apollo0510

Excellent points made in a solid, wel presented video, some are a bit over amplified but valid nonetheless. @NQ-Abu and @NQ-Sesch should really be sat down and watch it.
 
The problem is that from NQ's perspective you "just do not understand".. /s
 
 
The part about the PVE content which in turn becomes a PVP opportunity where the reward from the PVE content is valuable and serves a purpose in the game overall. That is what sets a game like EVE so far apart from its competition since _everything_ in EVE has a meaning, a purpose and value, it may not be much in some cases, but it does. Everything in EVE matters in one way or another, _that_ is why EVE is still such a varied game appealing to many different player types nearly TWENTY years after it was released. The total lack of it in DU is why the game really is boring and pointless.

Oh, it's also why EVE, as a F2P game, brings in about €5M in revenue each month.. Just to put that out there.. Players understand and see the value in spending their money on the game, even when a LOT of them never actually do and pay their way with in game currency entirely.
 
I think basic survival mechanics would be fun, but I think not a requirement. I absolutely agree that immersive and engaging PVE content will be a requirement for DU to even stand a chance.
 
The Talent system in DU is pretty much a half-baked copy from EVE but there, it goes hand in hand with using your ships fitting, the availability of boosters and drugs and most importantly gaining actual EXPERIENCE playing which will make the learned skill meaningful. In EVE, you can compensate to as good degree for not having skills by using modified/faction modules which are more expensive but will offer some benefits otherwise available through skills. 
 
Industry in DU uses schematics but for the game, schematics really have no purpose but being a money sink. In EVE, basic tier 1 blueprints (which is what they are called there) can be bought yes, but you can also find them in the game, you can research them, improve them, boost them, invent better versions, and sell copies of your modified versions for others to use.
 
I do not want to turn this into a "make DU more like EVE" argument as that is not the point. The point is that NQ clearly draws "inspiration" from EVE but so far has failed to both understand and capture the essence of what they are going for.
 
 
I asked this question in the Q&A:

 
 
The answer that came back, really just shows NQ has no actual clue about where such a question come from and just gives a pretty stock answer

 
 
The answer shows that NQ has no eyes on the discussions going on in the forums (or if they do, the message is not transmitted internally), does not understand what is driving us to ask these questions nor do they show any interest in actually engaging with it.
 
It's just a bland, boring and lifeless response. Which unfortunately aligns pretty closely to the state of the game

This is a call to all colonists, if you believe the UEF and Aphelia to be an illegitimate government like we do, then we invite you to join the "Tax Refugees". We will build an infrastructure to avoid the territory tax the empire has tried to place on us. We will not allow NQ to bankrupt us through this corrupt system while it burns our economy to the ground, and robs us of our homes and our way of life.

We will build an HQ on Alioth, and a space station, and provide asteroid mining ship designs to all newcomers who need them. This will take time, but we will not abandon our brothers and sisters as they struggle to make a home for themselves in Helios!

Post in this thread with your in game name if you want to join! We will show NQ that we won't stand for their attempts to enslave us all during out gameplay!
 

Harvesting ore stones (that are spawned after calibrating mining units) requires players to hold the left mouse button a lot. For some players this causes wrist and/or finger pain/discomfort. Could surface ore harvesting be made more ergonomic? Mining tool had an auto-mine mode (toggled with the middle mouse button). Perhaps the harvest tool could have this mode too?

Hello,

Some improvement I see for the calibration:
Display the percentage with a number in addition of the progress bar when searching for the best point.
Currently we have only a progress bar, it's not precise we are loosing a lot of time 1-4% because of that. Remove loading effect when loading the calibration.
This effect is useless and make use loose time for nothing. Add a new mission "calibration"
We should be able to create calibration mission to help new player.  
Kind regards

And that most likely means players leaving the game.
 
So once again like with 0.23, NQ has managed to drive away players with their "game saving" features. Makes you wonder how many more "features" this game can survive..

Yep.. just making things harder with nothing added and leaves me asking "why bother" when I log in and start something. Why gather ore? Why build that ship? Why build anything? just to pay tax?

