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joaocordeiro

Broken economy

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I would like to make a point 1st.

There are already big factories built by big trading orgs. Those orgs are mostly opting by direct trade and are not feeding the markets.

This completely screws the "market" concept that DU should have. (but i guess that was the primary objective of some cries... opposed to actually caring about any market orders)

 

But now we even have something completely wrong:

Players like me, 100% against owning any industry themselves, see themselves forced to have an industry, and find themselves as the only market supplier of some parts.

This is wrong.

I want to go search the pvp zone and kill ppl. Not manage how much copper I have to build res nodes so the noobs don't get ripped off with 5M prices...

 

Not having all items traded on the markets has proven to actually kill the market economy and transferring all major trading to direct barter between big players.

Those direct barters are the same ones that defend that bots should not have buy and sell all items.

 

This is killing the economy. Please act NQ.

The test has been made, and failed.

Now let's activate buy and sell for all items (with proper values and rarities) and test again.

 

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I have opposite view. Less intervention from NQ on the game market is better for long term play. Right now, after wipe, most of potential suppliers are focused on rebuilding their factories and chaines of supplies. So those who don't want to build their own factories, can only wait (or build them ofc). Be patient. Bots are simple but very lazy solution and we shouldn't ask for lazy solutions.

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4 minutes ago, Lucjan said:

I have opposite view. Less intervention from NQ on the game market is better for long term play. Right now, after wipe, most of potential suppliers are focused on rebuilding their factories and chaines of supplies. So those who don't want to build their own factories, can only wait (or build them ofc). Be patient. Bots are simple but very lazy solution and we shouldn't ask for lazy solutions.

The main problem with your view is that we are all enemies.
Why would any org craft weapons to arm unknown entities by selling them on the market?
Even if you find some logical answer for this, the reality we are seing already confirms it: they dont.

Big orgs are supplying them selfs  and their close allies while the rest of us refresh the market in hope for some "player driven economy"

Buy the time a Beta player gets his 1st XS gun, the supplier org will have a fleet of hundreds of ships with L weapons in space waiting for him.

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1 minute ago, RhenKhanhar said:

Jesus, the BETA is 2 days old and the release one year away and they already whine about little stupid shit.

1st watch your language.


2nd the testing of the game did not start 2 days ago, only beta did.

The problem I am presenting is real, his happening and you have not shown any reason why time would fix it.

In my experience the disadvantage non industrialist players and orgs are facing right now will only get bigger with time.

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17 minutes ago, joaocordeiro said:

The main problem with your view is that we are all enemies.

or maybe your main problem called "we are all enemies" is only your problem?
I would say that we are rivals, not enemies.

9 minutes ago, joaocordeiro said:

2nd the testing of the game did not start 2 days ago, only beta did.

The problem I am presenting is real, his happening and you have not shown any reason why time would fix it.

In my experience the disadvantage non industrialist players and orgs are facing right now will only get bigger with time.

so go industrial, just a little bit to satisfy your own demand - its simple as in RL (even way more simpler)

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5 minutes ago, Lucjan said:

I would say that we are rivals, not enemies.

Already answered:

18 minutes ago, joaocordeiro said:

Even if you find some logical answer for this, the reality we are seing already confirms it: they dont.

Big orgs are supplying them selfs  and their close allies while the rest of us refresh the market in hope for some "player driven economy"

 

 

5 minutes ago, Lucjan said:

so go industrial, just a little bit to satisfy your own demand - its simple as in RL

Nope, you do not start from Stone Age on RL, there is an already working economy around you in RL.

 

Also, NQ wants us to have the choice. That choice is not present right now. And I'm warning NQ about it.

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11 minutes ago, joaocordeiro said:

Nope, you do not start from Stone Age on RL, there is an already working economy around you in RL.

Yes, there is working economy around us but it was not magically grown from nothing, someone must build it, and run it.
Game gives you freedom, stop whining and use it.

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Just now, Lucjan said:

Yes, there is working economy around us but it was not magically grown from nothing, someone must build it, and run it.
Game gives you freedom, stop whining and use it.

From the logic of it: I would assume a ship the size of the ark ship traveling 10000 years with hundreds of thousands of souls inside would not send a person to the open world without having some kind of basic economy.

 

And again, that's not what NQ wants. And im just warning them of what's happening.
And I will not stop providing feedback to NQ about the state of things from the player perspective. I'm sorry if my feedback disturbed you...

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40 minutes ago, joaocordeiro said:

The main problem with your view is that we are all enemies.
Why would any org craft weapons to arm unknown entities by selling them on the market?
Even if you find some logical answer for this, the reality we are seing already confirms it: they dont.

