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XKentX

This is Dual Universe

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We all know the state of PVP is beyond miserable and big engagements are rare.
Here is our story of what you get when you try.

 

We spotted an AC HYP Flotilla leaving Locobus to Alioth. They had 3 XS ships, 1 S ship and 1 M ship.  We were heavily outgunned so we had to improvise.

The plan was to kite the XS ships away by showing only 1 XS core and then engage the M core with the rest of our ships (We had 2 S, 1 XS)


Part 1) The trap:
I am the pilot of the first XS ship that burned from alioth to intercept and then aligned back so they "catch up to me".
The rest of the ships were held closer to Alioth (like 10 SU from me) so they engaged only once I kited the XS away.

AC HYP flotilla cached up to me at about mid-way from Locobus to Alioth. I accelerated to max speed and got the M-Core at about 1-SU and opened fire with 4 L Railguns.
About 5min later the XS cores undocked from the M-Core as expected but couldn't catch up to me as we were at max speed. M-Core started slowing down forcing me to slow down too so the XS cores can get a lock on me at closer range.
I started changing trajectory as the XS cores were now slowly approaching me as I was not at max speed and slowly taking the XS cores away from the M-Core trajectory to alioth.

 

Part 2) The sheep:
Once I got the XS cores trajectory very well off the alioth trajectory, I instructed the rest of the ships to slow down and engage (so the M-Core that is heading to alioth will catch up with them, now without escort).
That worked and the XS cores got their trajectories all messed up and flew in different directions leaving the M-Core ship alone with 2 of our S-cores (about 16 L guns) opening fire on the M-Core.


The M-Core, left alone without escort, decided to run to Alioth and accelerated to max speed.
I changed my speed vector the other way and had intercepted the M-Core too (that was not planned but luck was on our side).
We now had about 22 L Railguns all engaging the defenseless M-Core freighter.

 

Part 3) The way out:
We were firing at the M-Core ship for about 20 minutes and then one of our gunners reported a player-kill + a crash. It happens when you kill an avatar, a known bug since the start of beta. The gunner-killer crashes.
The M-Core ship suddenly stopped (I assume, anyone who was on-board logged off or was dead). We all burned all our fuel to slow down and verified that the M-Core ship is now standing still and is a sitting duck.
All our ships started approaching and continued fire on the M-Core ship and trying to evade some XS-cores that finally arrived to try to save the M-Core freighter. 

 

Our own M-Core heavy gunship friend was about 40SU away and now burning towards us from Alioth so we didn't worry about XS cores spread all over as they are now outgunned and disorganized.

 

The M-Core ship started trying to repair some parts and accelerating but it had all it's engines down due to being under constant fire of about 22 L Railguns for the last 20 minutes. It started spinning and couldn't keep up with the repair.

Then, when AC HYP Gizzly ran out of options to survive, this happened:

 

 

 

For those who don’t understand what happens, The M-Core is standing still, is under fire (so the warp drive is in cooldown) and it suddenly just disappears. All 4 of our ships on field (about 12 players) just had it vanish from their radar. Can I get the skill to switch Universe too ? This is Dual Universe.

 

When I asked in Hyperion discord for comment, they threatened me that disclosure of this violated EULA and I will get a ban.

 

I believe I can disclose the footage of my video and share my experience. I don't see any EULA violation here.

 

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"When I asked in Hyperion discord for comment, they threatened me that disclosure of this violated EULA and I will get a ban."

 

It's strange for me to see that. I paid for 6 months subscription. Maybe I was in a hurry...

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25 minutes ago, XKentX said:

When I asked in Hyperion discord for comment, they threatened me that disclosure of this violated EULA and I will get a ban.

Interesting. I doubt it per se hardcore "cheats".

 

It can be that game itself may failed to register hits for cooldown (all kind of wierd shit happening all around). Or dysinc. Sure, some cheese (unknown to wider audience) is possibly present in situation too.

 

Probably now, when its gone public, we can get some comments from AC/HYP.

