LittleJoe

Who's really being excluded though? The cheapest backer pledge is only $16.00 USD an you can upgrade your pledge if you wish. Anybody who has PayPal and a job at McDonalds can be a part of this for as much a few Big Mac's. I think people who are willing to pay at least a little to fully enjoy and help the development of the game is game's primary audience anyways. Just my 2¢

Well, the way I see it is that it's NQ's game, NQ's data, NQ's website, and now it's NQ's discord.   They should feel free to purchase/use any scripts that they find that they feel necessary to complete their job.  If they find one that is free to serve some time-saving purpose, even better.  More money for the game itself.  They do not need permission to use - or to even tell us - what programming is behind everything they use. 
 
For all we know this very site and forum itself could be using open source that someone else coded.  They might even be DU players too. (gasp!)  IMO it's just not smart to re-create the wheel.  Almost everything I use for my own stuff and for my clients is open source. Lord only knows who originally coded it.  But if something is wrong with it, the community will darn well make it known, asap.  It's the proprietary stuff that no one ever gets to see that should cause issues (if you must have issues, that is.)

I honestly don't know what else I could add to this topic other than making a video describing every line of the bot source code one by one. 
 
The same thing is being rehashed over and over here to the point where it's obvious that no matter what is said that people are going to take issue with it. 
 
If you want links to the source code:
https://github.com/yamamushi/du-discordbot/blob/master/backer.go https://github.com/yamamushi/du-discordbot/blob/master/backer_handler.go  
Otherwise, I really don't know what else I can add to this conversation. I've explained what the bot does, I've explained why it does it, there's simply nothing else for me to cover.
 
The bot has been working for quite some time now and nobody ever complained about it before, it's just that when Discord went official that people started to freak out about it. It's not new, it's been serving its purpose quite well. 
 
If you want NQ to run it, I'm not sure what that is going to change because the bot is still going to be running off the same source code that I wrote, you're effectively just asking NQ to put even more work on themselves to support it going forward. I'm sure they'd do it if enough people demanded it, but it really wouldn't change much other than who owns the server the container runs on.
 
As for the bot collecting data, the bot doesn't collect anything that you don't specifically allow it to. It's not going to go automatically scraping user accounts on Discord, you have to manually run the command and specifically give it your forum profile to gather your backer status (or pre-alpha status if you have that disabled). Anyone can disable their backer public status, the only thing the bot needs to verify is whether or not you have pre-alpha status, which is something that you can't edit on your profile. 
 
The bot isn't just scraping the forums randomly looking for accounts to link up, you have to manually run the verification process, by which you implicitly agree to the collection of your publicly available information in the first place. 
 

Alright, so that's established. Now reading your mentioned post, correct me if I'm wrong but you appear not to agree with the idea of tieing a discord account to a DU community/forum account?  ?
 
If someone were to breach the NDA with an unlinked account, how then would you suggest we tell NQ whom to administer discipline to? I'm sure most of us involved all remember what happened on the first pre-alpha test and how quick NQ reacted to that breach. It seems to me that you'd rather not risk an account you have sunk money into so you can discuss NDA related topics publicly with your discord account which is, for all intents and purposes, free. To an extent, I agree with you and I personally don't like the fact that the NDA was extended by a year and some change. NQ has their reasons however, I personally would also agree with NQ that I would rather keep tight lipped about an awesome game rather than give the wider public a poor perception of an incomplete future product simply because I felt the need to tell everyone about it.
 
Good things come to those who wait.  ?
 
Now, while reading through missed discord messages this morning I came across this exchange from Zamarus.
While I'm sure manual authentication with a random staff generated string could be used to authenticate someones community and forum profiles in relation to their discord profile, this wouldn't be an issue with a small number of users. This however would set a poor precedent once people see a second method of authenticating and, as The War Doctor mentions, opens up a possibility for human error for which we in the staff would most likely be held responsible for any mistakes and/or breaches the manually authenticated user is involved in.
 
