ATMLVE

For those that want a community wiki with a place to record history, locations, organizations, whatever....
 
I've just created this wiki: http://dualuniverse.wiki/index.php/Main_Page
 
If anyone wants to help set it up let me know, otherwise you just need to create an account to have permission to edit it.
 
It still needs a better logo and tons of pages need to be created, otherwise it should be functional and usable at this point.
 
If you don't want to use it that's fine, just please don't go out of your way to berate me for doing this for free. 

The wiki is not the place to go to for up to date information on the busiest trade hubs or best cities. If a new player really is struggling to find where all the activity is and they look at the wiki, and not anywhere else in the community, then they are a fool. A game wiki is not an intuitive location for current community status. 
 
The reason not to add a busy hub to the wiki is the same as I have been saying; the status of that hub can change at any time. It could become overrun by pirates or become a rival and a target. Wiki pages aren't meant to change every week depending on the current status of their topics, it is meant to be a permanent page and resource for information.
 
Yes, game mechanics change over time, but they are far, far less volatile than a trade hub in a single-shard game.
 
I'll lay out a set of guidelines for the wiki so that hopefully discussions like this won't need to happen again. Community content may be included on the wiki, but only in direct case-by-case bases if that material could be valuable. Several people have made good arguments relating to EVE, where community content was appropriate for the EVE wiki. Content pages for organizations that are currently active, especially in pre-alpha, have the potential for more harm than helpfulness, but in time as the game progresses it may be appropriate to create pages for specific community organizations or projects that have ended but had huge influence. 
 
Once again, my main goal is for no pages on the wiki to be 'influencable' by players. If current player actions can determine the content of the page, then it does not belong. 

There is not a difference between Gamepedia and the wiki right now. The official wiki, the one under discussion, IS the Gamepedia wiki. 
 
I did not refer to these theoretical players as idiots, I called them fools. An idiot is simply unintelligent, but a fool merely lacks wisdom/prudence. There's a difference. 
 
The reasoning is not a cop-out though, as I have no reason whatsoever to limit community content from the wiki other than what I've stated. I gain nothing from not having organizations on the wiki; there's no hidden agenda. What I do gain is the time it would take to update them based on their ever-changing status. There is the possibility of their rival attacking their page and then having to deal with the fallout, smaller organizations arguing about why they belong the wiki, the fact that adding community content dilutes the wiki so that it is more difficult to find official information, and the fact that any community content, once gone, becomes insignifacnt and therefore the page on the wiki becomes obsolete. Yes, then someone can remove it, and guess who has the authority to delete wiki pages? The administrator. Aside from that, that's just not what wikis are for, to create pages for relevant topics and delete them when they become obsolete. They are for documentation.
 
I have no hidden agenda. I have my opinions for the reasons stated above, and they are just that; opinions.  I have no hard feelings towards @RightBigToe or you @Hades, or anyone else that disagrees with my opinions. I want to be very clear and explain my position so that there is no animosity, and to ensure everyone that I am trying to be fair and reasonable in this situation. 

The wiki is not the place to go to for up to date information on the busiest trade hubs or best cities. If a new player really is struggling to find where all the activity is and they look at the wiki, and not anywhere else in the community, then they are a fool. A game wiki is not an intuitive location for current community status. 
 
The reason not to add a busy hub to the wiki is the same as I have been saying; the status of that hub can change at any time. It could become overrun by pirates or become a rival and a target. Wiki pages aren't meant to change every week depending on the current status of their topics, it is meant to be a permanent page and resource for information.
 
Yes, game mechanics change over time, but they are far, far less volatile than a trade hub in a single-shard game.
 
I'll lay out a set of guidelines for the wiki so that hopefully discussions like this won't need to happen again. Community content may be included on the wiki, but only in direct case-by-case bases if that material could be valuable. Several people have made good arguments relating to EVE, where community content was appropriate for the EVE wiki. Content pages for organizations that are currently active, especially in pre-alpha, have the potential for more harm than helpfulness, but in time as the game progresses it may be appropriate to create pages for specific community organizations or projects that have ended but had huge influence. 
 
Once again, my main goal is for no pages on the wiki to be 'influencable' by players. If current player actions can determine the content of the page, then it does not belong. 

