Kruzer

Overall, this is great news a mission system will potentially give players something to do but with the game as it is it may not be enough. 
 
I don't know about pirating missions. There is no pirating in this game just murder.  The combat mechanic is so horrible that basically once you've been targeted/scanned and your warp drive is reset, you are done.  The balance of risks is terrible you can lose weeks of work mining ore and getting a large hauler just to lose it to some guy who slapped some guns on a box.  On the other side, killing another ship is basically just getting into range and button pushing.  The only real purpose of "combat" in this game is basically just a harmless outlet for psychopaths.
 

Can you imagine being a new player? Every hex that isn't a 25km flight to the nearest market is claimed or mined out.  Testing the cargo limits of whatever ship you've managed to scrape together you hit the lagfest aka markets and crash your ship.  Your little xs core is destroyed and you need to buy a new core.  Just as you are feeling lucky that the market you've crashed at actually has one in stock, the price of the thing comes into your field of vision.  You stare blankly at the screen for 30 seconds before hitting the escape key and punching the exit to desktop.  The only bright spot is that they've probably quit the game before seeing the price of a schematic.

Can you imagine being a new player? Every hex that isn't a 25km flight to the nearest market is claimed or mined out.  Testing the cargo limits of whatever ship you've managed to scrape together you hit the lagfest aka markets and crash your ship.  Your little xs core is destroyed and you need to buy a new core.  Just as you are feeling lucky that the market you've crashed at actually has one in stock, the price of the thing comes into your field of vision.  You stare blankly at the screen for 30 seconds before hitting the escape key and punching the exit to desktop.  The only bright spot is that they've probably quit the game before seeing the price of a schematic.

Can you imagine being a new player? Every hex that isn't a 25km flight to the nearest market is claimed or mined out.  Testing the cargo limits of whatever ship you've managed to scrape together you hit the lagfest aka markets and crash your ship.  Your little xs core is destroyed and you need to buy a new core.  Just as you are feeling lucky that the market you've crashed at actually has one in stock, the price of the thing comes into your field of vision.  You stare blankly at the screen for 30 seconds before hitting the escape key and punching the exit to desktop.  The only bright spot is that they've probably quit the game before seeing the price of a schematic.

Can you imagine being a new player? Every hex that isn't a 25km flight to the nearest market is claimed or mined out.  Testing the cargo limits of whatever ship you've managed to scrape together you hit the lagfest aka markets and crash your ship.  Your little xs core is destroyed and you need to buy a new core.  Just as you are feeling lucky that the market you've crashed at actually has one in stock, the price of the thing comes into your field of vision.  You stare blankly at the screen for 30 seconds before hitting the escape key and punching the exit to desktop.  The only bright spot is that they've probably quit the game before seeing the price of a schematic.

That may be the problem.  I'm here for entertainment.  I live in an actual society.  So factories have been crippled.  Well, ok it was interesting to expand my factory and be able to create new equipment to expand my capabilities in the game but, babysitting a factory was getting a bit stale and probably wouldn't have held my interest for too much longer.  So now that has been hobbled and I'm supposed do what instead of managing my factory?  Mine?  No thanks.  Make screws and schlep them 30 km to the nearest lag fest that pass for markets?  Again, no thanks.  Maybe, take what little wealth I've accumulated and piss it away on PvP.  That could be fun but, the current combat mechanic is pretty much at the level of being a graphical text adventure.  There is so so much that needs to be added content wise before worrying about forcing specialization. 

That may be the problem.  I'm here for entertainment.  I live in an actual society.  So factories have been crippled.  Well, ok it was interesting to expand my factory and be able to create new equipment to expand my capabilities in the game but, babysitting a factory was getting a bit stale and probably wouldn't have held my interest for too much longer.  So now that has been hobbled and I'm supposed do what instead of managing my factory?  Mine?  No thanks.  Make screws and schlep them 30 km to the nearest lag fest that pass for markets?  Again, no thanks.  Maybe, take what little wealth I've accumulated and piss it away on PvP.  That could be fun but, the current combat mechanic is pretty much at the level of being a graphical text adventure.  There is so so much that needs to be added content wise before worrying about forcing specialization. 