I won't speak for the rest of the community discord moderators when I say this, but I refuse to create a second class of users who are privileged through manual authentication. I will not create a second standard for a small handful while the rest of the community has chosen to navigate through the bot which largely hasn't been an issue for the greater community.
 
The bot has been the defacto standard for the entire community for a long time now, even the members of NovaQuark that we see from time to time have gone through the process without a hitch so now it really just begs the question of why the second standard for which I feel like I answered in the second paragraph and will refer to such.
 
I also won't speak for the team on this, but if it would help ease community concerns, I'll more than happily speak with Yama and ask if he'd be willing to resign full control of the authentication bot to NovaQuark (even though he is probably reading this and typing up a reply as we speak). Be mindful however that NQ already has a very full plate with the game as it is nearing Alpha stage in more or less two months, and that it more than likely will not be an overnight event, much like how the discord officilization was discussed over a series of months.  ?

Its funny at least to think that the majority of people give away more personal information on things like Facebook and Twitter than this bot collects. Come on, this bot uses publicly available data, there is literally NO argument to be had that they are getting any private information with the bot. If you do not believe those facts, look at the source code it, as long as you can read and understand the coding, you can see that there is nothing malicious.
 
Anything publicly available is free game to scrapers and data gatherers anyway. What is the difference between a bot gathering the data automatically and a user 'googling' the same information on you. The only difference is one is automated and does not require a human presence, and the other does. 
 
Its not that big of a deal, hence there is no reason to make one out of it.

I also want to clarify, there are things that I (and others on the Discord Staff) have been aware of in the works that we simply aren't allowed to discuss. Ie, for the Discord server, the process of making it official and handing it over to NQ has been going on for several months, it wasn't an overnight quick decision by any means. We couldn't publicly announce that for many reasons.
 
There were many questions about the auth process that I could have answered with "Well an NQ API is in the works" to assuage some fears, but I didn't want to break any confidentiality by saying that either.
 
I know there are many in the community that really don't like me at all, but I would not be where I am in my career if I made a habit of collecting data for illicit purposes or breaking confidentiality agreements openly. I'm never going to win those people over, but at least I can try to be as transparent as possible to the rest of you to show that I'm acting in good faith here with my contributions. 

When the NDA drops then there won't really be a need to authenticate with it, we can close (or archive) the NDA channels, and nobody will have to use it. If they want to get backer roles for cosmetic purposes they'll still be able to, but otherwise, there won't be a need for it. 
 
As for the data, that is going to stay in the database because it is what ties backer roles to users. Even for non-NDA purposes, such as Iron / Bronze / etc backers, or supporter pack purchasers (non-patron packs), or ATV.
 
The database stores:
Discord user ID Forum profile link Backer Status (Gold/Silver/Ruby/Whatever) ATV member (true or false) Pre-Alpha Access (true or false) Validated successfully (true or false) - This is used to track whether a user has completed the auth process or not  
When the API becomes available, I will adjust the database to only keep the data that the API provides.
 
You don't need to have your backer status made public to be validated either, as many didn't want to have to do that. The forums will show if you have pre-alpha access without needing to display what backer level you have. There are many in Discord who have access to the NDA channels while also hiding their backer level.
 
The bot is used for other things besides authentication, it provides utilities for NDA members which will be useful after the NDA drops too, it provides a live forum feed, a Reddit feed, a news feed for Dual Universe content (Youtube, Twitter, DevBlog, etc), it provides reactions (the Nyzaltar, Nomad, JC, etc reactions), it provides a server status utility and many more things. 
 
I don't see a good reason to remove it completely when the NDA drops. 

You already have community moderators on the forums . There is no much difference with Discord.
I'm assuming that NQ now has management rights and that they can react if they don't like moderators work (as they have being working on moderation for quite some time now, so it's not like they gave the keys to anonymous players).
 
As for the bot, I'm a bit worried about giving information to unknown players, but making the server official doesn't change anything: everyone was already doing it before and you are still free to not use it.
 