The wiki is not the place to go to for up to date information on the busiest trade hubs or best cities. If a new player really is struggling to find where all the activity is and they look at the wiki, and not anywhere else in the community, then they are a fool. A game wiki is not an intuitive location for current community status. 
 
The reason not to add a busy hub to the wiki is the same as I have been saying; the status of that hub can change at any time. It could become overrun by pirates or become a rival and a target. Wiki pages aren't meant to change every week depending on the current status of their topics, it is meant to be a permanent page and resource for information.
 
Yes, game mechanics change over time, but they are far, far less volatile than a trade hub in a single-shard game.
 
I'll lay out a set of guidelines for the wiki so that hopefully discussions like this won't need to happen again. Community content may be included on the wiki, but only in direct case-by-case bases if that material could be valuable. Several people have made good arguments relating to EVE, where community content was appropriate for the EVE wiki. Content pages for organizations that are currently active, especially in pre-alpha, have the potential for more harm than helpfulness, but in time as the game progresses it may be appropriate to create pages for specific community organizations or projects that have ended but had huge influence. 
 
Once again, my main goal is for no pages on the wiki to be 'influencable' by players. If current player actions can determine the content of the page, then it does not belong. 

The wiki is not the place to go to for up to date information on the busiest trade hubs or best cities. If a new player really is struggling to find where all the activity is and they look at the wiki, and not anywhere else in the community, then they are a fool. A game wiki is not an intuitive location for current community status. 
 
The reason not to add a busy hub to the wiki is the same as I have been saying; the status of that hub can change at any time. It could become overrun by pirates or become a rival and a target. Wiki pages aren't meant to change every week depending on the current status of their topics, it is meant to be a permanent page and resource for information.
 
Yes, game mechanics change over time, but they are far, far less volatile than a trade hub in a single-shard game.
 
I'll lay out a set of guidelines for the wiki so that hopefully discussions like this won't need to happen again. Community content may be included on the wiki, but only in direct case-by-case bases if that material could be valuable. Several people have made good arguments relating to EVE, where community content was appropriate for the EVE wiki. Content pages for organizations that are currently active, especially in pre-alpha, have the potential for more harm than helpfulness, but in time as the game progresses it may be appropriate to create pages for specific community organizations or projects that have ended but had huge influence. 
 
Once again, my main goal is for no pages on the wiki to be 'influencable' by players. If current player actions can determine the content of the page, then it does not belong. 

Hi everyone,
 
Here is the official stance of Novaquark regarding the wiki made on Gamepedia. We launched the wiki on this platform with the goal in mind to let the Community fill/improve/complete it. we really thank  all those who have already participated in it. However, the wiki was never meant to reference player-created content (hence organization descriptions). It's made to describe official content, game mechanics and possible emergent gameplay.
 
Here are the reasons for our stance:
 
1) To keep some meaning for each website.
- The wiki is there for the gameplay and the game mechanics and the official content.
- The community portal is the place for all the community-created content (as it will evolve a lot with the arrival of a dedicated web developer joining the team soon).
 
2) If we start to include Organizations description, we will have to do it for every organization or none of them.
Referencing a few organizations will raise a ton of issues while referencing will gave the wiki contributors an unreasonable amount of work.
 
3) To keep a certain neutrality and peace on the wiki.
We aren't blind or naive. The moment some player-created content (especially organizations description or history) is included on the wiki, it will become a battlefield and we don't want that. The wiki is not made nor designed for that. Remember what happened recently on the Community Portal with a system not (yet) fully implemented to take into account attempts of sabotage.
 
So for all these reasons, we don't want to see Organization pages appearing on the Gamepedia wiki.
 
Other wiki mentioned in this topic are, in our opinion, not relevant examples:
- World of Warcraft is a theme park MMORPG where Guilds are not in direct competition (sure, there are Battlegrounds and Arenas for PVP, but there is no reason to reduce the visibility of any guild, while there can be in sandbox MMORPGs like EVE Online or Dual Universe).
- No Man’s Sky is not a MMORPG. Not even Multiplayer, so there are even less reasons for this case to go wrong.
 
