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CalenLoki

Anti-TU device

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Simple suggestion: stationary device that prevent other players from placing TU within the same hex. Doesn't affect existing TU. Cen be localised by special scanner (you need to be close).

 

Why you ask?

  1. It should be much cheaper than TU to both build and maintain. Thus it's a form of protection anyone can use, even new players.
  2. Secret bases could use it to prevent someone claiming them by accident (or on purpose). As the device is much harder to be detected accidentally (attempting to dig is much more common activity than attempting to place TU)
  3. During battle, it prevents opposite side from placing their own TU seconds after original one get destroyed. If both sides have such devices, the battle will go on until one of them get destroyed.

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1 should be evenly expensive, there is no reason this option would be cheaper as it has the same function in general

2 simple solution, you cant build within feed of existing base, and existing bases are not deleted or destroyed by placing a TU

3 so then im gone place about 100 of these on all hexes around my base, lets break the game, and they are cheap so its easy peasy to do it with a large or semi small org already.

 

The original problem can easely be fixed by adding a limitation on the TU that all builders of bases in that hex will keep their rights and are automatically transfered to the TU with no chance of change in that. with a "aprove: Yes/No"box

 

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14 hours ago, CalenLoki said:

It should be much cheaper than TU to both build and maintain. Thus it's a form of protection anyone can use, even new players.

Open new way for grifer as they can place it everywhere, to prevent people place TU to stop their "troll" build on people's building.

14 hours ago, CalenLoki said:

Secret bases could use it to prevent someone claiming them by accident (or on purpose). As the device is much harder to be detected accidentally (attempting to dig is much more common activity than attempting to place TU)

Disagree because if someone build underground but other build on the ground, how to deal now.

14 hours ago, CalenLoki said:

During battle, it prevents opposite side from placing their own TU seconds after original one get destroyed. If both sides have such devices, the battle will go on until one of them get destroyed.

As Aaron say, you can just place them over the place, on every killing hole you can put it.

But after all if not count it cons, i would say this idea not need when there is TU, because it function same as TU but for grifer, troll and exploiter.

Simple solution for this: Time need for a TU to working like: Safe Zone ( 24- 48 hour ) , Wild Land ( 6 - 24 hour ), War time ( 8+ hour, in that time both side cant do thing like mining or edit terrain via tool ). Give that in safe zone it will allow people to move stuff in time, in wild land it give people need time to react and destroy those invader, war time to prevent they claim imdeally but give the defense a chance to reclaim the title if they can hold that long.

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Totally agree with Shioristein. This will be perfect for trolls and loads of drama, the original system is good, the solutions provided here do also work. 

And to be honest, if someone builds a base over my underground base, im sure i can find a way to rob them or make their life "complicated" Lets begin with adding perimiter defences while they are offline, add a boxed in bunker over their base and that will be funny. It is stated that property and builds will not be destroyed by placing a TU or something and the base will stay in your possession, so any invader will have an incursion incoming asap

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16 hours ago, CalenLoki said:

Simple suggestion: stationary device that prevent other players from placing TU within the same hex. Doesn't affect existing TU. Cen be localised by special scanner (you need to be close).

 

Why you ask?

  1. It should be much cheaper than TU to both build and maintain. Thus it's a form of protection anyone can use, even new players.
  2. Secret bases could use it to prevent someone claiming them by accident (or on purpose). As the device is much harder to be detected accidentally (attempting to dig is much more common activity than attempting to place TU)
  3. During battle, it prevents opposite side from placing their own TU seconds after original one get destroyed. If both sides have such devices, the battle will go on until one of them get destroyed.

DU is a social game. Why do ppl always want to give solo players the same protection/tools as orgs?

You CAN play DU on your own and that should be possible, I agree there. But placing a TU is a group effort (or a very long solo effort). A new player can ofc venture outside the safezones to do stuff but building a base (even a small one) is a big undertaking (and should be!). You have to make decisions here and it all boils down to risk vs reward.

Go alone and just dig in - cheap but dangerous

go alone and place a TCU - expensive but a bit safer

go alone, place a TCU and shield - very expensive but very safe

find a group to play with and do stuff with them - cheap and safe

 

Your suggestion would only lead to trolls (like me) annoying ppl by placing those anti-TCU elements everywhere but I won't reiterate the points already made by others here.

 

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47 minutes ago, Aaron Cain said:

and the base will stay in your possession

About this i thing it will make thing to be complicate.

