Jump to content

PVP Sucks


Slayer031992
 Share

Recommended Posts

On 12/31/2021 at 9:26 AM, Metsys said:

It has been clear from the very start that combat would be the way it is right now. Elite Dangerous, Star Wars or Star Citizen space combat is not at all feasible with the game's infrastructure, with voxel technology already devouring most processing and server performance.

The pvp ad videos of NQ are scripted little things that wont realistically happen in ordinary happenstance. Carriers deploying fighters that dogfight around the big battleships that slug it out, Star Wars style, does look intriguing and is an eye catcher, but simply not a thing that happens outside of dedicated community events.

The best comparison you should draw your PvP expectations from is The Expanse franchise. Combat there happens through 3 (or 4 if you count flinging asteroids) weapons:

-railguns for long distance, but they are dodgable the further away the target is,

-torpedoes with practically unlimited distance, and

-PDC (point-defense cannons) which are for close quarter battle (CQB) or to actively take out torpedoes.
There you have 3 modes of range: torpedoes for far up to unlimited range, railgun for effective middle range upon moving targets and PDC as close range.
And most every single fight is decided in the long ranges by torpedoes and railguns. We are talking hundreds of kilometers. PDCs take out the torpedo threats but otherwise chances that ships even get close enough to riddle eachother with bullet holes of PDCs instead of already blowing up from the other 2 weapon types is very small.

In DU you have a similar concept, but 4 weapon types:

-Railguns for max range, high damage per shot but low dps
-laser for medium to long range, higher rate of fire and dps
-missiles for medium range, high damage per salvo, kinda like a "shotgun" to quote NQ themselves
-cannons for close to medium range, low damage per shot but high rate of fire for strong dps

Currently, and for the foreseeable future, PvP combat engagements will happen at rather large ranges, taking out targets at hundreds of kilometers before you would even be able make out a target with your eyes alone. Chances a ship with XS or S weaponry (being an XS or S core) getting close enough to an L ship to effectively use something like cannons is very slim. With ships all maxing out at 30.000 km/h they wouldn't be able to close the distance anyway, unless the approached L core wills it so.

I like the idea of long-range combat like this and am comfortable with it. IMHO we'd need small core vessels to be able to slot L or M weaponry to their S gunner seats (even if 1 L weapon completely maxes out the capacity of the chair) to make smaller core ships fill a niche and make them viable as being near impossible to hit by L cores while being able to meaningfully engage them at THEIR ranges. Then they could in return be countered by dedicated gun platforms with smaller caliber weapons to take out these niche S ships due to hit probs. Lots of balancing and math involved with that concept idea, but worth thinking about.

Otherwise pvp could maybe benefit some visual improvements. If you shoot something and go into third person you should see a little light flicker in the distance from the impact of your shot, not just having a hole appear on the enemy ship in the telescope.

PS: damn, look at me monologuing

If you look at the promo videos of EVE online there is also action and other things .. but in practice, fleet pvp in eve .. ends for the happy pilot by pressing 1-2 buttons. and apart from tables and a square, there is nothing on the screen :) .. But after all, no one died or whines ..

And then some terrible misunderstanding.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Feriniya said:

Starbase is no longer a competitor to anyone .. Starbase is already more than dead .. forget about it :)

The same is said about DualUniverse, StarCitizen, NewWorld and the best example of "the game is dead" is probably World of Warcraft, which is supposed to be dead for over 10 years and still has several million players.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

57 minutes ago, VandelayIndustries said:

 

bild.png.832c21d47da82eeb52f055b2c92167d5.png


 

Screenshot (4362).png
 

 

 

9969 = 100%
117 = 1,17% (alpha)

913634 = 100%

55057= 6,02

 

We can speculate about numbers, I assume that in DualUniverse also the time of the highest active player numbers is long gone and there are only very few players currently. Not to mention the countless twink accounts. 

I don't blame DualUniverse or Starbase, since both are still stuck deep in an alpha stage and there is still a lot of content missing that can't be evaluated or tested.

In contrast to that is the comparison to NewWorld. Find it very sad that this game could not maintain or expand the player numbers. I'm primarily guessing the permanent intrusive grind and comparatively lousy character control. (But everyone has to decide for themselves)

I'm more curious about the numbers when Starbase, StarCitizen or DualUniverse are released. What do these games offer then? And, do all these players make it to a release?

