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Caprikel

Some Ideas Relating to PvE

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I'm sure there have been previous posts about PvE, but I want to share some of my ideas as to how PvE could work in Dual Universe. 

 

So in one of the early Dev Blogs, JC mentions NPCs in this quote: "

At this stage, it is not clear if we will have enough time until the alpha to implement NPC animals to come and bother you during the night, as well as serve as hunting preys. But that’s the idea, because you will need to feed yourself, and the nanoformer cannot make wood-based lunch for you!"

So based on this, it's clear that JC plans on the game to have a survival aspect to the game at some point, where hostile creatures will bother you in the night, like in Minecraft. I thought about how the PvE system would work if it was the same as it is in Minecraft, but the system of monsters spawning anywhere the light level is low wouldn't fit well with Dual Universe at all. Having monsters spawn in your skyscraper just because it's a little dark would be a huge annoyance, and would ruin the immersion that Dual Universe creates. 

 

So instead, I was thinking that hostile creatures could instead only be spawned in certain locations where a specific monster spawning block is generated. For example, this could be a giant nest that spawns a wasp-like creature that attacks players if they get too close to the nest. I think it would be interesting if these creatures behavior varied based on the species. For example you could have creatures that are extremely territorial, but are neutral otherwise. For other creatures, they could roam in packs like wolves, and attack anything they find. 

 

I think hostile creatures could become pretty important in various aspects of the game. For example, it creates an incentive to build shelters to survive the night, to build cities with walls protecting it, to create turrets to defend from monsters. It could also create a whole new profession, monster hunters. Maybe the game could spawn a nest of hostile monsters every couple weeks that creates a problem for a vulnerable settlement. These settlers don't have a group of powerful soldiers to eradicate the monster nest, so they hire a group to hunt these monsters and destroy them. (It could also create situations where you find abandoned towns due to monster infestation, which I think is pretty cool.) Also monster nests could be used as a rare material that's desirable, so monster hunter groups could also just hunt monster nests for the sake of getting the rare resource from it. (And of course the monster themselves could drop something somewhat useful, like food to help sustain the hunt.)

 

Of course, many issues arise from this system. For example, there needs to be a system that prevents a planet from being covered in monster-spawning nests, so maybe it could be limited to spawning within a certain radius of players. Maybe the higher the density of players in an area, the more powerful of a monster spawn-nest is created. Another issue is making sure there isn't too many monsters, so you obviously don't want the monster nest to continually spawn monsters that flood up the game, so as long as the monsters despawn when players aren't around, it should be fine.  

 

So what are your guys thought? Assuming there will be monsters eventually, what kind of system for monsters do you want Dual Universe to have? Also, what kind of hostile creatures do you want to see that would fit well with the lore of Dual Universe?

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I like this idea. And certainly hope there will be some PvE aspect in the future. As we know, it most likely won't be implemented at launch, probably a year or two later. And because of that, players will be set up with resources guns, ships, whatever. I think the monsters spawned should be difficult to take down, and a proper challenge (for moderatly geared people). This means there is a need for well equipped players to actually go out and take down these nests.

 

Regarding the nests, I don't think there should be something limiting a planet getting overrun by these monsters (please be bugs). This will mean you can't just leave the nest. The only proper way to stop them is to take out the nest. Although there should be a limit for how close these nests will spawn. My thoughts is have a pretty large distance between nests, but have their nests zones/territory intersected.

 

Lore wise, I definitly think we need monsters. Unknown planet with completely new ecosystem? Gotta be guys on the top of the food chain before we arrived.

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Well, there is already some rudimentary code for path-finding (that is currently being used for testing) that could be extended to create the AI for these "Monsters". However, there is the question on how to populate many life-bearing planets with unique creatures (unless it is the colonists that introduce the fauna into the ecosystem). Also, I think planets that have any life on them should be rare (to begin with).

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I have no issue with hunting bears, of any kind, grizzly, polar or care ones.

 

Thing is, as long as the PvE "Grinding" doesn't become a part of the game, I am all in for organic ways of using PvE, like hunting, or - hopefully down the line - pelt and leather gathering from animals, for the RP part of the community that likes itself some nice fur.

 

Also, having to clean a mining site from some spider Cronenberg-fuelled nightmarish spawn of satan and cthulu, is a good PvE thng. Having the spawn sites have Little Green Men with lazors, is stupid though.