~ Merwyn

So many of you know that I wrote the Authorization system for the Dual Universe Community Discord Bot, which allows for you to link your forum account to Discord so that you can have access to the NDA channels in the DU Community Discord.
 
There are several hundred people using it at the moment, and although it's a bit of a process to use it, it seems to have gone over fairly well.
 
Here are some stats about the current linked backer accounts on Discord:
 

 
I was thinking about possibly exporting the account information in the bot database into another database, and creating a separate public Auth bot for discord that would allow for any discord to verify whether or not their members have NDA access.

This would let other groups have their own NDA channels, so they could discuss NDA topics in a safer way.


However, I'm aware that this would have privacy implications for people using the auth bot on the DU Community Discord.

So I am wondering, would anyone be opposed to me doing this, or would you guys rather me not do it and just let other discords figure out their own way of verifying people?

It's not going to hurt my feelings if you guys don't want me to create it, I just thought that perhaps it might be useful for the various communities out there.

I saw this post buried on Reddit today  
 
 
 
 
 
Perhaps more appropriately than "it's happening.gif"...
 
 
 
 

I think that it would be prudent to enable 2FA across our Dual Universe profiles. Our game, forum and community site profiles are all one single sign-on, and considering the NDA under effect, I think it would be very useful to allow for 2FA for those of us who want it. 
 
We don't get notifications for when we login to our accounts from new locations, so there's not really an easy way for us to tell if someone has our creds and logs into our accounts. 
 
Please give us 2FA on the websites at least
 
Invision Community even supports it as of January 2017 - https://invisioncommunity.com/news/product-updates/new-two-factor-authentication-r995/ 
 
To clarify: This isn't about forcing people to use 2FA, this is about enabling it so that those of us who want to can use it for extra security on our accounts. It's 2018 and the realities of security on the internet these days necessitate that we have the option. 
 
 

Topic.

@boots_1588
As mentioned in the forum rules, please do not necropost on old threads as you have done already several times.
(The forum rules has been updated to indicate what is considered an old thread)
Granted, this time you stay in the limits but keep this in mind for the next times.
 
Now to reply on the topic:
Fallout56 is a multiplayer game and NOT a MASSIVELY multiplayer game. Todd Howard confirmed that during the E3 2018 Bethesda Conference. So it can be compared to Minecraft, Ark, Conan Exiles... but clearly not to MMORPGs where the server infrastructure cost is exclusively handled by the Dev Studio or Publisher.
  The Subscription model is one of the few topics not open to discussion. We have already talked in great length about why we went for a subscription model and no, there is no solid argument countering the reasons why we chose this model.
  1) Dropping monthly subscription to have more players is not a valid argument if the server infrastructure cost grows proportionally to the player base size while incomes don't grow accordingly.
 
2) Saying subcription is an outdated model is not a valid argument as it relies on personal opinion not backed by solid reasons. Seeing less MMORPGs using monthly subscription is not a solid reason if there is no understanding about the "why". 
 
Here is how we view the situation at Novaquark: monthly subscription model has been on the decline due to nearly no clear innovation in the MMORPG industry during the last decade. As new MMORPGs had to offer something different than those already well settled in the market (World of Warcraft, EVE Online, etc), if they weren't going to offer something really new, they had to be different on another level: monetization model. That's how the Free to Play games wave began. Many marketing representatives said many times that "Free to Play" was the future and most people believed it. Inconvients of such model were put under the rug... for a time. The question "Is F2P good or bad?" is irrelevant. Free to Play is a good monetization model good for some kind of games. We just don't think MMORPGs is among those. When you aim to have a game lasting for decades, you need to have steady income for decades as well. Free to play game incomes are too fluctuant, especially because they rely on the success of cosmetics (which is a everlasting gamble for a company as no one knows for sure in advance if players will love the new cosmetics and how much income it will generate before they hit the shop) and lootboxes.
 
