SMALLVILLE

i would suggest to reconsider the "for a single fuel tank"  bit.
a problem that all advanced Flight Huds have is the number of links on the control units. mainly the fuel tanks are the limiting factor, as whenever you have a bigger number of fuel tanks, those consume so many links, that we are unable to link all elements needed to control the ship to a single seat.  there are some workarounds in place, like not linking the fuel tanks and going via core and talent levels to try to get the correct amount of fuel in each of the fuel containers. but this is painful, difficult and honestly nothing we should have to do.

Just implement this change as a fuel "hub" allowing 10 fuel containers per fuel type to be accessed via one link and the problem would be solved, and wouldn't cause a risk,like increasing the general number of allowed links might do.

Hagbard.

So why can't we trade mining unit calibrations as consumable items? A schematic training queue is otherwise the same mechanic as generating mining charges (except that it is auto-queued for you).

Offer rewards, and still don't know if we will keep them???  Makes sense.  I see tons of people setting this up prior to a wipe decision...

Does not matter if it was kickstarter founder, backer or subscription money.
What is important is that players spent real money to play in a persistent MMO, as promised by NQ.
 
And it was NQ that made the decision to proclaim that the beta would be a "soft-release" and the "last wipe", so that they could start charging subscriptions for an unfinished game. And players have invested both time and money accordingly.
 

I won't be starting again, more games out there that don't wipe and have better gameplay than to start rebuilding what has taken me 2 years.  I'm out the day of wipe.

Ok, I care about this enough to put my 2 cents in.
 
I am fully against a wipe. 
 
The main reason I started playing was because of the mentions/promises that the server will never be fully wiped again. 
 
I guess I consider myself a relatively new player.  I started playing around September 2022, and played for about a month, enjoyed it but got busy.  Then started playing again 2 months ago. Maybe I'm too new to see the issues but I do find the game pretty damn good, so I don't see an issue between the new players and old players as been suggested. How was this considered an issue?
 
Infact.. Its the experienced players and their builds have keep me very interested.  Nothing I love more than exploring the ground seeing what kinds of builds people have done, getting inspiration, etc. 
 
This isn't a competitive game (unless you go beyond the pvp zone), its a cooperative game.
 
If your trying to get new players in, then focus on what makes it difficult for them to get started. Heres a list of things my friends and myself struggled with .
 
Complexity
The game has depth and with that depth, there's a lot more complexity. It took at least two weeks before we started understanding how to play the game. My friends and I are pretty stubborn so we stuck with it, but if a player cant get a hang of the UI within a few hours and get a good grasp of how to do things, they will give up quickly.  This game really is immensely complex with the things it does which will scare away the majority of the players. Simplifying it will do more in attracting new players than doing a server wipe. 
 
Resources
Quite frankly, if it wasn't for the player markets, we would of given up. Starting up, it took a hell of a lot to figure out how to produce things. In the end, we just started selling ores and bought the things from the market. This goes back to the complexity statement.
 
PVP
This is a negative actually. Games great, its good the pvp is enabled, BUT mining for high tier ores is can be difficult with the piracy. Its fair and reasonable. Good stuff is in the pvp zone, but you will be found 80% of the time if you go asteroid hunting for good ores. 
 
Now lets talk about exploits. 
 
I cant say I know much about this, but I'm guessing it was some sort of extreme and easy way to get resources and items really quickly and easily, flooding the market, bringing in excessive amounts of money etc. 
 
Just a thought, how does a real economy work for a country? They  certainly don't raze it to the ground and start again if it gets out of control. 
 
Its a slow solution to fix it, but it certainly is fixable in time. Increasing in game taxes, temporarily reducing outputs, etc can help bring that in line. But like I said before. I'd like to point out I'm pretty sure those exploits, which I haven't directly taken advantage of (Its more like been from a player of a player of a player kind of thing), has gotten me more engaged into the game faster.
 
 
So here's the question I will throw out there,.
 
