FalloutWB

I was of this frame of mind for a while.  I've been watching, and waiting for a reason to come back.  However, to Mega's point, I don't trust NQ either.  I'm still watching for that miracle, but after what I've seen since I've left, I don't see them pulling this one out.  There are quite a few former players that called this game "a scam" when they left.  I argued with them for a bit, but yeah, NQ is showing these players may have been right.  Really sad.

Nobody asked why you are choosing random construct abandonment, because nobody cares. The only issue is the plainly objective fact that this solution is vastly unacceptable, and you need to find another one. All the narcissistic batshit insane troll logic in the world won't make that fact go away.

This needs to be re-evaluated.  This game was advertised as a civilization-building game.  If there are extreme limitations on the solo players, you will never attract enough people to the game to even *start* large cooperative groups.  I backed this project because I was sold on JC's vision.  I feel like things have been getting squeezed tighter and tighter and this game is about to lose the majority of its players if this change is implemented as described here.

...after >10,000 views on YouTube, and many hundreds of hrs building:
Death Star
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/j8zxhd/its_operational_death_star_test_flight/
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/jdc5st/districts_9_5_6km_11kms_visible_from_the_death/
Roulette Table & Poker Machine
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/k74cws/this_took_longer_to_build_than_the_death_star/
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/kotnkm/some_epic_code_optimisation_to_get_this_working/
Spinning Radar
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/n8fhou/megabosslords_infinitely_spinning_radar_no_fuel/
Emperator
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/o8z3xg/the_emperator_sneak_peek/
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/o4uev9/market_shown_for_scale/
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/o1xflv/no_other_game_comes_close/
Hologram Projector
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/ohzbvi/a_huge_thank_you_to_those_whove_stopped_by/
Stuff Like This
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/orvc46/todays_voxel_challenge_everything_about_this/
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/mwp6xw/til_voxel_landing_skids_work_great/
Giant Floating Island
https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/pzntme/floating_island_progress_week_3/
...and a store with 50+ more DRM-free BPs.
It's NOT the constant bugs. This is a beta. They're a small studio running on fumes. It's no surprise having to fill in a dozen bug reports after every release: https://imgur.com/a/y4sPbpE
It's NOT the constant nerfs - losing our factories, HTML/SVGs, megas/scans, terraforming, LUA randomly deprecated, ship designs ganked by new element mechanics... also to be expected in a beta (even if it is soul-destroying.)
It's NOT having all my suggestions ignored - even the most basic QoL improvements which 50 other people also asked for since day 1, and still today: https://www.reddit.com/r/DualUniverse/comments/pu9eoc/watch_my_spirit_broken_in_real_time/

Sorry Xerrass. NQ just don't listen.
It's NOT the lack of vision or inspiration. JC's 'emergent gameplay' pitch was awesome bait. Now we're all being shoe-horned into a vanilla same-as-every-other-game meta, but maybe that's the price of doing business. If it means more players, also fine.
It's NOT the community. The community were awesome - although many good people have also left.
No, I loved this game - despite everything. Eyes wide open.
The issue is trust.
As a beta, the only point of investing time is if you trust the studio to respect your effort.
NQ have crossed from flaky to deceitful: showering us with platitudes while stealth-patching and quietly reversing stated plans.
If we can't trust them to respect our efforts, and we can't trust anything they say - any declaration now is potentially the opposite of what will happen. Every back-flip is attributed to some last-minute complaint from someone, but it's never clear who, or how many, or what the forum was to be heard, and how long discussion was open-then-closed-then-opened-again.
And because of the ham-fisted way they've handled letting players who quit long ago just leave their garbage laying around forever, tying up resources without paying a sub, there are absolutely no consequences to just walking away - which probably the dumbest design decision in the history of a game.
TL/DR: NQ caught lying. Again. No pre-nup.

Thought about coming back, but still waiting for NQ to make a significant update, and lost all hope after they actually went through with Demeter.  Do a lot of people still play this game?  Or did the playerbase drop after Demeter?