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10 minutes ago, le_souriceau said:

It can be that game itself may failed to register hits for cooldown

Warp jump during fight registers differently, you first see velocity increase, and then few ticks of ship moving away from you, it does not disappear instantly.
Later (like 30-60 mins later) this ship was found flying same route (Lacobus - Alioth), like 20 s.u. from the place it disappeared, already fully repaired, but was already in safe zone. So it surely was not a warp jump.

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It was likely an exploit that they used, and you are not meant to disclose exploits on the forums, which is why they threatened you. However, as you were not the one that used it, I’m not sure how you would get in trouble for showing a video of a ship disappearing, and I hope Hyperion gets in big trouble for this

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It saddens me that you try to paint a certain picture against Hyperion after accusing every organisation member as a cheater as one of the first few things you wrote. It also saddens me that you think it was a threat, when it was a copy-paste of the EULA section as a warning so you don't step over bounds you shouldn't, as others did before who ended up being punished for it. (As in openly calling everyone in Hyperion cheaters on a public platform, we thought you would be capable of doing so while being angry)

 

Well, I would be frustrated as well in your position, so I understand your viewpoint. However, before everyone else here judges early and harshly, hear me out:

 

Those that play PvP for a long time now (think Alpha, early few Beta weeks, and now) know of a common problem with the servers, especially for PvP, especially during weekend: Desync.

 

What newer players do not understand is how severe it can be, as they simply do not have the experience yet, but also because this was improved a lot, so it is rarely even noticeable.

These desyncs happen in excess of 100km at times. What I believe happened here was the Grizzly accelerating and a part of the game desyncing, resulting in a visible "jump" that might just have been a continuous movement, or the correction to the actual position (In this case many shots shouldn't have been possible to begin with because the position was "old").

 

On a sidenote: If there was a way to randomly teleport 100s of km in an instant, why would anyone do it during a fight, while people are recording? Why wouldn't they just avoid the fight and other ships to begin with? Nevermind that I don't even remotely have a clue how to do this on purpose.

 

As I said, I get that you're mad. But believing we would blatantly exploit something on purpose that I can't even start to think about how it should work...it saddens me. And accusing a complete org as cheaters because of what I believe is fundamentally a desync without originally even showing us the video of how it looked to you is a bit impulsive as well.

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1 minute ago, NQ-Naunet said:

I've just coordinated with another staff member and learned you've been instructed to submit tickets. :) 

I'll be keeping an eye on this, though. Thanks all!

We will submit tickets, I posted this to share my experience with the community.

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11 minutes ago, ZarTaen said:

Those that play PvP for a long time now (think Alpha, early few Beta weeks, and now) know of a common problem with the servers, especially for PvP, especially during weekend: Desync.

Only one, almost dead ship, out of 8 in range suddenly desyncs? when all their engines are down and speed is 0? Sounds veeery suspicious
After 45 mins of PvP encounter it somehow desires to desync only when it's almost dead? I can get if it was like 5-10 mins fight, but we were shooting this target for 45 mins straight.

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1 minute ago, W1zard said:

As soon as I posted "I have that on video" in Hyperion discord, I was banned on that server. Due to that fact I had no option to share video with you guys.
Which only increase suspiciousness

I guess you are "Wizard#7589 and as I see you are still member of our discord server. Please dont lie here. 😃
image.png.3c724013d36065e2f5a1e8834269151c.png image.png.aa4e891b83150ff24bb0f3e3f257932d.png

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7 minutes ago, Underhand Aerial said:

I guess you are "Wizard#7589 and as I see you are still member of our discord server. Please dont lie here. 😃
 

Yes, sorry, I checked it before your comment, and edited mine.
Seems like I was just posting in wrong text channel, and after that rights to this channel were removed or something like that, and I misunderstood that as server ban.

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The video is 

12 minutes ago, ZarTaen said:

And accusing a complete org as cheaters because of what I believe is fundamentally a desync without originally even showing us the video of how it looked to you is a bit impulsive as well.

1) It's nice you don't deny threatening me with EULA.

2) I did provide video, you banned w1zard(he recorded the video) from your discord so he couldn't share it with you.

3) Let's not judge, let's the community see and everyone to decide for themselves.

 

Fly dangerous.

o/

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4 minutes ago, XKentX said:

3) Let's not judge, let's the community see and everyone to decide for themselves.