That may be the problem.  I'm here for entertainment.  I live in an actual society.  So factories have been crippled.  Well, ok it was interesting to expand my factory and be able to create new equipment to expand my capabilities in the game but, babysitting a factory was getting a bit stale and probably wouldn't have held my interest for too much longer.  So now that has been hobbled and I'm supposed do what instead of managing my factory?  Mine?  No thanks.  Make screws and schlep them 30 km to the nearest lag fest that pass for markets?  Again, no thanks.  Maybe, take what little wealth I've accumulated and piss it away on PvP.  That could be fun but, the current combat mechanic is pretty much at the level of being a graphical text adventure.  There is so so much that needs to be added content wise before worrying about forcing specialization. 

That may be the problem.  I'm here for entertainment.  I live in an actual society.  So factories have been crippled.  Well, ok it was interesting to expand my factory and be able to create new equipment to expand my capabilities in the game but, babysitting a factory was getting a bit stale and probably wouldn't have held my interest for too much longer.  So now that has been hobbled and I'm supposed do what instead of managing my factory?  Mine?  No thanks.  Make screws and schlep them 30 km to the nearest lag fest that pass for markets?  Again, no thanks.  Maybe, take what little wealth I've accumulated and piss it away on PvP.  That could be fun but, the current combat mechanic is pretty much at the level of being a graphical text adventure.  There is so so much that needs to be added content wise before worrying about forcing specialization. 

That may be the problem.  I'm here for entertainment.  I live in an actual society.  So factories have been crippled.  Well, ok it was interesting to expand my factory and be able to create new equipment to expand my capabilities in the game but, babysitting a factory was getting a bit stale and probably wouldn't have held my interest for too much longer.  So now that has been hobbled and I'm supposed do what instead of managing my factory?  Mine?  No thanks.  Make screws and schlep them 30 km to the nearest lag fest that pass for markets?  Again, no thanks.  Maybe, take what little wealth I've accumulated and piss it away on PvP.  That could be fun but, the current combat mechanic is pretty much at the level of being a graphical text adventure.  There is so so much that needs to be added content wise before worrying about forcing specialization. 

That may be the problem.  I'm here for entertainment.  I live in an actual society.  So factories have been crippled.  Well, ok it was interesting to expand my factory and be able to create new equipment to expand my capabilities in the game but, babysitting a factory was getting a bit stale and probably wouldn't have held my interest for too much longer.  So now that has been hobbled and I'm supposed do what instead of managing my factory?  Mine?  No thanks.  Make screws and schlep them 30 km to the nearest lag fest that pass for markets?  Again, no thanks.  Maybe, take what little wealth I've accumulated and piss it away on PvP.  That could be fun but, the current combat mechanic is pretty much at the level of being a graphical text adventure.  There is so so much that needs to be added content wise before worrying about forcing specialization. 

That may be the problem.  I'm here for entertainment.  I live in an actual society.  So factories have been crippled.  Well, ok it was interesting to expand my factory and be able to create new equipment to expand my capabilities in the game but, babysitting a factory was getting a bit stale and probably wouldn't have held my interest for too much longer.  So now that has been hobbled and I'm supposed do what instead of managing my factory?  Mine?  No thanks.  Make screws and schlep them 30 km to the nearest lag fest that pass for markets?  Again, no thanks.  Maybe, take what little wealth I've accumulated and piss it away on PvP.  That could be fun but, the current combat mechanic is pretty much at the level of being a graphical text adventure.  There is so so much that needs to be added content wise before worrying about forcing specialization. 

I take it you've been too busy updating your resume and Linkedin profile to get to the questions?  Probably a good idea.

