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“Marketplace Heist” Response

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NQ messed up, players use intended game mechanics in a SANDBOX game where it's all about trying and doing stuff. Players get banned. (c) Dual Universe.

 

Like common, we pay real money to run around and press buttons. People pressed buttons that are allowed and had fun. No, you can't have fun. Pending operation didn't complete yet.

 

In 2020 developers think that their playerbase is a QA department that pays them and that should report bugs because they have beta in their name.

 

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Is there any confirmation that this was possible due to RDMS misconfiguration? I haven't seen any.

 

Even if so, to all you people who compare this to previous RDMS theft, there's a significant difference that can't just be tagged with "hypocrisy" and be called done: this "heist" didn't just target NQ - above all it was an attack against all of us and I have a hard time reading your postings defending that.

 

The most important difference between a construct owned by a player versus Aphelia is not a question of customer versus provider. The difference is in the number of players that rely on it and would be affected negatively. As said above, this was an attack against all of us - not just because "some of us" lost market orders, but because "all of us" now can expect a delay on the next update and other issues because NQ needs to tend to this issue now. In addition it impacts trust and cooperation between the player base and the provider.

 

Even if you are right and this theft is technically the same as other RDMS theft, it's still a vastly different thing to sabotage "our game and NQ's development" versus "a player's construct" - to me that's not hypocrisy but apples versus oranges. On the note of real world examples: this is like going to a building site and steal the copper pipes because there was no door. Just that this is the building we all want to live in, not just the shed of some hermit.

 

 

Many people, including me, think NQ should be more transparent and communicate openly - but by solely reading this thread I almost wouldn't want to talk to you anymore in their stead... but that doesn't take into account that I also think we're in this situation because they didn't communicate properly in the first place. Now people are jumping to conclusions again, calling them out based on made-up hypotheses alone, not really knowing anything? First paragraph of this answer: RDMS misconfiguration? Give me the link to that NQ confirmation first, on which your bad "reaction" vibes are based please - otherwise you're not reacting but just acting based on an imagined reality. I'm sorry if I just missed that piece of information about RDMS misconfiguration if there was anything official - even tho it still wouldn't change my general opinion.

 

 

The critics regarding "Why is Aphelia's market build and stored dynamically?" is easy to answer: player markets are planned. So setting up hard coded markets and then create another system with redundant functionality would be a waste of time. Aphelia owned markets are ground work for player owned markets and lets all of us test and harden it before we put our own terminals down. Once that happens markets will be spilled all over the game world and it would be a lot harder to maintain/fix/develop the system with an ever changing number of markets and different market configurations than working with a fixed set of Aphelia owned markets now.

 

Btw: it's been said here that Aphelia "is a player" - but that's not true. At best it's an NPC character that doesn't even have an avatar standing around in game. Aphelia doesn't set up RDMS policies either - again just presuming that it was "owners fault".

 

 

Ok, it may look like "Done to you? Haha! Done to us? Nono!" but to me that's way too simple and feels like a reaction of someone holding a grudge because of his personal situation or hurt feelings regarding prior injustice (for which we don't know why what decision made on which grounds). Some thought NQ only posted those announcements because "people whined" and refused to listen before their very special exploit was directly listed, even tho NQ clearly stated it as general rules - well, now at least you know, eh? ;) 

 

To those who say it's not clearly stated in the rules that you can't dismantle a market if it's in jeopardy because of "RDMS misconfiguration" (unconfirmed afaict) and the issue therefore should be treated exactly like any other player base RDMS scam, here's an excerpt from the EULA that Naerais referred to in the original post:

Quote

5.2. You must refrain from engaging in any behaviour that could harm NOVAQUARK’s image and/or reputation, that could harm one or more other Users or have a negative impact on their gaming experience, or that is detrimental to the proper functioning of the Game.

Source https://www.dualuniverse.game/legal/eula

 

^ If destroying a market ain't "detrimental to the proper functioning" I don't know what else could be. Permanent ban? Correct decision. This wasn't an accident - this was a deliberate act. And Naerais said explicitly that there was no report made by the people in question. Hence they put their lust for publicity and their ego above the well-being of everyone else in this community and even above the spirit of the beta, where we're supposed to help test and report issues to aid development. It's a 180° deviation from this ship's course and if they failed to see that they should not be part of this.

 

Even tho yesterday I told some friends I think "if NQ got balls" they could remove the stolen elements that players normally don't have access to and otherwise just say "gg" - meaning I would've be fine with that too - but when I said that I didn't know the magnitude or that players' orders would be affected.