Ironically, there has been recently a huge witch hunt about lootboxes. While we totally understand the reasons, it's a bit surprising that this problem has been exposed only recently, as lootboxes are as old as the Free to Play model and represents nearly always a (very) large part of F2P or B2P game incomes. Surprisingly, with this kind of monetization now forbidden in a growing number of countries, discussions about monthly subscription model are a thing again for many studios and publishers. 
 
3) Saying people want to make a one time payment is not a valid argument either: nobody with some common sense can ask for a one time payment (at the price of an average game) and expect to have a service lasting forever.
 
@Sofernius

Quite unlikely.
From a financial point of view, that would mean taking more risks than necessary: as said above, it would mean going from a steady income model to a fluctuant income model. Cosmetics make a good complementary income to B2P and subscription models but again, making it the main income of a game is very risky, especially if the structural costs for a game are high.
 

Those two things are already planned
Beta Key giveaways and Trial period at official release.
 
Best Regards,
Nyzaltar.

Update:20/06/2018: Clarification about Necroposting in section III
 
Smalll update on the forum rules about Necroposting.
 
Best Regards,
Nyzaltar.

@boots_1588,
 
Please don't Necro posts. Topic Locked.
 
~ Meldrik

New to the community and looking for a place to hang out and talk all about DU with other peeps, without joining an org? Come join us in the Community Discord: https://dualuniverse.chat
 
Come hang out, chat, play games, talk about DUway (eat fresh) or just plain... nerd-over DU...


P.S we also have NDA secure channels where you can chat a long other pre-alpha testers DUring the testing phases... 

See you in the Discord!!!

Cheers,
Comrade

 
 
 
I'm so excited, and I just can't hide it.
I'm about to lose control and I think I like it
 

 

Hi Dhalic and welcome on the Dual Universe official forum.
 
Thank you for your suggestion.
However, this idea has been discussed and discarded very early in the game development as it has been considered incompatible with the vision of Dual Universe.
 
Best Regards,
Nyzaltar.

I’ve seen a slew of new people posting about their old Landmark days. There’s and org just for you.  
 Also new org twitters @ProphetRocket

Tutorial: Voxelmancy Essentials
 
This tutorial was made for Landmark. I didn't make the tutorial or play the game but, since it's based on the same technology, we can assume that it will work pretty much the same.
It starts with the very basics and ends with some more advanced concepts.
 
Whether or not you have already tried Dual Universe, this tutorial should be able to help you to understand this awesome (but very difficult to master) technology which is the Voxel.
 
As a voxel beginner, I think I am not the only one who yelled at these crazy little voxels, "WTF happened?! I didn't ask you to do that!"
 
 
 
The Inner Space of Voxelmancy
Voxel Characteristics
First of all…and this might hurt your brain a bit…a voxel is NOT a shape. It’s not the 1x1x1 cube shape you add with the smallest ADD brush.
 
Actually, a voxel is a point. The different points (voxels) are connected to each other by lines (vectors). Those vectors form the outlines of the “cubes” that you see in the world when you use the ADD brush. (In other words, it takes many voxels to add enough vectors to make a shape.)
 
When you use the building tools to change the shape of the cubes you see in the world, what you’re actually doing is dragging one (or more) of those voxel points into a new location…and then all those connecting lines move too, thus changing the outline of the shapes you see.
 
There are only TWO voxel characteristics that matter to builders.
The position of the voxel The material applied to that voxel’s cube space Also, for the purposes of this document, there are only four terms that matter:
Voxel : The point in space that is the end point of one or more vectors. Vector : Any line connecting two voxels together. Shape : Any collection of vectors that outline an area thus creating a contained shape. (The default shapes are cubes, but voxels are easily moved around to create almost any shape. See below.) Cube space: In game terms, the natural "cube space" around a voxel is the same volume of space used by the ADD brush when you place a 1x1x1 cube into the world. Voxels *usually* live within their cube space, but can also comfortably live outside of it. However, the voxel is *always* associated with that cube space.    
 