 

And, instead of a Spawn Block, there could be a "Queen" for example, in the case of spiders, or an Alpha, when it comes to predatory fauna. Kil lthese "bosses" for some rare posion / fur or even plainly speaking a "Trophy" that you can craft a "Trophy Mount for a Wall" element in the game for bragging rights.

This way, explorers can locate the spawn of a "boss" mob, so people can mobilise to hunt them down, Monster Hunter style, similar to how in EVE, we can sell the location of a PVE combat site to people - a legit way to make money.

Mmmmm, thinking of mounting a Deatclaw's unholy mug on your wall? That's what I am thinking right now.

 

But not Green Men that are loot pinyatas, or Spiders that drop laser rifles and power armor pieces. That's a BAD PvE trope that it's time to take it out the back and... erm, send it in a farm with all the other tropes, like turn-based combat.

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I'm perfectly fine with hunting, dangerous environment and getting some basic resources out of it like food.

 

But you definitely have to prevent those mobs of dropping loot, some rare resource or any other rare in-game item. Because this turns out to be grinding and that's just plain boring.

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I think hostile NPCs are unnecessary, but if they are put in game I just don't want them to be a grind or too common. Attacking animals should be rare enough to where it surprises you, and most animals should be elusive and afraid of people.

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I think hostile NPCs are unnecessary, but if they are put in game I just don't want them to be a grind or too common. Attacking animals should be rare enough to where it surprises you, and most animals should be elusive and afraid of people.

Predators don't care. Have you seen a honeybadger backing from a fight? Nope. Honeybadgers give no shit, they will bite your ankles off.

 

We need space-honeybadgers to cull the meek in DU :P

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I like this idea. And certainly hope there will be some PvE aspect in the future. As we know, it most likely won't be implemented at launch, probably a year or two later. And because of that, players will be set up with resources guns, ships, whatever. I think the monsters spawned should be difficult to take down, and a proper challenge (for moderatly geared people). This means there is a need for well equipped players to actually go out and take down these nests.

 

Regarding the nests, I don't think there should be something limiting a planet getting overrun by these monsters (please be bugs). This will mean you can't just leave the nest. The only proper way to stop them is to take out the nest. Although there should be a limit for how close these nests will spawn. My thoughts is have a pretty large distance between nests, but have their nests zones/territory intersected.

 

Lore wise, I definitly think we need monsters. Unknown planet with completely new ecosystem? Gotta be guys on the top of the food chain before we arrived.

Hmm, I do like the idea of arriving on a new planet, and then finding out that it's infested with bugs. It would be really cool to find a spot safe from the bugs, set up a military base of sorts, and work with groups of monster hunters to eradicate the bugs to claim the planet to use for habitation.

Also having a planet infested with monsters would make having hover battle vehicles much more useful, since you would actually need to be near the ground and defended to take down hoards of them. Imagine arriving on an infested planet on a large cargo ship, and then a battalion of hovertanks are deployed, and an epic battle of man vs. bug takes place.

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Well, there is already some rudimentary code for path-finding (that is currently being used for testing) that could be extended to create the AI for these "Monsters". However, there is the question on how to populate many life-bearing planets with unique creatures (unless it is the colonists that introduce the fauna into the ecosystem). Also, I think planets that have any life on them should be rare (to begin with).

There is a few ways to explain only having a small set of monsters and having it still make sense lore-wise. For example, there's the common trope in science-fiction where there's a race of bugs that colonize all over the galaxy, so it would make sense to find these bugs almost anywhere. Those bugs could have also brought other creatures with them, so it wouldn't be unusual to have similar monsters throughout the galaxy.

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Assuming there will be npc monsters eventually introduced how I think the system should work is:
 
Lets assume we have planet A, on this planet there are certain random spawn points for monsters or general spawn areas for that matter where npc monsters will start spawning and to keep the expansion of these monsters controlled they will only expand their territories at night while they will stay in their nests and territories during the morning probably with more monsters spawning, now these monsters shouldn't give loot when killed as it introduces meaningless grinding(as lethys mentioned).

There should be no limit on as to how much these monsters can expand unless the expansion directly harms them, I am sure a polar bear would not like to live in a desert.

