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Kill Code

whats wrong & how to fix

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The Problem they have with this game is Lack of content....

 

UNDERSTAND THEIR SITUATION:

They cant just wave a magic wand and create 1000's of hours of programming that will put many different developed systems in the game to give players various ways to make money.   This game is set up much like EvE (resource based economy, player driven, everything is crafted by players, Game progress is based on money earned, skills are time locked) without the benefit of over a decade of subscription paid development.  They decided to go the time locked skill route like EvE, but without the option to buy skill injectors (purchase xp).  Ok, fine.... but if a player cant play the game to adv their character then what is left?  ANSWER: Making money, Just like EvE the way you do anything in this game is to make money, but UNLIKE EVE, there are only a few ways to make money the main one being mining (which is incredibly tedious, repetitive, boring).  

But!...They cant just wave a magic wand and create 1000's of hours of programming that will put many different developed systems in the game to give players various ways to make money.

 

What should they have done?  

Made it easy in game to acquire money,  and have warned players that in the future after a few more developed systems  have been implemented they are going to do a financial wipe....yes I know but its the only answer.  Wipe the finances of the game while keeping trained skills, and player made blueprints, but all physical property, all schematics and quanta will be wiped.  Unfortunately now they have painted them selves into corner.  Now they have a game that is grindy, nothing to do, and no option to wipe without pissing everyone off. 

Why would this have helped?:  If everything was cheap and easy to acquire a players time could be spent on what the game has and what is good about the game...the building tool.  Players could truly build anything they could imagine from large cities to flying fortresses with hanger bays for fighter craft without grinding endless hours on end in some hole.  Players who got in on the ground floor would have the benefit of learning how to build with the tool, having a skill trained avatar,  amassing fantastic blueprints for building and ships and production lines.  spending their time pvping or crashing ships or exploring the world without the limitations of a constant fear of needing to spend dozens of hours to make their next base or ship or worrying about losing something in pvp.

 

2nd thing they needed or need:

Creative mode for buildingThe ability to DREAM BIG!! has been stripped from players, they cant make what they can imagine because it costs too much time/money to do anything.  A player just starting out should be able to open the build tool and lay out a massive carrier ship if they so choose and turn that into a blue print, that they can spend the next 3 weeks farming for if need be.  To give players something to work for something to drive them to play the game.  If you are able to build without restrictions and lay out the materials, the colors, elements you want without having to actually own those items that would give people something to work for.  That would put the best of what the game has to offer as the first experience instead of the last or end game experience.

 

These things would have retained more hardcore players, AND casuals,  it would feel more like a playground  rather then a job.

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You didn't explain why the financial wipe is needed though.

 

How does emptying other peoples bank accounts improve your experience?

 

I don't necessarily disagree with everything else you said, but it's hard to get past the wipe part, without any explanation at all for how it would improve the game for anyone besides yourself.

 

Is it just about leveling the playing field?  Putting you closer to some sort of perceived "winning" of the game.

 

Why does someone starting now deserve that fresh start, but not someone who starts a few months after your wipe?

 

Or will you agree with them, 6 months after your wipe, when they are also calling for a wipe, because you have more money then them?

 

 

 

 

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8 hours ago, Kill Code said:

no option to wipe without pissing everyone off.

The number of players that would be pissed off decreases every day.

 

8 hours ago, Kill Code said:

2nd thing they needed or need:

Creative mode for building

That is actually planned. But it has a side effect. A lot of players will stay forever in creative mode. As soon as JC realizes that there are even less players left for his beloved civilization building, he will nerf the creative mode to death because players don't use it as expected.

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The moment they went pay 2 develop was that launch of their game. Being largely unfinished and just a grind sammich with some flying and basic minecraft and some overbloated complex crafting stations. Under the hood its like the most skeleton bare bones minimum they could produce. There is no substance or content or purpose to what you make or any reason to fight when it took so long to earn what you gained to just throw it away or have it stolen from you leaving PvPers scratching their heads like a school of piranha after a killing spree wondering where their next meal is coming from.

