Jump to content

Recommended Posts

If you’re in a protected area, yes.  Many people will say if you aren’t into PvP, this game isn’t for you.  It’s come up in countless threads prior, but I honestly disagree.  Major cities/installations will HAVE to be protected... stay within those limits, and do what you want... build new designs to sell, create fancy scripts... whatever.

 

Alternatively, fly to some obscene expanse of space and do your own thing.  The only truly contested areas will be between organizations over major resource veins and whatnot.  Yes, someone can come up on you by chance... but the universe will be vast.

 

PvP is a major component of the game, but it is not the end all be all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sure it possible.....probable.....maybe not....its all part of the game.

If they are flying over head and you're on their side/neutral then you gotta a good chance of not being killed.

However.....just remember, where  privateers come from.....

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What's different about PVP in Dual Universe is that the game won't be pitting us against each other.  In terms of creating teams, and arming us, and spawning us on opposite sides of a map and saying GO.

 

If that ship is going to come down and kill you,  you'll probably have to give them a reason to do it.

 

And if they decide to come after you, it's going to cost them.  Maybe just some ammo, or maybe a few of your friends show up and they loose their ship.

 

But unlike a lot of pvp games there won't really be an incentive for them to kill you just for the sake of it.  Unless you have something they want.  Or you did something they didn't like. 

 

But killing you isn't the point of the game.  It's just one of many options.

 

Personally i plan on spending most of my time hiding in a safe zone building stuff. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Captain Jack said:

What part of PvP matters in this game? I want to be farming in a forest and see big space ships flying overhead and feel small. Not threatened. Is that possible?

It's an evolving space:-
 

Quote


We know that each possibility comes with Pros and Cons. Expect the final decision to be announced more or less at the same time we’ll communicate in detail about the PvP gameplay.

 

 

For example early beta iirc there won't be combat, but there will be building/terraforming (voxel) gameplay.

 

Obviously combat is integral to the game:-

 

Builders and PvP:-

 

builders-pvp-players.png?w=630

 

I guess large orgs are going to be very necessary for the second part  of your preference, so in theory yes it should

be possible but it's dependent on conditions emerging. Likewise without these conditions in theory no, if considering the shadow of threat hovering over your head along with those big constructs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I disagree with the whole notion of

 

"Its a big universe"

 

Because while the universe is big, most of it is empty space you can't  do much with. I also learned that its a good assumption that someone WILL find you from Minecraft factions because sooner or later, I would find my base wrecked. I also don't think relying on  cities for protection  is a good idea as they would be hot targets for people looking to get quick loot.

 

I also disagree with the notiom that war NEEDS to be an essential part of the economy as there are other sources of demand for constructs like habitation and civilisn transportation. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

if nothing gets destroyed then the market will be saturated one day - so yeah, CVC/AVA is a big part of the economy.

 

to put it with terms of eve: "the best ship you can have is friendship". Cities won't help you much when attacked, nor some hidden base. Only your org and friends.

 

You may encounter ppl who shoot you on sight. You may encounter helpful ones. Some will ignore you. Some will kill you on day 20 and ask you for help on day 21. The fun part is to know who you can trust

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Hades said:

If you’re in a protected area, yes.  Many people will say if you aren’t into PvP, this game isn’t for you.  It’s come up in countless threads prior, but I honestly disagree.  Major cities/installations will HAVE to be protected... stay within those limits, and do what you want... build new designs to sell, create fancy scripts... whatever.

 

Alternatively, fly to some obscene expanse of space and do your own thing.  The only truly contested areas will be between organizations over major resource veins and whatnot.  Yes, someone can come up on you by chance... but the universe will be vast.

 

PvP is a major component of the game, but it is not the end all be all.

"I completely agree with this. If you don't want to PvP at all, that's fine. No one will force you out of the safe zones unless you bring something out of there. Bumping ships is something common in Eve, and I'd like to see how possible it is to get something bumped out of safe space. It should be possible after all. I mean, if someone destroyed your valuable construct for the fun of it and happens to leave his shiny hovercraft out in the open while AFK, you should be permitted to have some revenge of your own. That should give players a good reason to employ whatever 'anchor' or 'docking' mechanics Dual Universe will have in the future, and not leave children unattended in public places. Getting a cup of tea in a 'jiffy' is plenty enough time for some content-makers or disgruntled players to populate DU's version of Zkillboard (NQ, we need APIs for this.)."

