le_souriceau

Reason I think quite simple and nothing to do with "complex technology" or "studio size".
 
JC lied for years about actual state of game, both from technical and disign standpoint (something that become painfully obviously from latest post-JC blogs). Generaly he gone into Beta with completly (saying in card game terminology) empty hands, bullshiting us about "no red flags". I kinda repeat myself on this, but can't stess enough how its answers most of problems around.
 
In this situation, its obvious that they just can't do "honest" weekly updates without compeltly unmasking what kind of mess going on inside, with years long tech debt and no clear understanding of road ahaed. Actualy I think most of time they work not with things we expect (like actual new features), but trying to fix falling apart backend or something. So this why we can only have very rare and rather small updates about stuff they kinda less fearful to actually show. Its like you mucked up exam preparation and desperatly want to talk only about bits you somewhat know.

I, among others, have called for this several times. I have always drawn a comparison here with the Starbase progress notes, which have appeared every Monday since September 2019. Here is the link: https://forum.starbasegame.com/forums/progress-reports.38/

Either they can' t, or they don' t want to. 
 
But don't give me "we're a small studio" as an excuse;
- Factorio has given a brief glimpse of what is being worked on every Friday over its 5 years of development (The studio was only about 12 people at the time).
Have a look: https://www.factorio.com/blog/
- Space Engineers gave updates on its development every Thursday. (Well the bugfixes fixed something and broke something, but updates were welcome.)
Have a look here too: https://blog.marekrosa.org/
 
I'm pretty sure there were more studios than the 3 that did something like that. I list them here because I have played / tested all 3 games.
 
 

At some point in a relationship you sometimes have to recognize when it is becoming toxic due to the inactivity or inability to communicate from one or both parties.  Once you are sure that a relationship has passed a certain point then usually there is only one outcome that is logical, and a lot of people here have already passed that threshold weeks ago.  More are getting to that point.  Daily it seems. 
 
It hurts the most when you know the relationship could be salvaged or at least extended just a bit with better communication or a tiny bit of effort.  Then your heart breaks when you never hear a word or see any of that effort put in and you may never know the whole story of why.  

Sounds pretty much like every classical French love story :()
 

Problem is, Minecraft, realisticly, has much more content and variety of gamestyles, then DU. Calling DU "Space Minecraft" is veeery huge compliment currently, even unjust thing to do. 
 

Yes, its useless.
 
In short, it was made for different game disign concept, but before "Beta" release NQ completly lost any idea what they doing/want to do/suffered from knee jerk "change of plans", so Sanct ended up as cringe leftover. 
 
 

And whenever you get a response, it is one of these five. Maybe time to start a bingo.

We can not just snap a finger and the bug is fixed (within 8 months).
It does not make sense to fix a system that has an overhaul upcoming (for the last 8 months)
We cannot comment on it or the community will expect that feature and be angry when we don’t implement it (even if the community just asks how something is currently intended)
We read everything on the forums, but it would take too long to respond. Trust us, we hear you(we just don’t act like we do).
We already have a plan (but dont tell you because reasons and just implement it first and check your response later).

It seems the CM have very very strict guidelines regarding what they are allowed to say, stricter than I have seen for other games.

Its one of my greatest and longterm points of... can't find good word in english, let's say, severe disappointment over NQ. Posting of ideas on forum as common pleb is 99.999% just waste of time (Idea box section with thousands of posts is total mockery in context). Promised during KS "work with communinity" not happened.
 
So far only real interaction possible with NQ:
 
1) Mass rioting. Idea here not to influence NQ high-level congnitive mechanisms, but just make them so uncomfortable, that they can't just wait out (like they GLADLY do with minor shit). Usualy its end up with shitty solutions, but at least something. Reaction on irritation.
 
2) Having accesss to "kings ear", well, at least to someone of some importance in NQ. If you worked your way there, being succusseful simp or just nice useful and diplomatic (like zipped you mouth to tell only good things) guy, you can start your influence game, lobbying your shit to extent that is possible inside NQ usual disfunctionality (so absolutly no results garanteed).
 
 
 
 
 

So why do they then keep doing the same type of mistakes? Learning from past mistakes and improving is a fundamental skill that any dev team should be very aware off.
 
Here is the typical pattern on how NQ 'interacts' with the community.
 
---
NQ: We are going to do A.
 
Community: That will cause problems with B, and C and D,
 
NQ: No response..
 
Community: Lots of speculations and frustration because there is no response.
 
NQ: Releases original feature patch with no regard to community feedback
 
Community: Generates lots of feedback, mostly about the predicted problems that are now turned into reality
 
NQ: Silence...
 