I just finished turning off auto-renewal for my accounts. The reason? Mining changes.
Most games out there reward players for logging on daily. NQ chose a different path: DU is punishing players for NOT logging in daily.
I already work two jobs, the last thing I need is a third job which I pay for.
 
There is still game time left until Autumn 2022. I'll log in every now and then, to see what's going on. There's a chance I would change my mind, IF the game steers back to the proper path. As it is right now, it seems to be going the way of the Dodo.

It was fun while it lasted, though, gotta admit that.

With all the feedback over the last couple of weeks, I can't believe NQ actually went through with this update.  Still laggy, buggy and unstable to boot!
 

With all the feedback over the last couple of weeks, I can't believe NQ actually went through with this update.  Still laggy, buggy and unstable to boot!
 

Will the HQ option, in regards to taxes, be implemented in time for the Demeter release?  This is the "make or break" as to whether or not I will return.

Will the HQ option, in regards to taxes, be implemented in time for the Demeter release?  This is the "make or break" as to whether or not I will return.

Will the HQ option, in regards to taxes, be implemented in time for the Demeter release?  This is the "make or break" as to whether or not I will return.

Oh shit, no worries then... we are good, and yes agreed. I have many issues I take with Pann's communication and while I have nothing against her as a person as I don't know her... her commentary is quiet inflammatory to me as someone heavily impacted by these changes.

You sir, are 100% on point! Willy Nilly changes, and switch flipping, and BS off the cuff bandaids that won't be available before many players bleed out.

1. The reason players want full skill reset is that mining only reset doesn't give everyone an equal playing field, and you have grossly changed the primary way to earn quanta.
2. NQ-PANN says if you have fully optimized your resource pool you will profit over tax. Issue #1 means a builder is less capable of doing that, 
3. The economic impact of Dementor means people aren't largely buying designs like they were even at a 75% discount, cause we are all mining and hoarding quanta.

- This update is highly advantageous for those already skilled for activities that previously net them a lot of profit to begin with.
- Meanwhile it heavily punishes players creating content that invested their points into making honeycomb and building materials they needed to build.
- Additionally, if you were a builder that was trying to work on large player made locations, you are also being shafted.

What I made in quanta as a builder over 3-4 months, miners could LITERALLY make in 3-4 hours if spec'ed into those skills. Now you are taking my land, crippling my ability to earn in a new economy, and punishing me essentially for dedicating my time to making "player created content". Something I did cause I wanted to draw more people into this game...

@NQ-Pann your statement that "people don't like change" is heavily contextual. We as players would LOVE more ways to earn quanta, more reasons to interact as players, new content etc. What players don't enjoy is fundamentally de-stabilizing changes that threaten to wipe away a couple years of work, because we didn't play according to NQ's new vision of the game.

If you can't avoid chicken and egg mistakes with the autominers & DSAT, how can you ever hope to realize the devastation you are unleashing on the player base by combining taxes at a time you are fundamentally overhauling the entire economy.

 

@NQ
 
So, credit where credit's due. The vlog's are a nice step up from hardly any communication.
Also, the base territory unit (BTU?) without tax seems like an acceptable solution, as long as we get enough of them.
 
But.. If this BTU feature is not ready for when demeter goes live, then you are yet again going to do the type of rushed release mistake you have done so many times before.
I.e. by the time the BTU feature get released,  the damage would most likely already be done since demeter without BTU would force players to login and pay tax on tiles.
And we all know from experience that it would not be a matter of days or even weeks from demeter and until the BTU is ready.
 
 
 

I think you nailed every part of this spot on... including the stupid comment someone made to Pann. 

Watching the video, it would appear to me that there are so many, we don't knows, maybe after demeter, we are not sure yets and other phrases, that show this patch SHOULD NOT be released yet.
Not only is this patch VERY ALPHA, it is also very undecided. At this point you have to wonder if this is to save costs, maybe they should shut down the public servers for another year and restart with an alpha, when they are ready. 
Also wipe on release????? That has to be a mistake. How is the question of a wipe for release on the table? 

