Aaron Cain

indeed, but thats not part of the issue here, its a whole different problem as in godmode you will never discover issues that mortals have, like mining 90% of the day. Full markets is indeed an issue but the solution is not that easy unless NQ breaks their own rulings as in stuff will never get deleted aslong as the owner is active. and since we have no way yet to measure activity as most packs are sold not per month but in larger packs probably everyone is still within payed service.

Fully agree on this, not only because its logic but also because there is no need for all these towers, not only is Alioth full of them also the sanctuary moon is growing hedgehogs

What would be helpfull in my perspective would be not so much to place restrictions on for example Warp but to counter what is already said here, the cost of ships and other builds. It is very clear that by having high costs the reason to go PVP and hope for a high profit kill are locical but the negative side is that nobody with those ships will go PVP or even venture out into places where they can loose the ship. Adding territorial wars will not help in this. I know that talking about making building stuff cheaper is not the direction NQ wants to think in but to be honest it is the fastest way to more PVP. Not only in games but in real life too wars are mostly fought with the cheapest means possible and in many cases thats a simple human with a gun or bomb. only overly high tech stuff is deployed in wars when the risk of loosing that tech is minimal, else its just cannon fodder thats sent first. Morality nowadays does reduce that for some countries but not for the majority on world scale. Ingame it works the same, would i go through a pvp zone with a 300 million ship? No. Would i do it with one of 1 or 2 million? Probably Yes. Would both ships carry the same cargo? Yes. At the moment people dont go around PVP afraid of their cargo but of the loss of their ship and all the consequences of that loss. Cargo is easy to replace, even if its worth millions but the time invested in a ship its design and the testflights making it perfect, not. And although not all is lost as we can have BP still if the components of the ship together cost so much more then Any cargo we can think of there is no reason to fly. and with no reason to get new cargo ships are going to be grounded sooner then later. Good point about warp, also i saw good points about the aiming AI and about countermeasures like shieldings and stuff but please also consider the balancing of cost and effort and power to move cargo. What the latest patch did was add a few hundred millions extra into building that ship and that probably will result in loss of players and surely loss of people taking the risk to go through PVP zones. We really did not need another quanta drain and even with the "industry is to cheap" idea there was no massive PVP in space simply because industry was not cheap. It was cheap If you did organize with other players and build massive factories, but then still Massive factories require massive ores and those require Mining teams flying out taking risks. Looking back at for instance WW2, in the end the axes did not loose because their technology was inferiour, they lacked fuel and materials to build stuff and the allies mass produced cheap fighter planes and all the other materials overflowing their needs. Please think again about how we can all make PVP work by providing both hunters and pray with ships that they dont mind so much on loosing, cheaper building results not in an overheated economy but probably in larger nice buildings, ships and less fear of loosing ships and thus more pray to be hunted.

Please don't mention there is still solo play. We all know we get more restrictions and patches to kill off solo play if someone mentions it They almost did it with the industry overhaul, its freezing but i think we need one more patch to make the kill.

lets add more restrictions. Seriously, everytime i see a patch that is an overhaul or a way to make PvP more interesting its restrictions restrictions and more restrictions. And with every restriction that drives DU further from emerging gameplay and freedom to build its digging a deeper grave. It was a unique concept, it was a nice ideal. Now its a limited restricted sandbox where you are not allowed to kick in someone elses castle. You may only dig deep holes But there is hope, back to basics and to the kickstarter ideals

DU was intended to be for the long run and not like SE for quick space action. But the way this long run has acted out is indeed a small grind even Korean MMO makers will give a standing ovation for. Well, back to mining. Apparently i am one of the few idiots that wants actual chairs and tables in their buildings.

Towakin, with your own quotes mentioning people talk out their ass and should keep their opinions in their ass you are doing exactly the same. I don't know why you are angry at a lot of reactors on this forum and I do agree with most of your points. In general this game will not get better if we all argue among ourselves, don't sent tickets and don't have proper discussions. If i caused any frustrations with you by my recent posts, that was not intended but it seems to be a general issue in DU these days to frustrate players who really believe in the idea behind it. I am one of the people who really believes in it but I am no Fanboy, I believe in the need of critical arguments and showing frustrations over issues. I love to hear more from your ideas and feel free to discuss with me anything about DU, you can find me in discord but not on the Main DU discord as that is a wasp nest i don't want to mingle in. respect to all and wish you all nice discussions! Aaron

They specially said industry should only be on statics for PVP incentive if i remember correct, later we got more updates/restrictions for PVP incentive. But well, these things wont work at all since nobody counts the kills you make, there is no Honor list, there is only anonimous kills, you dont even get a red name for killing alot. So hardcore PvP players will not get any recognition for their kills or skills. add anyform of incent and it might help to drive people away or will give need to wars but not a single incent to the scoreboard killers that apparently PvP is made for. General and casual players will not go to pvp in their ships for a better mining spot ifthere are plenty around. Mining orgs will not go full PvP as its not their business, so only some organizations will maybe fight for a planet but probably just announce a planet is theirs and not a single shot is needed. If you really want alot of PvP think by yourself, Is the present DU going to give that? What does war cost? alot of materials and a vast industry. What is restricted in DU behind a quanta wall? Industry, What is a grind most people dont want to take? Mining. So the only needed incent to boost actual shooting is make the ships to shoot with cheap so its viable to loose it, make mass production of fighter craft plausible. and ass Graxxor said, DU in this form will in the end be anarchy and only the strong will survive with an army of minions and slaves.

