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Anaximander

Incapacitation / Revival System. And Futurespace CyberVampires.

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Pretty self explanatory. Instead of having death be finite, let avatars who got hurt by certain type of weaponry be icnapacited and possible to be revived and / or reviving after a certain point on their own via "futurespace medicine" CPR.


It should be noted :

1 ) this is to enable duels or arena matches that don't end with a person dying and losing all their stuff. A simple RDSM tag for the arena to enable "incapacitations"  but not "killing", would do the trick in this case.

2 ) non-lethal weaponry, for people who like to rob people , but don't like causing a person to lose their gear or what not. 

3 ) poeple say I can't go without a post without mentioning something from EVE that's cool - and I will oblige - so here it is, Nosferatu weaponry, AKA, drain a person's energy. And since DU avatars are more or less cyborgs  - yeah, that nnonformer arm is definitely not part of Human Standard Edition - an avatar could have capacitors on them you can drain so you can render them incapacitated -  which would need a "healer" to come in and "jump cable you" - you know, the same thing EMTs do with a defibrilator, only not as harrowing of an experience.

4 ) if an avatar dies in a ship explosion or by being hit by a 1 TNT Ton rocket, you can bet they won't leave a mollecule behind, let alone a body to revive. No, that's not Shepard past the Mass Effect 2 opening, WAKE UP SHEEPLE :V

FAQs incoming - I can see the future.

 

 

This soudns fishy Twerk, what's your game?

Just want to have alternatives to murder. Like a bounty hunter bringing a person in as "alive" - with the bounty unable to "/scuicide if they decide to come in alive and be "judged" by the Intergalactic Turbonerd Tribunal. And if a person can make for a good "arena bloodsport" and the hunted has implants they risk losign upon death, you can bet some of them would choose fighting for their freedom than actually losing their gear in a 1vs10 fight.

 

 

I seen this mechanism! It's fr---

Yes, Chronicles of Elyria. I don't hold EVE on a pedestal, I actually like other games as well.

 

 

What can it offer the game?

Maybe the ability for Player Police to incapacitate someone who's intentionally blocking the entrace to a place - if the game has avtar to avatar collision and it's not ghosting / cheating the terrain and / or players involved.

 

 

When will you make the whiskey joke?

I don't joke about my functioning alcoholism.

 

 

Nosferatu gear? LOLZIES, you can't drai nenergy.

Apparently, people don't know the opposite of energy, is entropy.

 

 

Space vampires? Really?

Cause obviously, using a magical arm that can conjure shapes is definitely something in the feasible spectrum of possibilities, but using entropy to drain a person's capacitors they have in their body cause they are cyborgs? Nah.


Cheers.



P.S. : Bring in the love.

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Sure! Your money not your life, right?

 

Great idea I'd say; can be used in multiple situations. You could use this on a large scale to mess up a ship pilot and its crew, to ensure that you can take its cargo without the risk of harming it. Also can be used for professional arena battles, as you say. Kind of like dueling in borderlands.

 

Another reason why one might want to go this route rather than just opening fire is that it could be hard to figure out who is actually using this entropy weapon. When there are bullets flying at you, it's not often difficult to figure out who and where the shooter is. But if your joints suddenly seize up, then it's harder to tell who's​ attacking you.

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Sure! Your money not your life, right?

 

Great idea I'd say; can be used in multiple situations. You could use this on a large scale to mess up a ship pilot and its crew, to ensure that you can take its cargo without the risk of harming it. Also can be used for professional arena battles, as you say. Kind of like dueling in borderlands.

 

Another reason why one might want to go this route rather than just opening fire is that it could be hard to figure out who is actually using this entropy weapon. When there are bullets flying at you, it's not often difficult to figure out who and where the shooter is. But if your joints suddenly seize up, then it's harder to tell who's​ attacking you.

In EVE it's pretty clear who's Nossing or Neutralisign your capacitor. Those blueyish purple beams flying FROM you to a target, are usually the drain, ant the bright trasnlucent blue hue bmea is the neutraliser.