8 hours ago, Alethion said:

Sure it possible.....probable.....maybe not....its all part of the game.

If they are flying over head and you're on their side/neutral then you gotta a good chance of not being killed.

However.....just remember, where  privateers come from.....

 

 

 

"Fifteen men on the dead man's chest.

Yo-ho-ho and a bottle of rum!

Drink and the Devil's done for the rest.

Yo-ho-ho and a bottle of rum!

 

It is wonderful the way you put it: you have a 'good chance' of not being killed. 'Good chance' in this case is similar to the fate of late General John Sedgewick whose reported last words were along the lines of: "Why are you dodging like this? They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance".  Before being shot by Confederate sharpshooters.

 

May his soul rest in peace. 

 

If you see a passing craft in open space, you will likely be fired upon, unless the owners of said craft are nice people, in a serious hurry, or they don't deem you worth the effort (which could be either of two things: you will likely cause them too much trouble to handle alone, or you simply don't have anything worth offering. In Eve, we generally don't waste shots on shooting stuff that costs way less than every salvo of expensive ammo. Yup, counting salvos is a thing, at times. You'll understand why if Dual Universe gets to that level.) 

 

Best defence: stay safe with other people, defences or build up a reputation of someone who doesn't mind ruining the game for someone else who ruins his day (pro-tip: you might want to keep an eye out for bounties, although if NQ follows the Eve way of bounty loss being equal to the ship destroyed, bounties will be a lot less attractive or effective than we would like...Be that as it may, HTX is here if you need help with swift vengeance.) 

 

Carry a big stick. You will know peace. 

 

Be an ant, you will get stepped on. 

"

 

7 hours ago, Atmosph3rik said:

What's different about PVP in Dual Universe is that the game won't be pitting us against each other.  In terms of creating teams, and arming us, and spawning us on opposite sides of a map and saying GO.

 

If that ship is going to come down and kill you,  you'll probably have to give them a reason to do it.

 

And if they decide to come after you, it's going to cost them.  Maybe just some ammo, or maybe a few of your friends show up and they loose their ship.

 

But unlike a lot of pvp games there won't really be an incentive for them to kill you just for the sake of it.  Unless you have something they want.  Or you did something they didn't like. 

 

But killing you isn't the point of the game.  It's just one of many options.

 

Personally i plan on spending most of my time hiding in a safe zone building stuff. 

 

"Hehe. If I feel in the mood for killing people on a certain day, you'd better hope that I meet people way out of my league. Generally, we don't need good reasons to destroy things. Once you lose enough stuff to people who make it a point to provide non-consensual PvP, you begin to look at things in a different light. Rampaging will be a thing and it will teach people to be circumspect (in Eve-speak: watch local, check corp, keep an eye on intel channel, D-scan, keep an eye out for probes, and all those kinds of security measures). I don't know how much self-restraint people exercise on a daily basis, but vets will generally think it their duty to show new players how it is not done in an MMO. How they go about that matter is different. Some blow you up and refund the cost (I love doing this), giving you tips along the way. Others blow you up and explain what you did wrong and leave. Yet others, ruin you and leave without saying a word, or sometimes they rub it in your face.

 

Like someone said: "Get over it. We can't all be nice people." 

 

What the aggressed usually forget is that it's a game What the aggressors generally know is that it will happen to them, or has happened to them. It will be a game, and it was made to be a game. By the time you have emos showing up - wailing, whining and issuing death threats, you know someone's about to get banned...in most cases, the aggressor gets off with a few hours of hate and life resumes as usual - with one player less, of course. I've lost expensive ships because I was too lazy to switch to an alt and move them to corp controlled territory that way. If you're hauling stuff and you have someone 'yellow-boxing' (targeting) you, generally dock-up fast and log-out (this happened to me quite recently. I logged off, came back, switched ships to something small and fast and made the safe delivery of expensive implants). Come back when the 'gankers' (think kamikaze) are mostly offline. It's mostly advised to fly covert ops ships in the first place, that way you're only seen when undocking and never again.

You'd want to avoid this kind of loss:  https://zkillboard.com/kill/67196585/ . 500 PLEX (One month of Omega subscription) is about 1.6 billion ISK. $20 == 500 PLEX. That freighter lost 84 billion. You may do the math at your leisure. Despite popular opinion, it's quite hard to imagine the pilot's face when that ship was down to 25% hull and there was no help in sight (assuming he was not AFK, or his client didn't close unexpectedly). 