I can respect what you are saying, and I would almost agree. I am 100% bitter about the changes as I see what it is hurting players, especially new ones that never had a chance to hoard away millions of quanta or liters or ore. That said I feel after the last vlog they aren't the advocates for the players they once were. I don't feel they are being thorough in their work, and in some ways I feel they themselves have given up on doing the proper checks and balances needed for an update like this.

Things like needing T3 ore to have the equipment to get T3 ore are a prime example. That was a fundamental thing that was no complex issue. Something here is broken, and what really drives the angst for a lot of us is the silence in the forums, lack of response, and overall absence of the dev's in engaging with us. 

I don't hate them as people, but I do believe their ability to do the job well is deteriorating with each update. So much so that I spend more times on the forum than I do in game now. I used to be a pretty peaceful builder, was excited and happy to try to create community focused builds cause I believed in this game's potential.

That said when you have issues like ship engines not turning on reliably with the default scripts after 2+ years, and you can't switch containers during trade? These are actionable fixes not complex matters being neglected. So they do absolutely deserve to be called out for ignoring the community, shoving updates down our throats that destabilize the economy, gameplay ecosystems, ruin community projects, etc.

They were warned about the outcomes and the impact on the players, we pleaded for them not to make the update in the current state and they shoved right through and said "we know better than you"... which is why they are getting our angst.

The writing is on the wall, if they continue course the game we love will be dead before the end of next year if not sooner.

NQ Staff Meeting Minutes:

NQ-Sesh: What could we do to make the game more miserable for them?
NQ-Pann: *laughing about the last update at the players expense*
NQ-Deckard: Well we just implemented taxes, so lets do something like player perma-death where if you crash you lose all your skills, items, and progress.
 

Feedback is simple, your update is poorly thought out. I'm not sure what the dev meetings must be like over there at NQ but let me make this KISS for you folks:
 
Currently:
 
Zero reason to build anything period outside of a ship. Especially now with your well thought out brutal tax on any grand building ideas creatives might have ever had for POI's. 
PvP that most hate and even the PvP'ers have to admit sucks in it's implementation, never mind completely broken risk vs reward balance
Player based economy is a joke with your constant meddling with bots & refusal to let players setup markets
Industrial gameplay that was put out of reach of all but groups or highly dedicated no lifers with endless time on their hands
Gigantic game world that is so sparsely populated deserts in the real world seem to team with life by comparison
Asteroid mechanics that defy game design logic in their implementation (I mean really is it THAT hard for you to spawn roids randomly and continually like literally every space game with mining ... ever?)
Completely broken organization tools that make managing any group harder not easier. 
Mission system that could have be automatic and really helped the game world when it comes to posting / payouts , instead is a hot mess of must be present hand shaking nonsense. 
 
I could go on honestly, but EVERY single time you people do an update you overcomplicate everything and make it a nightmarish chore, rather then simply go "here are auto miners, enjoy". Asteroids same darn thing, couldn't just create a asteroid belt in the game and have rocks spawn randomly for period of time, part in the safe zone part out? OH NO , you had to make even something simple like digging a rock the most arse backwards design of all time. 
 
*sighs* I am not sure what your grand vision for DU is anymore , but it certainly does not contain the word 'fun' for most people. Every update makes the game more grindy, more work, less reward. The only joy people seem to have anymore is sitting in Discord / Forums talking about game theory of what DU might have been if it wasn't what it is.
 

Problem with your math is that it only works if you set your clock by the game, join regularly and behave like a good little citizen doing all the chores no questions asked.

1. Those that don't agree with you aren't automatically whiners.
2. Respectfully, go fuck yourself. I graduated with a 3.8 GPA in college and that included Trig, Calc, Linear Algrebra, Geometry etc. all in an advanced and accelerated 4 week course for all topics just listed. Far beyond "basic" math. Not everyone that disagrees with you is stupid either.
 
If you can't support your points without disrespecting/insulting myself and the general community, then your arguments are weak.

This is just so very funny and sad at the same time.
 
