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Death of ore market?


Pleione
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Just checked (Nov. 25th, 2022 noon CST) the ore markets.  Average High sell price is now:

 

Bauxite - 3.38

Hematite - 4.25

Quartz - 2.04

Coal - 7.15

 

Somewhere around 7 is a line whereby a tile won't pay for itself without including calibration bonus ore, talents, and/or adjacency bonuses.

 

(Math:  400l/hr * 24 * 7 = 67,200l/week.  500,000/67,200 = 7.4)

 

Yeah, I know that calibration bonuses, talents, and adjacency bonuses all count, but one needs some profit to pay for schematics or buy parts with.

 

So basically no value in selling ore right now, unless you play games with the TU system, putting one down per planet, mining for the 3 free days, calibrating daily, then picking it up after a week and repeating.  Pretty sure that was not the plan.

 

This of course presumes one is interested in making more than their Haven /Sanctuary tile produces, and not interested in becoming a bulk space trader flying through PVP space to reach higher markets (which are falling as well - that is just a shrinking market margin game that won't last).

 

NQ?  Is this what you intended?

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Check Average Highest via "J":

  

     J -> search for Quartz -> Create a sell order:

 

image.png.63287559d6799c1605a0a71c98173aa4.png

 

Of course, prices will vary some, but have been trending down heavily over the last couple of days.

 

Repeat for any other your interested in.

 

Obviously its a glass-half-full thing - do you base it on what purchase contracts are for, or what 1 person might have 1 unit listed at? (Lowest selling price)

 

I opt to use Average Highest, as stated in the original post.

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3 hours ago, kulkija said:

Where did you get these numbers.

Just now sell prices are higher

Sell prices are always higher than buy prices. It's the price of hope. Sell prices can be thoroughly notional, as well, since those are the prices that haven't been successfully sold. They could be very far divorced from the prices people are actually paying.

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Even most of the sell prices are Sub 10h/l and dropping. Like I said I think we will see 5h/l or less very soon. Cause why would I buy what I can get for free from MU's, especially if I have billions of quanta to pay the taxes for literal real life years due to alt mission running.

Edited by Rokkur
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16 hours ago, Pleione said:

JBauxite - 3.38

Hematite - 4.25

Quartz - 2.04

Coal - 7.15

Those numbers are extremely misleading! Just logged in and T1 is 6-8q/L. Because you look for where the most sales happen, M6.

Coal was 15q/L for days. The weekend (that includes Friday) is the worst time to sell ore (and the best time to buy it)!

 

I've already started to pull down my automining operation. I have a LOT of T1 ore in reserve (haven't sold to the market since early launch), just have been building stuff with it and selling some industry elements to the market. More people will step out of automining with the realization that it's just not worth the hassle at the moment at Alioth...

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frankly these prices are more logical then the npc prices. The problem here might not be the prices but the idiotic quanta sink, but im already arguing that for months and most shout, nothing wrong, its needed.

DU does not need time or quanta sinks, everything already takes long enough

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2 hours ago, Cergorach said:

Those numbers are extremely misleading! Just logged in and T1 is 6-8q/L. Because you look for where the most sales happen, M6.

Coal was 15q/L for days. The weekend (that includes Friday) is the worst time to sell ore (and the best time to buy it)!

 

I've already started to pull down my automining operation. I have a LOT of T1 ore in reserve (haven't sold to the market since early launch), just have been building stuff with it and selling some industry elements to the market. More people will step out of automining with the realization that it's just not worth the hassle at the moment at Alioth...

Yes, when quoting prices for ore one needs to do it for a market where there a lot of buy and sell orders.  That's D6 or possibly Aegis for some of them.  You can't expect to sell your ore on whatever market is next to you any more because the bots are gone, you have to either move it or list it and wait for it to get picked up, which may take some time.

There is definitely a lot of ore for sale now though.  If people are using automining to build perhaps you can tax the tile for 1 cycle, automine, then leave them untaxed for a cycle or two so you only get enough to use for manufacturing.

