TonyTones

I stuck around for 7 months after .23. I decided if they are going to soft wipe my industry, i'll focus on ship building. The constant economy disruptions (like right now) make that challenging but my biggest problem is how feedback is completely ignored.
 
   I believe they were dangling the idea of a wipe even back in summer 2021 when i stopped playing. NQ is still playing "will we/won't we" wipe and its insane. A game that relies on a large number of players to spend large amounts of time making this living world; to treat them with such contempt is incredible.
 
   I watch from afar like many, hoping a real studio will take over and make DU what it can and should be. My 2 cents

Joined in the first Alpha played hundreds of hours with and even was interviewed by the mouse @le_souriceau himself for his gazette back in the early days (under a different name) and I honestly thought this game had hit the sweet spot, but then it all just went to shit after 0.23 hit and combined with a total lack of progress, nay intermittent downgrading, the game became all but pointless. Only a single member from our org of about 50 players still plays anything more than the skill queue mini game.
 
such a shame. I still stare at all my old screenshots from the NDA Alpha period and reminisce about what could have been.

I usually just say NQ and refrain from referring to any specific person.
But this time I think it is warranted to say that Decard's statement has been proven very effective, at killing the game.
And if the majority of comments are negative, that by itself is VERY much a data point that should NOT be ignored.

I've been screaming this for the 3 months since the wipe talk. I mean WTF? We have to wait 3 damn months (a whole business quarter) to get a decision that effects the player base in such a way that the game is going to die because everyone has left because of indecision.
 
I mean I just found starship evo and it has one guy developing it and it already has everything this game has including better voxel tech with moving parts like hinges and rotation.( land vehicles and mechs)  and you get to scale engines and thrusters to the ship. The map is thousands of systems almost in the vein of elite dangerous. 
 
And it has some pve and has online pvp. Yes it's in VERY EARLY access but it shows how far up their ass these Devs heads are. To have a whole group of Devs that can't beat a one man show. Embarrassing. 

I started with 1 account and got 3 beta keys, which became 3 accounts which I played regularly and at that time I intended to keep when the game launches, even through the introduction of Schematics until they brought in Taxes. Since taxes and the mining changes I have shrunk my 3 accounts all playing regularly to basically only 1 of them playing some of the time.
 
Every major change they make leads me to playing less, and if the schematics change and the industry limits change go through then I am likely only to play in a token way until I run out of DACs.
 
I am assuming there will be a complete wipe except for BPs and money for Schematics because that is all they have told us so far, which means that everything I have built so far will disappear so I will also disappear over the time it takes for my DACs to be used up.
 
If they are putting limits in to make us pay for more accounts that is a good way to lose us to a game where a single subscription is enough for the game to be enjoyable, and there are games around for which that is true.

I agree with Zarcata.
The only thing ANYONE wants to know really is:
"Wipe or no wipe?", "how much?", "When?"
 
Everything else is irrelevant until we know that.

I'm not sure if these questions or the answers are really what players are currently concerned about.
I often have the impression with all the Lua questions that you didn't want to create a game, but a playground for Lua writers, whether professional or as a hobby.
The question about Sanctuary and Haven was unfortunately uninteresting for me. It would be much more important how a game release looks like with these two moons and the players. In the event of a "wipe" for all players, will there only be Haven or do you "have" to keep your Sanctuary tile? If we were to lose everything, does the new system with the base and launch plane also come to Sanctuary with landing and choosing what to build?
When will there finally be information for us players on how DualUniverse will continue? Fewer and fewer are playing because hardly anyone is motivated to play or even log in anymore due to the wipe idea. It's a terrible state of affairs at the moment - why are you delaying such information?

You are not alone.
I too still hope for the realization of the vision.
 