Overal thoughts..
"Not expected outcome" on PTS changes was funny. It just shows NQ does not know their own product or their community very well
 
Geometry reset not main issue. Of course not, it is fairly minor and really roo small an action
 
The argument to not allow respec of talents is silly, NQ is basically still in alpha and making big changes here which justifes a full respec. The argument that you do not want to allow a respec every patch is not valid here as this is a major patch with deep changes.
 
Why is NQ saying the scans remain valid when they will not be as per this QA. 
 
Unlimited ore now? That ends the need for many to ever leave Alioth and will make big orgs and those with deep pockets thanks to exploits mass claim tiles from their existing infrastructure and availability of ships. Also, with T4/T5 ore now beiong nore sparse and on outerplanets, once big orgs grab them they have unlimited supply. This change pretty much undermines the core of DU from my POV
 
The typical "you do not understand" dismissal of valid concerns about mining (locations). "once you understand it wil lbe easy" mean you do not actually listen to yoru communities concerns.
 
Lovely how Pann pretty much describes alpha state game development (put something out htere and see how it works). NQ should really readjust their develolp;ment state an dbe honest about it.
 
Wipe/no wipe should not be a matter of discussion for NQ, changes like coming now during development ask for a wipe and NQ should grow a pair and pull the trigger on a wipe.
 
TAXES
Of course taxes are a big issue. It's a sensible idea, badly designed. Again, NQ being seemingly surprised by this shows they really do not hink these things through on a level beyond their own bubble. Taxes "to avoid land grabbing" was funny, I laughed so hgard. It will actually drive it as people with a lot fo currency will do exactly that to secure their unlimited supply of ore. Which is the very reason why a full wipe is needed on such a massive shift in core game design. Aquisitioning static constructs on a tile once the ownershipo expires and is claimed by another player makes sense but there needs to be a longer period for which you can pay taxes. If people have to be absent for longer they need to be able to not have to get back to the game while they can't OR be able to assign others to pay the tax while retaining ownership. Allowing one tax free tile per player will allow big orgs to combine tile ownership of members and own massive swats of tiles at no cost. This needs to be addressed/balanced.  
PRICING:
Frankly.. I called this one and do not see much of an issue with it. I do not expect it to make much of a difference now though, it woudl have if these prices were what NQ started with The spin on the price increase is hilarious "you can still pay $7/month but you need to pay for a year in advance". In other  words, "please make a long term commitment to the game" The pricing uses insane exchange rates in some cases  
COST CUTTING
The spin from Pann on the cost cutting by NQ is silly and shows a complete misunderstanding of the comments she refers to. It pretty much also exposes the massive disconnect there is between NQ and the community. NQ needs to stop making excuses and trying to spin their need to cut cost as a positive.
Lastly;
People saying a NQ staffer should "die in a fire" in any sort of way should result in an insta ban and it should not be laughed off during a Q&A. I've been berated and threatened by NQ staff with bans for far, far less. Pann should kow better with her background and experience than to put that out here and downplay it.

It'd be great to post a short transcript of relevant Q&As. 
 
An hour long video is okay...but you can't really blame anyone for not wanting to sit through this.
 
If this is the only medium of communication, make it more to the point...do some editing. I'm sorry but it's not super entertaining or funny, it's meandering. Or keep doing it in this format, but give us a summary in text. 
 
