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How hard (or easy) will it be to earn DAC?

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1 hour ago, Lethys said:

Ofc it'll be harder in the beginning in Du because there's no infrastructure, well organized markets, economy isn't running smoothly and so on. 

So it's hard to tell really but I assume every somewhat intelligent player can easily earn a DAC per month

It’s really hard to predict, especially when we have all of these founders DACs saturating the market in the early days.  Really just depends on whether or not people will be trading DACs early on for a leg up on the “rush” that will inevitably happen early on.

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1 minute ago, Hades said:

It’s really hard to predict, especially when we have all of these founders DACs saturating the market in the early days.  Really just depends on whether or not people will be trading DACs early on for a leg up on the “rush” that will inevitably happen early on.

I gladly buy every DAC someone throws at me in the first year ;)

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How much DACs will cost depends a lot on what else there is to buy in game with the currency.

 

If there's lots of amazing player made stuff to buy.  Then people with plenty of IRL money will want more Quanta, so they'll buy DACs to sell, so they can then buy a new ship or whatever.

 

The price will probably fluctuate a lot in the beginning depending on whether sellers needs Quanta right away or they're just in it for the profit.

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35 minutes ago, Falstaf said:

And they aren't cheap. ;)

 

I don't know if you are a customer of Starbucks but for those that are, it's a prime example.

Caffe Latte  -  Tall (Small)  -  $2.95

$3 x 5 days = $15

 

Cut out a week of your morning coffee and you'll never have to worry about a subscription. Unless of course, you have an addiction and get migraines when you go without caffeine for a period of time (like my mother and her Coca-Cola). Cut it out entirely and you be peachy free of headaches by the end of the month.

 

If you play Xbox Live, stop, play DU instead. :angry:

 

A year's membership of trigger fingers and YOLO over there gets you half a year of teamwork and fellowship here. 

 

If you have a job, it's not hard. If you don't have a job, be a productive member of the neighborhood and shovel, rake, mow, etc. ;)

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19 minutes ago, DarkHorizon said:

I don't know if you are a customer of Starbucks.. 

I don't do Starbucks, play Xbox, or any of that. 

 

I do have a life time subscription. :D

But those are definitely some cuts you could make to play the game. 

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I just tried to look back at links on DACs like the above.

I'm a bit unclear about which way an earlier decision was changed. It appears to be that NQ wanted to simplify things by making them unlootable, but under pressure is now trying to do something similar to the redemption system.

Trying to understand correctly about 'dropping DACs to a character', will this mean that the DACs that supporters will have to begin with are held in some kind of account and can be specifically dropped to a character/avatar when it is in safety - either for consumption or market sale?

On the ability to earn DACs (or rather the quanta to be able to buy them), how will quanta begin to build up to create market liquidity? Will people be able to buy quanta with real money, or will the kick-starting be by NQ buying up marketable items artificially for a while (as I think I have read)?

 

edit: thanks Mod-Merwyn below :)

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About DAC lootability: it is currently unknown and NQ is probably still thinking about it.

About Quanta: NQ said they will quick-start the market, but the only way to "buy" Quanta with real money is by buying DACs and then selling these DACs in game.

 

~ Merwyn

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Ok, this all makes a lot more sense now.  Those with RL money can use DAC to get ahead in the game, while basically subsidizing the ability of those without RL money to keep playing, as long as they work for it in game.  I like it actually.  Sounds good.

 

I do hope they are not lootable, considering it is something that is directly tied to RL money.  They should be some kind of digital item that is kept in extreme security, and only transferable voluntarily.  At least that's my opinion of it anyway.

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14 minutes ago, BlorgonSlayer said:

 

I do hope they are not lootable, considering it is something that is directly tied to RL money.  

That has been and still is a very hot debate. 

 

I'm for lootable once you decide to sell it or once it changes hands. Because I don't think it makes sense to have a resource in game that is completely safe. Naturally there are many good reasons for and against. 