Whether or not the pilot took it with a grain of salt, learnt something from it or cried himself to sleep, I have no idea. What I know is: it happened in an unprotected area of space where killing is legal: i.e Low-sec. Even in high-sec (protected space), gankers fly ships fitted to dish out massive DPS and laugh at your pain. You are free to hunt gankers down, but they generally use alts. Don't think me to be a horrible person: I'm firmly against ganking innocent traders and newbros, but that doesn't mean everyone is.

 

Others have lost it. Be smart. Be safe. Don't do it unprotected.

"

2 hours ago, 0something0 said:

I disagree with the whole notion of

 

"Its a big universe"

 

Because while the universe is big, most of it is empty space you can't  do much with. I also learned that its a good assumption that someone WILL find you from Minecraft factions because sooner or later, I would find my base wrecked. I also don't think relying on  cities for protection  is a good idea as they would be hot targets for people looking to get quick loot.

 

I also disagree with the notiom that war NEEDS to be an essential part of the economy as there are other sources of demand for constructs like habitation and civilisn transportation. 

"

Yes, the Universe is big, but investment (effort, resources, dedication) make any new home small. There's a reason why most people live on the coast or in heavily populated areas. 95% of humanity lives on just 10% of the land, anyway. But, there are always safer places to move to - it makes me wonder whether wormholes will be a thing, but I digress. This is DU not Eve, although a lot of Eve veterans and sandbox players, in general, will have a headstart in knowing how to secure and manage land. 

 

Oh, yes. Someone will find you. Most of the time, it won't be your average friendly neighbourhood Spiderman.  

 

Yes, and no. Cities are generally safe if you're talking about war declarations by small bands. There are enough people who care about making the game conducive enough for new players or themselves and they will swiftly show misguided gangs that you don't fight a city with standard rank and file army tactics. On the other hand, you might want to get your things in order if Zerg alliance decides it's annoyed your city exists. Zergs are very touchy people, you see. The reason being that the loot in a city is worth the Zerg's time and effort. They don't mind swarming your city like zombies and losing 300billion Quanta if they know the loot and property in that city is worth 600-900billion.

 

Oh, no. War needs to be essential for the economy. And you just mentioned why: occupied space will be small, right? For example, if the occupied space is small, and people refuse to move out, and resources are ever abundant (just a skip away to planet X, while the collective hive mind expands at 8 hex tiles a minute), tell me how you plan on getting rich from mining? War makes things scarce, war makes things unpredictable. That's why people are willing to pay more for items found only in dangerous environments. If everyone knows where to find something:

 

"Just go get it and come back chap. I'll pay you five Quanta per 100m3. What? Too low? Well, anyone can do it. I'll find someone else. Cheers."

And he will find someone else, because there is always someone more desperate than you or with a bigger ore hold than you.

 

But, if they know Sector F-911 is inhabited by dangerous content makers and the only other choice is to wait four weeks for Care Bear Hauling Services to get enough orders to make the trip to System S-112 worth their while, they will be willing to pay you many times the standard price. We as humans, generally want things done fast...besides, subscription won't pause while JDHS waits to ship several thousand tonnes of raw material. Time's a running. War makes you rich, and I'm not talking about BAE, Northrop Grumman or Lockheed Martin here, I'm talking about the average Novean.

"

1 hour ago, Lethys said:

if nothing gets destroyed then the market will be saturated one day - so yeah, CVC/AVA is a big part of the economy.

 

to put it with terms of eve: "the best ship you can have is friendship". Cities won't help you much when attacked, nor some hidden base. Only your org and friends.

 

You may encounter ppl who shoot you on sight. You may encounter helpful ones. Some will ignore you. Some will kill you on day 20 and ask you for help on day 21. The fun part is to know who you can trust

 

 

"

+1. 

 

 

Cheers.