 

The moment they chose a sub model they killed of more people since most people in my experience hate subs and prefer FTP, P2W, or B2P/DLC models over subs. Subs are like 10% of the market share if that. Not to mention their stance on solo/casual/small orgs and setting hard limits on megaorgs cuts out about 70-85% of the potential market from touching their game or staying with any longevity of new players or player retention. Since they dont want new players, players playing, or making money and handing out multiple beta keys for people who wont likely stay past the free time I dont see this game making it long if it makes it to launch a year past deadlines already without sustantial pay model hybrid servers, a E-Bay store for people to sell anything in-game with real $$$ and taking a cut because turns out this massive grind sink they created is pretty profitable to gold/ore farmers can actually make a decent living and NQ should take their cut for doing nothing since most gold farming sites take your cut already for you.

 

The goal is to grow the studio, create a good game tons of people want to play, hire more devs, and produce the game faster. They have done the bare minimum to make the wireframe of the game and its now time to make the real game.

 

Its not that NQ has basically made a PvC building game with granksquad pvp to make the building game harder. Honestly the pvp is so bad in this game I just want to play on a full resource respawn PvE server frankly at this point because that is the real game. There will be no big battles that arent megaorgs blocading your planet or soon blockading and ransacking everything through Territory Wars. Its not fun and it likely never will. At least a PvE server could make a less grindy experience meant to make pvp run but in the end the whole system is ill concieved. I was excited for PvP when I joined but now I dont care about it. In the end I really just want to build and make a handful of ships to mine or haul with and just make the building stuff I want to make but dont have the time because its always mine mine mine mine mine.

 

There is no fixing DU without huge sweeping changes and even still the damage is likely already done to stop it. I suggest that if you like this game you should enjoy it while it lasts. Its pretty quiet in here these days.

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1 hour ago, Maxim Kammerer said:

That is actually planned. But it has a side effect. A lot of players will stay forever in creative mode. As soon as JC realizes that there are even less players left for his beloved civilization building, he will nerf the creative mode to death because players don't use it as expected.

If that does happen, maybe NQ should take the hint.  

 

If a majority of their players aren't interested in PvP, they at least need to make it easier to swallow. Relax industry a bit. Make blueprints a real game concept instead of a hacky item in your inventory and link them cleanly to industry.

 

Your ship got blown up? It should take almost no time to rebuild a fresh copy from a blueprint. If your factory doesn't have the required raw minerals, it shouldn't be hard to order them from the nearest market for automatic delivery or buy the right to build it from a friendly org. 

 

Industry could also be the bedrock for NPC (gasp) vessels that patrol civilized areas -- giving players more security, pirates more targets, and builders a fleet of craft to create and maintain. If a group of players keeps pirating your NPC fleet, that conflict will lead to PvP. It would also give an advantage to defenders, which they already want to do. 

 

I was surprised that they nerfed industry because I thought it would be a great foundation for actual civilization mechanics -- like quickly rebuilding vessels and building a limited fleet of NPC craft to facilitate more automation and QoL. More automation helps everyone -- you can pirate NPC haulers transporting goods or get drawn into PvP because you want to defend your org...not just because you got ganked. 

 

This insistence that there be no NPCs and that everything must be run only by players is really pointless. There's no game design justification at all, just JC's weird RP obsessions. 

 

Industry should be the bedrock for more automation, more scale, more QoL. 

 

Instead....NQ has opted to make the game even slower and more arduous. It's like they know that their off-the-shelf engine and off-the-shelf servers won't actually support the cities and civilization they pitched, so now they need to make sure the game is "slow" enough so that getting the stuff to make civilization is a grind fest. 

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31 minutes ago, michaelk said:

This insistence that there be no NPCs and that everything must be run only by players is really pointless. There's no game design justification at all, just JC's weird RP obsessions. 