 

The thread about DAC being lootable linked earlier is a treasure of interesting opinions. Albeit a bit heated at times. :D

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I’m all for lootable DAC’s. If you just want sub time for real money, then by sub time. I imagine people will only be vying DAC’s to sell, so they don’t have to spend so much time earning money to do stuff. DAC’s are a tradeable asset, and should be lootable to ensure a good amount of risk. Otherwise DAC’s could be used as a relatively safe way of holding and transporting funds that isn’t the in game currency, which I also think should be lootable

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1 hour ago, BlorgonSlayer said:

Ok, this all makes a lot more sense now.  Those with RL money can use DAC to get ahead in the game, while basically subsidizing the ability of those without RL money to keep playing, as long as they work for it in game.  I like it actually.  Sounds good.

 

I do hope they are not lootable, considering it is something that is directly tied to RL money.  They should be some kind of digital item that is kept in extreme security, and only transferable voluntarily.  At least that's my opinion of it anyway.

I believe it was tossed (not by NQ, by players I think) around that when you buy it, it’s stored in a “vault” type system.  Safe and sound.  Once you trade it, it’s taken out of the vault... and the player purchasing the DAC would (probably) have x time to redeem it before it becomes lootable.

 

I think this is a fair solution because, no matter what we desire DACs WILL be a commodity.  Protecting the initial purchase is important, but if DACs are completely unlootable it allows someone to buy DACs at market A and travel to market B and sell them for 1.2x the price.  

 

DACs need to be lootable... just like any other trade good.  Imho 

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yeah, sorry for having wider questions a bit earlier, but I wanted to see how it would probably fit in. I suppose the basic question behind it was: will earned DACs be safe/ be able to be kept safe? 

If I understand correctly, one place where we will be able to market stuff and buy (thus earn) DACs in game will be on MSA markets? People with an STU there will be able to store stuff safely, so I guess my question is answered as 'yes' with or without the off-topic part that should be discussed on the linked thread...

 

How easy will they be to earn? My guess is that at the beginning the quick-starting of the market will mean we can at least generate quanta pretty much in direct ratio to playing time. People wanting to get at quanta faster to get ahead faster will be keen to pump real money into DACs to be able to sell them, so initially the DACs might be quite quick to earn compared to later on.

Edited by dualism
Added more on topic

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English (deepl used)
 
For the safe custody of DAC's there is the DAC-Bank
 
 
Quote

 

German (original)
 
Für die sichere Verwahrung von DAC's gibt es die DAC-Bank.
 
 

 

Die Waldfee

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13 minutes ago, dualism said:

yeah, sorry for having wider questions a bit earlier, but I wanted to see how it would probably fit in. I suppose the basic question behind it was: will earned DACs be safe/ be able to be kept safe? 

If I understand correctly, one place where we will be able to market stuff and buy (thus earn) DACs in game will be on MSA markets? People with an STU there will be able to store stuff safely, so I guess my question is answered as 'yes' with or without the off-topic part that should be discussed on the linked thread...

 

How easy will they be to earn? My guess is that at the beginning the quick-starting of the market will mean we can at least generate quanta pretty much in direct ratio to playing time. People wanting to get at quanta faster to get ahead faster will be keen to pump real money into DACs to be able to sell them, so initially the DACs might be quite quick to earn compared to later on.

For simply storing DACs in a MSA or the Arkship?  I’d say storage of DACs would be more than safe.  If you try to move the DACs from one MSA to another, I’d say they should be lootable.  (If they have been traded, if they were purchased by the account holder they should be in the aforementioned vault)

 

And not a problem, it’s an important mechanic to toss over.  Been awhile since we’ve talked about it, and new members probably have insightful methods :)

 

Once initially traded, I think DACs should be treated as any other commodity.  You can protect resources in a MSA, so you should be able to drop off your DACs in a MSA

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Ah haha, thanks.  Missed it on the page crossover, thought mine was the first ;). Think he posted while I was developing my reply.

 

I do believe the topics go hand in hand.  The difficulty of attaining DACs plays directly to the nature of hoarding and transferring for markets.  But I suppose I can understand segmenting the topic.

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8 hours ago, Hades said:

 

 

I do believe the topics go hand in hand.  

They do. 