"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Stay in the safezone if you are so scared, or hire protection alternatively be in an org that can provide protection. This isn't a game in god-mode or creative-mode, you will have to take risks if you want to do many things. As simple as that. And when you are at it you'd probably want to realize that the likelyhood that something flying over the tree-tops is gonna spot or attack you may very well be very small even if they could technically kill you. Just learn how to calculate your risks and find smart ways to stay safe, nobody is gonna just provide that for you for no reason, that's what the safezone is for and nothing else.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Folks looking to use bumping/exploits like in Eve, pointless killing sprees like in Eve, I think it's fun to kill other players and then give their stuff back (typical Eve), some will kill you on day 20 and ask you for help on day 21 (Eve), stay in the safe zone if you are so scared, we don't need good reasons to destroy things, get over it, we can't all be nice people... and don't forget to load up your alts.

 

Sigh. I was hoping for more.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Captain Jack said:

Folks looking to use bumping/exploits like in Eve, pointless killing sprees like in Eve, I think it's fun to kill other players and then give their stuff back (typical Eve), some will kill you on day 20 and ask you for help on day 21 (Eve), stay in the safe zone if you are so scared, we don't need good reasons to destroy things, get over it, we can't all be nice people... and don't forget to load up your alts.

 

Sigh. I was hoping for more.

Then do smth more, it's up to you, me and everyone else to do whatever suits them. 

 

I enjoy being a pirate and scamming ppl (with all consequences). That doesn't mean I won't or can't enjoy other activities.

 

Don't like the pirate threat near your traderoute? Drive em off - it'll be hilarious for everyone. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/24/2018 at 8:05 PM, ToTOJA said:

Congratulation,
for this lesson, Aetherios.
Even DualUniverse will become evil!

"Hello.

 

Dual Universe doesn't need to become evil. A game is always what you make it. There will be times when people decide to help an aggressed player because they pity him. There will be times when they decide to deal with the aggressors because there are scores to be settled. And, yet, there will be times when they leave both sides to fight and capitalise on that to finish off the victor. If new members to the game can't see the forest for the trees, it may not be entirely their fault. At the same time, it could be their fault alone. As said in my previous post, when people lose a lot, they often decide to fight back or make others pay. That's called displacement in Psychology. It's completely natural. Others choose to repress, but sooner or later, they quit because they can't keep up with the losses, or become exhausted with constantly feeling threatened. 

 

PvP is not a touchy topic. Please let's not make it one. This game is about more than just fighting, just the same way it is about more than just building. Both are important, both are necessary. There is fun to be had in tactics, excitement in adrenaline...and plenty of spreadsheets in industry to supply the materials for that. No one is a PvPer from the moment he starts a game till the day he logs off for the final time. Believe me, no one - not even in Eve. If you see such a character, it's probably an alt: the main character is doing something else to finance the losses: trading, PvEing...or even mining in the corporation controlled territory. Once the losses become too much to sustain, every sensible player takes a pause to refill the coffers. That's DU. Find what you like doing, and find something to support it. If what you like doing sustains itself, it's win-win for you. Be happy.

 

@Captain Jack 

Like Eve, like Eve, like Eve...Both are MMOs, both have content, and both refrain from forcing a player to follow a linear storyline. I understand if you don't like Eve, or the tactics in Eve: many have left, many are leaving and many more will leave. At the same time: many have joined, many are joining and many will still join. For all the prophecies of doom and declining statistics, the game has survived, even more so as they had 6000 players in a single system two days ago. Of course, time dilation made the battle a horror, but that draws the next topic for you. How DU is not like Eve. 

 

Eve doesn't give you the ability to build whatever you want, however you want. DU doesn't give you a blank slate with a ship and the freedom to turn into a thorn in the side for bigger ships or an exploration frigate. Because DU doesn't give you a ship. DU tells you to create one. People in Eve are interested in DU, and they keep marvelling at the potential for creativity that DU holds. 

 

Eve doesn't give you an infinite universe like DU, and DU doesn't limit your interaction with planets to collecting resources, like Eve. Eve does not provide you with a completely safe environment once you undock. Even in high-sec, you can and will be attacked if there is sufficient reason. DU does, even if it's only one planet. Make no mistake, I do not support glorifying the ego of players in Eve who want CCP to push out all the new players from high sec so that they can populate their killboards. The players who fly the most expensive ships know what activity is involved in building them: mining. 