NQ do you really think schematics is the problem? In my opinion the problem is that you do not have any long term plans and goals, you just radically change things and you wait how does that work, this way you kill this game. Please focus all your coding power to implement new things to this game -> when game starts to lure more players in, markets will heal. Its just economy around living active universe. More interesting planets -> more to explore, more unique items (items you cannot craft!) -> dangerous places (if you really do not want pve, danger can be achieved via weather, unstable wormholes, etc) -> this kind of things creates interest. Now we have several allmost similar planets, pvp is crap, players are quitting, economy is not working (because time to time you change everything related to it and people sell everything they own crazy cheap). On top of all this, you have mentioned wipe, many players parked their ambitions and goals for their digital "Star Life" and they are now waiting for possible wipe... Sad.
 
I think you still have the most interesting platform to make it. To be the best space sim where people will spend countless hours enjoying things all we space breathing individuals dream in our dreams. Dont change existing, go forward and we follow...

This post was confusing, it kind of sounds like the left/right hands of development aren't on the same page. Is this essentially saying, they're making 'core' schems and you have to print a consumable copy to run an industry - So now I have an additional possible reason to troubleshoot all the industry when they turn off?
 
PLEASE NO
What happens to current schematics, and factories running them? Are schematic locations affected again? Some of the lower tier items can't be bought on alioth, sanctuary or haven, You have to go to at least Madis to find some BASIC ITEMS! Because of this people would stock up on schematics and overcharge those back on Alioth who couldn't be bothered (or have the capability) to warp there real quick.  How will this benefit longtime/existing players? Cause it sounds like it isn't going to reward the hundreds of millions (billions) of quanta people have already spent to specialize in an industry or like me, dabble in a little of everything.  If I have the cash, and want to purchase anything NOW, I'm not going to wait for a schematic to cook up in some queue. We already have a talent system that limits people that way.  We literally just had a talent reset, it was unexpected and it took me hours of taking screenshots of every skill page, then referencing those each again took hours more to restore post-wipe.  This  update would most certainly require another talent wipe. This update still does nothing to address the huge problem of the economy: theres no current way to show interest in buying certain items without a 100% deposit as a buy order. The Quanta just sits there and I have no way of knowing if/when the order will get filled.  The bot-linked ores in the market have crashed the prices, now theres no incentive to have large hauls from planets because people just sell ores to the local market bot. This means no ones paying to have anything hauled and they don't need to move it themselves. I used to have T1-T4 mining units on various planets and have since gotten rid of all of them and moved just to a  giant T1 plot on alioth because its easier to make a profit and manage. The mission system was just butchered, so options for earning quanta are extremely limited. We've been seeing changes coming with regards to markets, the exchange, talk of recycling items down to lesser components, talk of wipes .... and I get it, clearly the devs are trying to take the next best step forward. So please lets have the step actually move forward. Everything this post made me think is that I've wasted time/quanta earning schematics, so now I will lose that investment in favor of another mini-game that doesn't address the bigger issues. I've been around since before schematics were put in and STILL recovering from the damage it did but after the dust settled and people adapted it wasn't THAT bad of a change but it came at a point in the game that seemed oddly late, was not thought out well enough, and HAD TONS OF ISSUES like disappearing randomly or having the value mistakenly altered giving some players a HUGE advantage over others. Honestly the only changes to them i want to see at this point:
Cheaper. Some items and tiers are just so outrageously expensive that you're broke before you ever consider building anything you actually plan to put any time into.  Duplicates: ya its kinda lame having to buy more of the same schematic so a system where you have a core schem create copies would be nice. Maybe some of the lower stuff, decorations, etc re-added to nanocrafter.  More quality of life improvements please, not a tedious step backwards.

Just add a quanta tax to assembly lines or something. Not this "print this, spend time and quanta, sell it to someone who has to buy them weekly like fuel" wtf. Feels like a horribly complicated way to do a tax OR a lazy way to do a fuel-like energy mechanic. RIP DU

I get what you're saying and agree we need sinks and for the economy to get some balance. NQ also dropped the ball on countless occasions with many exploits that they blatantly ignored for months letting the economy get this way in the first place. Schematic shenanigans on .23 release and many other factory bugs that made people trillionaires and jacked up the whole thing. They also have the logs and could have squashed it then, but didn't. 
 