Community: Problems are now so bad that people are starting to riot.
 
NQ: "Don't worry guys, we know there is a problem and we are looking into this."
 
NQ: Long silence, while community continues to riot and point out ways to avoid said problems
 
NQ: Release some quick and dirty patch that half solves the problem, and causes unplanned collateral damage
 
Community: Continues to point out problems with patch and quick-fix, and how they could have been avoided
 
NQ: Very long silence before announcing next feature, and everything starts over again..
---
 
So if people are wondering about the current state of the game and the bad mood in forums, it is because this release cycle accumulates lots of bugs and fundamental game issues over time and at the same time manages to alienate the community.

... other than just to give players an outlet for their frustration?
 
does NQ ever read it? I gave it a cursory look through for the first time ever just now but failed to see any indication of NQ presence in that thread. 
 
what is the point on an ideas thread that nobody reads?
 
If you go to the FDEV forums (elite dangerous’ developers), any thread with “official” interaction -even a single post- has a little mark next to it.
 
im just wondering, is that forum taken seriously and has it a serious purpose or is it the place where good (and bad) ideas go to die and is just a filter to remove “blue skies” and “wishful thinking” posts from this thread?
 
 

Actually no, that was always a thing and hasn't started with beta. It's called a safezone where builders can do whatever they want in 100% safety. Nothing changed, was the plan from the beginning

@NQ, if you are wondering why there is so much negativity in the community this is pretty much it in a nutshell.
Having to watch your inability to execute even the simplest task in a meaningful way over and over again, is enough to make even the most dedicated player lose hope.

DU not only tech demo in many aspects, but as it was confirmend with latest blogs (AKA "we still not sure what we are doing"), JC also lied about actual state of game for years.
 
"No red flags about 21 release", do me a favour!
 
 
 
 

DU not only tech demo in many aspects, but as it was confirmend with latest blogs (AKA "we still not sure what we are doing"), JC also lied about actual state of game for years.
 
"No red flags about 21 release", do me a favour!
 
 
 
 

Here is my idea how it can be done realisticly with game mechanics sense:
 

 
Obviously closer part of belt to established SZ base will be most contested/dangerous, but more patient miners can approch from much less popular angles. So it will be balanced in that sense.
 
Weak part is time/maintenance dependant respawn, but if NQ able to do it wth more finesse automaticly (like respawn regions where not players present on live server) -- even better.
 
 
 
 
 

That's indeed a basic problem. There should be more restrictive rules for static and dynamic constructs (e.g. no floating voxels or elements or even complete static constructs, no flight elements completely covered with voxels but still being functional, no asymmetric lift or thrust without resulting torque and so on). Maybe it could even be possible to implement simple rules for structural analysis (as far as possible without decrerasing performance too much) making weak structures collapse or brake apart. That would open a market for those who are specialised in designing and optimising specific types of constructs.
 
However, implementing such rules would brake most existing constructs. That would be even worse than a full whipe and is therefore not going to happen in DU.

Exactly - not much use in any of this because nothing really has a purpose or value except "uhhhhh shiny!"

Don't want to sound salty/nothing personal (+ I kinda semi-retired for summer)...

But. Thats almost intolerable to read how misguided some of you, guys, are.
 
Whole idea of single-shard-player-driven-whatnot-game is literaly self defeated if you start to divide "pvp" and "pve" players for matters of "mental peace and conviniece", especialy -- economicly (something NQ methodicly doing for some time, and this is grave mistake). Because this degrades whole experience to pretty much isolated, instanced gameplay, where nothing beyond your own bubble affects you. Sure people can visit each other, show off their stuff, but thats it. You can do it in every not even true multiplayer, but just coop game.
 
Moment players get enviroment with no risk or barriers to get stuff, they naturaly disperse for solo/small group play. Orgs just can't offer real benefits beyond being some loose "interest clubs" and die as meningful entities. 
 
Ofcourse, SZ must exist on level of "building museum" or "reserve storage base", space to learn how to fly in safety, fool around, socialize. Yet ast same time SZ must allow only minimal economic activity (idealy -- nothing beyond some basics that important for true noobs).
 
New -- have your time.
Come just for building decorative stuff in peace -- welcome.
Want to be at least somewhat rich and impornant, produce stuff en-masse? Go and actualy risk your fat ass.
 
Currently this fundamental princple that makes keystone sense for true player driven sandbox is absolutly broken, to level of mockery. 