Like if i build a base on a tile include your base, build TU but you let me do it and time pass i claim the title. Now you move away but not destroy your base because "Maybe i will be back" or "So much effort, i cant just destroy it". Now i want to digging to underground to do something like a big room underground but hit your base now how can i salvage your base?

Assume that you are part of a giant org so declear war is not a possibility. So your base will stay there forever and if i ask you may nicely remove it but maybe not.

So in this part i disagree about idea your stuff still your possession after a TU is working.

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I can understand, but it was not an idea i had but the way buildings work for all i know now. You need to actually take over the core else its still be someone elses. In my case, What would you offer me to leave? and else, good luck with destroying my base :). I would want complete compensation And a fee for leaving. You want this spot while there is a whole planet, then pay for me leaving.

 

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2 minutes ago, Aaron Cain said:

I can understand, but it was not an idea i had but the way buildings work for all i know now. You need to actually take over the core else its still be someone elses. In my case, What would you offer me to leave? and else, good luck with destroying my base :). I would want complete compensation And a fee for leaving. You want this spot while there is a whole planet, then pay for me leaving.

 

That is what a grifer will do.
I have 3 choice to choose: War, Pay , Move.
And it isnt give me emergent gameplay feeling, it give me RAGE feeling for unfair.
You do all thing to get a TU now a base is inside, right the place you want and you cant do a thing ? No please.

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you are right. So I hope that there will be a message "there already is a base in this territory" when you want to add a TU. And then When you place it anyway it is your fault and noone else is to blame. There was a choise Not to put it there with another base already in the territory

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That is not a solution.

IF do that i can think a way to exploit, by place the TU to scan the secret base, very very bad move.

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Guys, that's physical device. You can just blow it up. It's not TCU, you can still dig there, blow the door, kill the core and claim the base. So if anyone decide to spam them all over the place, they need to build durable structures around them, equipped with AI-guns, ammo, energy reserves, ect.. Or they became free resources for anyone willing to pick them up. At least outside safe-zones.

So while yes, griefing is possible. But it's also much easier to deal with than TCU griefing that it prevents.

 

It only protects from someone claiming the tile with your base and using TCU magic to block your ability to dig out of your grave.

 

It apply to safe-zone too, and that's area designed for newbies, even solo ones. Without that anyone who can afford TCU can box-troll every single base in safe-zone with dirt box around it.

If you had to choose to either have stuff dug around you base, or the same +blocking you from fixing it or even entering a base: which one would you choose?

 

It apply to hidden org bases too, not only to solo bases.


It also cost monies to place and operate. Just less than TU, as it's much weaker claim.

14 hours ago, Aaron Cain said:

1 should be evenly expensive, there is no reason this option would be cheaper as it has the same function in general

Claiming terrain that nobody can build or construct anything there and preventing someone from claiming the tile = preventing someone from claiming the tile?

Interesting.

14 hours ago, Aaron Cain said:

2 simple solution, you cant build within feed of existing base, and existing bases are not deleted or destroyed by placing a TU

Pardon my, but what is "feed of a base"? Proximity? Boundary box? Whole hex? Under&over? That would mean each construct works like smaller TU. May be even easier to abuse, as you can build constructs much cheaper than suggested Anti-TCU

Second part seems like an good idea. Existing constructs belong to their creators until someone blows the core. But You can't expand them, as you can't dig on claimed hex.

14 hours ago, Aaron Cain said:

3 so then im gone place about 100 of these on all hexes around my base, lets break the game, and they are cheap so its easy peasy to do it with a large or semi small org already.

They still cost to build and maintain. And they don't prevent digging, and are detectable by scanner. So unless you build structure (with ai guns and stuff) to protect them, someone can just go around and pick them like mushrooms (free resources :D).

5 hours ago, ShioriStein said:

Disagree because if someone build underground but other build on the ground, how to deal now.

Fight. Anti-TU doesn't prevent other players from placing Anti-TU too, so either owner of underground base destroy overground Anti-TU, or the other way around.

6 hours ago, ShioriStein said:

That is what a grifer will do.
I have 3 choice to choose: War, Pay , Move.

It's not griefer, if you can fight him.

Griefer is someone who do nasty things to other players, while being protected by game system. If griefing is possible, then it means game has design flaws.

So such thing would be a problem only within safe zone. In UA war is the ultimate tool against griefers.