Best Regards,
Nyzaltar.

Hello beautiful people I just published a new article on Outpost Zebra. This week I decided to demonstrate my work flow for concepting a space ship. 
 
I go over some useful tools and a few tips. And I hope it might be of use to someone. ?
 
From concept to final model, designing a space ship.

Hey guys, I'm a Gamepedia staff member and just wanted to throw some information in here. Player content does have a place on wikis, but it should be in a separate namespace and tagged as such, just so it's not confused as official game information. Here are some examples of how other wikis handle it:
Guilds on Wowpedia
Journals on No Man's Sky
Fan art on Ark
If you'd like to go this route, we can set up an "Organization" namespace, so pages will look like this "Organization:Terran Union". With that, you all will want to set up a template and some guidelines for people to follow as well. I'm happy to provide more examples or answer any questions.

I see a lot of people saying that Dual Universe is based around player made content, so it does belong on the wiki. I look at it from a different perspective; there is infinite potential for player made content. (Essentially) infinite constructs, organizations, players, etc. are all possible for the game, so what determines which get added to the wiki?
 
The wiki is for mechanics in my opinion. You report the physics, and materials, and report the reasons for forming an organization and benefits of living in a city area. You do not report specific constructs, are buildings, or organizations, but the mechanics they are based upon and that is it.
 
For an analogy to the real world: with Dual Universe, you would not make an article for New York City or London. You wouldn't make an article for Winston Churchill, or the Empire State Building or Big Ben or the companies that built them. What you WOULD do is make articles on good construction materials and physics, the skills that enhance activities such as construction or leadership, and the benefits for sticking together as players. The wiki would provide guides and tips on how to build and where to obtain materials and which materials are best for what. But again, the wiki would not report what was done with all of these resources, it would only report them and allow players to do as they see fit.

There's a lot of discussion here, I like it. Several people agree with me l, but are saying that some player made content belongs if it is influential. Thank you all that have shared your opinion. 
 
I will say I am even more "radical" than most that agree with me; I'm against all player made content entirely, if it can change. If it is an organization or city, it can change, so it doesn't belong. Sure game content can change too, but thats the point of a wiki, to update it as features change, not as cities and empires rise and fall. 
 
Activities themselves, like some EVE examples like ganking, would belong on the wiki because they a part of the game, but specific examples or organizations that take part in those activities can change, and so they do not belong on the wiki.
 
Perhaps a select few organizations or individuals may make it onto the wiki in time, if they had a huge impact and what they did or have is relevent and permanent. But in my opinion, no information on the wiki should be able to change based on the actions of players. If what a specific player or group of players does can change the information, then it doesn't belong. 

I see a lot of people saying that Dual Universe is based around player made content, so it does belong on the wiki. I look at it from a different perspective; there is infinite potential for player made content. (Essentially) infinite constructs, organizations, players, etc. are all possible for the game, so what determines which get added to the wiki?
 
The wiki is for mechanics in my opinion. You report the physics, and materials, and report the reasons for forming an organization and benefits of living in a city area. You do not report specific constructs, are buildings, or organizations, but the mechanics they are based upon and that is it.
 
For an analogy to the real world: with Dual Universe, you would not make an article for New York City or London. You wouldn't make an article for Winston Churchill, or the Empire State Building or Big Ben or the companies that built them. What you WOULD do is make articles on good construction materials and physics, the skills that enhance activities such as construction or leadership, and the benefits for sticking together as players. The wiki would provide guides and tips on how to build and where to obtain materials and which materials are best for what. But again, the wiki would not report what was done with all of these resources, it would only report them and allow players to do as they see fit.

I posted this in discord will post it here as well...
 
The Gamepedia wiki is the game's official wiki, and as all official wikis they should only contain official core mechanics and official information regarding Dual Universe, nothing else.
 
Because our organizations are all player made content, it is therefore "non-official" - I use the term here loosely because the game does revolve around player made content - this information should be kept separate in a player made wiki. 
 
 
Again;
 
Gamepedia Wiki = Official Information from Novaquark only (mechanics, lore, information etc)
 
Playermade Wiki = Unofficial Player Made content
 
 
 
Cheers,
Comrademoco
 

Perhaps we need some sort of of specialised group of players who are interested in working on a separate record of the games history and the orgs within it ... Some sort of Historical Society ...