 

It's more a tactical tool for stealth combat. You open a target from stleath, and maore or less immobilise them so they can't fight.

 

Funny neough, this doens't work against people using ballistic wepaonryi neVE, since ballistic weaponry doesn't need electricity to fire, it's ballistic, not laser or railgun based.

 

To be hones,t an alternative would be "Cryo Rounds", that sap energy out of you - similar to how in Skyrim frost damage draisn your stamina, more or less that.

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2 ) non-lethal weaponry, for people who like to rob people , but don't like causing a person to lose their gear or what not. 

I remember talking about something like this for training purposes/mock battles. +1 on that one.

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Imo this is especially a good idea if spawn points aren't going to be super common.

It's also good for creating a precedence, that "this pirate group will rob oyu, but not kill you, so might as well not fight like your "(virtual) life depends on it".

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How'd you handle griefing with that mechanic? I'm sure you thought of that one too ;)

 

For all who can't follow: if you can't suicide, what would prevent a guy to throw you into prison and just incapacitate you regularly?

 

Maybe add a timer so you can't be incapacitated twice within let's say 12h. And maybe you can suicide after let's say 30min.

But I'm curious what others come up with

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How'd you handle griefing with that mechanic? I'm sure you thought of that one too ;)

 

For all who can't follow: if you can't suicide, what would prevent a guy to throw you into prison and just incapacitate you regularly?

 

Maybe add a timer so you can't be incapacitated twice within let's say 12h. And maybe you can suicide after let's say 30min.

But I'm curious what others come up with

You mean not everyone carries a cyanide capsule in their gum in emergency cases?

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I remember talking about something like this for training purposes/mock battles. +1 on that one.

Sure, you COULD use it that way, but it's not about non-lethal weaponry, it's the same shotgun you'd use in live combat, you'll just have to "execute" a person who's on the ground passed out. 

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You mean not everyone carries a cyanide capsule in their gum in emergency cases?

I just bring an apple everywhere.

If you get the joke, props to you.

But would there be ranged weapons filled with Armour Piercing NyQuil tranquilizers? Just a single poke and you just incapacitated someone by bypassing the health system (How many bullets you can take vs. a single tranquilizer?)

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How'd you handle griefing with that mechanic? I'm sure you thought of that one too ;)

 

For all who can't follow: if you can't suicide, what would prevent a guy to throw you into prison and just incapacitate you regularly?

 

Maybe add a timer so you can't be incapacitated twice within let's say 12h. And maybe you can suicide after let's say 30min.

But I'm curious what others come up with

I did spell it out. You HAVE to agree to be brought back. If yo agree, you can't "cheat" a bounty hutner by offing yourself in their csustoddy and robbing them off both the boutny prize of killing you or the live part.

 

If you don't agree, you can /suicide and the people can't imprison you :P .

 

Again, it's a cosensual "bring you in" situation, not a forced thing. If you WANT to take your chances by being a bloodsport for peopel topalce money on, cool. that's on you, if you don't, then just /suciide, if oyu got the money to buy all the cybernetics you had on you :P

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Sure, you COULD use it that way, but it's not about non-lethal weaponry, it's the same shotgun you'd use in live combat, you'll just have to "execute" a person who's on the ground passed out. 

Yeah i'm just saying that it COULD be used that way indeed. I would personally love to use it and incapacitate people without executing in that sense.

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I did spell it out. You HAVE to agree to be brought back. If yo agree, you can't "cheat" a bounty hutner (...)

Ah makes sense now, haven't seen that bit :P

 

If it doesn't force people, I'm good. Nice idea. +1

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Sounds nice. I also think you should be able to train against being tranquilized. But what about disabling machines like LUA-automated drones or something using an EMP blaster or something similar to that.

 

For example, you could use it to shut down ship automation(for example, a basic evasion system or a automatic lockdown) before attacking it. And EMP-hardened equipment/modifications that has a higher chance of surviving such an attack.