Now they're trying to fix issues they created by being lax on punishing exploits. Doing so by stealing every game mechanic they can from eve and calling it some new thing. Where's the creativity? Who in that meeting said yeah cool lets copy everything CCP does and play it off like someone actually thought of it. 
 
Where's the damn integrity?

economic stability, how do you figure they can archive that with people leaving the game?
 
the servers are not the resource, the players are the resources, NQ needs to gain and retain users badly
 
 

As a solo player I can say this... you took a system that worked fine (but took forever to build) and [filtered]ed it up with schematics, and with this change I don't feel like you are going back in the "fun" direction... feels like you are going further into what's wrong with the current system...
 
For a game about building stuff, you seem to love to put roadblocks in front of builders...
 
Edit: I just realized you are implementing the equivalent of microtransactions for schematics...

At first read this sounds even more cumbersome and tedious than the current implementation. It also sounds completely unrealistic.
 
Can we please see this in action on PTS BEFORE you finalise the system and implement it.

As if anyone is even around to care anymore, it's been 75 days+ since this was first posted. 
 
Since then, I think NQ has chimed in about the wipe 2 or 3 times. 
 
I'm not surprised that Nouredine Abboud (NQ's new CEO) is doing....basically nothing. His recent linkedIn post from today is about...RDMS and how brilliant it is:
 
Yeah, throw that bitcoin into your post -- real timely with that. DU has jack to do with blockchain or web3, but sure, try to convince people that DU is a "metaverse". 
 
 
Yep, no chaos here! The vision is so clear it's basically transparent. Nothing to see here, folks! 😭

Paying the subscription has one purpose, and that is gain access to the server. It's really that simple, you have no claim or right to anything but access to the server.
So no, NQ does not owe you anything once they wipe. 
 
The reason why I keep saying that it would simply not make any sense to thinks NQ will not wipe at/around release as they would have said so by now and put this to bed. Having said that, it would be for each individual player to decide whether to keep their subscription active until NQ makes the announcmeent. That really is the only leverage you currently have. 
 
Personally I really think NQ is wrong in thinking that holding off on the announcment of what I honestly believe will be the inevitable wipe, will just work against them once it happens.
 
I mean, think about it, if NQ would annouce they will wipe prior to release (and as I expect offer a 1-2 week headstart before the actual release date for backers and beta key holders choosing to take a subscription), that woudl then actually allow them a trial run of the release patchbeforfe that.. 
 
So they could effectively wipe - test the release patch in a "live PTS" situation to find any last minute issues - wipe again - headstart - release

Oh, forgot to point out, after last time we learnt that Entropy doesnt know there are no L wings, this time we learnt NQ was unaware players dont like memory leaks. I wonder what other things they dont do due to lack of player feedback.

Dear NQ,
All the bugs, we would actually rather have them fixed.
The server issues, desynch, ships teleporting back to where they were, we would actually like to have that fixed.
New bugs on the test server that people report, they actually report them because they do not want them to hit the real server.
The game hugging over 30GB of ram if you have them, we would rather have that fixed.
And there is a faint rumor, that some players may even would like to know what is going on with that wipe thing.
 
Hope that clears it up, now you know.
 

agreed
creating ships and buildings is the strongest aspect of this game and pvp is the weakest.
i was shocked when i saw the first pvp video on youtube, a clean 0/10 from me. i feel like only atmospheric combat around planets has potential. i would even like on foot combat like starbase has but this space combat over huge distances is the most boring "pvp" i have ever seen.

This game was fine as a sandbox building game, kind of a big empty LEGO world.
Lego builders dont need entertainment or gameplay, they just enjoy builds. Cities skylines players also just like builds, they like to just follow an npc and just look around.
Train-set builders also do nothing but to watch their builds.
I think this game would attract so many builders from every corner around the world, that it would always have enough ingame players, and maybe not too many at once as some would always take a break.
 