I take it you've been too busy updating your resume and Linkedin profile to get to the questions?  Probably a good idea.

This update will only work if there is a full wipe or else big orgs just buy all recipes and dominate the game while the game gets even harder for small groups or solos who are struggling even now.

Hi NQ
 
Nobody can dispute making everything in megafactories was too easy, linear, and out of balance. But there are so many issues with your approach to fix it.
 
 
PROBLEM 1) You are putting yourselves in quite a position with treating the game as a beta and non-beta whenever it works. On one hand, with the promise of keeping our wealth into the release, we're expected to treat the game as it's an actual launch to compete with other players and organizations. But then there is no support, mechanics can change dramatically, etc. You're also putting at least a 6-months gap between those who could exploit the unbalanced mechanics early and accumulate wealth, and those who couldn't.
 
SOLUTION: I don't really have a solution to this. Perhaps the best way to operate right now is to announce a full wipe at the end of beta if you can financially handle it.
 
 
PROBLEM 2) This update leaked to lots of people for several weeks. The knowledge put those people further ahead.
 
SOLUTION: Either enforce your NDA, or do not disclose (economically sensitive) details of how you'll change things.
 
 
PROBLEM 3)  Completely unhelpful talents just to unlock elements are a bad idea. Eve Online learned this lesson over the years and they are doing away with artificial prerequisites to start playing the game. Industry is one of the rare domains where talents actually GREATLY matter. Most production will eventually become unviable overtime without respective talents. It's bad analysis if you thought the lack of talents was an issue.
 
SOLUTION: If you want to wall element usage behind talents, you should do so behind the existing talents. This way at least people get a benefit alongside element access. A sense of actual progression and no waste of days of training.
 
 
PROBLEM 4) I am quite worried whether the game actually has enough quanta supply recipes for sufficient production.
 
SOLUTION: The game needs isk faucets besides the honeycomb NPC order businesses. I have low-cost proposals for that in the idea box.
 
 
PROBLEM 5) Machine-based recipes create lots of issues. It'll be quite tedious to teach the recipes to every single element and to keep tabs on them even in non-megafactories. Moreover, how will our investments be saved? I hope (but am not certain) the recipes will be saved under "dynamic properties" of a machine. But then we won't be able to deploy the same factory from a blueprint. It'll be impossible to move factories. So you're not only investing in the machine, but also in the location of the factory. That'll have even greater repercussions with territory warfare. 
 
SOLUTION: You should have at least made the recipes character-based. Given that you don't tolerate account sharing and ban those who do, this would still achieve specialization, yet make it way less tedious.
 
 
PROBLEM 6) Cost is an artificial and unsustainable way to motivate people to specialize. Once people accumulate enough capital, megafactories will begin popping again. Then those who can afford them will be miles ahead of others.
 
SOLUTION: To achieve truly sustainable differentiation and specialization, there needs to be differentiation in the ways the source materials are acquired. Ore is equally available to every individual. It should take organizational level effort to access some building materials; it should take outside-the-box intelligently developed systems to access others. Moreover, it should make more sense to make one product somewhere and to make another elsewhere (geographically). 

So, I quite like this change, but it's absolutely not something that can be injected into the game in the state it is.

There is little enough for players to do in the game at the moment. This will make building constructs significantly harder for people, taking that activity out of reach of many. That leaves us mining, and flying around in space shooting at other ships. With little to no reason to engage in the latter.

If this is something that's going to work, it needs the whole game to be on board.
 
Atmospheric combat, not just space Incentive to engage in combat (strategic benefit to holding certain areas such as fighting over resources) Resource sinks such as power to make sure that, once up and running, there's an ongoing cost to running a factory other than feeding it mats. And most crucially...
A full, comprehensive wipe. Skills, mats, resources, reset the planets, delete all constructs, start all players back at the arkship.
 
Potentially allow people to keep blueprints so that all the design time that's gone into those isn't lost, but that's it.