And topics naturally drift as the discussion evolves but I think they want to keep the specifics to a single thread so it's easier to collect feedback. 

 

It's a massive thread. :lol:

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I would love to see DAC´s more of a way of a Money Sink, like an NPC sells them ingame for Quanta so you get money of the Market, this way NQ has the ability to adjust the DAC Prices when the game progresses further. People arent able to use the IRL privilages to get ingamewealth. so everyone is equal ingame.

 

Lootable or not?

 

I think lootable is just fine, as you have the possibility to use the DAC right away after buying.

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3 hours ago, Falstaf said:

but I think they want to keep the specifics to a single thread

I've been having this problem in real life a bit. If you separate too much, then you begin to lose a feeling for connections and consequences - and I think it's important for conversations to mention or link to other threads, which happened. The OP did also ask about DAC overall, but in a way that is more about facts than opinions..

19 hours ago, BlorgonSlayer said:

So how will DAC work overall, and how will NQ address some of my concerns above?

 

Anyway, an important factor in how easy to earn is obviously about supply/demand affecting the relative price. Hoarding will also be part of this.

Making DACs cheaper will be that they are apparently the only way (afaik) of injecting real cash into the game, so paying to try and get ahead fast will all be via DAC supply side. Edit: this is perhaps the most important step by NQ as an answer to your question.

 

Making DACs more expensive may be attempts to buy up and hoard DACs for a time when cash injection slows down and supporter DACs per player are running out.

 

19 hours ago, BlorgonSlayer said:

If they are harder to get, I am worried that that is all people will focus on doing.

 

Harder to get means more effort in-game to get the quanta to buy a DAC. However, the prices of other things will be relative as well and that unit/currency will be quanta. People will focus on their motivations - but most will agree that doing well is part of having fun, so trying to amass quanta actively and through investments paying off is what will actually drive a lot of the focus in my opinion. DACs are only a subset of this.

I suppose the critical element is how many players will be aiming to play for free and how acceptable this is for the players trying to get ahead faster by paying/investing real cash. If NQ make a great universe then I think there will be no problem for them to get incomes based on the number of active players (=monthly subscriptions).

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I'm not sure if hoarding DAC is the absolute best solution. 

 

The cost of a DAC will or should always be in relation to the amount of quanta in circulation. You won't get a 100 Q if people can only pay 50 Q. So by selling your DAC after a year your actual buying power wouldn't be much more because of the prices of things increasing as people accumulate wealth. 

 

Naturally since you can't grind Quanta from the world its more complicated. But I think my original thought holds up. 

 

You could get a serious economic advantage by selling your DAC early. 

 

 

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English (deepl used)
 
Hello Falstaf,
DACs can also be sold for ores and Services.
 
 
Quote

 

German (original)
 
Hallo Falstaf,
man kann die DAC's auch für Erze oder Dienstleistungen verkaufen .
 
 

 

Die Waldfee

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Just to note that the merge point is now on page 4 of 5 and we were not considering what is now the first post and instructions ;)

https://board.dualthegame.com/index.php?/topic/12901-how-hard-or-easy-will-it-be-to-earn-dac/&do=findComment&comment=80833

 

@Falstaf: The tricky bit for me is that NQ will be quick-starting the quanta economy by presumably initially buying the most basic ores at the market or things that can be made directly using Alioth materials.

It would be a short-circuit if NQ bought DACs themselves on the market in return for quanta, so I assume players will be selling to an artificial mining or crafting market for a while.

If there are only two ways to get your hands on quanta, time/activity in-game or paying cash to get DACs to sell to others, I imagine some people will be keen to pump money in as DACS and sell them to get funds, while some will think it is 'better' not to go for infrastructure quickly, but to do as much low-level mining as possible (=time) and gather/hoard DACs as their investment instead.

 

"Absolute best" as you put it .... probably impossible to say, but I believe it will be a strategy inside DU. I think I disagree with you on price developments, however. I think the prices of low level stuff will go down over time, not up, meaning basic work in game will become less valuable over time, also in relation to the ability to buy DACs. ... I think I'll write on my semi-diary if anyone wants to branch out.

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