Too bad nq didn't focus on the building/trading part and give us more things to build and trade with.
They gave us a false start with unrealistic sized doors, couches and beds, 3 types of toilets, the most useless empty plantcase and no xs space fueltank. Also crazy core sizes which make no sense to me, why 63(127-255-511) voxels and not 64 (128-256-512)?
Instead of adding more types of wings, doors, cockpits, trees, npc elements (ive made these myself with voxels later on, even made them interactive with detection zones and transparent screens), nq cut down on builders. 
There is lua for ships on water, something nq should have implemented themselves. I know for sure people would start digging canals (because of the ugly random generated planet with puddles) and just sail on them for fun. Videos of ingame builds would flood the tube channels.
The builders needed more things to easily make quests so we could make more adventures, to aquire items to open doors in mazes and labyrinths. Now it was only possible in lua.
I think, that players would subscribe just to see the amazing world that has been build by players. 
 
Nq could have focused on building(what this game started with). Expanding the game with the lua-ideas, just like other games implemented mods from the community, and adding elements that have a proper function.
But nq focused on destroying. Pvp, limiting and wiping that is.
And now you are here, a full wipe (so no world) and a few players.
 
Pvp bashing by me:
Pvp in this game is the fugliest version of space combat i have ever seen, even space invaders is more dynamic, at least you can dodge in space invaders! Territory warfare in this game would be just as ugly, boring and untactical as spacewar in this game is. You cant hide behind an asteroid, so why would you be able to hide behind a hill?
Pvp in this state kicks out the creativity of building. 
Pvp in this game reminds me of those old atari 5600 games, where the box art was nowhere near the ingame screenshots or the gameplay.
Tactics do not exist in this game.
 
In the end, I am sure that this game had more potential for a sandbox building game, than a pvp game.
But hey, nq is trying to proof me wrong, so ill keep an eye out.
 
 
Edit after 5 likes:
Its about this game being fine after 0.23

AND what day would that be when you could give us "more concrete" news on a reset???? Could you perhaps tell us that??? Yall are trying to address the problem without addressing the problem, and every time you release a statement that is not an answer to the wipe but  another "we are still discussing it" you prove that point. Once again you have released a statement that is no statement. I have been a subscriber since the first beta weekend and have never been more frustrated. I know there are plenty of people who have supported this game longer but I think most of us want to know that answer to only one question more than any other. You are looking to things that will release when? after launch? before launch? that wasn't answered. I finally canceled auto renewal on all three of my accounts because there IS NO POINT IN PLAYING when we don't know the future or even about when these plans will be in place. I would love to play this game with my friends when we have a goal. but as long as the "reset" (wipe) is uncertain there is no goal I can think of that may or may not be wiped. 
 
You may not care but you will get no more money from me until you answer those questions. 
I have never spent more time on a game than I have with DU and this is so frustrating and upsetting. I am not yelling as I type, just sad. 

Please, "Fleet", not "Flotilla"

Du is no longer the "make you own game" MMO, and instead we now have NQ who is hand feeding us very specific ways that we must play the game.
For example they are now using the old mining system as a higher tier incentive where everything is stacked so that the PvP crowd get some involuntary victims to shoot at.
 
I.e NQ is saying either get involved in PvP (asteroid mining or missions), or learn to live with pocket change money given out by the mining bots.
And while I have no problem with risk-vs-reward systems, you cannot just decrease the non PvP income factor by something like 1/100 in a building game and call it a day.
 

Just if we are going to wipe it every year.
In one year we'll get the same that we have now.

serves you right for squating the landing pad. Thanks to people like you considerate people have had trouble finding a place to land near market terminals.
It's all water under the brige. You ship along with other 40 (by me personally) or so were scrapped and its parts found a new home with people who know how to park. 
 
It wasn't about quanta, in case you were wondering. I considered it a community service, thanks to which markets aren't laggy and everyone has room enough to land
be it L sized, klingon or even chinese ?