 

To those who say that they don't want to test anymore because they don't know if that test could lead to them being banned: I agree, if you can't tell the difference between a) testing if you can remove unimportant elements from a market that you know you shouldn't have access to and then report and refrain from doing more harm, versus b) ripping a market apart, utterly destroying it... then yes, I agree that you should stop testing. But I'm pretty sure that distinction should be rather easy for everyone, so I'd suggest and prefer if you'd just rethink that over exaggerating stance ;) 

 

tl;dr

Seeing them finally taking action is highly welcome. I'm all for "innocent until proven guilty" - but this case is without any doubt. I hope future decisions will be just as strict when there's sufficient evidence to act without risk of hitting the wrong target. And I hope that they'll soon be up to date with reports again and act faster - right now we don't even know if the past exploit thefts (not RDMS mistakes) will remain without action or if they're still investigating. Tracing an issue and distinguishing it from normal/legit behaviour can be pretty difficult and take time. Just because we haven't seen action for that yet doesn't mean it's not gonna come at some point - even if they could act quickly on the "market heist" issue, which just means that the facts were clear and it was easy to trace and act.

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3 minutes ago, vertex said:

Is there any confirmation that this was possible due to RDMS misconfiguration? I haven't seen any.

 

Even if so, to all you people who compare this to previous RDMS theft, there's a significant difference that can't just be tagged with "hypocrisy" and be called done: this "heist" didn't just target NQ - above all it was an attack against all of us and I have a hard time reading your postings defending that.

 

The most important difference between a construct owned by a player versus Aphelia is not a question of customer versus provider. The difference is in the number of players that rely on it and would be affected negatively. As said above, this was an attack against all of us - not just because "some of us" lost market orders, but because "all of us" now can expect a delay on the next update and other issues because NQ needs to tend to this issue now. In addition it impacts trust and cooperation between the player base and the provider.

 

Even if you are right and this theft is technically the same as other RDMS theft, it's still a vastly different thing to sabotage "our game and NQ's development" versus "a player's construct" - to me that's not hypocrisy but apples versus oranges. On the note of real world examples: this is like going to a building site and steal the copper pipes because there was no door. Just that this is the building we all want to live in, not just the shed of some hermit.

 

 

Many people, including me, think NQ should be more transparent and communicate openly - but by solely reading this thread I almost wouldn't want to talk to you anymore in their stead... but that doesn't take into account that I also think we're in this situation because they didn't communicate properly in the first place. Now people are jumping to conclusions again, calling them out based on made-up hypotheses alone, not really knowing anything? First paragraph of this answer: RDMS misconfiguration? Give me the link to that NQ confirmation first, on which your bad "reaction" vibes are based please - otherwise you're not reacting but just acting based on an imagined reality. I'm sorry if I just missed that piece of information about RDMS misconfiguration if there was anything official - even tho it still wouldn't change my general opinion.

 

 

The critics regarding "Why is Aphelia's market build and stored dynamically?" is easy to answer: player markets are planned. So setting up hard coded markets and then create another system with redundant functionality would be a waste of time. Aphelia owned markets are ground work for player owned markets and lets all of us test and harden it before we put our own terminals down. Once that happens markets will be spilled all over the game world and it would be a lot harder to maintain/fix/develop the system with an ever changing number of markets and different market configurations than working with a fixed set of Aphelia owned markets now.

 

Btw: it's been said here that Aphelia "is a player" - but that's not true. At best it's an NPC character that doesn't even have an avatar standing around in game. Aphelia doesn't set up RDMS policies either - again just presuming that it was "owners fault".

 

 

Ok, it may look like "Done to you? Haha! Done to us? Nono!" but to me that's way too simple and feels like a reaction of someone holding a grudge because of his personal situation or hurt feelings regarding prior injustice (for which we don't know why what decision made on which grounds). Some thought NQ only posted those announcements because "people whined" and refused to listen before their very special exploit was directly listed, even tho NQ clearly stated it as general rules - well, now at least you know, eh? ;) 

 

To those who say it's not clearly stated in the rules that you can't dismantle a market if it's in jeopardy because of "RDMS misconfiguration" (unconfirmed afaict) and the issue therefore should be treated exactly like any other player base RDMS scam, here's an excerpt from the EULA that Naerais referred to in the original post:

Source https://www.dualuniverse.game/legal/eula

 

^ If destroying a market ain't "detrimental to the proper functioning" I don't know what else could be. Permanent ban? Correct decision. This wasn't an accident - this was a deliberate act. And Naerais said explicitly that there was no report made by the people in question. Hence they put their lust for publicity and their ego above the well-being of everyone else in this community and even above the spirit of the beta, where we're supposed to help test and report issues to aid development. It's a 180° deviation from this ship's course and if they failed to see that they should not be part of this.