 

Don't blame DU for having humans play it. Should you want a completely automated environment, DU cannot and will not provide that for you. CCP did not create bumping, or griefing, or killing sprees. These things were there before Eve because there were gamers and people before Eve - even as there were people and gamers before DU. People are not senseless robots. Unlike NPCs, they will not attack without reason once you enter their reaction zone. Find out why they attack you, or why they look for you and take the right measures to protect yourself. Make yourself happy and make the gankers sad. There are ways to do that...and most of the time, you don't even have to do it yourself: someone else is always willing - for the fun or for the right price. Be a human, and unlike an NPC, find that person, if you are incapable of defending yourself against aggressors. Who knows? Your aggressors may just turn out to be friends in disguise.

 

There is so much more, but you have to find it. It won't come to you by itself. 

 

Cheers.

 

"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Aetherios

 

Yes, a lot of people from Eve are looking at this game for how it can be a better Eve, but a lot of people that have hated there experiences or never wanted to play Eve are also into the idea of this game.  

 

This game can and hopefully will appeal to those of us who won't even consider games that are balanced toward PVP because of our experiences with Eve.  If this game has the same player atmosphere of Eve, then a lot of the interested players will move on.  Those of us who don't like Eve want this game to be more than we believe that game could ever be.  We want it to be oriented toward building and growing a society together.  We don't want the entire game to be about war and destruction.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The entire game isn’t about war and destruction.  But major components of it are.  If you’re in unprotected space and get shot down by a solo bandit, it happens.  If you’re in a seemingly protected space, but an equal or bigger fish has conflict with the city owners and raids... it happens.  

 

You can go your own way and avoid conflict as much as possible, which can become a fun past time in and of itself.  Since you won’t be needing combat abilities, try and implement the most efficient construct for escape.

 

There is open PvP in this game, there will be people who kill everyone on sight, there will be people who attack anyone with a semblance of wealth. 

 

As I’ve said before, you will be able to enjoy DU without seeking out PvP... you might even become one of the wealthiest players because of it... however, DU has combat at its heart and that isn’t going to change.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Hades said:

The entire game isn’t about war and destruction.  But major components of it are.  If you’re in unprotected space and get shot down by a solo bandit, it happens.  If you’re in a seemingly protected space, but an equal or bigger fish has conflict with the city owners and raids... it happens.  

 

You can go your own way and avoid conflict as much as possible, which can become a fun past time in and of itself.  Since you won’t be needing combat abilities, try and implement the most efficient construct for escape.

 

There is open PvP in this game, there will be people who kill everyone on sight, there will be people who attack anyone with a semblance of wealth. 

 

As I’ve said before, you will be able to enjoy DU without seeking out PvP... you might even become one of the wealthiest players because of it... however, DU has combat at its heart and that isn’t going to change.

I disagree that it has combat at it's heart.  Yes, PVP will be part of the game, but that doesn't make it the games heart.  Building is this games heart.  When JC talks passionately about the game he talks about coming together to build great wonderful things.  He barely mentions PVP most of the time.  It's the community that try to make PVP the most important part of the game.  I understand that necessity drives innovation, and that PVP will be a large part of the economy.  If you think about the real world though, most people don't fight for their lives daily.  There are parts of the world where they might, but most of the world lives in peace most of the time.  That is because for most people the risk of fighting over a thing is not worth the value of the thing.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, fortunately DU isn’t the real world.  Yes there will be consequences for ganking every poor chap who comes across your path.  However, that’s entirely dictated by player organizations and whatever committees are formed.  Furthermore, large organizations will be more likely to be at odds over territory than in the real world.  Thinking that “nations” won’t turn on each other because that’s how the real world works is pretty misleading.

 

Arguing what the heart of DU is is pretty subjective, and I think you brought that up just to be argumentative.  Conflict and building go hand in hand.  When you build a city it invites conflict, people who want the wealth provided by the city may fight for it.  Obviously building is required for this game to get anywhere.  It’s like arguing which feature is the mitral valve or the ventricular valve of the heart.

 

If you think that the DUniverse is going to be full of sunshine and dandelions you’re in for a rude awakening I think.  Conflict is what keeps the gears turning, and that’s the point I’m trying to get across.  There will be times where you are forced into conflict, it’s just the nature of it.  The cool thing is you can build a construct efficient at escape or diversion.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

RL industries have fared just fine even when much of their market is civilian. There will be demend for products without war thanks to civlian companies looking to expand their assets and people crashing their ships and such. This is especially true if machines have a limited lifespan.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Felonu

I couldn't have put it better myself. That's one of the main things that drew me to the game, is that in most interviews JC never really talks much about combat. Even when asked about combat, its more of an after thought, compared to all the other features. Its a stark contrast to the way most space game developers talk. Even on the website, the first thing you see in BOLD letters is "Dual Universe: THE CIVILIZATION BUILDING MMO ". You have to scroll down 7 pages, to the bottom, before it even mentions combat. An even then it doesn't says free for all PVP combat, it says Warfare.