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Sounds nice. I also think you should be able to train against being tranquilized. But what about disabling machines like LUA-automated drones or something using an EMP blaster or something similar to that.

 

For example, you could use it to shut down ship automation(for example, a basic evasion system or a automatic lockdown) before attacking it. And EMP-hardened equipment/modifications that has a higher chance of surviving such an attack.

That's more in the realm of E-War between constructs, not really energy depletion when it coems to avatars. But the same princple applies, you COULD use a more jacked up version of Nosferatu weaponry to drain a ship of its energy in its capacitors and weaken its shields. Maybe having to use certain Insolating materials to mitigate the effect of that.

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What a lovely idea. Knock people out. Do you love the thief who kills all your guards, or hate the thief that knocks them all out?

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1) Don't like the idea of a revival medicine:

-In a small fight (ship vs ship), the fight ends when the ship is destroyed, not when the players are killed (since they can respawn with said medicine). Boarding has less/zero value.

-In a large battle, the resurrection node (an important strategical objective) would be less relevant.

-People with more medicines would be able to respawn in the same position. Who has more medicines (aka money) has an advantage, and since it does matter less if you die, skill is less relevant (like initiative, since even if you surprise them attacking first, they can just respawn and recover)

-Life is less relevant and people are going to play badly just because they can get revived. 

 

2)Weapons with the ability to incapacitate could work well, it just depends on how they're going to be balanced. 

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1) Don't like the idea of a revival medicine:

-In a small fight (ship vs ship), the fight ends when the ship is destroyed, not when the players are killed (since they can respawn with said medicine). Boarding has less/zero value.

-In a large battle, the resurrection node (an important strategical objective) would be less relevant.

-People with more medicines would be able to respawn in the same position. Who has more medicines (aka money) has an advantage, and since it does matter less if you die, skill is less relevant (like initiative, since even if you surprise them attacking first, they can just respawn and recover)

-Life is less relevant and people are going to play badly just because they can get revived. 

 

2)Weapons with the ability to incapacitate could work well, it just depends on how they're going to be balanced. 

 

- depends on who you attack. they can still choose not to be incapacitated. If you incap ALL people OR kill them -> ship is yours

- yeah, those with more money will always have an advantage. But you'd need a special guy for reviving. Only he can do it. He has to put time and effort into it. Deaths won't matter even without such a system - no sane pirate will take expensive gear with him on a suicide mission.

 

2) no they won't work better. This proposed idea is about CHOICE - want to be incapped or dead. A stun gun is no choice for the victim - you're always incapped. You contradicted yourself very well there

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1) Don't like the idea of a revival medicine:

-In a small fight (ship vs ship), the fight ends when the ship is destroyed, not when the players are killed (since they can respawn with said medicine). Boarding has less/zero value.

-In a large battle, the resurrection node (an important strategical objective) would be less relevant.

-People with more medicines would be able to respawn in the same position. Who has more medicines (aka money) has an advantage, and since it does matter less if you die, skill is less relevant (like initiative, since even if you surprise them attacking first, they can just respawn and recover)

-Life is less relevant and people are going to play badly just because they can get revived. 

 

2)Weapons with the ability to incapacitate could work well, it just depends on how they're going to be balanced. 

a ) the point of piracy is to take over a ship if possible to scrap it for profit. I don't know WHAT kind of game you expect in DU. but boarding parties WILL happen, it's part of the game. Ships are lso when the crew is dead. Stop making silly assumptions.

 

b ) people who have a dedicated healer should NOT have any benefit??? Is this even serious? Also, did you understand that I said "energy revive", similar to how the cyborg / robot Guardians from Destiny are "brought back to life", when they are jumped by their Dicklebots ??? If you were to have a module on your avatar, that's an Emergency Power Supply, that can revive you if you were to fall in battle, that item would need RECHARGING to work. You just have 1 revive, at the cost of more Shields or Amor or anything.