Big orgs are supplying them selfs  and their close allies while the rest of us refresh the market in hope for some "player driven economy"

Buy the time a Beta player gets his 1st XS gun, the supplier org will have a fleet of hundreds of ships with L weapons in space waiting for him.

Lol we are not all enemies, you are a bit paranoid matey.  The market is going fine, I have been selling on it since launch (I didnt do the ore rush) and the increase in seller has been crazy since the bots nerf.  Today i visited every market in Alioth / Sanc moon, EVERY market had players in it.  I have NEVER seen anything close to that before.  Please dont take this the wrong way, but i dont think you have a full grasp of the market.

The thing is the game is not ready for pvp players like you, sorry but that is just the way it is.  Let us build the world first, then when pvp is working, I will pay you plenty of quanta to keep my stuff safe.  You will have a role, just not quite yet.

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6 minutes ago, Moosegun said:

Today i visited every market in Alioth / Sanc moon, EVERY market had players in it

Well new players spawn there and have to do a bunch of tutorials there. So its not representative of any economy. Open the market and search for "remote control"

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Remote control: isn't that a bit of a luxury?

 

I've not been on the market, since I've only had the time to do some mining, but isn't there anything on there at all? A week in, even solo players bootstrapping themselves out of their pockets full of rocks should be starting to think "maybe I could sell a spare one of [whatever] and get [this other thing] off someone else a bit quicker than making it myself" . Is the market really totally devoid of sell orders?

 

That would be a bad sign. 

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If you want to go at it alone and you want to focus on pewpew you will need to choose between finding an org willing to sell you what you need, wait for items to become available in markets or set up industry, Stocking markets would in fact be what will wreck the economy and make player interaction irrelevant. Use the trading section here  or on discord to request supply of the materials you need, create relationships with orgs with manufacturing to agree hey sell you what you need., team up with industrially focused players to obtain the stuff you need. 

 

Plenty of options that work, the one which won't would be complaining here about how you are forced to do it yourself (while you are not, it's a choice).

 

 

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There is no remote control for sale in the entire marked, no resurrection node either last time I checked.. And that's just two items I happened to look up since I wanted them. I am sure there is even more essential stuff missing also.

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Just now, CptLoRes said:

There is no remote control for sale in the entire marked, no resurrection node either last time I checked..

I, a damn pirate, had to build a industry line to offer res nodes at 150000 because without me the price would be 1M.

Thats the player economy working for you. Pirates selling res nodes.. 

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2 minutes ago, CptLoRes said:

To be fair we will have to give it some time to see how the market develops. But I suspect there will lots of fringe cases like this for a long time.

But do you think the industrialists dont have their factories ready to start selling products? 

Or like me you think they have been producing for a long time but are trading outside of markets and only with allies? 

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I think that if there are some strategic parts missing in the market, eventually someone will see an opportunity and fill the segment. But without real competition I think prices will stay high. Even for essentials.

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7 hours ago, joaocordeiro said:

I would like to make a point 1st.

There are already big factories built by big trading orgs. Those orgs are mostly opting by direct trade and are not feeding the markets.

This completely screws the "market" concept that DU should have. (but i guess that was the primary objective of some cries... opposed to actually caring about any market orders)

 

But now we even have something completely wrong:

Players like me, 100% against owning any industry themselves, see themselves forced to have an industry, and find themselves as the only market supplier of some parts.

This is wrong.

I want to go search the pvp zone and kill ppl. Not manage how much copper I have to build res nodes so the noobs don't get ripped off with 5M prices...

 

Not having all items traded on the markets has proven to actually kill the market economy and transferring all major trading to direct barter between big players.

Those direct barters are the same ones that defend that bots should not have buy and sell all items.

 

This is killing the economy. Please act NQ.

The test has been made, and failed.

Now let's activate buy and sell for all items (with proper values and rarities) and test again.

 

Hell Yeah!

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6 hours ago, joaocordeiro said:

Well new players spawn there and have to do a bunch of tutorials there. So its not representative of any economy. Open the market and search for "remote control"

At the market terminals I am talking about.

LMAO yeah because a Remote Control is something that is vital for new players on start up.......  of course noone is building them yet, people are focusing on stuff that people will buy, not niche products.

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1 hour ago, joaocordeiro said:

But do you think the industrialists dont have their factories ready to start selling products? 

Or like me you think they have been producing for a long time but are trading outside of markets and only with allies? 

pretty much every key product has seen a surge of products since bots were nerfed, I KNOW because i watch the markets, I AM an industrialist......

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