 

I think every player understands that you will have the ability to kill each other. But, I don't think free for all PVP is Novaquark's main focus for DU, based on what they say. Ultimately, it will be the mindset of players who shape this game.

 

@Captain Jack 

The way I see it is, civilizations can only be build if there is stability first. You can't build on unstable ground or in an unstable environment.

 

Scenario 1: If players have no way of securing there build site an resources while working on a project, then what will happen is 90 percent of the player base will stay in the 1 crowded safezone, and the whole Universe beyond the safezone will become a PVP gankfest, with nothing but bases used like combat arena's for PVP. An eventually, gamers may feel DU is no different then other space games, not worth the monthly fee, and move on to another game.

 

Scenario 2: If players have access to good defensive systems (Shield Domes, Ion/EMP cannons, enemy/weapon detection, land/space Mines, etc..) and not just guns, then it should create a good enough balance that players can actually build civilizations outside of the safezone. Grouping up in a Organization doesn't help most of the time, Because you're friends/org mates aren't always online, and if you have to spend most of you're time chasing away griefers, and most of your money paying for protection, then you have less time/money to do anything else.

 

I'm very curious to see what DU becomes, because regardless of all the game mechanics, every MMO is shaped by the mindset of the playerbase.

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Felonu said:

@Aetherios

 

Yes, a lot of people from Eve are looking at this game for how it can be a better Eve, but a lot of people that have hated there experiences or never wanted to play Eve are also into the idea of this game.  

 

This game can and hopefully will appeal to those of us who won't even consider games that are balanced toward PVP because of our experiences with Eve.  If this game has the same player atmosphere of Eve, then a lot of the interested players will move on.  Those of us who don't like Eve want this game to be more than we believe that game could ever be.  We want it to be oriented toward building and growing a society together.  We don't want the entire game to be about war and destruction.  

"

You seem to misunderstand me. 

 

I am not looking for a better Eve. If I was looking for a better Eve, I would be talking to CCP's developers and CSM, not posting on Dual Universe Forums. My level of involvement with Dual Universe is many times greater than Eve: I'm not an active member of the general Eve community, and I have not made any posts on the Eve Forums either. I play Eve with my corporation in Eve to learn more about MMOs and prepare myself for a similar environment in Dual Universe. 

 

As Hades noted, it isn't going to be a bed of roses. I believe JC knows this, whether or not he talks about it. What DU provides is an option to make it a bed of roses for yourself...with effort as a prerequisite. It is not against the game's terms and conditions to create a garden of flowers, we are just advising you to fence it round with thorns. Conflict is natural and its cause may vary from territorial reasons to things as ridiculous as cosmetic content. We are not forcing you to PvP, no. We are warning you to be prepared for it. NQ has planned for mechanics that will lessen the effect of conflict. But, what they will not, and should not provide, is a means of invincibility. As players the world over have proved repeatedly, provide a loophole or something that can be used as an exploit, and it will be found and abused. At this point, I don't know how a 'godmode' in building will turn out, given that the game isn't out yet, but it might just provide a means for some player to bot industry while being untouchable. You wouldn't like that. I wouldn't like that. NQ wouldn't like that either, as it will negatively impact the value of creativity and industry. Even if Dual Universe turns out to be what every builder wished it to be, builders will still leave when they get bored. Players moving on from games is normal. Sometimes, they move on to other games and realise that the new fantasy is worse than what they left behind. What do they do then?

 

Forgive the Eve-Dual Universe comparisons, if you will. But, you should understand that there will always be PvP in Dual Universe. It works as a good counter to illegal automation at the same time, increasing the importance of builders who know their trade well. We would like all the players we can get. At the same time, developers have learnt the hard way not to listen to every suggestion. Many players don't know what they want and place the blame squarely on the developers when the result of their demands turn out to be sour grapes. There's a solution to protection from PvP. Find it and use it. 

 

Cheers.

"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think what makes DU so great is that at it's heart, it's about pvp and building.  And exploration, and trade, and harvesting, and community.