How did you come to the conclusion that the older community is the reason to why new members aren't interested? Seriously. Its the complexity thats more of an issue than anything.
 
Note, i'd be pretty peeved as well if a wipe did occur. As I said. The promise of never doing a full wipe again was the main reason I started playing. Breaking that promise is breaking that trust. Even if DU said they would never reset again after this one I could never believe it. There's a very good chance I probably wouldn't play again and probably seek a refund. 
 
In terms of a partial wipe.
 
 - Keep Talents 
 - Keep Blueprints/ships/etc
 - Kind reserve of credits/space/atmo/rocket fuel to help get started again.
 - Starting items for basic industry to alleviate the initial grind
Id be more receptive of that admittedly 

I have been thinking a lot about this in the past days. I guess many of us have. This is the last I'll say about it.
 
Some approach a no-wipe by giving arguments, some by ultimatums, some by expressing how they feel, some disappear in silence, some undergo it, and some approach it by bargaining: your wipe is ok if you leave me with this; thinking to compromise.
 
The pro-wipe people on the other hand have yet to present to me a convincing argument. Everyone agrees that a wipe will resolve symptoms, for some time, but, in the end, that it wouldn't resolve the underlying issues. Thus, history will repeat itself (mark this). NQ could still make mistakes (e.g., radar in PTS just recently) affecting us, and that can't be prevented, it is the nature of development. People will still exploit these mistakes, it is the nature of people, and should be punished for it if they could have known better.
 
Hence, I need to conclude that the only real reasons for a wipe, from the player-base's perspective, are competitiveness, seeing the world burn, not caring, trolling, ignorance, aside from technical reasons that are parroted, of which I have said before: any good technical reason would result in a statement from NQ that there would be a wipe and to what extent. And that is not what we got.
 
Nevertheless, I get NQ's point of view .. it is about minimizing collateral (us) on the prospect of new players at launch, but also old players that gave up somewhere along the way, most notably around 0.23. They might be convinced of the need to promise a leveled playing field at launch, given the state of the game today, while not angering its community too much not to lose those that actually play the game, and organize fun in it.
 
Some propose a poll in here ... I think the poll is being executed by this post of NQ (like they did through previous ambiguous announcements). Else, if that wasn't its purpose, I don't get it. Not only has it sowed discord, it has created distrust, is ineffective, is giving people time to reconsider things and move on, killed the incentive to play the game, and what not. Whatever NQ's ultimate decision would be, this post has done much more harm than it could have done good. That's why I said in #duscussion that NQ is probably watching the channel with a big bowl of popcorn, as all of this is either incredibly shortsighted or intentional, and how can it not be intentional?
 
But, NQ: IF you had just laid out your concerns, instead, and the fact that you don't have a good solution, without any hint as to what you would/could decide or implement it. That would have been constructive as it would help people see your point of view, and you would have gotten a response much less driven by emotion (or have casted people in emotional roller-coasters). This could have helped you see what your community thinks about it (who have all been new players at some point), rather than making them angry at you and each other. Furthermore, timing ... you are running a PTS for an update, in the Easter period. Why not wait until after for such an announcement, so you could actually provide clarity in due time, instead of letting us hang.
 
By now, there have been many logical arguments against a wipe (aside the list of promises made or hinted at by NQ) to be found in this thread (ranging from technological reasons to commercial implications). There is no point in repeating all of them.
 
I think the most notable one is that there will remain a need for a continuously leveled playing field in the future, not solved by a wipe. Thus, a wipe without the required changes for equalizing things doesn't make sense, and when these changes are in place they invalidate the need for a wipe. This is pure logic. However, people don't always follow logic, and thus even under these changes NQ might need to convince new players with the prospect of a fresh start. What can I say, they run a business.
 
