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I need to vent about DU.. Readers Beware!


Mordiaky
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Hello all, I purchased DU when they first announce. I played for a bit and then I felt my first go was just basic learning and mistakes where made.. great, time for me to start over and do things right the second time... and then my first gripe was found... I have only one single character, I can not delete it or reset it.. I am stuck with this guy and the mistakes I made.. that alone made me want to quit so I did for a bit...

 

After some time, maybe a year I came back and said, fine I will deal with it and just try to recover and go from there.. and when I log in... what is this I see in the starting city? POP UPS.. All over, advertisings, player built structures... recruiters, people selling their ships like I just walked into a car dealership... I swear; I felt like I was running windows 98 with a bad virus and malware. I was VERY overwhelmed by all of this. 

 

Why in GODS name would you allow players to build in the starting cities? I imagined if I wanted to go to their shop I would explore Their city.. go to their plot, see their venders etc..... but nope. no need for that. they brought it to me in my face with HUGE monitors, flashing screens, arrows pointing me left, right up and down! 

 

oh and do not get me started on all these abandoned constructs all over the place. I know people been complaining about this alone... 

 

well. I am quitting again for the second time, and YES I will leave m y construct on that starting city with all the others as that is the thing to do. But I am sure some people will build around that to recruit more members with their flashy signs and the next ship dealership will move in next to it... its chaos and very dirty feeling. I have to go, this game is NOT what I was expecting and hoping for..

 

that is my rant and if you made it this far. thank you for allowing me to vent.. I was wanting a better game and that is why I am angry.

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1 hour ago, Mordiaky said:

 

 

well. I am quitting again for the second time, and YES I will leave m y construct on that starting city with all the others as that is the thing to do. But I am sure some people will build around that to recruit more members with their flashy signs and the next ship dealership will move in next to it... its chaos and very dirty feeling. I have to go, this game is NOT what I was expecting and hoping for..

 

that is my rant and if you made it this far. thank you for allowing me to vent.. I was wanting a better game and that is why I am angry.

 

So you plan to add to the thing you hate..... which is probably how most of that crap got there in the first place.  Making it worse in an effort to make it better.... do you work for the Government?  

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The best part is if you run out of places close to the market you can drop your ads from above on top of other constructs. The poor ones below will have to maneuver tool their crap out to fly.

And it is always a good idea to add some scrap shop with x3 price for scrap. People collide a lot with your tall ads(due to their FPS getting to single digits while landing at marketplace) and their ship is kinda stuck high so they have to use your scrap to repair it - free money.

And don't worry about people doing anything to your ads, it's a safezone they can't do anything and if they find a way they will probably get a ban.

 

Building shops on your own title ? WTF are you talking about, there is less customer exposure there. Why would I hurt my space-business ?

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You know the difference between a marketplace and a market? Marketplaces is on the districts, while markets are not. People want to be there and nowhere else because the conveniences are right there such as the VR machines, the ship shop, trading machine with bots and storage, the district teleporters, the shuttle, and accessibility to the default respawn point! Why would you leave this place and lose these conveniences? That's why everyone is there and this is where they advertise as well! It is the CBD area! (commercial business district)

People will migrate here because business is the most convenient here! Metro Manila is the most densely populated city in the world and that "tip" (which is surrounded by a bay on the west and a lake on the east) is smaller than Bangkok. They can't expand because there is no more space and the only way for them to do so is reclamation projects in the bay. It is too congested because people are continuing to migrate in, and you can't blame them because other parts of the country have poor infrastructure. Do you know that Metro Manila is 30% of the country's GDP and it's surrounding regions in the north and south (Greater Manila) are another 25% of the GDP, and if you add these up, that's more than half of the country's total production? Only Manila has public train systems (and this is being expanded to Greater Manila), do you know that? The opportunity is all there! So how do you decongest and make the national growth inclusive? By creating opportunities elsewhere! The same as DU: how do we do that? How do we make a good player-driven and player-established CBD outside these districts with competitive conveniences?  If the CBD is not competitive, nobody will do business there! 