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22 minutes ago, Delove said:

How are new player supposed to even get started with those ore prices good luck to anyone new trying to get a ship to be able to afford any items to get started

 

I do not see problem in that. Element prices follow ore prices.

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37 minutes ago, kulkija said:

 

I do not see problem in that. Element prices follow ore prices.

The starter ship prices in the UEF store don't, though, because the player driven market is only part of the markets in DU and NQ likes to create bits and pieces outside of it to replace player driven content.  As the ore prices go down the ships in the UEF store, which are meant to be starter ships, effectively get harder to obtain for a new player.

 

New players can make money from the daily challenges, though, which are also not connected to the player driven economy and are therefore worth more and more as the ore price drops.

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16 minutes ago, Zeddrick said:

The starter ship prices in the UEF store don't, though, because the player driven market is only part of the markets in DU and NQ likes to create bits and pieces outside of it to replace player driven content.  As the ore prices go down the ships in the UEF store, which are meant to be starter ships, effectively get harder to obtain for a new player.

 

New players can make money from the daily challenges, though, which are also not connected to the player driven economy and are therefore worth more and more as the ore price drops.

Yes.

Problem with UEF store is that it is also Bot. It should not compete with player made ships, so in this case it is now, with lower ore prices, easier to compete with UEF starter ships. However UEF store is problematic because as you said it should offer affordable starter ships, but while doing that it competes with player made ships.

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NQ is kinda like the government stepping in and saying... hey you guys are saving too much money in your bank accounts! We need to fix this for you! Keep you grinding for that quanta!!! grind grind now! no saving money!

Edited by Rokkur
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45 minutes ago, kulkija said:

This was about ore markets, rigth?

It was, but then someone brought up the other factors that need considering. Who was it now? Oh, there we are:

1 hour ago, kulkija said:

 

I do not see problem in that. Element prices follow ore prices.

Which is simply untrue. Element prices have to include the schematic cost which certainly does not decrease as the income a beginner gets from their ore production plummets through the floor.

 

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4 minutes ago, Kezzle said:

It was, but then someone brought up the other factors that need considering. Who was it now? Oh, there we are:

Which is simply untrue. Element prices have to include the schematic cost which certainly does not decrease as the income a beginner gets from their ore production plummets through the floor.

 


Makes the schematics fees even more painful, but I figure this is what NQ wants innit?

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22 minutes ago, Rokkur said:

NQ is kinda like the government stepping in and saying... hey you guys are saving too much money in your bank accounts! We need to fix this for you! Keep you grinding for that quanta!!! grind grind now! no saving money!

 

Fantasy reflects reality:

 

Consumer patriotism is the American way

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1 hour ago, Pleione said:

 

Fantasy reflects reality:

 

Consumer patriotism is the American way


Borders on the political so I won't get deeper... I will say... things are pretty messed up RL, which is probably why we get so triggered about the economy in a game. we don't want real life problems being present during our free time.

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4 minutes ago, Rokkur said:


Borders on the political so I won't get deeper... I will say... things are pretty messed up RL, which is probably why we get so triggered about the economy in a game. we don't want real life problems being present during our free time.

 

Exactly.  Something like 60% of USA citizens have less than $5000 in the bank - basically living paycheck-to-paycheck.  Why do I want a game economy that reflects that - which is where supply and demand always takes us.  By selling in my local market I provide a job for somebody else, with a big hauler and appropriate talents, to make a few coins shuffling things between markets.  I'm not going to feel bad about that.

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6 minutes ago, Aaron Cain said:

So stop doing missions

 

I, for one, have not sunk that low yet.  Alas, members of my team have - flying 5 accounts at once and using Arch-HUD to make the hops a matter of just doing Alt-4-4 once the endpoints are known.

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Speaking of death of ore market, has anyone had issues trying to sell ore?

 

\I often have a situation where even though I have 10k of Txxx ore in my ACTIVE container I am unable to create a sell order. The "amount" shows zero.

 

This game has sapped my confidence. I no longer know whether NQ are being NQ or I'm having a stroke and am doing something wrong.

 

This game is like the C++ version of Gaslighting.

 

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