 

Edited by Zarcata
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, Zarcata said:

The same is said about DualUniverse, StarCitizen, NewWorld and the best example of "the game is dead" is probably World of Warcraft, which is supposed to be dead for over 10 years and still has several million players.

no mate .. not the same Dual Universe.. and not the same WOW.. and etc.. Starbase no any moer ppl there.. atol.. like you can see it. And many million ppl WOW.. and 100 on Starbase is looks like not the same right?

And you cannot call wow dead game cose there you dont like changes.. same like DU..  If you not like or game not fallow your idea and view.. is not mean game dead.. WOW for example have many million players.. is mean not dead.. only dead for you not for game . 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 11/17/2021 at 6:11 PM, Walter said:

Did any of you try out DU PvP with friends on a not staged fight? One can repeat what one hears from others like a parrot or try it out. DU PvP can be real fun if you are introduced to it by knowing people. Here is an example of something else than an L core in DU PvP XD

 

 

 

 

Every time I see this video pop up I think more and more NQ should add a cooldown on weapons when they are placed down. Have it be like 5 minutes before the weapon can be fired. Anyone going with the desire of engaging in PVP should have their ships already armed well before getting into the combat area anyways... At least whoever is watching on the other ship has the time to react if some joker decides to place down a XS core, a weapon and core their ship, which is more like griefing than actual PVPing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Wolfram said:

 At least whoever is watching on the other ship has the time to react if some joker decides to place down a XS core, a weapon and core their ship, which is more like griefing than actual PVPing.

There is no effort at all to install a shield on your ship to avoid being ganked like this. This playstyle is much needed and should be promoted not fought in my opinion.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Wolfram said:

 

Every time I see this video pop up I think more and more NQ should add a cooldown on weapons when they are placed down. Have it be like 5 minutes before the weapon can be fired. Anyone going with the desire of engaging in PVP should have their ships already armed well before getting into the combat area anyways... At least whoever is watching on the other ship has the time to react if some joker decides to place down a XS core, a weapon and core their ship, which is more like griefing than actual PVPing.


 

Like seriously ?

So, are you really complaining about getting killed by a single XS cannon?

Do you think about putting a shield on your ship on day maybe ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Perhaps it should be remembered that spaceships are not tanks. As a rule, spaceships have a paper-thin outer skin that can be seriously damaged with the smallest things. In that respect, a tank can withstand various bombardments up to a certain strength and impact force.
Most sci-fi movies rely on various shields.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

L cores should the the mammoth cruiser class ships (XL cores capitol ships) but currently its L core ships so tiny they more or less M core with weapons or even smaller.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 11/17/2021 at 6:31 PM, Warlander said:

The biggest problems with PvP are and have always been:

  • Its not based in any skill since its basically tab target and not by actually requiring people to see the radar and get up close enough to actually target ships to lock onto them with homing missles, cannons, chainguns, etc.

This is the sort of thing people say when they haven't actually *tried* PvP.  It's true that getting killed by a pirate without bothering to figure out how to fight back or escape requires very little skill but once you actually try to either get and keep someone in your optimal, evade another ship to escape, get out of someone elses optimal while staying in yours, maneuver to get the best hit chances while minimising someone else's or whatever you'll realise that there actually *is* skill there.  It just isn't the sort of skill you're expecting when you just read about it.

 

 

On 11/17/2021 at 6:31 PM, Warlander said:
  • Its not about slow boating since you can warp out of anything. Its not a bad thing since PvP is lame but with speed limits at 30K Kmph cap you cant outrun players or missles even if you should have had the jump on them leaving before them since missles essentially travel practically forever faster than you could ever outrun.

No you can't.  If someone can get you identified and shoot at you before you can get into warp you can't warp away and are stuck in the fight.  You would know that if you had tried it.  Also missiles aren't really a thing in PvP right now.

 

On 11/17/2021 at 6:31 PM, Warlander said:
  • Its not about how much armaments you can add you can pretty much stack and fill a core with as much firepower as you want since the best defense in this game is pre offense with unlimited ammo, no power cells/reactors, overheating, jams, etc.

No you can't.  A lot of PvP is about speed.  If you ram a core full of as many guns as you can it will be slow and require a lot of players to man the guns.  You're better off putting those players onto more smaller ships.  Same with ammo, bring too much and you can't shoot it all but it will still slow you down so your target can get away.  Again, you'd know this if you had tried it.

 

On 11/17/2021 at 6:31 PM, Warlander said:

Until all of this changes this game aint a legit PvP game.

I suggest you actually go out there and try doing some PvP before writing it off like this.  It's true that PvP isn't perfect but it is there, it is fun and it is slowly getting better over time.  What it really needs is more people doing it and un-informed comments like this are really unhelpful IMO because they just put people off.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...