 

Even tho yesterday I told some friends I think "if NQ got balls" they could remove the stolen elements that players normally don't have access to and otherwise just say "gg" - meaning I would've be fine with that too - but when I said that I didn't know the magnitude or that players' orders would be affected.

 

To those who say that they don't want to test anymore because they don't know if that test could lead to them being banned: I agree, if you can't tell the difference between a) testing if you can remove unimportant elements from a market that you know you shouldn't have access to and then report and refrain from doing more harm, versus b) ripping a market apart, utterly destroying it... then yes, I agree that you should stop testing. But I'm pretty sure that distinction should be rather easy for everyone, so I'd suggest and prefer if you'd just rethink that over exaggerating stance ;) 

 

tl;dr

Seeing them finally taking action is highly welcome. I'm all for "innocent until proven guilty" - but this case is without any doubt. I hope future decisions will be just as strict when there's sufficient evidence to act without risk of hitting the wrong target. And I hope that they'll soon be up to date with reports again and act faster - right now we don't even know if the past exploit thefts (not RDMS mistakes) will remain without action or if they're still investigating. Tracing an issue and distinguishing it from normal/legit behaviour can be pretty difficult and take time. Just because we haven't seen action for that yet doesn't mean it's not gonna come at some point - even if they could act quickly on the "market heist" issue, which just means that the facts were clear and it was easy to trace and act.

NQ has harmed their image more by their absurd response to the theft from their wide open RDMS than from suffering the RDMS theft.

 

They're welcome to selfban for ruining their image.

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Dual Universe needs Drama, so, we got another.


But seriously, does perma ban means an individual or an account ? 

if its just an account, can someone please just offer a betakey to the 'heroes' that have done so completely brainless actions , so we can go and steal their stuff
when we finally have working PVP?
That would hopefully end this dramaqueenish BS.

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16 hours ago, Mordgier said:

I agree with your general idea, but I'd be far more open to NQs response if they had also banned all the dupers.

 

All the dupers got was a note asking them to self report on Sept 22 within 48 hours and delete their duped mats. What since then?

 

If the market was looted with RDMS exploit, ok yeah a ban, but this was a misconfiguration by the devs. 

 

A ban for this while inaction on literally everything else sine beta seems heavy handed.

Actually you can't really ban dupers, since the game dupes by itself quite frequently.

 

This Theft is so bad on NQ... the proper handling would have been a statue to the successful thieves.

I am not surprised this exposed them this badly.

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1 minute ago, Rashi_ said:

Actually you can't really ban dupers, since the game dupes by itself quite frequently.

 

This Theft is so bad on NQ... the proper handling would have been a statue to the successful thieves.

I am not surprised this exposed them this badly.

Exactly, they could turn it into lulz for community especially that material gain/game impact is minimal. Instead, no-no banhammer swing.

Like, there was that thing called monocle and a statue that got ruined for those who know what I mean.

 

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1 minute ago, Rashi_ said:

Actually you can't really ban dupers, since the game dupes by itself quite frequently.

 

This Theft is so bad on NQ... the proper handling would have been a statue to the successful thieves.

I am not surprised this exposed them this badly.

I think there should be punishment.

 

It would have set a terrible precedent if there was none.

 

I would have done it more in the spirit of the game though. Bind the player to a rez node in JC's castle dungeon for the crime against Aphelia and call it a day.

 

An out of game EULA response based on NQ screwing up and in game mechanic that is meant to be abused doesn't feel right.

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1 minute ago, XKentX said:

Exactly, they could turn it into lulz for community especially that material gain/game impact is minimal.

 

To be fair the impact was not minimal.

 

Impact was massive due to how the markets actually work. The looting of the terminals managed to entirely wipe out all sale and buy orders. Players lost millions. Our org lost all their sales orders on the market. They just poofed. 

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1 minute ago, Mordgier said:

To be fair the impact was not minimal.

 

Impact was massive due to how the markets actually work. The looting of the terminals managed to entirely wipe out all sale and buy orders. Players lost millions. Our org lost all their sales orders on the market. They just poofed. 

The guys that did it didn't get that buy orders quanta to their accounts. NQ can easily check the DB of the time the market was disassembled and see the buy orders you had and get you the items/quanta back on case by case basis (yes it's work but they messed up and now need to make up for it).