What data is in a voxel?

Imagine a grid of dots. (Each dot is a voxel.)



Now imagine that each of those dots is connected to its neighboring dots by lines (vectors).



Now, stack that up so that it’s in three-space. Voila. You have a decent representation of the voxel points in their natural “healed” cube-like state.


NOTE: The positions of the voxels, in the rigid formation shown above, is the natural “healed” state of the voxels. The resulting shapes created by the vectors connecting them are what we normally see as “cubes” (and which, erroneously, we all have been calling voxels even though those shapes are actually composed of voxels instead.)
When you move one of the voxels, the vectors connected to it also move. Thus, you change the shape of any cube seen as soon as you move a voxel.



So just remember…everything is connected. You can’t move one thing without moving another. All the different welding, recopying, and smoothing tricks you may hear about are just different techniques to get these dots to end up in positions that make cool shapes.

Last but not least: Cube space. The world is gridded out into cube space. (NOTE: Cube space is the same size as the smallest ADD brush when in cube mode.) By default, voxels live along the edges/corners of these cube spaces and the resulting vectors connecting them look like cubes.

Normally, voxels need to stay within their cube space. However, there are building techniques that let a voxel wander out of its normal cube space. This is how shapes that are bigger than a cube are created. Voxels can also be smashed down into the center of that cube space, which allows the creation of smaller shapes as well. Roaming vectors let voxels wander WAY outside their normal cube space, but that gets pretty hairy to explain so we’ll discuss it some other time.
 
 
What Material is on the Voxel?

Material, in this case, is the material you chose from the Element Tray. (Example: Red Lumicite is a material. So is Hammered Gold or Raw Iron.) When a material is specified for a voxel, that changes its appearance in the world.

That’s it. There’s only two special cases that might not be immediately obvious:
Air. Yes, air is a material. Air voxels act *exactly* like regular voxels. They are just painted with a 100% transparent material, which is air. Default terrain. Everything in the world that has notbeen changed by a player is designated as “default terrain”. It has less data than a user-changed voxel so that we can optimize the heck out of stuff that players haven’t changed. The important characteristic about this default terrain is that it cannot be copied. (Its data structure is simpler and doesn’t have all the dots/vertices described earlier.) The other important thing to remember is that HEALing a voxel returns it to this “default terrain” material. And that’s why you can do nifty stuff with healed earth. These latter two special cases (Air and Default Terrain) cannot be directly selected with the selection tool. So the only way you can “grab” them is by also grabbing another nearby shape that’s painted with any of the other materials in the game.

Side Note: What is a Roaming Vector?

When we added Roaming Vectors to the game (6/26/2014), we increased the precision of lines and shapes quite a lot. This was done by “borrowing” nearby voxels and letting them “roam” outside of their normally allowed cube space. This means that nearby shapes sacrifice some of their own definition so that another shape can get one or more extra voxels added to it, thus providing more possible vectors, which enables that shape to have more detail.
 
 
Pasting Dominance

There is one thing to keep in mind as we go through the rest of this doc. Any item that you are pasting into the game is dominant. All the voxels within that copied area will keep their relative positions. This means that any shapes nearby are likely to change shape slightly as their voxels reconnect to these new voxels, and the vectors connecting them are changed.

This “dominance factor” can be very useful when fixing any warpage that occurs, because any current data is overwritten by a paste. That lets you “re-weld” voxels and vectors by pasting in small bits that are the desired shape.
 
 
Voxelmancy Techniques

Okay. Now let’s talk about the various building techniques the community is using.

Micro-shapes & Anti-shapes

NOTE: Players have been calling them microvoxels and antivoxels, but that makes this discussion harder to follow when talking about voxels in conjunction with these shapes, so we’ll refer to the microvoxels as micro-shapes, and antivoxels as anti-shapes. (Sorry for the switch.)