 

Industry should be the bedrock for more automation, more scale, more QoL. 

 

Instead....NQ has opted to make the game even slower and more arduous. It's like they know that their off-the-shelf engine and off-the-shelf servers won't actually support the cities and civilization they pitched, so now they need to make sure the game is "slow" enough so that getting the stuff to make civilization is a grind fest. 

This is the game design decision I still can't figure out and am hoping for more clarification in future announcements/q&a's. Prior to the industry changes I thought the game was focused on player driven content and experiences. The industry changes both slowed down player driven developments and moved players to interact more with the non-player elements of the game (ore bots, schematics, nanoformer market, etc). The balance between player driven content and non-player driven content seems off right now.

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10 hours ago, Atmosph3rik said:

You didn't explain why the financial wipe is needed though.

 

How does emptying other peoples bank accounts improve your experience?

 

I don't necessarily disagree with everything else you said, but it's hard to get past the wipe part, without any explanation at all for how it would improve the game for anyone besides yourself.

 

Is it just about leveling the playing field?  Putting you closer to some sort of perceived "winning" of the game.

 

Why does someone starting now deserve that fresh start, but not someone who starts a few months after your wipe?

 

Or will you agree with them, 6 months after your wipe, when they are also calling for a wipe, because you have more money then them?

 

 

 

 

the reason for a financial wipe would be to allow the devs to set the game to "easy mode"  making everything easy to obtain and most importantly dirt cheap.  This would effectively make the full game a creative mode letting players build, fight, do what they want with very little grind.  This would be done to float the game until more systems for money making could be made and implemented  (dedicated in game creative mode).  Such as auto miners, missions, pvp zones with rare minerals, item shipping or people shipping contract/transport services with in game menu to facilitate transactions.  During this development phase people would be amassing large wealth quickly but obviously this would neg effect the market and or make it too easy to self-produce all items.  This in either case would be an unfair advantage for those playing now during the easy times to those playing in the future near release date.

 

Then after enough content has been added to the game and devs and players feel there is sufficient fun ways to play they could do what they did back with the last patch and constrict things a tad making stuff more expensive again.  But I by no means think that when they do this they should return to where the game is now and stuff be too expensive.  With the addition of talked about content like auto miners, base minerals would flow into the market making at least low tier items cheap, so one could build large things out of cheap stuff.  The more expensive stuff would be in pvp areas where auto miners would get blown up, leaving it up to a corp to defend them constantly or make it pointless to try it forcing manual mining.  High end minerals would need to be battled for and would mainly be used in pvp construction hulls or of course end game elements, or rare master rank production of low tier gear. 

 

Things such as alien stations could be put in game in pvp areas to allow a "capture the flag" system where corporations could fight NPC's for control of alien constructs that would yield some form of extra rare resource such as alien schematic data shards that could be traded in for alien tech schematics.  These stations could have a drip feed mechanic that gives resources over say a 1 day- 3 day time frame. Force the conquering corporation to not only fight the NPC's for initial control but then hold the alien construct for the duration from attacking player corporations in order to secure said rewards.

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9 hours ago, michaelk said:

 

I was surprised that they nerfed industry because I thought it would be a great foundation for actual civilization mechanics -- like quickly rebuilding vessels and building a limited fleet of NPC craft to facilitate more automation and QoL. More automation helps everyone -- you can pirate NPC haulers transporting goods or get drawn into PvP because you want to defend your org...not just because you got ganked. 

 

This insistence that there be no NPCs and that everything must be run only by players is really pointless. There's no game design justification at all, just JC's weird RP obsessions. 

 

Industry should be the bedrock for more automation, more scale, more QoL. 

The whole 'built and driven by players' premise is in part, what attracted me to the game. The problem is like in the real world, there must be people willing and able to do the extremely tedious, everyday small things. The issue is most of those things quite frankly, make for horrible gameplay. Silly me for misunderstanding remote controls and lua script as a stepping stone to automating the tedium such as mining, running to and from markets, etc. Boy I was wrong.

