank players for helping highlight an issue during beta testing" if it headlined at all. 

Much better than the current headlines. 

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46 minutes ago, ColonkinYT said:

17 pages of demagoguery. Let's all the same turn to the primary sources. At least those that we all see and accept.
1. The first post in this thread. Quote:

 

2. EULA referenced by an NQ employee. https://www.dualuniverse.game/legal/eula#article-5 

Quote:

 

Many people assume that NQ has banned players for gaining access. Although it is clearly and clearly visible for what reason it happened. NQ's actions do not contradict themselves or any other promises.
If the guys who got access to the market wrote with colored voxels on the wall "John was here" then nothing would have happened or the consequences would have been minimal. I think that NQ would have left this inscription as a meme and a landmark.


However, players instead began to remove not only voxels but also market modules. Where the players had in-game property and warrants. Did these players have negative experiences as a result of this action? Yes. Were they inconvenienced? Yes. Accordingly, a clear violation of clause 5.2. user agreement.


Dispute then about what? Many facts are distorted and instead of arguments people are already beginning to get personal, trying to justify their position.


Let me remind you that NQ clearly said that everything is allowed that does not prevent other players from playing. And this does not mean PVP and other game moments. All of them. When you attack a player in PVP or attack his base, your aggression is sanctioned by the game. Your opponent is a specific target. And you make decisions about the attack. There was clearly an action (albeit out of ignorance) that prevented a large number of impersonal players and made it impossible to use their items.

 

A similar question has already been raised regarding the construction of unreasonably high walls to interfere with other players. And the answer was the same. If everyone deliberately creates obstacles, there will be sanctions. Proof here. NQ-Naerais created a topic in Rules & Announcements

 

Why then it seems to some that NQ are inconsistent in their actions.
For those who spray foam from the mouth and are unable to understand the first time, I will summarize.
GUYS NOT FUNNED FOR RDMS! Not for market access! They were banned for what they did next and did it INTENTIONALLY! Because 50+ times to select voxels and elements and put them in your pocket is not a random action!

 

This person gets it.

 

The writing is in black and white... And pretty clear.

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4 minutes ago, carijay766 said:

Where is my speculation? Where is my assumption? I rely my arguments on avaible evidence aswell, maybe it be from NQ, what ive seen with my own eyes or seen screenshoted/documented in other ways. It was definitely more than confirmed 10 people who took a hand full of voxels from the market. I just dont know the exact numbers. If im speculating I'm making it clear.

Ok. I do not claim complete knowledge. Therefore, I will indicate those places that you clearly assume and distort.
1. 

19 minutes ago, carijay766 said:

NQ banned because they had a absolute shit way to implement the database for unfathomable reasons which no player could have anticipated and players unintentionally deleted it.

Do you know exactly how the database is implemented? Or do you suppose? The fact that links to the markets were lost is a fact. As in the game, when you remove an engine or machine, the link is lost.

 

2. 

Quote

And youre forgetting this was out in the open for hours if not for days without any reaction from NQ, so it was not one or two players who participated is was several in the 10s, maybe 100s who knows for sure.

So days or hours? 10 or 100 players?
It is about these assumptions that I speak. You base your judgments on them.
Regardless of how many people beat one person, everyone will be responsible personally.
Even if the developers did a bad job of the database, even if this is the approach of 10 years ago, it does not justify what was done.

I don’t understand at all how arrogant or stupid it is to steal from the developer market and then admit it to them. What were they hoping for?

 

I will explain my position. You may be interested in this (but I'm not sure about it). )))

 

The developers in the game act as a game master. They don't take part in the game. They make the rules. If a player applies everything that is allowed in relation to another player, this will be ignored. (except what was described in the post about bugs). In our case, there was an attempt to attack the game master. This was suppressed. Everyone should know their boundaries. And the guys suffered exactly for that.

 

About the user agreement. Yes, I agree that the wording is very vague. But this is a common game practice. Unfortunately, nothing belongs to us here ...)))