There's a lot of discussion here, I like it. Several people agree with me l, but are saying that some player made content belongs if it is influential. Thank you all that have shared your opinion. 
 
I will say I am even more "radical" than most that agree with me; I'm against all player made content entirely, if it can change. If it is an organization or city, it can change, so it doesn't belong. Sure game content can change too, but thats the point of a wiki, to update it as features change, not as cities and empires rise and fall. 
 
Activities themselves, like some EVE examples like ganking, would belong on the wiki because they a part of the game, but specific examples or organizations that take part in those activities can change, and so they do not belong on the wiki.
 
Perhaps a select few organizations or individuals may make it onto the wiki in time, if they had a huge impact and what they did or have is relevent and permanent. But in my opinion, no information on the wiki should be able to change based on the actions of players. If what a specific player or group of players does can change the information, then it doesn't belong. 

So far it seems like the two sides are pretty close together on the issue. We all agree that obviously some player content will have to be on the wiki, like major cities and space stations, trade hubs, star gates, and so on; and even those most strongly in favor of adding orgs to the wiki can agree that it shouldn't be for advertising or propaganda purposes. So, to refocus the discussion, it seems like the largest issue is whether or not there should be biographies for individual organizations and players.
 
In relation to that issue, first I'd like to say that arguing for or against having multiple websites is a serious waste of time. There will be multiple websites, no matter what we say about it. That's not a bad thing at all. If you can't handle searching multiple websites for information, then you probably can't handle playing a game like DU, where virtually all of the game world is a PvP zone. What's most important here is that each website be clear and useful, and it's hard to accomplish either of those goals when you're attempting to do everything. So, the wiki should be focused on accomplishing a specific goal: being a central location for people to go to get a basic understanding of topics essential to playing the game.
 
So, to go back to the EVE example: If I were to write an EVE wiki, I would definitely include a page just about Jita, because it's the most important system in the game. I'd also probably include a page on suicide ganking and smartbombing on gates, because those are important things to look out for. These are player created activities and content, but they're essential parts of playing the game, so they would belong in a wiki. However, I wouldn't write an article about specific alliances, like Pandemic Legion for example, because you don't have to know who PL is to have fun in EVE. I wouldn't bother with keeping track of who's flying where, how many pilots they have, what systems they hold, their current tactics, and so on, because those things change all the time and aren't really essential to playing EVE. Furthermore, websites like Evewho and Dotlan do those jobs much better than I could with a wiki. So, players would come to my wiki to find out about how to play the game, but they'd go someplace else to find out about the other people playing the game.  
 
Similarly, a DU wiki should focus on explaining things like the building mechanics, how to set up a Territory Control Unit, how to find the best ores, or where the most important cities and space stations are. Leave the tracking of organizations to other websites that will do so more effectively. If new players want to figure out which organizations to join, they should be going to the community portal, or some other website dedicated to detailing orgs, and not the wiki. 

I think we need to separate "essential game concepts" from organizations in the wiki. However, in a single shard universe, some player made content will be essential. For example, no guide to EVE Online would be complete without mentioning Jita and the vital role it plays in the game. Jita is only Jita because the players decided that it is, so that's definitely a function of player content, not the game. The content on the wiki should definitely include similar issues that are highly important to how we play the game.
 
However, adding articles about organizations themselves seems like a bad idea. Doing so will present a huge array of problems. Those articles will need to be updated constantly to represent changes in those orgs. Any org on the wiki would have a built-in advantage over everyone else simply on the basis of being more well known. By including an org you'd automatically offend any org that doesn't get included, and that could also spiral into a flame war on the wiki between orgs that hate each other.
 
Nevermind the fact that including orgs at this time seems really silly given that none of us have even played the game yet. We don't actually know what each org will be doing, who will be on who's side, and so on, because the game doesn't even exist yet. As of right now, all discussions about orgs and their function is entirely hypothetical and academic, so making a big deal about it seems incredibly arrogant.
 
So no, leave orgs off the wiki. Maybe include some player content later, but right now it's very premature. 