The players will need to make fortified settlements as protection and will need to clear out monsters so that they do not harm the cities, the only way to get rid of monsters in a particular area would be to destroy the nest and for that special mercenaries/ monster hunting groups or even the local army would need to go in the nest filled with monsters and destroy them. This situation should stop the spawning of monsters for a period of time after which either the monsters start spawning at that location or a random new spawn point is generated.

Now considering that the planets are procedurally generated, I don't know if monster infested planets will be generated or once the planet is generated then the spawning of monsters will start.  

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Another thing that could be used would be a "breeding" mechanic where as long as there are 1 or 2 animals on a planet more could spawn every so often. This would also allow for planets to be purged of hostile mobs as well as force people to "play nice" with nature as you would be able to kill it all off. Would also possibly be useful for later when there are core worlds that people want to be far safer than other planets

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Another thing that could be used would be a "breeding" mechanic where as long as there are 1 or 2 animals on a planet more could spawn every so often. This would also allow for planets to be purged of hostile mobs as well as force people to "play nice" with nature as you would be able to kill it all off. Would also possibly be useful for later when there are core worlds that people want to be far safer than other planets

The idea of "breeding" mechanism while quite good poses the problem that indeed a planet can be purged of a specific species and while some people may play nice I don't think the general populace will care much about it and just destroy it unless ofcourse they get a loot or some reward from killing those that they leave some or breed them for that matter to kill them which would then again introduce the problem of grinding. That's why I think that purging them should hold them from spawning for some time but they should auto spawn some time after perging.

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Another thing that could be used would be a "breeding" mechanic where as long as there are 1 or 2 animals on a planet more could spawn every so often. This would also allow for planets to be purged of hostile mobs as well as force people to "play nice" with nature as you would be able to kill it all off. Would also possibly be useful for later when there are core worlds that people want to be far safer than other planets

OR, the good ol' proximity based spawn, with the aforementioned "Elite" creep that as long as it's alive, more of its type but less in rank, spawn around it. I.E. an Alpha Wolf - or a Wolfmother - keeps spawning more wolves periodically around it until killed.

 

The only way that a planet should be "purged" would be to simply cover a planet with claims, which it would mean there won't be spanws inside players' claims - mind you, spawns, not that animals could not attack the claim itself.

 

Safety is relative. Build a wall - and make the alien fauna pay for it - and your peeps cwould be safe.

 

Oh, what's that? People outside the wall are not safe? Welp, that's a bummer then.

 

The people you should be worried about, not the silly NPC bots. People can orbitally strike your cities to a subatomic pulp, not wolves.

 

Plus, one thing I've learned in EVE, is that High-Security people love themselves some PVE. What? Rich Aristocrats should be able to go fox-hunting in their back yard mate. Or... w/e nightmarish creature NQ conjures that can be hunted :P

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You know what would be awesome?

 

-This is it. The expansion that adds Stargates. You and your org are gonna go blasting off, Team Rocket style!

 

-But wait! Stargates need a new resource you've never heard of before, "Super-Mega-Extra-Unobtainium".

 

-Everyone is looking for it now, the prospectors are out in force. The first person to find this new ore will become filthy rich.

 

-Suddenly, someone reports in, "We found it! It's here at these cord- wait, whats that? No, it can't be. Retreat, RETREAT! They're everywhere, They're everywhere! Shoot them, shoot them! AHH----"

 

(Through the power of respawn technology, they tell us that the planet is infested with bugs. huge insects. 100's of millions)

 

-With too many to fight alone, all of the major orgs put aside their differences to wage one massive bug war!

 

-Slowly, but surely, we clear the planet of the bugs, and their nests, and find the ore we were looking for.

 

(Then somebody blows everybody else up, steals it, etc)

 

-Finally, with the "Super-Mega-Extra-Unobtainium" in hand, somebody builds a stargate, and shoots off into the future!

 

 

 

Yes, it's basically Starship Troopers.

 

 

Realistically, the stargate expansion would probably come before the "monsters, bugs, and other nasties" expansion.

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But not Green Men that are loot pinyatas, or Spiders that drop laser rifles and power armor pieces. That's a BAD PvE trope that it's time to take it out the back and... erm, send it in a farm with all the other tropes, like turn-based combat.

 

 

Aww come on - there's a crap load of awesome turn-based combat games. Not something to look forward in an MMO, but still.... But yeah, I agree that snakes that "kick you for x points of damage" and drop rusty swords belong in the very happy nostalgic memories of the past :P

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You know what would be awesome?