But, NQ, note that for this equalizing, in society, we have tax systems, like a non-linear tax on capital and income. If in DU linked to the daily income system, this would effectively level the playing field. This leveled playing field is also why in society we guide our economy's inflation, to give active people an advantage over non-actives, to give newer players an advantage over older ones, to devaluate capital that goes unused. And thus, to renew the economy continuously. Add to that degradation of property and maintenance (by reducing your HP counters over time), and what you get is a real economy that can be tuned through taxes and minimum/maximum prices. Recall that with such an approach you wouldn't have needed construct slots either (as I said then). However, by the time people can propose solutions, you have already implemented/developed your solution, which you introduce, and which then can only be weakened or strengthened, based on the community's response. But from which you can no longer pivot.
 
Note that NQ's approach in this announcement is similar to before (and after some examples of the kind can only be concluded to be intentional too), with construct slots the most recent example. They make a statement which is infuriating to some and then revert it back a bit so that people feel acknowledged, reaching an end-point which would not have been accepted otherwise. It is NQ's one-sided bargaining with the community. Or rather (emotionally) manipulating the community. And that's abusive to those that don't see the manipulation, and insulting to those that can.
 
At the very least by it, we feel agitated, deceived, manipulated, stopped playing, or quit the game to convince you, NQ, that you shouldn't take us for granted and treat us like this. People that have been with you for a long long time, have promoted you, and have walked the path you have taken us through highs and lows. People that are mostly silent. People that understand compromise, that things change, and above all that want this game to grow. People that only ask for openness, clarity, and a bit of respect for their time and money.
 
I know, none of us individually matter. Whatever I do as a consequence of whatever decision NQ takes, it won't be felt nor by NQ nor the community. So, I'm not gonna give an ultimatum, nor be angry, or try a tactic to have you don't wipe. I will not try to move the public opinion in any way. I think I'm in a state that is much worse .. I don't care anymore. My relation with you NQ has changed, and it won't be fixed easily. I don't trust you anymore. You had once this resolution that you would stick your ground, that you would live your vision, which made me feel safe to invest my limited time in, for which I would have compromised a lot. But Yama said it: this has turned into an abusive relationship; and the best thing you can do in that case is cut your losses and live with the hurt. TBH, NQ, you have just turned from the company I am a customer of (and do business with), into my dealer: I have a hard time trusting you, but you sell me something I like too much to give up on yet.
 
To NQ. Thank you. I'm grateful although it might not have sounded that way. The visionaries, the developers, and community managers alike. I'm convinced you want the best too. So, let's see what you do.

To NQ. I challenge you (if you dare) along with the entire community to solve The Metacomplex (vr) puzzle.
No one ever has, I think no one can (without cheating), and when wiped, likely no one ever will.
 

Wipe and I'm done

EDIT: 
Message removed for advertising another game in a thread dedicated to feedback on Dual Universe. 

@yamamushi We can understand you're upset about changes in the development of Dual Universe and we're thankful for all the involvement you had in the Dual Universe community during several years. If at some point you want to come back on the game, you will be welcomed. However, all this doesn't give you the right to have such behavior on the forum.
 
Best Regards,
NQ-Nyzaltar
 

Oh and NQ while your at it give me a One Click Core Destruction Functionality, Where I can walk up to a CORE of any size that I own Dynamic or Static and have it revert back to elements and voxel into my link container. A cherry on top would be the have it return the associated blueprint as well if used. Now that would be exciting.

Many people speak of Missions as if there quick and easy far from the truth. There not, remember warp is disabled so it still takes hours on top of hours to complete these missions which I will remind you are Legit Game Mechanics, not an exploit just because I can do it with 10 Alts someone one else could do the same with 10 Friends. Mission were used to get rich just like tri scanners were used to scan three tiles at once. Just because you do something in MASS or in excess does not mean you were wrong. 

I have completed many mission with 10 Alts and make good quanta but it takes HOURS man. So I don't see how I am a bad guy because I found a way to do it more efficiently . Now granted that is not my only way of making money. I have been known to go out with a Space Only Hauler and Complete empty a Asteroid, just like I use to empty Mega Nodes spending hours on hours brain dead mining for days some times. Come back to base only after filling my ship.
 