Nice discussion. If i read it all i get the feeling most people think that PvP and Non-PvP as it is now or as it is intended to be implemented both suck. Well, ill just go back to my previous statement, first fix stuff already broken, then go back to kickstarter ideals and from that point just follow the previously known roadmap. If DU works from the bottom up PVP will be the easiest thing to fix. But at the moment there are more then enough issues with the bottom.

Maybe its a good idea to go back to the kickstarter originals. Finish all the stuff thats bugged first, then implement the actual roadmap as provided a long time ago, reshape stuff to actually match kickstarter ideas and when that is all finish and there is no discrepancy anymore between the promised features everyone backed the game for, the added roadmap and the actual game, maybe then fine tune? There are a few ways to do things on a larger scale that in general come to 2 options: 1, develop a creative plausible solution to make something work and keep freedom intact. 2, add restrictions or taxes to restrict on use. The first of the two ways requires skilled professionals, the other one is a simple solution because you have no fracking idea how to do the first one. In general governments go for option 2

I guess you dont have any quanta bugs ore other stuff and everything works perfect since day 1? I was talking about new players with only a hover and stuff like the Quanta bug and such.

well, with the numbers falling since initial Beta launch and again after the scematic patch and the kill individualisme update maybe this system will help some players to get back in business. However, if the system needs players to actually do stuff off-planet and they cannot build or buy spaceships. hmm. Lets see this

not sure what is worse, a wipe or to continue with what we have including all the stuff some got by information they should never have gotten and other stuff in the catogory, where there is smoke.... But beta is beta and no release so there should be glitches and such. Only difference is that a normal beta ends with a wipe and maybe the players get a week head start. No idea what would be better, if we get more changes that define the core of DU and drive us away from the kickstarter ideas a wipe would be best.

looks like a perfect foolproof system. wouldn't it be easier to just introduce a research mechanism and forget the quanta dump? There are so many creative ideas to generate a system that might not be faster (for those who gained trillions of quantra) but would be more logical, research.

Another reason we will never see those is because they first told us we could build them, then they showed they could be build and we should all build our dreams!!! And then came the restrictions for: Performance, Pvp, PvP, statics have no goal, pvp, why would anyone build statics so more restrictions on dynamic, flying is to easy more restrictions, pvp, industry is cheap this hurts pvp,, etcetera. so after killing of most ideas and hopes for small organizations to push everyone in some large organization there is only a need of a few people with ideas and telling a few individuals about what is going to change or what is bugged and can be exploited does not help. DU was promised as build in freedom everything you want, combination of minecraft and eve, pure freedom... But in the end apparently it can only live with enough PVP people and thus is alot restricted to push in that direction. Once there was a posibility to actually build a +8km dynamic space city with merchant zones and industry, now it lives on in Space engineers because clang is much more forgiving then general restrictions. And because everytime someone shouts, they never said that, here is the kickstarter page that holds all the info:

Main problem i have with schematics is that i never got any quanta and thus needed to do alot of stuff to get some to even begin with. and with only a starter hover and no quanta it takes a long time to get anywhere, now with these things all the players with the same bug, the No quanta Bug, will be very fracked. missing 100k per day may sound like peanuts but when you can only mine and sell for a long time to even get some stuff together DU is burning you up even faster then governmental taxrates on your income.

you get free quanta? How? I dont get any even sent in a ticket on day one and still dont get anything and the option to resent the quanta is apparently a no go, so since day 1, No quanta. And with the way DU is build I am just Fracked with a capital F.

as i said before, the game is going away more and more from the original ideas and where most supported for. With a creative mode there is no need to actually be ingame for about 80% of the time or more for the creative people who are just here to develop and design. Hope they add the 8 km core soon that was also promised a longlong time ago together with infinite freedom to build and no restrictions on element placements like lets say industry and markets. People forget fast but there was a time that the idea of building vast space ships with industry and markets were actually promoted as you could build all you ever dreamed about. Now....

Sometimes its not so nice to finally be right. I am telling this for a long time already, but most people didnt care or ranted. Even the texts on the website have been altered to fit the current game, building your dream stuff, and think big as there are no limits to imagination...all gone. And some nice restrictions came inplace. Still waiting on that 2 and 4 km core we were getting. There is only one thing to do online, mining. DU started out very promising but at the present rate of adding restrictions even faster then new blocks or solving bugs it is starting to look like keen where every new patch is a new set of bugs, dc and once in a quarter a dlc with nice colors. What happened to freedom to build whatever you can think of, and do not start with "thats possible just need a large org" Then tell me what large, 1000 plater org builds 100 dreams simultanious, or is it some players who rule the org and the rest, well they can always mine

Seeing all these remarks i think we are missing the most important part. Apparently there are players, as seen before, that are tipped by interns at NQ about stuff ingame, updates and glitches so they can get profit from it. If this is the case it is serious and well, this could end a game even before it starts. Even rumours about it are damaging to a company and a game. Who will play a game where some players are informed about how to work around updates and glitches by someone in the company while all others must struggle? Since there will be no wipe, any advancement now will be enormous in a few years, but some seem to forget that. Remember the enourmous Quanta some got, nooo no issue that will fade away, now we need to buy schematics with quanta...... Not to go to the conspiracy corner, its simple there should not even be the thought that some players are treated different then others. But then again, we will see

Yes i want to know that too, would be good to do that with all the people just random parking.

Good point untill Player vs Player ground combat kicks in at alioth and fresh players are just shot down after leaving the arc zones

Probably this will not happen

So still an exploit, just throw it at discord, dont expect NQ to act on this forum or the official report site, at the moment they only react on discord as said before

True words, but for this beta to be alpha or pre alpha we would need more crashes and full continues pending pending pending pending pending, relog-clear cashe, bzzzzping pendingpendingpending