What I meant is that players didn't get 100500 items that now affect game balance.

 

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@Mordgier I don't think that the length of your answer is in a good relation to the length of that quote. But apart from this I think there's a huge difference between harming yourself and harming others. Analog to this you're not allowed to poke a needle through someone else's ear without their permission - but you're always welcome to poke a hole through your own ear if you want to wear an earring. That's so simple it almost seems like you're trying to derail an official thread? Juuuust pondering :P 

 

On top of that I referred to the second part of that paragraph. Please don't quote my entire posting just to address something that's not even part of my argument and was just included because the paragraph number was in front of it. If you read my posting you might notice that I refer to everything in that quote but the part you quoted me for ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Just now, Mordgier said:

I think there should be punishment.

 

It would have set a terrible precedent if there was none.

 

I would have done it more in the spirit of the game though. Bind the player to a rez node in JC's castle dungeon for the crime against Aphelia and call it a day.

 

An out of game EULA response based on NQ screwing up and in game mechanic that is meant to be abused doesn't feel right.

The spirit of the game is now:

 

You can steal people ships, blow them up and get them to be yours, harming many players and ruining their game experience until NQ says anything.

 

You can't press B and dismantle a structure and get 200m3 of blocks + 3 windows because that belongs to the all-mighty ban hammer owner.

 

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Just now, XKentX said:

NQ can easily check the DB of the time the market was disassembled and see the buy orders you had and get you the items/quanta back on case by case basis (yes it's work but they messed up and now need to make up for it).

 

 

 

Yeah....but we all know they won't.

 

They clearly take the easy way out.

 

They could have easily actually banned people who dupped or abused the links - but they couldn't have been bothered to do that either.

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3 minutes ago, Mordgier said:

 

Yeah....but we all know they won't.

 

They clearly take the easy way out.

 

They could have easily actually banned people who dupped or abused the links - but they couldn't have been bothered to do that either.

Exactly. The incident has no relation to guys pressing the in-game buttons to do fun stuff IMHO. Anyone who would notice it would do it for lulz, common it's a game. It's not like they did forge some computer exploit or something.

 

And I am with you to make noise if they don't reimburse most of your items. I am a trader myself so i get it.

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If NQ wants us to 'report' and leave things alone, they need to improve their communication.

 

Players report theft all the time and seem to have massive trouble getting their tickets looked at. Trust is a two way street.

 

If players can't trust NQ to help when they suffer exploits...why should anyone feel obligated to help NQ?

 

They're the party actually making the monies...so why does the community have to help them cover up their technical sloppiness when they don't have any sense of urgency with the community's tickets...? Fine, we'll report exploits. Just give us a few weeks. 

 

I don't really care that these players were banned, but they should also be issued refunds for unused time because NQ shares plenty of responsibility due to their sloppy tech, imprecisely worded EULA, and inability to use the features they invented to secure their own property.

 

Further, if they promptly ban these people, they ought to put just as much urgency on other community tickets instead of only seeming to care about theft when it happens to them...Frankly I feel this theft did more good than harm long-term, but only if NQ uses it as a learning experience instead of reacting with embarrassment and anger. 

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Yeah. Interesting topic.
Many of the defenders of the guys who hacked the market are missing out on a few things.
1. The owner of DU is NQ. And as the owner, they have the right to establish rules and change them in the event of non-standard situations. No "fair" "unfair", etc. THEY ARE OWNERS! 
2. Inviting us to play (for our own money) this game, they also count on our discretion in some issues. Those. if a player earned money to play this game, then he is certainly an adequate person in real life. If people do not behave adequately, then they need to be ready to get hit in the face with a banhammer. Why? See point 1.
3. Some things look childish. the guys had fun analyzing the market. But when the realization came that they had done they really wanted to avoid punishment. And all the subsequent excuses look exactly like this.
In the matter of drawing attention to this problem, I am entirely on the side of the guys.

BUT.

They didn't pay for the bug they found. And for what they did THEN! If they built some kind of voxel figure, meme, etc. that would draw the attention of developers to the problem, then I think that there would be no punishment. It resembles a crowd of looters in a store, who are being fired at with weapons. They also have an argument that the doors were open. But it's' too late. The crime was committed. And no one pushed or forced to disassemble the market and destroy people's orders (though not intentionally).

 

I still hope that the result of these actions will be that NQ will pay attention to this problem, and not only patch the holes in the markets.