 

-This is it. The expansion that adds Stargates. You and your org are gonna go blasting off, Team Rocket style!

 

-But wait! Stargates need a new resource you've never heard of before, "Super-Mega-Extra-Unobtainium".

 

-Everyone is looking for it now, the prospectors are out in force. The first person to find this new ore will become filthy rich.

 

-Suddenly, someone reports in, "We found it! It's here at these cord- wait, whats that? No, it can't be. Retreat, RETREAT! They're everywhere, They're everywhere! Shoot them, shoot them! AHH----"

 

(Through the power of respawn technology, they tell us that the planet is infested with bugs. huge insects. 100's of millions)

 

-With too many to fight alone, all of the major orgs put aside their differences to wage one massive bug war!

 

-Slowly, but surely, we clear the planet of the bugs, and their nests, and find the ore we were looking for.

 

(Then somebody blows everybody else up, steals it, etc)

 

-Finally, with the "Super-Mega-Extra-Unobtainium" in hand, somebody builds a stargate, and shoots off into the future!

 

 

 

Yes, it's basically Starship Troopers.

 

 

Realistically, the stargate expansion would probably come before the "monsters, bugs, and other nasties" expansion.

 

Yes. All the yes. But a reason why the bugs/monsters arrived in the first place could be the introduction of stargates.

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You know what would be awesome?

 

-This is it. The expansion that adds Stargates. You and your org are gonna go blasting off, Team Rocket style!

 

-But wait! Stargates need a new resource you've never heard of before, "Super-Mega-Extra-Unobtainium".

 

-Everyone is looking for it now, the prospectors are out in force. The first person to find this new ore will become filthy rich.

 

-Suddenly, someone reports in, "We found it! It's here at these cord- wait, whats that? No, it can't be. Retreat, RETREAT! They're everywhere, They're everywhere! Shoot them, shoot them! AHH----"

 

(Through the power of respawn technology, they tell us that the planet is infested with bugs. huge insects. 100's of millions)

 

-With too many to fight alone, all of the major orgs put aside their differences to wage one massive bug war!

 

-Slowly, but surely, we clear the planet of the bugs, and their nests, and find the ore we were looking for.

 

(Then somebody blows everybody else up, steals it, etc)

 

-Finally, with the "Super-Mega-Extra-Unobtainium" in hand, somebody builds a stargate, and shoots off into the future!

 

 

 

Yes, it's basically Starship Troopers.

 

 

Realistically, the stargate expansion would probably come before the "monsters, bugs, and other nasties" expansion.

And then, after a few weeks/months, a field emitter is developed that repulses the bugs away. Just imagine how quickly a mining outpost or military base could fall if someone were to, say, conduct sabotage on said field emitters.

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Yes. All the yes. But a reason why the bugs/monsters arrived in the first place could be the introduction of stargates.

 

That would be the simplest explanation - or in other words: Wormholes.

 

 

An energy conduit formed between two active Stargates. A Stargate transfers a person or object into energy as it passes through the event horizon, then transmits it through the wormhole to the receiving Stargate - which then reconstructs the matter in its original form.

Wormholes traverse vast distances across the galaxy, and even between galaxies. The conduit does not always exist, but is formed only between two active Stargates. An object can travel in only one direction in a wormhole, through the initiating gate.

 

Take the multiverse and you have a plausible explanation. 

That could be everything. It does not even have to be human. But ... big, ugly bugs? Count me in.
Newsreel announcer: Young people from all over the globe are joining forces to fight for the future.
 
Soldier # 1: I'm doing my part.
Soldier # 2: I'm doing my part.
Soldier # 3: I'm doing my part.
Young kid dressed as a soldier: I'm doing my part too.
 
Newsreel announcer: They're doing their part. Are you? Join the Mobile Infantry and save the world. Service guarantees citizenship.

 

 

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Yes. All the yes. But a reason why the bugs/monsters arrived in the first place could be the introduction of stargates.

 

 

Or, you know, modify the drake equation for animals to spawn on certain biomes. Procedural generation and goldilocks planets are the only explanation the devs need. :P

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NPCs takes a long time to develop, I don't think there'll be much for release, maybe 4-5 creatures just for aesthetic. This is a sandbox, PVE is not just killing mobs, there'll be plenty of activities to do. Yes, most activities will probably have a risk associated, but that's how the game works. 

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