So am I wrong because I am willing to trade TIME and Effort for money. 

 

Sorry this is going to be long...
 
NQ's approach towards the live server has been one of this being a live game for the entire beta:
Players that have to pay monthly to play a game (not a test) No major wipes or even reversions of the server to fix major exploits (not a test) A promise of no wipes unless there were catastrophic and unavoidable issues (not a test) Changing game design to make the game more grind oriented in order to slow player progression (not a test) NQ's Pro and Con list is so bias it is a joke. One of the major Cons they did not mention (or possibly erroneously put in the pros) is making DU an empty world for launch. How this could be a Pro is beyond me. You have had veteran players who have the most game knowledge building content for your game over cumulative hundreds of thousands of hours through bugs and changes. You have had free content created for your game that has virtually no inerrant content and you want to delete it? 
 
This brings me to another point of NQs complete lack of understanding of the scale of their own game world. You have had the entire DU player base building stuff in this game world for multiple hours a day since the start of beta and we have only built up things on a tiny fraction of it. Also, this is in your mind on an accelerated timeline because of exploits and game design flaws. You want to reset everything and everyone on a slower progression because you think you will bring in more players because of a "clean slate" at launch?
 
Even with 10,000 active players working 5-8 hours a day to build things it would take them years to cover even a large portion of just Alioth. If the balance of current construction and accumulated wealth is so game breaking that you need to wipe then you have almost 0 hope of keeping it balanced with a healthy population of players. The game's scale is massive... Is the aim to have an empty solar system forever? Barren, virtually untouched nature preserves? That seems to be the goal if you are truly worried about wiping based on current economic progression. 
 
My personal experience is I have been playing this game since Alpha 1 with a group of 10-20 players. We built up a lot in Alpha but held back as we knew there would be a wipe at the launch of Beta. When we were told there would be no wipe unless things went completely off the rails we put our strongest effort in building a city and progressing in the game as it was designed using 0 exploits. Over tens of thousands of hours we built a unique city, space station and community. We took all of the changes through Beta in stride as we knew in the end we would keep our progression and our hard work was still worth something. With a wipe our completely unique and unreproducible city (Freeport, Teoma) will be gone forever as it will be impossible to recreate even with magic blueprints. It would even take NQ a massive effort to put it back together as it currently is. The city is fully functioning and all it needs is more players in the game to flourish. With a wipe it will just be gone forever. 
 
NQ has all of the tools at their disposal to be accurate and concise about fixing any problems keeping current progression would cause. They could use a scalpel but it seems they are leaning towards using a sledgehammer instead. If you wipe the game I will say best of luck and watch it fail from afar but that is okay as it makes the decision for me to play the game at release very easy. 
 
 
 

1 - Keep schematics.. they are needed for the economy.
2 - Remove peoples beta access, if they wanna play have them pay that way people who are not playing will decay and the community can clean it up
3 - before launch do planet reset 
 
cleans up the rubbish and most ppl will be happy.
 
just make up your mind asap as to be blunt your player base will not wanna play a game if they think its going to be deleted in X months time.

NQ put this out for our feedback so here’s my two cents:
 
Shedding Light on Wipe Prospects: 
 
I think the most important thing to consider is how this impacts our community.  Community is what makes this game what it is. It’s the people who are there to help the new folks, to give advice and even money and ships. It’s the builders who have spent hours upon hours building and designing ships for sale. It’s the builders who create cities and huge space stations which add flavor to this world. 
 
If they do a construct wipe, NQ takes all that away and leave an empty shell. They will have taken away what means the most to the community: the time and effort that they put forth in building and creating. Some members have spent hours and hours building their bases, their spaceships.  There will be no incentive for them to play to start over on that scale. New players come to this game looking for the community they see in the trailers. They will find planets that are completely devoid of population and cities.
 