 

We can't decongest because nobody can compete with these districts and there is no mechanics in this game that can provide you that!

 

Here is a failed attempt:

 

Nobody is leaving the districts unless we can have better CBDs or something in par with those!

 

Starbase is gonna come out and it's gonna have the same sh*t! The undisputed CBD is the game's starting zone and people will live as close to it as possible, just like in DU.

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8 hours ago, GraXXoR said:


NQ have had more than enough time to address the marketplace problems but they just don't seem to want to fix them... These markets are literally the first post-tutorial part of the game world new players see... and it's really not a good look.
Yet for some reason NQ seem to be more interested in changing the colour of engine parts and making the multitool glow. Priorities are a complete mess, IMHO.

Having multitool glow can be used in video ads.

Different color engines gives the reason to say "We added new engines"

Market look post tutorial - doesn't matter, you already paid for 3 months.

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I think that rant doesn't make sense. Why would the "mistakes" he made be still relevant after he quit for more than a year? If he starts again everything his character already has is a plus, compared to a fresh character, even if he invested in talents he won't regularly use. But I guess it is a question of how u look at stuff and the post seems to be more for the sake of ranting and venting anger. Even more senseless when he anyhow quits right away again. To me it feels like he just wants to bring in his negative energy, trying destroy the game he dislikes. ....and maybe fishing for approval

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5 hours ago, Eternal said:

You know the difference between a marketplace and a market? Marketplaces is on the districts, while markets are not. People want to be there and nowhere else because the conveniences are right there such as the VR machines, the ship shop, trading machine with bots and storage, the district teleporters, the shuttle, and accessibility to the default respawn point! Why would you leave this place and lose these conveniences? That's why everyone is there and this is where they advertise as well! It is the CBD area! (commercial business district)

People will migrate here because business is the most convenient here! Metro Manila is the most densely populated city in the world and that "tip" (which is surrounded by a bay on the west and a lake on the east) is smaller than Bangkok. They can't expand because there is no more space and the only way for them to do so is reclamation projects in the bay. It is too congested because people are continuing to migrate in, and you can't blame them because other parts of the country have poor infrastructure. Do you know that Metro Manila is 30% of the country's GDP and it's surrounding regions in the north and south (Greater Manila) are another 25% of the GDP, and if you add these up, that's more than half of the country's total production? Only Manila has public train systems (and this is being expanded to Greater Manila), do you know that? The opportunity is all there! So how do you decongest and make the national growth inclusive? By creating opportunities elsewhere! The same as DU: how do we do that? How do we make a good player-driven and player-established CBD outside these districts with competitive conveniences?  If the CBD is not competitive, nobody will do business there! 

 

We can't decongest because nobody can compete with these districts and there is no mechanics in this game that can provide you that!

 

Here is a failed attempt:

 

Nobody is leaving the districts unless we can have better CBDs or something in par with those!

 

Starbase is gonna come out and it's gonna have the same sh*t! The undisputed CBD is the game's starting zone and people will live as close to it as possible, just like in DU.

Right on. Manila is definitely the place to be.

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In this game, we don't have a single CBD that is not owned by Aphelia because we just couldn't compete in terms of conveniences. 

 

14 hours ago, DrDerp said:

Right on. Manila is definitely the place to be.

 