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23 minutes ago, DavidDavidson said:

Also if you're going to pull an "NQ clearly said..." let me remind you that they clearly said that permission based theft is 100% the fault of the person who failed to set the correct permissions so going by what NQ said taking everything there is absolutely fine, provided it wasn't the market terminals, which neither Uber nor Scoopy took, as such the only part of the EULA under that section they could have broken is the "They made us look silly which is the most retarded thing you could be banned for, never mind a permaban. 

...permission based theft is 100% the fault of the person who failed to set the correct permissions... PERSON! And the structure of the game master was attacked. They are not the same thing. ))

 

They made us look silly - 

Quote

You must refrain from engaging in any behaviour that could harm NOVAQUARK’s image and/or reputation,

There is also a clause about this in the user agreement.
 

I'm not saying this point is fair. There is little that can be called fair in this world. But he is. The guys put the developers in a bad light. And they paid.

Where is the inconsistency?

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27 minutes ago, ColonkinYT said:

Ok. I do not claim complete knowledge. Therefore, I will indicate those places that you clearly assume and distort.
1. 

Do you know exactly how the database is implemented? Or do you suppose? The fact that links to the markets were lost is a fact. As in the game, when you remove an engine or machine, the link is lost.

 

 

 

The no links are lost in bp. No database is lost of stored correctly and professionally. The database. The market names. All was lost even tho they set the elements themselfs again (I was around when it happened and checked the terminals occassionally and followed the process).

 

Quote

2. 

So days or hours? 10 or 100 players?
It is about these assumptions that I speak. You base your judgments on them.
Regardless of how many people beat one person, everyone will be responsible personally.
Even if the developers did a bad job of the database, even if this is the approach of 10 years ago, it does not justify what was done.

I don’t understand at all how arrogant or stupid it is to steal from the developer market and then admit it to them. What were they hoping for?

Theyre and you were basing your justification for a perma ban on their intentional destruction of the database and the hard to replace part.

 

An official warning and statement towards the players involved, a clarification of the situation and a deletion of the stolen items or voluntary return would have absoltely been appropiate and no one wouldve bat an eye about that. I talked to several players involved and all of them have told me they even deleted all the items very shortly after taking them, because they did not want to gain a profit from this (some kept a souvenier at best until it was obviously deemed a bannable offense in hindsight). Scoopy and Uber did not touch the AGGs as they were of high value. The market terminal themself were of no value and not even placable, they became a mere souvenier of the incident. The plastic voxels that the market was made out of has no huge value either. I guess you could have charged them for some XS lamps at bot market price if not returned or proof of deletion.

 

Quote

The developers in the game act as a game master. 

Exactly and they have shown that theyre insane, irrational and tyrannical masters on the one hand and on the other hand nepotic and grooming towards certain alpha backers.. Only the most immoral people in history have sided with such people.

If an authority gets contradictory, hypocritical or start even blatantly lying to you they loose their natural authority and can only push their stuff thru with force and fear. This has never lead to anything lasting or positive in the history of mankind.

Its their right to make shitty business decisions. Its their right to ban half the player base. But if you love DU you should change your thinking. Its not NQ we're here for its DU.

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8 minutes ago, carijay766 said:

The no links are lost in bp. No database is lost of stored correctly and professionally. The database. The market names. All was lost even tho they set the elements themselfs again (I was around when it happened and checked the terminals occassionally and followed the process).

Again you are guessing based on your own observations. The fact that we see the sun rises and sets does not make us experts on the mechanics of the universe. These are just observations. Which you are trying to pass off as a fact. I admit that you are a specialist in game design, databases and a good programmer. But this does not give you EXACT knowledge of how everything works here. But many statements (not necessarily by you) are constructed this way. First, a hypothesis is put forward, and then reasoning is built on the basis of a hypothesis, not facts. Here I have no complaints against you personally. I see a lot of posts built like this.