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8 minutes ago, michaelk said:

If NQ wants us to 'report' and leave things alone, they need to improve their communication.

Players report theft all the time and seem to have massive trouble getting their tickets looked at. Trust is a two way street.

If players can't trust NQ to help when they suffer exploits...why should anyone feel obligated to help NQ?

No, they don't "because of that". I agree with the sentiment that communication needs improvement, but I strongly disagree with using this incident as leverage to achieve this.

 

NQ still has to grow into the shoes they build. Just because they don't fit yet doesn't relieve you from your obligation to report bugs and exploits and is unrelated to other issues. This is not a street with similar lanes in both directions. The support that flows into your direction is vastly different and unrelated to the support we give to the developers. If you withhold your support on purpose because on the other side the support is delayed, you're comparing a single person twiddling thumbs with a whole support staff that works 8h a day just to get back to you as soon as they can. That comparison feels off to me and refusing to cooperate based on it feels unfair, especially since it doesn't cost you much effort to report a bug or exploit and just be done with it.

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Just now, vertex said:

No, they don't "because of that". I agree with the sentiment that communication needs improvement, but I strongly disagree with using this incident as leverage to achieve this.

 

NQ still has to grow into the shoes they build. Just because they don't fit yet doesn't relieve you from your obligation to report bugs and exploits and is unrelated to other issues. This is not a street with similar lanes in both directions. The support that flows into your direction is vastly different and unrelated to the support we give to the developers. If you withhold your support on purpose because on the other side the support is delayed, you're comparing a single person twiddling thumbs with a whole support staff that works 8h a day just to get back to you as soon as they can. That comparison feels off to me and refusing to cooperate based on it feels unfair, especially since it doesn't cost you much effort to report a bug or exploit and just be done with it.

There's a big difference between support being "delayed" and them not looking at tickets at all, sometimes for weeks.

 

I'm not saying it is okay to not report a bug or exploit, I'm saying it doesn't matter if you do. NQ hasn't had any sense of urgency to fix major issues for players unless they are shoved in their face like this heist.

 

You're right that the lanes of support aren't equal. 

 

As players, we give way more support to the devs than the other way around. 

 

If the support team is truly so busy, hire more support. That's why we pay them real-life monies. That's why they got $22 million in investments. So they can support their product. 

 

When should NQ be done "growing" into their shoes? I'd say 6 years is long enough to grow up and hire enough staff that you can process reports of thefts/exploits. 

 

Honestly, I'd agree with everything you said if it weren't for many players having their tickets ignored. It does create a perception that NQ doesn't have any sense of urgency when it comes to their paying customers...and only seems to act quickly when it embarrasses them. 

 

Maybe I'm way off-base and there are players that have had great experiences with NQ promptly dealing with theft/exploits, I just don't hear about any of those... 

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10 minutes ago, michaelk said:

Honestly, I'd agree with everything you said if it weren't for many players having their tickets ignored.

Part of problem, support (especialy in discord and probably in tickets too) is completly clogged by smartasses (or idiots) who spam to teleport them or ships after they crush or muck up res nodes or something every single day... when its 100% their gameplay trouble/error.


While I not name names obviously, but there is some people who already bothered support dozens upon dozens of times with "i need teleport" thing. They all waste already not perfect support team available resource.

 

So may be first logical step will be get rid of them some way.

 

 

 

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There is a negative wave on the forum, there is an image adjustment in the opposite direction, this is followed by a drop in sales, a decrease in revenue, subscriptions already purchased will not be renewed, programmers ' income will have to be reduced due to a shortage, and only then will tickets be processed :) but it will be too late, the most valuable time for us is time, if they do not want to respect it, then we will not respect the developers, we do business for NQ and not they for us, I would not like to see this as manipulation, this is a fact, NQ do not understand that we form the image, the market, and their task is to write code and respond to requests during, they preferred only to write code

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I have heard of other players reporting it and seen posted proof of the same. I have filled various tickets, most of them have not been touched in weeks, to months. Including bug reports. It is hard to take the standpoint that this should be a ban, when it is enteirly the fault of NQ, and when the ticket proecss sucks so much.

 

It is hard to justifiy this action when NQ came out a week ago and said that they wouldn't get invovled in RDMS issues and that it was the players responsibility to ensure this doesn't happen to them.

 

This is NQ's fault they need to deal with it themselves. When @Vifrevaertand his crew stole nearly an entire factory from DSI, it was a mess in DSI, and yeah a lot of the people who had stuff stolen from them were pissed (and still are), and while they would have wanted a ban, it isn't fair to the people who stole the stuff. Just like in this case it isn't fair to ban the people who stole voxels from a market. You have marketed your game towards people who played EVE, and if you didn't expect this to happen then you need to get better rules.