 

c ) the ability to drain a person's stamina / energy from their batteries, ties with the whole "food system" of the gmae. A player would have to rely on a "capacitor energy pool" and a "battery energy pool". Draining a person's energy would lead them to "collapse, essentially an alternative way of fighting a peron than reelying on brute force.

 

In EVE, Nosferatu is nothing more than Mana Drain with Neutralisers being Mana Burn. I know many EVE fanbois who say "I do not play Fantasy MMOS, only Sci-Fi, like EVE" just had an aneurism, but thats' the harsh truth. In DU, draining a person's "mana" would more or less be a devious way of combat.

 

What's the backfire of this? Rather simple, you can't drain a person's energy if your batteries are full. Yeah, pretty dope ey? If you have MAXED batteries, you CAN'T drain a person's battery. Also, Nosferatu, are VERY VERY short range weaponry - like almost melee range in EVE's context, about 5 to 8 kilometers.  The average gun in EVE can punch easily 15. You also need to use a form of "slow" to keep a person within range while you drain them and it's not something that can help you 1vs5, cause it's a fighting style based on ganking anyone with a larger capacitor than you and that's NOT shield-tanked, because in EVE, shields regen even when yo ugot 0% capacitor energy.

 

But in DU, the Nosferatu style of combat, could provide the ability for a person to take on a heavy armor dude head on, if they manage to sneak up to them. In a real scenario, 5 light assault guys, would NOT be able to take on a power armor behemoth of a player, cause that's the point of the pwoer armor,, to take on lesser foes easily. But a Nosferatu changes the battlefield. The Power ARmor is strong as long as POWER exists within it. Drain that away, you got yourself a guy, in a very slow armor, that can no longer protect themselves.

 

It's self-balanced as a mechanism. 

 

To reiterate :

 

1. You can't drain more than your max "mana" pool. (not unless you carry empty batteries on your person). Usually, people who play this kind of game, they sport a Capacitor Neutraliser as well (Mana Burn) that burns YOUR energy to burn an equal (or more) amount on the opponent's, so the Nosferatu complements the Neut.

 

2. You need to be EXTREMELY close to the person - within shotgun range. You seen Blade, you know what happens to vampires that get into shotgun range.

 

3. It makes the playing field more balanced - anyone needs energy to run, jump, jetpack or to pwoer a power armor.

 

4. It makes "Drain Ships" are possible. Have a frigate attack a larger capital by draining their capacitor while the frigate uses the drained energy to power its own propulsion to keep harrassing the larger ship - unless you want the game to be a slugfest withotu flavor to it. This video illustrates the point. This group in EVE would never been able to take down a Thanatos class carrier, cause its capacitor and shield can last forever. but once the friendly Bhaalgorn (Battleship Class nosferatu ship) arrives, a sepcailised ship that can drain MORE than its capacitor can handle, the Thanatos carried (up to that point just shrugging off the damage) starts going down.

 

Unless ou wnat in DU to non-stop bitchign that "OMG HEAVY ARMORS OP, NERF HEAVY ARMRORS, I CAN'T KILL THEM WITH MY PISTOL :sadface: ", Nosferatu is the only alternative for tactics that are more dubious and for more specialisation on ship building AND avatar combat.

 

People who invested into heavy armors are not "OP", cause they still have a weakness to being drained dead of energy, and solo or small group PvPers have something to play as that's not relying on brute force to take down an enemy.

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c ) the ability to drain a person's stamina / energy from their batteries, ties with the whole "food system" of the gmae. A player would have to rely on a "capacitor energy pool" and a "battery energy pool". Draining a person's energy would lead them to "collapse, essentially an alternative way of fighting a peron than reelying on brute force.1

 

What's the backfire of this? Rather simple, you can't drain a person's energy if your batteries are full. Yeah, pretty dope ey? If you have MAXED batteries, you CAN'T drain a person's battery. Also, Nosferatu, are VERY VERY short range weaponry - like almost melee range in EVE's context, about 5 to 8 kilometers.  The average gun in EVE can punch easily 15. You also need to use a form of "slow" to keep a person within range while you drain them and it's not something that can help you 1vs5, cause it's a fighting style based on ganking anyone with a larger capacitor than you and that's NOT shield-tanked, because in EVE, shields regen even when yo ugot 0% capacitor energy.