I agree -- its one of bigest weak spots of game. Building in DU is glorified (and 99% mechanicly useless) plastic molding.
 
This why dispite heavly-promoted minority enjoying it as wannabe 3d model editor, majority, who want something more then cosmetics (gameplay sense), voted with their feet like "nope". 

This comes back to (for me) one of the glaring issues with DU in general. 
 
Elements placed together does the same job as a beautifully voxel designed ship. The driving force to have a nice ship is purely personal preference. 
 
This goes the same for building bases and ports and cities. There needs to be functional uses tied with beautiful designs and I think building a system that pairs these two things together is a key piece in ANY successful voxel based multiplayer game. (personal opinion)

Don't want to sound salty/nothing personal (+ I kinda semi-retired for summer)...

But. Thats almost intolerable to read how misguided some of you, guys, are.
 
Whole idea of single-shard-player-driven-whatnot-game is literaly self defeated if you start to divide "pvp" and "pve" players for matters of "mental peace and conviniece", especialy -- economicly (something NQ methodicly doing for some time, and this is grave mistake). Because this degrades whole experience to pretty much isolated, instanced gameplay, where nothing beyond your own bubble affects you. Sure people can visit each other, show off their stuff, but thats it. You can do it in every not even true multiplayer, but just coop game.
 
Moment players get enviroment with no risk or barriers to get stuff, they naturaly disperse for solo/small group play. Orgs just can't offer real benefits beyond being some loose "interest clubs" and die as meningful entities. 
 
Ofcourse, SZ must exist on level of "building museum" or "reserve storage base", space to learn how to fly in safety, fool around, socialize. Yet ast same time SZ must allow only minimal economic activity (idealy -- nothing beyond some basics that important for true noobs).
 
New -- have your time.
Come just for building decorative stuff in peace -- welcome.
Want to be at least somewhat rich and impornant, produce stuff en-masse? Go and actualy risk your fat ass.
 
Currently this fundamental princple that makes keystone sense for true player driven sandbox is absolutly broken, to level of mockery. 

Don't want to sound salty/nothing personal (+ I kinda semi-retired for summer)...

But. Thats almost intolerable to read how misguided some of you, guys, are.
 
Whole idea of single-shard-player-driven-whatnot-game is literaly self defeated if you start to divide "pvp" and "pve" players for matters of "mental peace and conviniece", especialy -- economicly (something NQ methodicly doing for some time, and this is grave mistake). Because this degrades whole experience to pretty much isolated, instanced gameplay, where nothing beyond your own bubble affects you. Sure people can visit each other, show off their stuff, but thats it. You can do it in every not even true multiplayer, but just coop game.
 
Moment players get enviroment with no risk or barriers to get stuff, they naturaly disperse for solo/small group play. Orgs just can't offer real benefits beyond being some loose "interest clubs" and die as meningful entities. 
 
Ofcourse, SZ must exist on level of "building museum" or "reserve storage base", space to learn how to fly in safety, fool around, socialize. Yet ast same time SZ must allow only minimal economic activity (idealy -- nothing beyond some basics that important for true noobs).
 
New -- have your time.
Come just for building decorative stuff in peace -- welcome.
Want to be at least somewhat rich and impornant, produce stuff en-masse? Go and actualy risk your fat ass.
 
Currently this fundamental princple that makes keystone sense for true player driven sandbox is absolutly broken, to level of mockery. 

^ This. Its even very easy to trace with objective evidence of NQs (JCs) blablabla if you dig in old stuff.
 
Initialy DU was promised as very PvP-centered game (it was main/only reason why some people particiapated in KS). Then its U-turned to some lame Landmark-2 with elements of PvP (and even then most of them heavly downgraded in importance and postponed to somewhere in future).

^ This. Its even very easy to trace with objective evidence of NQs (JCs) blablabla if you dig in old stuff.
 
Initialy DU was promised as very PvP-centered game (it was main/only reason why some people particiapated in KS). Then its U-turned to some lame Landmark-2 with elements of PvP (and even then most of them heavly downgraded in importance and postponed to somewhere in future).

Because coming from years of MC, I can say, that builders stamina is relativly finite resource.
 
For sure, DU has very mature audience with hugely superior attention spans, then MC youngsters (on average), but even they have some soft-cap limits on how long they can be occupied with building. Obviously resting and revigoration occures, but general trajectory is to some sort of creative end, when you done all you wanted/tired doing it/catched "priority" interests somewhere else.
 
It was discusussed I think ad nauseam here, that while builders are very convinient part of community to use in pseudo-marketing NQ so adores, they not demographic who can really "carry" game financialy.