Both of these kinds of shapes are really just normal shapes that appear to be different. (It’s still useful to give them names for easy reference, but the point is…they’re still just normal shapes composed of voxels and vectors.)

When you smooth a regular shape down into a micro-shape, you’re essentially just taking all the voxels the cube was composed of and squashing them down toward each other so that the resulting shape is a very small cube.

Side note: Just to expand your mind, you’re also enlarging the air cubes around your brand new micro-shapes because you’re dragging those connected voxels away from the center of those shapes. Right? Everything is connected.

Still, it’s cool, right? That voxel *looks* smaller and that make it useful for lots of building stuff.

So what’s an Anti-shape? It’s exactly the same thing as a “micro-shape”. But its material is “air”. So it’s (currently) tricky to make, but it behaves in all other respects exactly as a smoothed-down (micro)shape. You just can’t see it or select it directly, because it’s made of air.

Why do micro-shapes warp other nearby shapes?

Remember how the voxels in a micro-shape are squished toward the center? Well, when you copy that micro-shape, you are really selecting the positions for the voxels that constitute that micro-shape.

When you copy that shape into place near another existing shape, the vectors of the existing shapes are forced to attach to the voxels in your micro-shape. The game knows that what you *want* is for the thing you copied to paste as true as it can, so it connects the vectors from other nearby shapes toward the voxels you smashed into the center of your shape and this can cause warpage on the neighboring shapes. Make sense? Again, everything is connected.

“Strings”

So now let’s paste several of those new micro-shapes in a row, one cube space apart from each other. What happens? They stretch into strings! So cool!

But no, that’s only what it looks like. What’s actually happening is that you pasted one micro-shape down (composed of a bunch of voxels and vectors) and then you copied another identical micro-shape in the cube space next to it. When you did that, the vectors from the previously pasted MV stretch out to connect to the voxels in the new one you pasted, and the resulting shape looks like a line. (Remember, the last shape pasted is dominant and everything else warps to it.)

There is a convoluted process that force the end points of the string to align to the normal voxel borders. This technique creates “Antivoxel strings” and is Example 4 in the section below.
 
 
Warping vs Non-Warping Shapes
 
There’s a bunch of techniques designed to create objects that don’t warp neighboring shapes, but ultimately, there is only ONE way to avoid warping.
 
That way is to ensure that the voxels in the shape you are pasting are aligned in such a way that they don’t cause the vectors of a neighboring voxel to move.
 
That’s it. Just don’t make the vectors move and your shapes won’t warp.
 
To make that seem simpler, here’s a few images. These images don’t show all the voxels. They show the shape instead and the normal “cube space” that the voxels for that shape live within.
 
Ex 1: Micro/Anti voxel
Regular “microvoxel” or “antivoxel”: This shape lives in the very center of its normal cube space. It will warp EVERYTHING IT TOUCHES because any neighboring voxel will extend its vectors out to reach the voxels in your micro-shape.
 
 
 
Ex 2: Microvoxel strings
Any “string” that is created by pasting two of these centered MVs together will still cause warpage everywhere it touches because the end points of that string are in the center of the cube spaces they represent.
 

 
Ex 3: Any shape with a “normal border” flat edge
This shape would not cause warpage *if* it is pasted onto something along its bottom side. (Example: If you pasted it onto a flat floor.)
It would cause warpage if it was situated next to any shape above, or to the left/right of the shape, because those neighboring vectors would be forced to extend outward to connect.
 

 
Ex 4: Antivoxel strings
This is the shape that many people call an “AV string”. This is a useful shape because it still looks like a thin bar, but its ends are exactly at the “normal” cube space border and is in the center of the shape. Because it’s situated properly, any normal cube connected to either end of this string will not cause warpage of the block it’s touching.
 

 
So What’s a MegaShape?

Honestly, it’s just the exact opposite of a microvoxel or antivoxel. Players have been calling this a Megavoxel. (And again, for the purposes of this document, we’re going to start calling this a “Megashape” instead to avoid conflict with “voxel” conversations.)