 

But in DU, the Nosferatu style of combat, could provide the ability for a person to take on a heavy armor dude head on, if they manage to sneak up to them. In a real scenario, 5 light assault guys, would NOT be able to take on a power armor behemoth of a player, cause that's the point of the pwoer armor,, to take on lesser foes easily. But a Nosferatu changes the battlefield. The Power ARmor is strong as long as POWER exists within it. Drain that away, you got yourself a guy, in a very slow armor, that can no longer protect themselves.2

 

3. It makes the playing field more balanced - anyone needs energy to run, jump, jetpack or to pwoer a power armor.3

I really, really doubt that somebody's natural legs are electronic, Twerk.

2 So you mean, the armour just "poofs" away? If I de-power a tank, the armour is still there. Unless, you obviously we're referring to shields. If so, apologies.

3 Not everyone uses a power armour. What prevents some extreme cloaker running around draining people and then killing them, effectively making a field of statues?

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I really, really doubt that somebody's natural legs are electronic, Twerk.

2 So you mean, the armour just "poofs" away? If I de-power a tank, the armour is still there. Unless, you obviously we're referring to shields. If so, apologies.

3 Not everyone uses a power armour. What prevents some extreme cloaker running around draining people and then killing them, effectively making a field of statues?

1. We are talkign about humans who are Cyborgs in DU's lore. They got cerebral implants and an arm. Beleive it or not, your muscles work by electricity. It's how TASERS drop you dow nas well, by amping the electricity on your muscles, tensing them up, to the point you lose cotnrol over them. Guess what else needs legs to keep going. Legs. Dran a person's energy fro mtheir cyborg capacitors, and they would collapse like a runner out of calories to spare and a metabolism unable to keep up. Humans are just machines made of flesh.

 

2.No, but if you power off a... power armor, the human inside can't really use magnetic servos to move around. You know, the whole exoskeleton part, it kidna needs energy to function. Is the person inside unable to move? No, their battery is shield by the armor, but they can't move fast either. Think Fallout 4 Power ARmor rules. You run otu of energy? Slow walking is your doom. You run too much? You'll drain the capacitors faster. A person in a light armor, keeps trainign and burning your power and CONVERTING the energy they drain to keep powering a jetpack, flying around you like the Capacitor Fairy? That's more like it. Even if a person has armor, they are just going to slowlly die, instead of dying quick.

 

3.The burning of energy works in a simple way. You burn 150 Joules on your battery, you burn 150 Joules on the enemy. You drain their energy, you repeat it until they got no more energy and you just bludgeon them to death - or eve tickle them, I seen people kill others with ridiculously low DPS in EVE, just by draining them dry. This also means that the draining process takes TIME. Remember, you need to be VERY clsoe to a target to drain them. If you drain/ burn them from a distance, it doesn't work as effective.

 

You could be burning 150 MegaJoules and only burning 20 MegaJoules if you tried to burn a person at 100 meters, instead of 10 meters, wihchis your optimal range. That's what prevents it from being exploited. A cloaker needs to strike fast on a target to burn the down, and if the target uses apower armor (somethign with a LARGE pool of energy) you better know how to move and avoid being hit ,cause that guy probably has the firepower to metl your face if you act cheeky.

 

It's a tactical option, dirty fighting some would say, but it's a way of fighting.

 

Nosferatu / Neutralisers, are a "death by a thousand cuts" instead of "esta la vista baby" kind of combat of "mad crits".

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Your idea is nothing but refined idea from a classic MMO games, you talking duels, mana, healers etc.