The biggest problem I see is that Industry was the _only_ thing _anyone_ could enjoy and get into. 
Building is not for everyone, beyond basic stuff.
 
Now.. there is only mining and/or doing someone else's bidding as the big orgs will start dictating what does or does not go in the game and it will be virtually impossible to get to their level unless... you join up in massive orgs..
 
This pretty much ends the prospect of being a solo player or even a small group unless you are willing to pay through the nose for everything with quanta you can only get by mining. 
 

I used to play elite a lot but the grind for everything got too much. It got to a point where I wasn't having fun I was just grinding just to grind because of the way the mechanics are set up. I bring this up because I fear DU is going the route of tedium.
 
I understand trying to balance things and I will still test this patch and future patches however I do not think the current direction is where the majority of the player base wants it to go. I have ten percent of my organization left playing. Out of that 10 percent left 90 percent are in complete disagreement with this upcoming patch. Patches should be something to be excited about and add content not more tedium, more grinding, and a throttle to fun gameplay. If you wanted to limit creativity to make this game only operable by hard core big groups than I guess that is where this is leading in my mind.
 
I was trying to stay optimistic and was hoping and still am that NQ has some card rolled up their sleeve and have some content to go along with this throttling of fun update but that optimism is starting to look like foolishness. 

THIS .. many, many times

This game will be full of 'emergent gameplay' as long as you play it the way they intend. If players persist in pursuing their 'emergent gameplay' then NQ will 'improve' the game forcing players toward the gameplay that they intend.

This is probably one of the worst systems I've ever seen implemented into a game.. Was is designed by a child?

WHY THE HELL are you making Bots the cornerstone of civilization again.. IT GOES AGAINST EVERYTHING you said about a player driven universe.

How about making the schematics researchable with skills then let players sell schematic loaded factories to other players....

NO MORE BOTS, Please... They ruin everything.

If industry specialization is the end goal, then reset our skills and allow us to respec based on this new rule set.  Time is the most valuable commodity in character development.  I made decisions on which way to specialize my skills based on the rules of the game at the time.  Those rules are changing dramatically and will create an industry system that I no longer want to be a part of.  Therefore, millions of skill points are now lost and effectively will set me back considerably.

NQ, you must deliver more content or your dwindling player base will continue to fall.  I play in an org with a good group of players.  It is that group, not your game, that keeps me logging in.  There are only a few things to do and you just hamstrung one of them with debilitating limitations.  Now, more than ever, you will be forcing people to mine more.  I mine A LOT.  It is not fun.  It is necessary.  
 
The intent of this change may be justified but not without something else to balance it.  All I've been hearing is how to slow down the pace of the game.  Make the game harder.  We never intended on players progressing this fast.  For anyone reading in between the lines, what this means is "We don't have the content to support this game; therefore, we must make existing content harder to consume."
 
This software will soon need to be reclassified as a simulation rather than a game.  Please remember that reality doesn't make a good game.  People take breaks from real life to play games, not to subject themselves to a grind. 
 

Soo, I need significant capital to buy these 'recipes'.  Ok, how does a new player get quanta ah yes they mine and mine and mine some more.  Well, that's not exactly engaging game play is it?  I guess it could be worse.  NQ could do something monumentally stupid like nerf mining.  Imagine if someone at NQ was off their fckng rocker enough to propose something to make mining even more tedious like perhaps slaughtering the linked container range?  Only a complete imbecile would contemplate that..... right??

Soo, I need significant capital to buy these 'recipes'.  Ok, how does a new player get quanta ah yes they mine and mine and mine some more.  Well, that's not exactly engaging game play is it?  I guess it could be worse.  NQ could do something monumentally stupid like nerf mining.  Imagine if someone at NQ was off their fckng rocker enough to propose something to make mining even more tedious like perhaps slaughtering the linked container range?  Only a complete imbecile would contemplate that..... right??