 

11 minutes ago, carijay766 said:

An official warning and statement towards the players involved, a clarification of the situation and a deletion of the stolen items or voluntary return would have absoltely been appropiate and no one wouldve bat an eye about that. I talked to several players involved and all of them have told me they even deleted all the items very shortly after taking them, because they did not want to gain a profit from this (some kept a souvenier at best until it was obviously deemed a bannable offense in hindsight). Scoopy and Uber did not touch the AGGs as they were of high value. The market terminal themself were of no value and not even placable, they became a mere souvenier of the incident. The plastic voxels that the market was made out of has no huge value either. I guess you could have charged them for some XS lamps at bot market price if not returned or proof of deletion.

When the punishment for an action becomes more real, criminals always want to just return and forget. )) I have not seen NQ's logs and have no idea on what basis they made the decision to ban certain players. But I'm not surprised that the ringleaders suffered.
In real life, the instigators are always shot or punished the most severely. Even if they themselves did not rob, they killed and raped. It is with their call that everything begins.

Yes, the developers did it tough. Perhaps too much. But sooner or later, this precedent must arise.

 

 

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Hello Noveans, 

 

At this stage it’s hard to ignore that the “Market Heist” has definitely caused a stir of dialogue and reactions both in our community and on the internet.

 

We have taken some time to look at the situation in more detail: the actions of these players are not ok, not condoned, and will not be tolerated. We stand by our decision, and we’d like to better explain it. 

 

Most of what Novaquark builds within the game world, such as markets, institutes or the Arkship is not a player-owned construct. It is a part of the game play designed to serve all players. There are exceptions, like shipwrecks, which are designed for salvaging, and clearly communicated as such. 

 

We did, indeed, state to players that if RDMS is not properly set on a construct, and it results in theft, it’s part of the game and we won’t act upon it. This is to acknowledge that treason can happen in an organization, for instance, and is part of the emergent gameplay we’re trying to promote. 

 

Now, this does obviously not apply to NQ-built constructs, which are designed to serve a specific purpose in the game. It is obvious that these constructs, owned by NQ accounts or Aphelia, are not meant to be interacted with in the same manner as player constructs. Besides, they may contain some highly overpowered and unbalanced elements which were never meant to fall in the hands of players. So the situation with the market is clearly covered by section 5.2 of the EULA: “You must refrain from engaging in any behaviour that could harm NOVAQUARK’s image and/or reputation, that could harm one or more other Users or have a negative impact on their gaming experience, or that is detrimental to the proper functioning of the Game.”

 

Finally, and for the record, the issue with the market did not result in a wrongly-set RDMS, but rather in a duplication bug. Part of what we use is the same tools as players to build constructs. We create one district, then duplicate it. Something went wrong in the duplication process of one of the markets, which resulted in players being able to edit it.

 

Were we harsh? Yes. But we had previously communicated that we would no longer tolerate abuses of bugs and issues. We do realize that perhaps this started innocently enough in that someone pressed “B” while standing on a market. But it went beyond this, and that shows intention. The players involved indicated that they reported the issue, and after further investigation, one did, though not by following the proper feedback channel: they pinged a staff account on Discord in the middle of the night. We’ve clearly stated that staff do not respond to pings on Discord, and that the reporting method for exploits and bugs of this nature is either via our ticket system, or via a community manager on the forums. 

 

Even a proper attempt to inform us about an exploit doesn’t mean that it’s OK to go on and abuse it. Communicating an exploit to the NQ staff doesn’t serve as a way to absolve the players, it’s only meant to ensure that we fix the issue - it’s not a free pass to use an exploit. The banned players destroyed a player market by dismantling it, and the fact that they communicated with us via Reddit with a request not to be banned shows that they knew what they were doing was wrong. They posted on Reddit, proud of their ‘achievement’ and of the destruction. 

 

In the end, repairing the damage cost us hours of manpower across multiple departments, which could have been invested into further progressing the game. 

 

That is why we take this seriously. 

 

Here are a couple of things that we’d like to reiterate:

  • We are in beta.  Things aren’t always going to work as intended. But we have a persistent, single-shard universe, and altering its foundations impacts all players.
  • Bug Fixes aren’t instant. They take manpower time to find, investigate, fix, test and roll out. We try to make sure that fixing a bug doesn’t introduce a dozen more.
  • As beta players, we count on you to help us and report bugs, not abuse them. We believe that this is fairly standard for most games.  