 

I'm looking at DU as opening to new genre of the games and the whole thing runs more like a simulator of reality when NQ set up some rules and we, as a players will come up with ideas how to organise stuff. As a minimum necessity, they have to came up with resurrection nodes. But restricting, setting or giving specific directions to the game mechanic? Especially combat system? It should be left as close to real as possible imho.

 

If we met out in a wild and killed each other, that's it! Defeated goes to Resurrection node, end of story here. muddling the system with graded armors implants, potions, mana or anything else goes into some weird realm category. This is not a Mortal Kombat nor Counter Strike or Battle Field. However you like those system in modern games I believe in a bigger picture of this project.

 

People will fight for resources, influence, territory as they always do with whatever they got, but we don't need a set of super hero abilities, graded gear and skills. Please do not turn this into that kind of grind.. ever!

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The dual mechanic sounds interesting and things like stun weapons would be very good for things like security that don't necessarily need or want to kill someone the first time they shoot them. Maybe it could be something like smart ammo that has the ability to stun a person instead of kill them depending on what mode it is shot in.

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You idea is nothing but refined idea from a classic MMO games, you talking duels, mana, healers etc.

 

I'm looking at DU as opening to new genre of the games and the whole thing runs more like a simulator of reality when NQ set up some rules and we, as a players will come up with ideas how to organise stuff. As a minimum necessity, they have to came up with resurrection nodes. But restricting, setting or giving specific directions to the game mechanic? Especially combat system? It should be left as close to real as possible imho.

 

If we met out in a wild and killed each other, that's it! Defeated goes to Resurrection node, end of story here. muddling the system with graded armors implants, potions, mana or anything else goes into some weird realm category. This is not a Mortal Kombat nor Counter Strike or Battle Field. However you like those system in modern games I believe in a bigger picture of this project.

 

People will fight for resources, influence, territory as they always do with whatever they got, but we don't need a set of super hero abilities, graded gear and skills. Please do not turn this into that kind of grind.. ever!

Hi newcomer to the forums. Here are some things you need to know as a newbro in the forums.

 

1) Combat is based on dynamic values, like angular momentum, avatar tracking speed (reflexes more or less) weapon type, ammo type, enviromental conditions (atmosphere density) and more. It's as close to realistic as it can get. You know what else is realistic? Armor types. Light armor, medium armor, heavy armor, power armor. All of these are realistic. What you mean to say "I WANT SLUGFESTS, MY BRAIN CAN'T HANDLE TACTICS". Too bad, you'll be target practise :) No worries :)

 

2) Specialised weaponry and armors, are also part of the game - JC spoken of them in the Kickstarter Video as well. You should read the OP I made. Last quote and answer. It was meant DIRECTLY for you kind of haters.

 

3) BOO loves the idea of atternatives to murder. But you "peaceful RPers" ? You would want nothing else but murder in the game. Congratulations, you got on the hit-list, if you don't want ot be spared in combat you WON'T be spared in combat.

 

4) You lsoe all your stuff on death. So should NQ remove that as well cause you want to grief people without penalties for sucking at PvP - a thing we already proved on 1) already?

 

5) "Power Armor" doesn't mean "better armor". This whole suggestions is based on that arguement. You would be able to see it, if you were not a hater. And given 4) that power armor, is also a tactical asset. An expewnsive one. In EVE, alliances insure a very expensive capital ship of a person, which in DU, s a power armor ,cause they are very expensive and only should be used in tactical operations like defending your territory. But hey, you are never gonna own territory, you'l lbe busy being targeted by people - and of course, shown no mercy.

 

Like it or not, the game has grind. It's why people come together in larger orgs and alliances. Good thing NQ is not building a game geared to people who don't want challenge.

 

 

Now quit being a hater. If you read the post at the very end, you would not look like one now :) I suppose you accept as "realism" the magical arm that can conjure shapes out of thin air, but an energy drain mechanism? Nah, too unreal. You haters are amazeballs at being made fun of.

 

 

Cheers.

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