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This game is about having an open world, with relatively non-renewable resources. Guarding resources will be important, but should probably be super, super expensive. If not, the massive number of players will eventually just overwhelm the game and claim everything. I feel like we should leave it like is until we understand how the current games implementation will work with thousands of concurrent players. Until then it is too early to even speculate on something like this.

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4 hours ago, yamamushi said:

Anti-TU device... You mean like, their military?

Yea I second this answer %100 ! There will be things in place to slow down attacker but not forever giving people time to get back up help ! NQ does not want night raiders or a solo griefer to simply be able to destroy all your hard work in a hour so they better bring friends and they better bring a lot of fire power ! Not to forget if they get counter attacked and lose a lot of ships and resources they have just lost a large investment in materials so if your going to attack I would make sure the gain is also worth the lose !  =)

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11 hours ago, yamamushi said:

Anti-TU device... You mean like, their military? 

What?

Have you even read first post, or just the title?

How is military able to protect base without TU from night-TU-placement?

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I still disagree, after a long long war over the title, now to claim it have to find every single one of ATCU ?

 

They can hide it any where, burry in underground, burry in the bush, burry anywhere ... If I manage to wipe all of them but the enemy come back amd start the so called defensive war, place a ATCU after one is found...

 

Also if in safe zone, how can I manage to fight them. Let them ruin my building and get over it ?

 

And I still dont see if it require in game. Remember TCU is very expensive, group( or medium group +) effort not someone effort. So they cant just bring group effort go and troll people.

 

So simple solution is timer for TCU to active.

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50 minutes ago, CalenLoki said:

What?

Have you even read first post, or just the title?

How is military able to protect base without TU from night-TU-placement?

'I think the point yama's making is that the military is basically the same thing as an anti-TU device.

 

Say two sides are fighting each other with hexes in between army and objective. Either side will definitely strive to deploy protected TUs to prevent the opponent from deploying TUs of their own. Placing an anti-TU device levels the playing field by preventing a TU from being placed. In my opinion, that just makes warfare simpler: deploy anti-TU, protect anti-TU. Both sides have equal territory control, which is none. 

 

Sans anti-TU, deploy TU first, protect TU. One side has the advantage: they have effectively stripped the opponent of the ability to go underground, deploy constructs, and possibly enforced a no-fly zone (if it's in their favour), and may prevent the placing of res nodes on the hex concerned. 

 

Frankly, I don't see anti-TU's being much of a deal if we add a caveat to placing them: expiration date or restriction on subterranean placement. 

They'd still cost someone something to produce and hence, they'll cost someone else something to purchase. It just depends on how much time you're willing to spend on something that can be found easily and destroyed without protection. 

 

Cheers.

'

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e37.png.625d2dc5334ea5fd04031bdf91871cab.png

 

But in regards to the topic... If you want an anti-tu device, you should get to the tiles you want first and set up a TU of yours. In this case, an overly complicated system is not needed.

 

You need competition to get the good spots... Otherwise you'd have people running around placing ATUs everywhere just to troll.

 

 

Cheers,

Comrademoco

 

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TLDR: What the OP wants is a TCU that isn't publicly visible, but doesn't offer protection to counterbalance the stealthiness, which I think could actually be a pretty good idea assuming nothing conflicts with it.

 

It could even be just an option on a regular TCU to turn off protection, but as a benefit makes the location of the claimed hex invisible.

Protection On = Visible (Can see on map)
Protection Off = Invisible (Can't see on map)

In both states the territory is claimed and no other TCU can be placed on that territory.

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12 hours ago, LittleJoe said:

TLDR: What the OP wants is a TCU that isn't publicly visible, but doesn't offer protection to counterbalance the stealthiness, which I think could actually be a pretty good idea assuming nothing conflicts with it.

 

It could even be just an option on a regular TCU to turn off protection, but as a benefit makes the location of the claimed hex invisible.

Protection On = Visible (Can see on map)
Protection Off = Invisible (Can't see on map)

In both states the territory is claimed and no other TCU can be placed on that territory.

If you want this, i would propose to add another unit. Instead of building a shield unit, build a stealth unit. Does exactly that but reduces your actual defences, so its still claimed and all the stuff that goes with that but the stealth has a negative impact on total defences, not talking about actual armor or concrete boxes but about shieldings or defence units. With stealth on all other electrical defence units are off to hide the location.

 

Would that work for you?

 

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