The gaming community is not so large – they all frequent the same gaming web pages. NQ will not be able to afford all negative feedback and the loss of population. The population will likely drop significantly. That’s a pretty big financial hit. The feedback that NQ will continue to get as a result will impact its ability to recruit new players.  The fall out will be all over the gaming community and on every board that gamers frequent.  This feedback will negatively impact the new players who see it. 
 
I am a newer player but even I feel that starting over, rebuilding, rescanning, mining again feels pretty overwhelming to me. I am unsure if I will continue. 
 
I heard that there were 'Magic Blueprints' previously. Is this a possibility? 
 
Warp Drives, Adjusters and Command seats:
I do not understand why NQ is choosing to make these elements (especially warp drives ) so much heavier. I’m afraid this change will effectively remove all the personal warp shuttles from the game. It won’t be possible to build xs core warp shuttles that are cost effective. The warp cell cost is going to be much higher. 

The only way this game will be successful is NQ is smart enough to sell it to a actual game developing company or just go bankrupt and sell the game. Lets face it NQ has shown the world what not to do when it come to developing a game. Do what ever you like because we all know you will.  

If you do any type of wipe that removes quanta, talent points, or BPs - then you are guaranteed to lose a whole bunch of the people who supported and helped get this project off of the ground. That is lousy to say the least. We spent a lot of our time toiling away (through *all* of the early beta issues mind you) to earn the assets that we have - under the impression that there would be no wipe (as NQ clearly stated.) It's not our fault that you didn't listen to the very clear feedback about the nonsensical schematic system, so don't (doubly) punish us for it now. 
 
The people crying about wipes only want an opportunity to hit it rich, like some of those *early supporters* did. If you bend the knee to them, you'll just deal with the same thing at some point in the future. Because there is no stopping the giant disparity between casual and hardcore players. A wealthy elite will always come into existence, no matter what you do. So why punish your earliest supporters just to kick that can down the road?
 
You made people pay for access to the game - that means you are literally stealing people's money if you decide to reset everything. I know you'll never get another dime from me, and I'd imagine that plenty of us feel the same. The 'full wipe' enthusiasts won't stick around any longer after a wipe than they will now - save for the few that actually get rich. Make sure you take that into account as well. There are other means to attract/incentivize new players without completely destroying the game for the vets. Hopefully this reply doesn't fall on deaf ears, because a full wipe is going to destroy the game.

Wipe and I'm done

Wipe and I'm done

Wipe and I'm done

I loved my debut in DU I found it funny to have to pick up stones and go sell them with a speeder scraping the ground.
But what we have already done once, we do not want to do again. And I won't find it fun to do it again. For me it will be a nightmare.
I've been in the game for about 18 months ... when I started I met other players with big ships that made me dream and therefore move forward. 
But I was not jealous, nor envious of those already present before me!!!
When I arrived on Alioth I installed myself ready for Alioth 13 because there was no place next to D6 and then D6 was nothing for me and yet I did not miss anything on the contrary there I had plenty of meganodes and not too much competition.
I waited then one day I had my D6 ready tile because I was smart and patient. Because above all it allowed me to develop a larger factory. 
But I was not jealous, nor envious of those already present before me !!! with their great construction ... 
All this to tell you that wipe is not a good idea. No one wiped the world when you were born. You have made with this world. New players will too and we will have to help and welcome them, strangely we already do. Tell me if I'm wrong? 
With 3 billion quanta or a hundred million it's the same why limit myself? fairer why? because I had to adapt (not without complaining) to a free world where we craft everything without paying in a trade world (which made my fortune) parts that I didn't even make?
Isn't it just because I spent hundreds of hours mining meganodes? Isn't it just because I've been paying my subscription for 18 months?
 