 

A game, almost by definition, sets up a fantasy situation where we can become the best gun, the top mogul, the fastest smuggler, the best builder, the richest pirate, through a series of challenges, training, forethought, and even a bit of grinding. In doing these things we advance through our chosen area gladly knowing where we want to end up. 

 

In this game, the only way to advance in any significant way is to find others to do the tedius grunt work. Even if this game had a million players, the likelihood of finding enough people happy to pay real money to do tedius virtual chores month after month with no advancement is very very low. That is where the automation and the NPCs are supposed to take over. To allow a greater number of players feel like they make a real difference and are getting somewhere.

 

Doing this will take a LOT of code crunching, debugging, testing, patching, in other words TIME, to implement this in a meaningful, playable, and comprehensive way. Based on the games progression so far as heard from alpha backers, and the fact that the game got to this point now YEARS after first alpha release, I can not see this happening until many more years. I just don't see this experiment of DU becoming much more than a niche game. Guess I could be wrong 🤔

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So the solution is to turn DU into an effortless SP sandbox in space? I disagree, there are games out there to scratch that itch. DU doesn't not need to be just a build tool thx.

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54 minutes ago, Xennial said:

So the solution is to turn DU into an effortless SP sandbox in space? I disagree, there are games out there to scratch that itch. DU doesn't not need to be just a build tool thx.

Until there is a game to play yes... right now its not a game its a building tool

 

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1 minute ago, Kill Code said:

Until there is a game to play yes... right now its not a game its s building tool

 

In your limited view maybe. Many in my org fill their time so much so that they simply don't have enough time to do everything they want to do (and no they don't spend it just mining or building). I will agree if your a player that needs your hand held with 'quests' , instant action buttons, or if you need to be able to craft without having to interact with a 'game world' at all then DU doesn't have a lot to offer. Thats ok, DU doesn't have to be for every single game loop minded gamer out there.

 

DU shines when you take personalities that prefer to define their own game experience rather then a scripted ones. There are MANY different way to 'make money' in DU other then mining. The creative mode to design your blueprints is already in the works so that should largely solve many of the creative types complaints, right up until they find out to use it in game they need to actually play the game to use the ship. So the complaints of "omg , it will take me months to earn the stuff to bring my super carrier dreadnaught into the game change the game!!". I still like the idea of it just for convenience.

 

 

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23 minutes ago, Xennial said:

In your limited view maybe. Many in my org fill their time so much so that they simply don't have enough time to do everything they want to do (and no they don't spend it just mining or building). I will agree if your a player that needs your hand held with 'quests' , instant action buttons, or if you need to be able to craft without having to interact with a 'game world' at all then DU doesn't have a lot to offer. Thats ok, DU doesn't have to be for every single game loop minded gamer out there.

 

DU shines when you take personalities that prefer to define their own game experience rather then a scripted ones. There are MANY different way to 'make money' in DU other then mining. The creative mode to design your blueprints is already in the works so that should largely solve many of the creative types complaints, right up until they find out to use it in game they need to actually play the game to use the ship. So the complaints of "omg , it will take me months to earn the stuff to bring my super carrier dreadnaught into the game change the game!!". I still like the idea of it just for convenience.

 

 

you are the minority not the majority so its you with the limited view.   Just cause your org fills its time doesn't mean their is a ton of content in game.   You might enjoy staring at rocks all day, you might enjoy administration of org resources, you might enjoy walking around and flying that doesn't mean there is actually content to play....using the same "fun with friends" argument fallout 76, and no mans sky (release) used...

 

There are not many ways to make money in DU... the DEV's themselves have said as much in their last update post, so sorry to say you are just wrong.

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1 hour ago, Xennial said:

There are MANY different way to 'make money' in DU other then mining.