When you really want the community to "see", feel free to share all messages from discord...;)

Here is my part of "threatening" you:
image.thumb.png.2b4af7cfc698c3f3f4e3c442134b3ff4.png

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56 minutes ago, NQ-Naunet said:

Hey there, although it's the weekend I'm interested in looking into this. Stay tuned!

Thank you for your hard work. I wrote in another thread about triangular windows. They are in the game, but there is no access to recipes)))

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This reminds me of PVP in Everquest.  Where from time to time you would get disconnected from the server in the middle of a fight.  But in the heat of the moment, not realize it, and just think you were winning.  Then suddenly it dawns on you, why is the other player just running into that wall, and not fighting back, or losing any HP...??

 

It sucks when it happens when the fight was going your way.  But it happens.

 

All i see in that video is a desync.  The actual desync probably happened a few minutes earlier, and the moment that the ship vanished is when the servers caught up.

 

But to accuse someone of cheating just because the server choked, and it happened to benefit them, is a bit over the top.

 

Accusing NQ of cheating on behalf of a player, with no evidence, is just silly. 

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16 minutes ago, Atmosph3rik said:

Accusing NQ of cheating on behalf of a player, with no evidence, is just silly. 

We didn't accuse NQ of cheating.

 

In past, there was 1 instance that happened to one of the participants that a target ship under attack was teleported by the GMs due to request in the discord channel.

 

When this happened the first thing that we all thought is that it was teleported by the GMs so we all started writing in the support channel that the ship under attack was teleported demanding it be brought back to the battlefield.

 

NQ staff from discord confirmed that they did not teleport this ship.

 

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1 hour ago, Atmosph3rik said:

All i see in that video is a desync.  The actual desync probably happened a few minutes earlier, and the moment that the ship vanished is when the servers caught up.

 

But to accuse someone of cheating just because the server choked, and it happened to benefit them, is a bit over the top.

 

Accusing NQ of cheating on behalf of a player, with no evidence, is just silly. 

As I think of it think right now (after emotional heat cooled down) this could have been just a huge desync (and probably it was).
But the amount of time and resources (a lot of fuel, more than 2000 ammo) wasted on this fight are much higher than average interception, and after an hour long PvP interaction it ended the way it's represented in the video.

I think this should be taken into consideration by NQ to fix, as it makes our gameplay very unpleasant.

My apologies to Hyperion (can talk only about myself though) for this kind of overreacting.

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3 hours ago, _Kiwi_ said:

It was likely an exploit that they used, and you are not meant to disclose exploits on the forums, which is why they threatened you. However, as you were not the one that used it, I’m not sure how you would get in trouble for showing a video of a ship disappearing, and I hope Hyperion gets in big trouble for this

While it is not allowed to discuss and exploit, it need to first be one first and so, unless NQ declares an exploit, there is no way to know if it is. This could be any number of things happening and yes, while some may be bugs that can be exploited, there is no announcement from NQ about this so as far as I can see they would never be able to make the claim this is an exploit. But then again, this is NQ and we know they have  a tendency to shoot first and ask questions later.

 

Does anyone here have experience with a what another player entering warp as you are watching them looks like in game?

 

  

7 minutes ago, W1zard said:

As I think of it think right now (after emotional heat cooled down) this could have been just a huge desync (and probably it was).

Honestly, if it was, the reaction from Hyperion (assuming it was as stated here) tells me it was not "just" a desync.

 

  

1 hour ago, Atmosph3rik said:

All i see in that video is a desync.  The actual desync probably happened a few minutes earlier, and the moment that the ship vanished is when the servers caught up.

Then why is the reaction so passive aggressive when asked for clarification? desync can happen sure, but it is also possible a potential exploit is used to trigger one

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2 hours ago, Underhand Aerial said:

When you really want the community to "see", feel free to share all messages from discord...;)

Here is my part of "threatening" you:
image.thumb.png.2b4af7cfc698c3f3f4e3c442134b3ff4.png

I don't get what this drama is all about - this response is pretty clear.

 

If you want to accuse someone of cheating, submit video logs to NQ.

 

Frankly NQ should ban anyone posting such accusations on the forums. Reddit generally already does as it's witchhunting.

 

 

 

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