NQ basically hacked in a right to use a mining unit and called it "Mining Unit"
It's pretty much an unneeded right as the esixting rights should cover the use of a mining unit since:
Access to a mining unit allows it's use/activation as is the case for any other element in the game. The "Mine territory" right allows access to the territories resources and so determines whether activating a mining unit actually results in mining resources.  
Not to complicate things for themselves and since actually designing in a consistent way seems too hard, yesterday's "hotfix" shows
Updated Mining Unit right description and name.  
And with it the right "Mining Unit" is renamed to "Use Mining Unit". It's still a superfluous right for which there actually is no need. It also break the core design purpose of how the RDMS system is set up and should work (yes NQ, I understand how RDMS works, seemingly better than whoever thought this up). There is no need for this right as handmining and use of mining units is mutually exclusive, so one right "Mine Territory" is sufficient for either.
 
The fix should have been:
Removal of the "Mining Unit" right The "mine Territory" right will determine if a mining unit will be able to mine when activated  
This is textbook NQ "fixing bugs", the issue is still there and nothing really changes, we just change the rule in order to not have to actually address and fix anything. It also shows that different devs do not actually care to (re)use existing code or options and seemingly can't be bothered to learn the mechanics of a feature someone else made but feel they must cook their own at every corner..  The game is filled with examples of this.
 
Some will say this is a minor issue and why the fusss, I'd say, this is a structural flaw in the way NQ designs their game and uses their own in game functionality in inconsistent ways. It is a waste of developer resources/time and thus money.

Ok. let's try again to explain why I reported this as a bug:
 
- we will assume for simplicity that there is a complete wipe, and all players start at sanct.
- so some make it to alioth with the ingame shuttle and want to start to explore the "universe"
- space tech requires T2 ore
- space fuel requires T2 ore
- Tier 2 mining units require T2 ore to be built.
 
And there we have a problem. Because the pts scans showed quite clearly, that T2 ore is very rare on the the inner planets.
But you don't have T2 mining units yet. One needs to fly to space to find T2 somewhere else.
 
And all this with those 3 NON RESPAWNING 20 liter rocks that lay on the earth ???
 
Who is doing game design at NQ ? 
How can NQ-Cosmos tell me, it was never intended to have a respawn for surface rock ?
It was never intended to eliminate the normal mining gameplay. 
But that has changed.
So surface ore respawn has to change.
 
I am reporting this as a bug, because it is a serious bug in gameplay design.
And a support guy giving me this answer is ...... 

Hi Noveans,
Thanks for the warm welcome! Since I've joined I've been amazed by the incredible job the Novaquark team is doing, working hard on delivering the dream of Dual Universe. I’m also very impressed by how you, our community, have been supporting the DU project from day one. Let's all keep moving forward together!
Cheers,
Nouredine

If the rationale for taxes is to clear out inactive tiles wouldn't it make more sense to actually add FUN content so people come back and become active again.
 
It's obvious that NQ doenst actually play this game still. They think, rea life has death and taxes so they both have to be in game too? What?
 
So many changes starting with 0.23 only makes the game tedious. Paying taxes is suppose to be fun? Mining unit mini game is suppose to be fun?
 
Taxes may "solve" a problem but without the ability to physically mine the rewards of these mining units will be used to mostly pay taxes. 
 
Taxes in game destroy capital, remove content and slow progression. That money serves no real purpose it's simply cancelled. 

Easy solution to this whole vaccine patch...... first claimed tile is free! after that the tax can kick in incrementally.... 100k 2nd tile, 200k 3rd, 400k 4th, 800k 5th and so on...

>> The very first territory per planet per (paying!) player must be tax free <<
 
This is an easy way to preserve all the player created art and content all over the planets.
 
Everything else would be a digital middle finger raised towards the playerbase.
 
Thank you for reading.

Welcome Nouredine Abboud.

I sincerely hope your influence will encourage your team to minimize negative gaming experiences, game breaking changes piled up and delivered all at once, and to add large wings and xl atmo engines.