Currently there are just two ways to make money in DU:

 

1. by getting the daily 150 kℎ

2. by mining and selling ore to bots

 

All other ways to 'make money' just mean that other players make money for you. If they stop doing it, because they are bored to death, you will need to do it yourself. Than you have even less time to do everything you want to do because you are mining all day long.

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On 1/13/2021 at 8:45 AM, Kill Code said:

The Problem they have with this game is Lack of content....

 

UNDERSTAND THEIR SITUATION:

They cant just wave a magic wand and create 1000's of hours of programming that will put many different developed systems in the game to give players various ways to make money.   This game is set up much like EvE (resource based economy, player driven, everything is crafted by players, Game progress is based on money earned, skills are time locked) without the benefit of over a decade ....

 

TLDR

There are loads of easy ways to make money in this game, without even mining.  My issue is not making money, it is spending it, there is currently no point.  The issue is that the ways to make money are not clear, there are actually loads of viable gameplay paths that some people are doing but many people have no idea about.   

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9 hours ago, Kill Code said:

the reason for a financial wipe would be to allow the devs to set the game to "easy mode"  making everything easy to obtain and most importantly dirt cheap.  This would effectively make the full game a creative mode letting players build, fight, do what they want with very little grind.  This would be done to float the game until more systems for money making could be made and implemented  (dedicated in game creative mode).  Such as auto miners, missions, pvp zones with rare minerals, item shipping or people shipping contract/transport services with in game menu to facilitate transactions.  During this development phase people would be amassing large wealth quickly but obviously this would neg effect the market and or make it too easy to self-produce all items.  This in either case would be an unfair advantage for those playing now during the easy times to those playing in the future near release date.

Hate to break it to you, we have already had the building phase where loads of player have got everything they need to play for years.  Things like missions systems etc are supposed to be coming soon, and then hopefully more of the wealth generated can be passed to other people. via the methods you mention above.

 

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5 hours ago, Maxim Kammerer said:

Currently there are just two ways to make money in DU:

 

1. by getting the daily 150 kℎ

2. by mining and selling ore to bots

 

All other ways to 'make money' just mean that other players make money for you. If they stop doing it, because they are bored to death, you will need to do it yourself. Than you have even less time to do everything you want to do because you are mining all day long.

No, what your talking about is money generation within the game. That is different from a player 'making money' to fund whatever activity they are trying to do. Two different concepts. 

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On 1/13/2021 at 9:14 AM, Atmosph3rik said:

You didn't explain why the financial wipe is needed though.

 

How does emptying other peoples bank accounts improve your experience?

 

I don't necessarily disagree with everything else you said, but it's hard to get past the wipe part, without any explanation at all for how it would improve the game for anyone besides yourself.

 

Is it just about leveling the playing field?  Putting you closer to some sort of perceived "winning" of the game.

 

Why does someone starting now deserve that fresh start, but not someone who starts a few months after your wipe?

 

Or will you agree with them, 6 months after your wipe, when they are also calling for a wipe, because you have more money then them?

 

 

 

 

I would say a wipe is very necessary especially if we want to grow the player base after launch because without a wipe we  would essentially break the lore and back story. for me I view launch day as the day that the ark ship actually arrives on Alioth and anything before that is just beta testing. personally I think it should all be wiped prior to launch. Its not like the beta testers won't have an advantage because they already know how to play the game. Look at it from the perspective of anyone who doesn't want to help beta test but buys the game at launch like most people will. The story says that we traveled for 10k years and just got here. Well if that is the case why is this place already built out with huge factories and such and lots of space and air traffic and huge strip mines scarring the land scape, not very immersive in my opinion.

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14 hours ago, Kill Code said:

the reason for a financial wipe would be to allow the devs to set the game to "easy mode"  making everything easy to obtain and most importantly dirt cheap.  This would effectively make the full game a creative mode letting players build, fight, do what they want with very little grind.  This would be done to float the game until more systems for money making could be made and implemented

 

Why would any of that require or benefit from a wipe?  you haven't explained that at all.