Instead of crushing the voxels in your shape down toward the center, you’re stretching them outside the normal cube space borders of your voxel instead. (In other words, you’re making all the neighboring air voxels smaller so that your current voxel can seem bigger.)

That’s it.

But the shapes are still useful because they create the appearance of behavior that you normally can’t achieve.

So how on earth do you go about stretching the voxels of a shape outward? Answer: You don’t really. Instead, what you do is you crush in the voxels of a neighboring shape, thus dragging the voxels outward in the shape you want to enlarge. That’s why people create a megashape by pasting micro-shapes nearby. They are forcing the voxels to drag outward toward those micro-shapes.
 
 
Warpage in General
 
Isn’t it annoying that you can create a really cool shape, it looks totally awesome, but then it deforms the heck out of stuff when you paste it near anything?
 
Well, the truth is…you’re just *seeing* the warpage for the first time when you paste it in next to the new shape. That same warpage was occurring originally also. You just couldn’t see it because when you made the shape, it was surrounded by air. Those nearby air shapes *did* warp, but you couldn't see them.
 
Voxels always connect to other voxels via vectors. When one voxel gets dragged outward or inward, it tends to drag neighboring voxels along with it slightly to smooth out the “curve” of a voxel face as much as possible. And that’s just about it. But it’s happening on EVERY voxel all the time every time you smooth shapes or paste shapes or even when you remove shapes.
 
 
Inlay Technique

The last major building technique to cover here is the “Inlay Technique”. This is probably the coolest trick that any builder can learn, as it allows you to do a ton of curvalicious detail that's not possible to do otherwise.

We won’t take the time to describe applications of this (there are many player tutorials), but here are some details of how the process works:

Step 1: Select any-sized area of non-air shapes as long as that area is only one cube space thick.
Step 2: Take any other area of any design and paste it once above your object from Step 1, and then once again below it.

This forces the “sandwiched” object to realign its vectors and voxel positions to match the object that was pasted above and below.

Why? Because the game is trying to preserve the data of the object that you are pasting. It’s NOT trying to preserve the shape you created in Step 1. Thus, the sandwiched object in Step 1 gets all its voxels realigned to match the object above and below and when you copy that slice out of the sandwich, you’ll see that it has been transformed accordingly.

Make sense?
 
Sources : Smokejumper, forums.daybreakgames.com
 
 
 

Even if it were awful, people would still take the time to learn it. If you don't want to learn it, just use the normal tools I have used solidworks and it wouldn't need to be nearly as complicated.
 
what people are suggesting with a CAD system wouldn't be mandatory at all, just another way/tool to build with the same voxels. a simple addition for those who want more control over their voxels

No, not really. Just like LUA. If you want to go the extra mile and learn something to improve your skills, go ahead, but don't be limited by making everything within the skills of everybody. There's no unfair advantage granted to those who learn a simple in-game CAD system... The current voxel tools will always be available to those who don't want to go the extra mile and learn something... That's like saying they should make a visual IDE for LUA so people don't feel excluded from programming
 

No, not really. Just like LUA. If you want to go the extra mile and learn something to improve your skills, go ahead, but don't be limited by making everything within the skills of everybody. There's no unfair advantage granted to those who learn a simple in-game CAD system... The current voxel tools will always be available to those who don't want to go the extra mile and learn something... That's like saying they should make a visual IDE for LUA so people don't feel excluded from programming
 

I want basic cad tools!!! Even using a extremely basic in game cad would be awsome! Check out Onshape. It’s a simple cad program based on the cloud! You can run it off of chrome! Implementing this would be huge for bilders. As nq was saying you can specialize in a specific career so why can’t cad and building be a part of this. Cad is not difficult to lead but is extremely powerful tool. I would love to see nq implement this. 

More info is available in the pre-alpha subforum   - 
 

I forgot to update this thread with the coins when they arrived