So as we come back to earth with the subscription, I only have one life and it's too short to do things twice! I did not want to redo DU from the beginning because it will be without pleasure without discovery to try to regain what was taken from me so for me any form of wipe will be equivalent to canceling my subscription.
This why? to hide a lack of renewal in the game? And after, the new ones who will arrive, those according to the old new players, what do we do ?we wipe the wipe in a loop?
Why remove schematics? they are expensive so it takes playtime for the acquirers. This is the basis of MMOs "the  long time"!! maybe simplify them (an object = a schematic)... And still it's not an idea because already adults can't understand that selling your ore is more profitable than selling manufactured items for less expensive than the ore in it.
Why remove broke  from elements? It was enough to place sanctuary and the markets in a non-collision zone and to drop the wreckage so that the less fortunate had solutions by recovering parts. But no, get out! because putting this in place when all the markets were lagging and skills were crashing was crashing our ships. So we grumbled
why limit the number of cores which prevents the collection of ships? and so made the game work! It was enough to modify the Blueprint to spawn the chips in limited numbers on a platform of the player's tile as if he were taking his ship out of a garage and storing it (blueprint with the material) to take out another one from his collection. .. But no it is better to lose players !!!
What could be better than a collection of ships to increase the interest of a game, trade, construction, exchange, manufacture of parts...!!! Possession of items a good way to retain players.
Just a succession of bad choices that you at Novaquark have made !!!
  
A Wipe will not weaken large organizations and you know it. They will "speedrun" the game and finally resume their place as before and all this will have been for nothing.
   
Eventually even the most relentless and passionate players you will manage to make them leave !!! 
 
NO WAY FOR WIPE !!!! 
 
Nota : the worst is that you ruin my desire to play! so make up your mind !

Any wipe that affects constructs and the resources on planets and I am gone.  I am not going to spend more time redoing what I have done for a 3rd time.  My 4 accts gone.  I have spent every day playing DU building constructs, ships, cities and I am not about to have to do it again.  Some of my constructs require specific alignment and I'm not going through that again and spend months trying to get back to where I am.

I've been doing some thinking... If NQ does a full wipe, except talent points. Existing players would have a HUGE advantage! My main can perfectly produce most T1 (Basic) Elements and is getting close to perfectly building T2 (Uncommon) Elements, the same is true for Atmo and Space Fuel. Do some math and see how much of a difference that makes compared to a fresh player. That's not only an issue with quanta, but with resource consumption rate, and advancement rate. I can make stuff faster, be earlier done with a ship, get earlier to missioning, trading, mining, etc. Grab land earlier, start scanning tiles earlier, etc.
 
My main has almost perfect passive mining talents, my other three characters also have almost perfect passive mining talents (except the handling talents, need only one char for those). Not only do I get more per autominer, I also get a TON more mining charges per week. My secondary has perfect placement talents for vehicles, combine that with the perfect flying skills of my third and (almost) fourth char. That would mean I could lift a lot more, a lot faster, combine that with the limitations of the max speed in space, that is also a huge advantage over newbies.
 
That's why keeping the talent points is a bad idea if the objective is to equalize the difference between new and existing players...
 
But there's something you can't realistically block, the knowledge on how to do stuff effectively in DU, what you should look at, how, why, when, etc. The only way to counter this is to massively change the game on launch or just start blocking existing players. Keep in mind that the players and corps that where playing in Alpha had a HUGE advantage over us Beta starters, they became massive fast. For some reason people keep forgetting this...
 
The problem with this is, there is no solution, not even an imperfect solution. The cat is out of the bag.

I invested in years ahead of subscription into this game cus of the promise of no wipe... If wipe, I have to demand my money back, due to broken promise that made me invest in the first place. I hate starting over the endless grinding to just get a few elements for the first decent ship. If a wipe I'm done for good. And as mentioned I will demand a refund!!

This idea of a massive horde of potential players just waiting for a wipe is purely imaginary.
 
When was the last time you saw a game and thought, "That looks interesting. But it has a lot of established players already, and I don't want to be a noob, so I won't play that interesting game. But if they did a wipe, then I would start playing." I'm not saying that would never happen, but it's exceedingly rare. Most people who see an interesting game just start playing, and give little concern to other players who were there before them.