 

What your suggesting is basically what NQ did already.  Except A full wipe, followed by a huge influx of quanta and ore, to jumpstart the game.  And now they are tightening the purse strings and trying to find a balance.

 

I'm not so sure it was the best plan in the first place, and they definitely made some mistakes along the way.  But it's what they did.

 

All your suggesting is that they do it all again, but this time just for you.  How does that improve the game?

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41 minutes ago, Corphius said:

I would say a wipe is very necessary especially if we want to grow the player base after launch because without a wipe we  would essentially break the lore and back story. for me I view launch day as the day that the ark ship actually arrives on Alioth and anything before that is just beta testing. personally I think it should all be wiped prior to launch. Its not like the beta testers won't have an advantage because they already know how to play the game. Look at it from the perspective of anyone who doesn't want to help beta test but buys the game at launch like most people will. The story says that we traveled for 10k years and just got here. Well if that is the case why is this place already built out with huge factories and such and lots of space and air traffic and huge strip mines scarring the land scape, not very immersive in my opinion.

 

I think you're right, but i also think it's too late now, they already made their decision, and did it.

 

When they announced that this was the plan i was pretty vocal about my disappointment.  Having a huge land/resource rush in a persistent game like this, and then announcing the game to the world a week later, like, whoops sorry you missed it.  That was a terrible idea in my opinion.

 

From what i understand their theory was that the majority of players would rather enter a thriving game world where there were already ships flying around, and organizations building things.  It seems like they were wrong, but again that's just my opinion.

 

The fact is they did it.

 

And i think it would be a much larger mistake to announce that the game is live/open/persistent and then go back on that and wipe everything, without a REALLY good reason.  Like a technical reason with absolutely no other solution.

 

 

 

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12 hours ago, Xennial said:

So the solution is to turn DU into an effortless SP sandbox in space? I disagree, there are games out there to scratch that itch. DU doesn't not need to be just a build tool thx.

Look. Not knocking your playstyle. You and your org love it, that's great. If how you are playing brings YOU instant satisfaction then you are very likely to be here for the long haul. Even if the coming changes very plainly promise to change DU again in a very drastic way, i do wish you the best.

 

But with everything I have seen, experienced, done and read over the many many years of my gaming life, every year the top sellers, the best games, the most successful software companys all have one thing in common in all their genre of games. Appeal to the common man and a semi-instant feeling of accomplishment and gratification.

 

Do you really believe, as is, DU appeals to those money bearing gaming masses? And to reach what JC and ads have all claimed is DUs end game... Millions of people... THOSE are the ones to convince, not me.

 

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5 hours ago, Xennial said:

No, what your talking about is money generation within the game. That is different from a player 'making money' to fund whatever activity they are trying to do. Two different concepts. 

You missed the point. All methods of making money other than 1. and 2. as mentioned above require sombody else to generate money for your. They don't work if to many players try to do that. That makes your statement misleading. The majority of players need to grind to make the game working.

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52 minutes ago, Maxim Kammerer said:

You missed the point. All methods of making money other than 1. and 2. as mentioned above require sombody else to generate money for your. They don't work if to many players try to do that. That makes your statement misleading. The majority of players need to grind to make the game working.

 

I think the theory is that if there is a high demand, and no supply, the value of ore will increase to the point that the potential profit is enough of an incentive for people to go out and mine.

 

So the "somebody" who has to go out and mine, is whoever wants a piece of the action.

 

Eventually there will be enough ore, and the prices will drop, and then maybe almost no one will mine for a while.  Until the next boom.  Maybe some devious people will still mine, and sit on the ore until demand goes up again.

 

The missing puzzle piece right now is Demand, not supply.  People need more things to do with ore, and more things to do with Quanta.

 

NQ knows this.