We genuinely hope this brings some clarity to the situation, and ask you all to remember this is a communal effort. We’re in this together.

 

Sincerely,
The Novaquark Team
 

 

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You just keep digging the grave. Very disappointing.

 

Also this:

Quote

It is obvious that these constructs, owned by NQ accounts or Aphelia, are not meant to be interacted with in the same manner as player constructs.

 

Is far from obvious and clear. By using your own convoluted logic bends it is very much feasible to think that Aphelia's Constructs will at some point be subject to Territory Warfare.

 

 

Quote

In the end, repairing the damage cost us hours of manpower across multiple departments, which could have been invested into further progressing the game.  "

Which is noone fault but your own? If you didn't have this major design flaw in how the Markets work, it would have been as simple as setting down a new Building from a Blueprint.

 

It could have been a necessary learning experience for you of how to manage an MMO. Instead it seems to me you still refuse Basic MMO lessons from the last 20+ years.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Rashi_ said:

Is far from obvious and clear. By using your own convoluted logic bends it is very much feasible to think that Aphelia's Constructs will at some point be subject to Territory Warfare.

Where is that written? Why do you think so?

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16 minutes ago, NQ-Naerais said:

Hello Noveans, 

 

At this stage it’s hard to ignore that the “Market Heist” has definitely caused a stir of dialogue and reactions both in our community and on the internet.

 

We have taken some time to look at the situation in more detail: the actions of these players are not ok, not condoned, and will not be tolerated. We stand by our decision, and we’d like to better explain it. 

 

Most of what Novaquark builds within the game world, such as markets, institutes or the Arkship is not a player-owned construct. It is a part of the game play designed to serve all players. There are exceptions, like shipwrecks, which are designed for salvaging, and clearly communicated as such. 

 

We did, indeed, state to players that if RDMS is not properly set on a construct, and it results in theft, it’s part of the game and we won’t act upon it. This is to acknowledge that treason can happen in an organization, for instance, and is part of the emergent gameplay we’re trying to promote. 

 

Now, this does obviously not apply to NQ-built constructs, which are designed to serve a specific purpose in the game. It is obvious that these constructs, owned by NQ accounts or Aphelia, are not meant to be interacted with in the same manner as player constructs. Besides, they may contain some highly overpowered and unbalanced elements which were never meant to fall in the hands of players. So the situation with the market is clearly covered by section 5.2 of the EULA: “You must refrain from engaging in any behaviour that could harm NOVAQUARK’s image and/or reputation, that could harm one or more other Users or have a negative impact on their gaming experience, or that is detrimental to the proper functioning of the Game.”

 

Finally, and for the record, the issue with the market did not result in a wrongly-set RDMS, but rather in a duplication bug. Part of what we use is the same tools as players to build constructs. We create one district, then duplicate it. Something went wrong in the duplication process of one of the markets, which resulted in players being able to edit it.

 

Were we harsh? Yes. But we had previously communicated that we would no longer tolerate abuses of bugs and issues. We do realize that perhaps this started innocently enough in that someone pressed “B” while standing on a market. But it went beyond this, and that shows intention. The players involved indicated that they reported the issue, and after further investigation, one did, though not by following the proper feedback channel: they pinged a staff account on Discord in the middle of the night. We’ve clearly stated that staff do not respond to pings on Discord, and that the reporting method for exploits and bugs of this nature is either via our ticket system, or via a community manager on the forums. 

 

Even a proper attempt to inform us about an exploit doesn’t mean that it’s OK to go on and abuse it. Communicating an exploit to the NQ staff doesn’t serve as a way to absolve the players, it’s only meant to ensure that we fix the issue - it’s not a free pass to use an exploit. The banned players destroyed a player market by dismantling it, and the fact that they communicated with us via Reddit with a request not to be banned shows that they knew what they were doing was wrong. They posted on Reddit, proud of their ‘achievement’ and of the destruction. 