More or less, this is essentially my point.  That there are some things that are important to playing the game because players make them that way.  With Dual Universe, in my opinion, its exacerbated because there is so little content developed, no empires no missions, etc.  As a result, the interactions between players become even more important and are virtually unavoidable. 
 
I agree that it is somewhat silly to specifically include organizations on the wiki in such an infant stage, but nothing on the wiki is real unchanging information, its all vague observations based on something someone said or showed once or twice.  My intent is not to have the wiki replicate the community page, but supplement the pure game mechanics & concepts with information about "important" player creations.  How you decide what is important is conjecture, but I vehemently disagree that it should be completely disallowed from being included on the wiki.  
 
To repeat my previous post, there is no sense in creating more sources of information for players it just makes things confusing unnecessarily.  It is not difficult to have different sections of a wiki are label them as such.  Its even easier to have a banner at the top of every page focused on player-created content as a disclaimer or equivalent.

So to start off, @RightBigToeand myself are, by the numbers, the two biggest Dual Universe wiki contributors, and I am currently the administrator of the wiki. RightBigToe recently began adding organizations into the wiki as articles, a decision I disagreed with. Rather than repeat myself, I'll just post our conversation thus far. I will summarize after.
 
 
To summarize, RightBigToe argues that large organizations are a big part of the game as it is in it's unreleased state, and as such belong on the wiki. I disagree, I think that they have no place on the wiki because they are player-made content; I do not believe community content of any kind belongs on the wiki, only information gathered by the community based upon steadfast mechanics and data released by Novaquark.
 
One of our opinions will have to be set aside, and I feel that it should be the majority opinion based on what the community thinks. Also, there is no animosity of any kind between us, it is simply a difference of opinions! I want this to be fair.
 
So what do you as the community think? Should community content, at least for now, be added to the wiki? What are your thoughts?

So to start off, @RightBigToeand myself are, by the numbers, the two biggest Dual Universe wiki contributors, and I am currently the administrator of the wiki. RightBigToe recently began adding organizations into the wiki as articles, a decision I disagreed with. Rather than repeat myself, I'll just post our conversation thus far. I will summarize after.
 
 
To summarize, RightBigToe argues that large organizations are a big part of the game as it is in it's unreleased state, and as such belong on the wiki. I disagree, I think that they have no place on the wiki because they are player-made content; I do not believe community content of any kind belongs on the wiki, only information gathered by the community based upon steadfast mechanics and data released by Novaquark.
 
One of our opinions will have to be set aside, and I feel that it should be the majority opinion based on what the community thinks. Also, there is no animosity of any kind between us, it is simply a difference of opinions! I want this to be fair.
 
So what do you as the community think? Should community content, at least for now, be added to the wiki? What are your thoughts?

I learned, it's just a classic new user filter. You have to make a certain number of edits to be allowed to make external links (which you have done!)

Hey Guys,
I'm not totally sure if this the right place for this xD
If it isn't, I'm sorry...

Today, I started a new video series on my German YouTube Channel.
I will upload a Video about DU every Friday.
The Topics will be different but all kind of informational.
The first Video is a basic video that answers the question "What is Dual Universe?"

Because it is a German video on a German Channel I will continue in German with specific information. 


So, nun noch mal etwas genauer:
Jeden Freitag kommt ab sofort ein Informationsvideo zu DU auf meinem YouTube Kanal.
Die Themen werden recht verschieden sein, sei es ein Deutsches Video zur Lore, zu Gameplay Mechanismen oder auch zur Community.
Das erste Video behandelt die Grundlage was DU eigentlich ist und soll für jeden ein Einstig bitten. Für die denen das Video gefällt, ist es denke ich auch gut um das Spiel neuen Leuten zu Zeigen.
Ich hoffe es gefällt euch ^^
 
 

Hi Blog4life,
 
Last public statement from NQ about alpha is in this post :
Note that it's a "closed" alpha as only ATV and some backers will join first. More information in this post :
Regards,
Shadow
 
 

Welcome to the forums Dan! (Or do you prefer Dak?) How did you find out about Dual Universe?
 
Also, what the heck is a Zimmer?