 

And you don't have to be into all of those things to enjoy the game.  But the fact that it has all those things will bring more players hopefully.  And I think we all know what really makes an MMO fun is the other players.

 

The game that got me interested in building was Landmark.  and while the building in Landmark was amazing, just building wasn't enough to make it a successful game.  And from what I see of PVP games out there these days, most purely PVP games are popular for a few months and then everyone moves on to the next game.

 

So we need each other.  And we don't all need to force our personal play style on each other.  We just have to give our money to NQ and then enjoy the game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Skim reading some of the posts here (they are long and I am tired) I realise that this may well become another eve-alike in the manner that people tend to descend to the lowest common denominator when given totally free reign to do anything they want. Ultimately becoming a case of who has the bigger stick. Regardless of if it is wanted, throughout the course of human history (not just mmo's) humans have always followed similar patterns;

Person A wants to destroy or take what person B has
Person A gets bigger stick and clubs person B, takes/destroys item
Person B gets some mates together with many stick and either attacks A or waits for them to come back
By waiting to come back Person B and his group establish an outpost, for better defences, shared resources, that "feeling safe in numbers" thing
Person A sees this, tells his friends who are like person A so they start to build up better weapons etc

It escalates. It is human nature, and to a large extent unavoidable; the will always be people wanting to break someone elses toy for the sake of breaking it. The only way that is prevented in a game is mechanics to stop it.

In a rather long winded way am saying; it is unavoidable for PvP to occur, unless you install mechanics to stop it, which will then upset those who live for PvP.
PvP is essential to the game, it will be this games version of a resource sink, but it must be balanced; so that players are not put off by the constant threat of being picked on or destroyed because "some one can". As those "carebear" (pardon the eve parlance) players very often are the people happiest extracting resources and creating the building blocks on which the PvP hierarchy is built. (think food chain with PvP at the top, Builders below them, processors (turning raw mats into components for builders) below them and at the bottom the resource gatherers). 

If the balance is off the will not be enough materials for those who love PvP to PvP, without external (dev) interference. And I think we can all agree we do not want NQ doing what CCP did & "helping" some players over others?
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've mentioned this before, but it is worth bringing up.  The power of defensive vs offensive tech is of central importance to the type of gameplay in the game.  One example is if it takes 1 month of resources for an agressor to kill someone whos defenses took 1 day to gather the resources to power, then the aggressors have to have a good reason or overwhelming numbers to attack.  This makes PVP functions more tactical, and meaningful.  When an outpost gets overrun it would take something other than just offensive might.  It would still make sense to attack ships if you know that their cargo would more than make up for the difference in losses, but new players and people just exploring wouldn't be worth the resource cost to destroy.  There would still be people attacking and killing people for no reason other than that they had the resources to spare, but it would reduce it.  

 

This simple mechanic is an intrinsic part of PvP balancing, and depending on where NQ puts the fulcrum we'll see how the game plays. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Felonu said:

I've mentioned this before, but it is worth bringing up.  The power of defensive vs offensive tech is of central importance to the type of gameplay in the game.  One example is if it takes 1 month of resources for an agressor to kill someone whos defenses took 1 day to gather the resources to power, then the aggressors have to have a good reason or overwhelming numbers to attack.  This makes PVP functions more tactical, and meaningful.  When an outpost gets overrun it would take something other than just offensive might.  It would still make sense to attack ships if you know that their cargo would more than make up for the difference in losses, but new players and people just exploring wouldn't be worth the resource cost to destroy.  There would still be people attacking and killing people for no reason other than that they had the resources to spare, but it would reduce it.  

 

This simple mechanic is an intrinsic part of PvP balancing, and depending on where NQ puts the fulcrum we'll see how the game plays. 

Problem with your arguments about "PvP" balancing is that it's a made up concept in this case. How PvP plays out will to the largest degree revolve around how the players uses the tools. You might have defenders that figured out the cheesiest strat for building a fort and can hold for days versus much larger numbers, or you might run into agressors that has siege tactics figured out and overrun you even when you are confident you can defend yourself. At such moments you shouldnt get to whine to the devs that things are unbalanced because another group didnt put as much money into the PvP power offensive or defensive as you and still won. Reality is that you'd be looking at the different players and their home-made tactics/skills being what dictates most of the balance. You can't nerf a player the way you nerf a mechanic, but you shouldn't nerf a mechanic because a player outdid you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...