 

In the end, repairing the damage cost us hours of manpower across multiple departments, which could have been invested into further progressing the game. 

 

That is why we take this seriously. 

 

Here are a couple of things that we’d like to reiterate:

  • We are in beta.  Things aren’t always going to work as intended. But we have a persistent, single-shard universe, and altering its foundations impacts all players.
  • Bug Fixes aren’t instant. They take manpower time to find, investigate, fix, test and roll out. We try to make sure that fixing a bug doesn’t introduce a dozen more.
  • As beta players, we count on you to help us and report bugs, not abuse them. We believe that this is fairly standard for most games.  

We genuinely hope this brings some clarity to the situation, and ask you all to remember this is a communal effort. We’re in this together.

 

Sincerely,
The Novaquark Team
 

 

This is what myself and dozens of others have said.  

 

Time to lock this down and say good riddance to trash.

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On 10/21/2020 at 8:39 PM, Ram said:

Plenty of people care. Ones with decent moral standing. Thats why offenders were punished. Arbitrary lol. Ingame mechanic lol. Yes completely leave out any contexts to make it seem like they didn't do nuffin.

you're the same dude who is going to cry when you get killed in PVP. This is no different than the human-based 'immoral' actions of a PVPer, taking advantage of noobs who leave their stuff unlocked. Except the 'noob' happened to be a staffer and they banned someone because their pride was hurt.

In a game being developed to allow interesting human on human interactions, a ban for utilizing an in-game mechanic (call it spin if you want but that's what it was) when a human made a mistake is ridiculous, arbitrary, and a great reason for me to not renew. I'm the type of person who will take advantage of you when you leave something unlocked, unattended, or undefended in the game because of the excitement. I don't want to be banned for outwitting you or catching you slipping.

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14 minutes ago, le_souriceau said:

Then you have some problems, if such simple thing is diffucult to understand.

If it's "obvious" why were they allowed to edit it? Not being allowed to edit it would have made it "obvious". To me, the fact that NQ 'allowed' them to edit it OBVIOUSLY means it was something they were 'allowed' to do.

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29 minutes ago, NQ-Naerais said:

Hello Noveans, 

 

At this stage it’s hard to ignore that the “Market Heist” has definitely caused a stir of dialogue and reactions both in our community and on the internet.

 

We have taken some time to look at the situation in more detail: the actions of these players are not ok, not condoned, and will not be tolerated. We stand by our decision, and we’d like to better explain it. 

 

Most of what Novaquark builds within the game world, such as markets, institutes or the Arkship is not a player-owned construct. It is a part of the game play designed to serve all players. There are exceptions, like shipwrecks, which are designed for salvaging, and clearly communicated as such. 

 

We did, indeed, state to players that if RDMS is not properly set on a construct, and it results in theft, it’s part of the game and we won’t act upon it. This is to acknowledge that treason can happen in an organization, for instance, and is part of the emergent gameplay we’re trying to promote. 

 

Now, this does obviously not apply to NQ-built constructs, which are designed to serve a specific purpose in the game. It is obvious that these constructs, owned by NQ accounts or Aphelia, are not meant to be interacted with in the same manner as player constructs. Besides, they may contain some highly overpowered and unbalanced elements which were never meant to fall in the hands of players. So the situation with the market is clearly covered by section 5.2 of the EULA: “You must refrain from engaging in any behaviour that could harm NOVAQUARK’s image and/or reputation, that could harm one or more other Users or have a negative impact on their gaming experience, or that is detrimental to the proper functioning of the Game.”

 

Finally, and for the record, the issue with the market did not result in a wrongly-set RDMS, but rather in a duplication bug. Part of what we use is the same tools as players to build constructs. We create one district, then duplicate it. Something went wrong in the duplication process of one of the markets, which resulted in players being able to edit it.