Here's a not-so-quick summary, I'm sure others can do it better:
They don't want to reset all talents because "that would mean we have to reset talents all the time!" and they feel people should be "locked in"...Which isn't what the player base is saying at all, but okay.  New vertex complexity meter -- so more build limits coming down the line, but not here yet.  Brake change reverted (already mentioned), but changes will come. Seems like they have some branch management issues.  Scans will show old information (will show resources that don't exist anymore). So....all old scans are defunct?  No real feedback about mining -- not going to make it more intuitive (idk about minigame) and yeah resources are infinite which we knew. Chicken and egg with T3 ore and DSAT..."we'll get back to you" --> guess they never thought about this somehow lol Some whining about "we can't win with this" regarding scans is annoying to me they can find a solution -- it's called planning ahead instead of this "let's just push it out and see" approach. Take some responsibility for your poor planning -- that's the root cause, not that "players are divided about what to do" in regards to keeping scans or making them all worthless. It's their problem created from their radically changing design and poor plans.  They are increasing asteroid spawns in safe zones, but not the spawn time frame.  Surface mining on unclaimed tiles is fine (other than sanctuary)  Higher tier ore is not "deliberately excluded" from pools, "should be present on outer planets". More rare.  Any LUA APIs on mining units? 4 new functions (maybe) to query state/rate/ore/territory pool.  Taxes... They need the resource sinks they say, because "resources are now unlimited". I don't think they've actually though about what "unlimited" means, because they are rate-limited. They are unlimited like gold in WoW is "unlimited" --> it's still finite because time is finite, the well just won't tap out. The prices of ores will change of course.  They are considering some free "HQ" hexes that won't be taxed and can be used on any planet. That would solve a lot of issues. "We might add it to Demeter, maybe not". Clearly they need this for Demeter.  They seem confident that the revenue of mining will be plenty to pay for taxes -- seems they don't expect ore prices to change. We'll see if that's true. Static/Dynamic constructs will become salvageable if parked on tile that changes ownership after "2 weeks", could be changed -- so there's a bit of a waiting period before you can requisition constructs Future plans -- new roadmap in early 2022 Increasing the price of the sub. If you want to pay $6.99/month, you must sub for a year. But they are introducing a 1 month plan at $9.99/month   
I want to remind NQ that this is a paid game, so players don't treat it the same as they would a typical beta. Nor should they.
 
A lot of reminding us "this is just a first iteration" etc. -- well...throwing it up and waiting to see how it goes isn't a great idea for any paid game. Especially when you're increasing prices. It isn't like this "push and see how it goes" approach is how games are normally designed, especially an MMO! 
 
It would maybe be fine for closed alpha, but that's not where we are. 

Enjoy my stuff... you and the other 8 players left should have a wonderful time with it for the time the game has left.  Too few players don't pay the bills at NQ.  This game was on borrowed time as it was.

Enjoy my stuff... you and the other 8 players left should have a wonderful time with it for the time the game has left.  Too few players don't pay the bills at NQ.  This game was on borrowed time as it was.

NQ,,, thank you for a game that I have enjoyed playing. I know you have reasons for these mining changes and that they are probably required for the majority of players. I however am in the minority that was on this for Mining and scanning and have Zero interest in PVP. With the safe zone asteroids being limited in number I will be cancelling my account if Demeter as planned is deployed on the main server.
 
I am not bitter, and wish you all the best, it is just that all the feature that made me willing to pay for this game no longer are available.
 
Good luck!!!!
 

Enjoy my stuff... you and the other 8 players left should have a wonderful time with it for the time the game has left.  Too few players don't pay the bills at NQ.  This game was on borrowed time as it was.

Games die before going live all the time....it's extremely common. 
 
And it's been in development for 7+ years now, it isn't like this is some brand new thing that just hit beta and is still early in the dev process. 

For people who have been waiting to come back to this game, I think you have pretty much wrapped it up for them with the airbrakes and taxes.  These are things that should be done at a later time, not mashing in a bunch of changes all at once.  This many "shocker" changes at once is what led to so many leaving the game during the schematic debacle.
Mining unit idea is great, as it is on the roadmap and creates something new.  Work with that.
Voxel change... good, and I hope it works.  In theory, should reduce lag and improve performance.  Those two alone should keep your devs busy for months with the bugs likely to come about.  However, the taxes and airbrakes, will definitely reduce the lag as more players leave, and no way old players, like myself, will be returning.  Players are going to be busy enough having to dig out their structures as it is!  Having to rework or even scrap current ships due to the airbrake thing is not a way to keep players.  Implementing taxes on our territories on top of all of this?  Are you serious???
Please reconsider this.  Add things to do rather than penalties and nerfs.  Taxes on territories should be a release time "tweak", not a named patch feature.