If the government just invested quality public works on other regions that have potential for growth--and they can do this with the national budget as it is a unitary country (not a federal one)--, then the economy wouldn't be concentrated exclusively in Greater Manila (Metro Manila, Central Luzon, CALABARZON) which is by the way more than half of the country's total production. This is in contrasts to California that has 40 million people (15% of the total population of US) which is the largest state economy with an output of 15% of the total GDP. When the quality public works are there, then the private sector will invests in developing the community and participate in PPP (public-private partnership) infrastructure projects. For example, building a light-rail system (LRT): that can be funded with private money because it can be monetized and it's profitable to the investors. Technically the private sector cannot own public infrastructure such as a train system because that is a monopoly (a monopoly creates incompetence). So they will fund the infrastructure project, the government will give them the operating contract for a term (this is part of the PPP deal), they will profit from the operation of this public infrastructure (enough for them to make a profit from all their investments), and once that term expires, they lose their rights to ownership and operation and there will be a bidding on who will be the next to operate it. The private sector funded the construction of the infrastructure, they are the owner until their term expires and the ownership is turned over to the government. That is how it works! You gonna make the city competitive in terms of conveniences to attract investments! If another city is more competitive, that city will bag those investments! You can't grow if you can't attract investments! (the money the city has are those investments)

 

You cannot compete with the conveniences of the districts! That is why we don't have any city in this game that is viable for activity! We do all our commerce in those districts! Everyone is gonna be there unless some city can compete!

 

If you want new cities to emerge, you gonna fix this problem! 

 

And it is possible to have a city in this game that has no central government. All you need is a cluster of tiles owned by different people and you got a community that has no politics. It's an area of commerce where everyone has a storefront, and as they make more money, they grow their business until they become a tycoon that can fund privately-owned mega projects such as big malls. To get an economy like this going, there's gonna be consumption.

 

This is what you call an entrepreneur society with entrepreneur culture! This is my dream for the game!

 

I don't wanna see slavery and all these bull sh*t inequity! How do you become a successful entrepreneur if you are gonna join an org like New Genesis and work for them for free? How do you become a successful entrepreneur if your goal is for the good of the org and it's leaders? The problem here is the culture! My dream is everyone is an entrepreneur themselves! There are 2 types of entrepreneurs: the ones making money and the ones losing money. It's a game!

 

But because this game is group-oriented, you can't compare this game to games like Ragnarok Online where people make a merchant alt to vend their items that they farmed, crafted, and/or bought, in busy cities like Prontera, Morroc, Payon, etc. making everyone entrepreneurs (and the economy in those games work because the consumption are there). This game sucks! It is dictatorship! How do you become an entrepreneur on North Korea?

 

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This game is a replication of Eve! Wow did we just copied everything! Eve sucks man! That game is a spaceship game that has no content! The traditional MMOs that I played all have content and a working economy!

 

Stop copying Eve and look at other successful and better examples! It's better, so why can't we implement that? Because it's not Eve! It's still better and more immersive! My rant here is you are dragging this game to the ground replicating that Eve! It's not even a good MMORPG! What it is is an MMO simulator! That's what it is! No wonder you got no RPG element! How do you support an economy without RPG? You support it with the PVP! So what it is is a dictatorship game! And then you got people practicing politics when I'm trying to improve my character and asset! What the f*ck is wrong with you people? The game has no order! How do I protect my equity on a game that has no order and has culture of disorder? I need an environment to grow, not fight the Vietnam War with you warmongering people! 

 

You got 2 choices to make the economy work:

Develop the RPG in this game so the consumption will come from there (making it a character-centric game),

or

Develop the PVP and make it technically work so this game will become Rust and Eve (group-oriented games).

 

What do you want: a character-centric game or a group-oriented game? Me, I prefer the former!

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I think a mixture would be great. Also I think if u want cities, they will have to be group projects. I agree though, it seems hard to get these kind of things running in the current system. I hope/think player owned markets will solve that. On the other hand don't forget a player build city can have the same effects as the aphelia owned "Manila". But I agree consumption should be a thing otherwise the game feels like an editor.

P.s. I sense a contradiction in your wish to become a tycoon. The way u describe it, it sounds your tycoon will be sth. Very alike to an org. the difference might be one is established by choice the other by qantas. So I d say both are valid approaches and should be possible in the game. It think it is more like personal gusto how you approach your goals.

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23 hours ago, Eternal said:

You know the difference between a marketplace and a market? Marketplaces is on the districts, while markets are not. People want to be there and nowhere else because the conveniences are right there such as the VR machines, the ship shop, trading machine with bots and storage, the district teleporters, the shuttle, and accessibility to the default respawn point! 