 

Were we harsh? Yes. But we had previously communicated that we would no longer tolerate abuses of bugs and issues. We do realize that perhaps this started innocently enough in that someone pressed “B” while standing on a market. But it went beyond this, and that shows intention. The players involved indicated that they reported the issue, and after further investigation, one did, though not by following the proper feedback channel: they pinged a staff account on Discord in the middle of the night. We’ve clearly stated that staff do not respond to pings on Discord, and that the reporting method for exploits and bugs of this nature is either via our ticket system, or via a community manager on the forums. 

 

Even a proper attempt to inform us about an exploit doesn’t mean that it’s OK to go on and abuse it. Communicating an exploit to the NQ staff doesn’t serve as a way to absolve the players, it’s only meant to ensure that we fix the issue - it’s not a free pass to use an exploit. The banned players destroyed a player market by dismantling it, and the fact that they communicated with us via Reddit with a request not to be banned shows that they knew what they were doing was wrong. They posted on Reddit, proud of their ‘achievement’ and of the destruction. 

 

In the end, repairing the damage cost us hours of manpower across multiple departments, which could have been invested into further progressing the game. 

 

That is why we take this seriously. 

 

Here are a couple of things that we’d like to reiterate:

  • We are in beta.  Things aren’t always going to work as intended. But we have a persistent, single-shard universe, and altering its foundations impacts all players.
  • Bug Fixes aren’t instant. They take manpower time to find, investigate, fix, test and roll out. We try to make sure that fixing a bug doesn’t introduce a dozen more.
  • As beta players, we count on you to help us and report bugs, not abuse them. We believe that this is fairly standard for most games.  

We genuinely hope this brings some clarity to the situation, and ask you all to remember this is a communal effort. We’re in this together.

 

Sincerely,
The Novaquark Team
 

 

Weak. Scapegoating. Poor leadership. No accountability. Bad communication. Terrible decision.

 

I'm out.

 

Next time you fck up, man up, take responsibility, have a laugh because It's a game, and keep people who are so engaged in the game that they're curious and exploring every possible aspect of it. These people finding bugs are the ones you want. You're going to be left with some boring ass vanilla gamers who want to stay in their bubble and not touch anything, and this whole game is going to be bugged to shit and will become unpopulated.

Reverse the decision and show you've actually learned from YOUR mistakes, and I'll be renewing. Otherwise, I'm not putting another dime into a game with immature devs who blame their users rather than take responsibility.

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2 minutes ago, Flamm said:

in order to show my disagrement about NQ prema-BAN action i decide to stop play DU for at least one Month.

 

Same. I'm disappointed I can't actually go in and "unsubscribe" so they get the hint now rather than when I simply don't renew in a month or two.

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11 minutes ago, Promulgator said:

Weak. Scapegoating. Poor leadership. No accountability. Bad communication. Terrible decision.

 

I'm out.

 

Next time you fck up, man up, take responsibility, have a laugh because It's a game, and keep people who are so engaged in the game that they're curious and exploring every possible aspect of it. These people finding bugs are the ones you want. You're going to be left with some boring ass vanilla gamers who want to stay in their bubble and not touch anything, and this whole game is going to be bugged to shit and will become unpopulated.

Reverse the decision and show you've actually learned from YOUR mistakes, and I'll be renewing. Otherwise, I'm not putting another dime into a game with immature devs who blame their users rather than take responsibility.

K bye then. Nothing of value will have been lost.

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1 minute ago, Arctic_fox said:

K bye then. Nothing of value will have been lost.

If you don't think paying customers so engaged that they are discovering bugs are of value, your social worker should take your computer away because you're too disabled to use the internet.

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1 minute ago, Promulgator said:

If you don't think paying customers so engaged that they are discovering bugs are of value, your social worker should take your computer away because you're too disabled to use the internet.

lul and yet your still here crying like a toddler screaming "ima run away" and throwing insults like a village idiot. You and people like you tend to stomp around screaming and waving your hands around. But you are usually all talk and will soon be back to moaping under your bridge until the next thing you can throw a tantrum over comes along. And if you do leave well, im sure some rust group will be more then happy to take you.

 

So again bye!

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