The problem is caused by this :
 
- player X claims a territory for HIMSELF
- player X drops a static core for his org Y
- player X places mining units on the static core that is owned by org Y
-> player X can not operate the mining unit, because he gets "Unauthorized request".
 
So either claim the territory for the org, or you must drop the core for yourself. 
 
Already filed a demeter bug report for this.

Total agree. A rough calculation tells me : the game is NOT fun anymore. So why should I pay for it ? These game mechanics would be ok (and expected) for a free to play game. But here I am paying real money. And what do I get ? I was used to bring home 100 to 200 kilo liters of ore PER DAY. What NQ gives me now is a fraction of that. They hinder my progress. They slow me down. This is the opposite of fun. Who is doing game design at NQ ? You want players in your game ? Then motivate them. I can not see motivation here. Its the 0.23 desaster happening again.
 
Some detailed problems :
- demeter will cut me off T3/T4/T5 supply. I would be forced to do PvP asteroid mining to have access.
- Scans are listing T2 but it is by far to rare. I have detailed maps on the old ore distribution around my base. Demeter is practically removing T2 from the surface. It is quite rare in only a few spots.
- Ore yield is simply off by a factor of 10 AT LEAST. who on earth designed that ? Any stupid guy doing surface mining is faster by several mangitudes ...
 

I confess I'm quite disappointed by what I saw in PTS regarding the implementation of mining units. 
 
1- Ridiculously low ore yield. Half an hour of manual mining will yield more ore than I could get from an tile's MU extraction in a week. So why even bother investing the time, quanta and talent points if there's no significant return? It barely covers the cost of fuel to travel between planets just to recalibrate MU's every 4 or 5 days. Tiles should have a far higher yield in order to make it worth the effort.
2- Calibration mini game is based on luck and not the player's actual ability to infer the best place to start extraction - seems pointless.
3- Regenerating calibration charges? Why not just stipulate a total amount of MU's a player can own (affected by talents), just like Core Units?
What to expect when Demeter lands in the live server? 
1- Ore shortages, leading to product shortages in the market. I doubt that MU's will have the capacity to produce an overall equivalent amount of ore as is currently produced by planetary mining.
2- Players actually having to dedicate more time to mining. MU's wont provide enough ore, and with only asteroids to mine, which have smaller ore nodes, mining is less efficient than current planetary mining, so more time spent. I expected the implementation of MU's would actually reduce the amount of time we would need to spend in manual mining, but I guess it's going to be the opposite.

So all the tier 2 ores on Alioth are 0L/H - that's a bug right? an 200L/H for Tier 1 - that's approx. 1/2 a single scoop of traditional mining - that ain't gonna power no industrial complex - who comes up with these numbers???

>> The very first territory per planet per (paying!) player must be tax free <<
 
This is an easy way to preserve all the player created art and content all over the planets.
 
Everything else would be a digital middle finger raised towards the playerbase.
 
Thank you for reading.

>> The very first territory per planet per (paying!) player must be tax free <<
 
This is an easy way to preserve all the player created art and content all over the planets.
 
Everything else would be a digital middle finger raised towards the playerbase.
 
Thank you for reading.

Total agree. A rough calculation tells me : the game is NOT fun anymore. So why should I pay for it ? These game mechanics would be ok (and expected) for a free to play game. But here I am paying real money. And what do I get ? I was used to bring home 100 to 200 kilo liters of ore PER DAY. What NQ gives me now is a fraction of that. They hinder my progress. They slow me down. This is the opposite of fun. Who is doing game design at NQ ? You want players in your game ? Then motivate them. I can not see motivation here. Its the 0.23 desaster happening again.
 
Some detailed problems :
- demeter will cut me off T3/T4/T5 supply. I would be forced to do PvP asteroid mining to have access.
- Scans are listing T2 but it is by far to rare. I have detailed maps on the old ore distribution around my base. Demeter is practically removing T2 from the surface. It is quite rare in only a few spots.
- Ore yield is simply off by a factor of 10 AT LEAST. who on earth designed that ? Any stupid guy doing surface mining is faster by several mangitudes ...