 

When was the last time you played the game?  NQ separated the market terminals (trading machines) from the rest of services some times ago.  The teleporters, shuttles, default respawns etc are now a couple of km away, and pretty empty.   For someone who has such a strong opinion about the game, I am surprised you made such a fundamental mistake?

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On 7/20/2021 at 5:22 AM, Eternal said:

This game is a replication of Eve! Wow did we just copied everything! Eve sucks man!

 

Talking about economy and saying that a game with the most sophisticated and realistic economy sucks. Yea, NQ should really listen to you. The dumpster will burn faster and my friends that still stuck there will be free.

 

P.S:

Saying that DU economy is replication of EvE is like saying that my 5 y/o son replicated Mona Lisa but for some reason it doesn't sell for millions...

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Bro, in real-life, we have needs such as housing, transportation, energy, food, water, clothing, sanitation, health, and many more. These are necessities and this is what motivated us to continue to contribute to the development and advancement of our society. You wouldn't work if you have no necessities! So these are the demands that production has to meet! Now it just takes common-sense to figure out that if you throw us into a completely player-driven open-world with no set objective (other than to set our own, which there is none), there is no motivation for activity other than to just have fun building in this game that really has no purpose. If the PVP (a PVP with no progression mechanics) is that motivation for activity, this is a dictatorship game! It's just a number's game! If there is no character progression for the PVP, then the point of the game is to dominate the game with your group. I observed this in other similar MMOs: if you can't beat them, you join them. This is not a game for character development because it's very hard in this game to assert your personal interest. This is a group-based game as the point of the game is the PVP with no character progression. It is a number's game!

 

If you are used to this kind of gameplay, I'm not, and many are not, and that is why this game is failing to attract long-term dedicated players! Explain to me how the economy of Eve works because I just couldn't fathom how it works! What is driving the economy in Eve that defines the gameplay of that game? This better not be a group-based game! I'm not used to--and many are not used to--that kind of gameplay! 

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On 7/19/2021 at 6:56 AM, DrDerp said:

I think that rant doesn't make sense. Why would the "mistakes" he made be still relevant after he quit for more than a year? If he starts again everything his character already has is a plus, compared to a fresh character, even if he invested in talents he won't regularly use. But I guess it is a question of how u look at stuff and the post seems to be more for the sake of ranting and venting anger. Even more senseless when he anyhow quits right away again. To me it feels like he just wants to bring in his negative energy, trying destroy the game he dislikes. ....and maybe fishing for approval

Ya it doesnt make sense especially considering the talent reset was within that year so it's basically a new char.

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player markets will be a hard thing to do.

 

If you just let player make Markets like the NPC ones, all of a sudden your market search will have hundreds of different markets on Alioth. How will any of them be able to get on top; if they don't then we will keep going to market 6.

 

NQ are going to have to look very long and hard to workout how to make markets.

 

As for orgs, vs free enterprise; that depends on what players want. Not every player wants to mine, set up a factory, and sell their goods until they have a mega factory and a mega shop. Some just want to set up their factory, some want to play the stock/market game. Some like mining, others want to PvP. The good orgs are there to try and help along the way to get there.

 

People group together in Orgs as we work more efficiently in groups than induvial.

 

Real life, I work, so I can buy food, I don't grow food, I don't make my own game.

Game life, I like factories and running missions. I can't design a ship to save myself but the org helped me with one of their designers. I hate going and trading on the market; so I work out what our guild needs and sell to them.

 

If your Org just makes you a mine slave, maybe its not Orgs are evil, maybe you just in the wrong one.?

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On 7/22/2021 at 2:05 PM, CoyoteNZ said:

 

 

If you just let player make Markets like the NPC ones, all of a sudden your market search will have hundreds of different markets on Alioth. How will any of them be able to get on top; if they don't then we will keep going to market 6.wrong one.?

Erm price and location, like any business ever........

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