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The mission system will only serve to bait people into pvp or to pay cut rate missions. You arent going to pay more than something is worth and the ones that seem worth it are liely going to be traps. If suddenly there are quests to transport anyone can do that. Missions to mine anyone can already do in a bot run market. PvP when you can already do that. Build when you can already do what it seek to achieve. The system changes nothing. The only reason for it is to pay people less then you would pay for it on the market or to exploit someone to their death for quick profit. JC even said so much on one of the live streams.

 

Territory Wars? Same thing it will destroy more than it helps the game. This isnt a 2d plane game Shadowbane where tons of population capped guilds and their sub guilds fight it out non stop taking 3-4 hours of grind fighting npcs to flip back into your forge and re-roll until you get prime gear and fight over mines with 100 people a night or dropping banes to steal a city with a royal rumble of guilds that show up to sanke it from you. DU is different in that all your neighbors are enemies. Everyone is an enemy. You can join the communist party I mean mega orgs 1 size fits all just a number but still the mega orgs dont even fight and they have everything so why should I be forced to fight all my neighbors? I dont care about the geopolitics of the game im just here to build and have a good time and not throw away $100+ in ship or cargo every time some pvper gets the jump on me. There is nothing to the PvP or TWs when they go live. It just pushes out more people from the game.

 

Why? Its not a PvP game they designed or want to force everyone to play as a communist miner giving everything away to other people who get rich off of your effort and dictate your playstyle or talents in game. I will never join a mega org no matter how much JC wants to punish me or design the game to kick me out the door if I dont. Its not JC's choice of how I play that is like the most fundamental basic gaming principals to giving players a choice and in this case your fole is dictated to you in the game design to mine and to fly then to build an industry to fight. As one or 3 people you are meant to have what seems like 10-25 people bare minimum to make all the basic ship parts alone with enough time to do just a few other things in the game with enough breathing room from machine demands or covering the cost of blueprints setting you to eat 100 parts before you break even which requires the little refined parts, which requires the pure and raw ore. Before you even do that it will take you 6 years of talent time locks to even do that, and even if you spec that between 10 people to do most of crafting it still cuts the grind down to just under a year. Seeing as the mining, piloting, industry, and crafting are all like about 8 years of grinding, sinks, time locks, up front investment beyond the insane numbers of containers needed for all steps its pretty beastly of a challenge that not having 25 people base makes even slightly profitable as an small org.

 

There will just be too big of a gap between the alpha backers, megaorgs, and people hoarding massive stockpiles. Anyone remember the thread a while back talking about how someone got access to their guilds supplies and they sat in horror as some other guild came in and they had no access to their stuff and some other org walked away with a couple billion in assets? Yeah those types of people who have "billions" sitting around who are destroying the market, sitting on enough ammo to last any kind of sustained war and seeing as PvP is hyenas in space prowling for kills what do they think is going to happen when suddenly they take Territory Wars live? All the coma people's territories are gone, all planetary bases are gone, anything outside alioth is gone. Nobody will ever build outside Alioth if it is even allowed to be a safe zone and since all those people who were in a coma or had their entire gameplay wiped out are going to quit.

 

SO is it worth it? Its what is going to happen. Kill off the game to make the neglected bastard children pvpers you brought in or keep the people who make and build and mine everything happy who make up the 75+% happy and continueing to play? This is a crafting game after all. If it werent then PvP would be more of a thing then the PvP community figuring out how best to kill off the rest of the game by stipping protections piece by piece and nobody wanting to enguage them and if they could there is no defenses to stop it. Nobody wanting to PvP in a supposed PvP game is not a good sign and an indicator of how badly designed this game is. There is no one thing you cant point at where the system is broken and going the wrong direction. Or that fixing any of it pretty much requires a complete direction shift to make it approachable to anyone. Designing a grind sink to defeat a player from lack of content is not a game at all. At best we have a home business sim with some muggers added to spice things up. There is no reason for the muggers to exist in the scenerio being there its just for show.

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