As long as you are prepared to ban everyone who has and will do something on this serverity (all item duplication included) then I think should be allowed. Else, you should unban these guys and use this as the policy for the future.

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2 minutes ago, michaelk said:

Honestly, I'd agree with everything you said if it weren't for many players having their tickets ignored. It does create a perception that NQ doesn't have any sense of urgency when it comes to their paying customers...and only seems to act quickly when it embarrasses them.

Yeah, until some days ago I had the same feeling and feared that this would be the case - but then I heard that the ticket in question finally got addressed and solved after 6 weeks. So I was really relieved to know that they are not lost.

 

I'm not defending that there's no response in 6 weeks - if it was my system I'd write some lines of code to update tickets within 24h with an automated response and have one person to go over them just to reply "Thanks! That's an issue with X and I'll forward to Y!" etc. But that again is something that needs someone to organize and do it and might not receive priority for quite some time, especially if you're deep into other things - like fixing a market that someone destroyed on purpose. Plus even with that response players would give them shit about "I just received some automated response and some guy said he's not capable and had to forward me to someone else who now ignores me!" ... it's hard to satisfy and if you can't jump to 100% you might be inclined to postpone that jump until your boots are fully charged.

 

Regarding player base gives more support than it receives: weellll... compare size of the player base with the size of the support staff. They can't hire a support guy for $7/month which not even all players pay, so that comparison will always be off.

 

Regarding funding: for a project like this 22 million are a drop of water on a hot stone. Budget is really limited and cuts need to be made and priorities set. If we want a bright future in DU we should stick together and help as good as we can - not cause additional issues and throw dung balls :( 

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Wow this has escalated quickly.

 

Not knowing the complete picture it can easily appear to be a bit excessive for the actions displayed.  But again not knowing the complete picture.

 

The RDMS abuse issues is a long standing issue in DU.  It is something they are most likely working on.  And the damage to the market should stay as a stark reminder of the damage done by this.   It adds history.

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10 minutes ago, Darrkwolf said:

I have heard of other players reporting it and seen posted proof of the same. I have filled various tickets, most of them have not been touched in weeks, to months. Including bug reports. It is hard to take the standpoint that this should be a ban, when it is enteirly the fault of NQ, and when the ticket proecss sucks so much.

Hence all these people that reported but didn't exploit it are proof that it is possible to report and not exploit. Something that those now banned failed to do. They didn't only fail, they did the exact opposite: they did not report but they did exploit.

 

So if NQ can't fix the issue fast enough, next time when there's an issue like this NQ should shut down the servers and re-open them once the issue is fixed, so nobody thinks it's ok to exploit if NQ doesn't fix instantly? I certainly wouldn't like that.

 

The rest of that posting again implies that it was RDMS mismanagement which still nobody provided any proof for.

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6 minutes ago, vertex said:

Hence all these people that reported but didn't exploit it are proof that it is possible to report and not exploit. Something that those now banned failed to do. They didn't only fail, they did the exact opposite: they did not report but they did exploit.

 

So if NQ can't fix the issue fast enough, next time when there's an issue like this NQ should shut down the servers and re-open them once the issue is fixed, so nobody thinks it's ok to exploit if NQ doesn't fix instantly? I certainly wouldn't like that.

 

The rest of that posting again implies that it was RDMS mismanagement which still nobody provided any proof for.

NQ Said:

Quote

" it appears to be an issue that was created when we moved the markets, making it editable by players"

That would mean it is in some way an issue with the permissions system (RDMS). This doesn't appear like an exploit, or hack. Its was just a bug that people used.

Fundemetnally, after it was reported three days ago, NQ should have came out and said that this is an exploit, please do not use it. Then this would not have happened, and if it did the bans would be 100% justified.

 

Its not that hard. There was a bug after an update in EVE, it took a couple of hours (at max) for it to be declared an exploit so people wouldn't use it, and if they did a sanction could have been applied to their account.

Quote

 

NQ just needs to improve their communication.

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2 minutes ago, Darrkwolf said:

That would mean it is in some way an issue with the permissions system (RDMS).

No, it woudln't. "An issue" can be like.... anything? Including but not limited to RDMS.

 

In my opinion the option to exploit does not need to be announced ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

Btw: I don't care about EVE. I'm not into archeology ;) 

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