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So NQ has stated that Construct vs Construct combat will be released in a future expansion, and that means in the meantime ship vs ship combat will be limited to boarding parties. I'm perfectly fine with this, and understand why they need to wait to release CvC combat due to development costs. However, this concept seems incomplete. How exactly does one catch an enemy ship in order to board it, without even basic CvC combat?

 

Space is a big place, with a lot of place to run/hide, which is great, but a problem if you are trying to board a ship. It's not like someone is just going to pull over and agree to be boarded, unless they think they can win. Otherwise, the second another ship tries to get close, people are just going to leave. And with no way for ships to shoot at each other or otherwise disable another ship, there will be nothing anyone can do prevent people from just running away. It's not like you can lean out the window and try to shoot out their engines with a pistol.

 

This would eliminate many forms of emergent gameplay:

  • Smugglers
  • Pirates
  • Navies
  • Police
  • Blockade Runners
  • Blockades

Ships would essentially be nothing more than flying buses, perfectly safe from any sort of threat. Space would be reduced to nothing more than a means to get from planet to planet, rather than an interesting environment of its own.

 

As such, I feel that, even if advanced CvC combat doesn't come out until a future expansion, there should be a basic system in place to allow ships to disable/immobilize other ships, so as to allow boarding parties to do their job. 

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Well if they don't have the time or resources to add it immediately then they won't. I believe they are efficiency allotting their time at Novaquark, and if when the alpha comes out there is no way to attack other ships, that is unfortunate but no one is forced to play. It will be in alpha, and as such incomplete; and other areas deemed more important will be focused on first. I know they're trying to make a fantastic game, and as such I know they'll do what's best when they see fit.

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You've definitely got a point.

 

Has NQ mentioned anything about Player vs Construct combat yet?

 

I wonder if they plan to let players target and attack constructs.

I would be a little surprised if PVC combat was not a thing at launch, as that would allow players to effectively hide in a construct (assuming it wasn't an open-topped speeder).

This is deff one of those "we'll have to wait and see" kind of things

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You've definitely got a point.

 

Has NQ mentioned anything about Player vs Construct combat yet?

 

I wonder if they plan to let players target and attack constructs.

Yes you will be able to damage constructs from what I understood. Player vs construct.

 

Even if there was some form of "tractor beam" you would still need to break down the door. I'm ok with CvC after launch but OP brings up some good points.

 

And the tractor beam was something they might look into after launch. So yea...

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Well if they don't have the time or resources to add it immediately then they won't. I believe they are efficiency allotting their time at Novaquark, and if when the alpha comes out there is no way to attack other ships, that is unfortunate but no one is forced to play. It will be in alpha, and as such incomplete; and other areas deemed more important will be focused on first. I know they're trying to make a fantastic game, and as such I know they'll do what's best when they see fit.

 

I know they are doing their best to make a fantastic game, and alpha is designed to be an alpha. I was referring to features at launch.

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You board big ships with smaller ones? Nah I don't know how they will manage the fact we need to board... by a sas ? how.

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For reference this was in the AMA, its the only thing i have found that speaks to player vs construct at launch when CvC is not around.

 

"If Construct vs Construct' is a stretch goal, how about ""Construct vs Player""?

How are the PVP battles going to be if you don't get this ""Construct vs Construct"" stretch goal?"

 

First of all, if we don't reach a given Stretch Goal, is does not mean that the feature will never be implemented, but that it might be postponed to a (free) game expansion. Remember that this is a MMO, and unlike a singleplayer game, there is no "final" build. Now, Construct vs Construct combat means more precisely that we implement certain elements like weapons, shields, etc, that you will be able to use to make localized dammage to other constructs. If this damage hits a players inside the construct (or at the surface of a planet), this player will die and respawn. So, in effect, CvsC combat implies CvsPlayer too! Now, without CvsC combat you could still board enemy ships and take control of them by neutralizing the crew. Who knows, maybe this will become the prefered way of doing combat business in Dual!
 
it seems to state that player vs construct will not be in game at launch, if i understand it right.

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For reference this was in the AMA, its the only thing i have found that speaks to player vs construct at launch when CvC is not around.

 

 

First of all, if we don't reach a given Stretch Goal, is does not mean that the feature will never be implemented, but that it might be postponed to a (free) game expansion. Remember that this is a MMO, and unlike a singleplayer game, there is no "final" build. Now, Construct vs Construct combat means more precisely that we implement certain elements like weapons, shields, etc, that you will be able to use to make localized dammage to other constructs. If this damage hits a players inside the construct (or at the surface of a planet), this player will die and respawn. So, in effect, CvsC combat implies CvsPlayer too! Now, without CvsC combat you could still board enemy ships and take control of them by neutralizing the crew. Who knows, maybe this will become the prefered way of doing combat business in Dual!
 
it seems to state that player vs construct will not be in game at launch, if i understand it right.

 

 

Yes, I saw this. They said the only initial way to do combat is to board the enemy ship and neutralize the enemy crew. My point is that without any sort of CvC combat, nobody is going to be able to board anybody else in the first place. So the boarding aspect becomes virtually nonexistent as well, hence my point that if they wish for boarding to be possible, they will have to have some sort (even if it's very limited) CvC or the whole thing falls apart. I know they will release the full CvC later, that's not in dispute, but I'm talking about at the initial launch of the game.

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Build a porch on your interdictor and let players stand there to shoot the pursued vessel until they blow out an engine, then board.

 

For some reason when I envision this, the people on the porch are sitting in rocking chairs with old-timey shotguns haha. But that's not a bad idea, if it's possible with the planned game mechanics.

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Also since there is a common theory that it will take the collective populace a while to get the tech to leave orbit, there is a good chance that hover vehicles will get a "speeder" style open-top cockpit. planetside, you may be able to just pop someone out of their ship.

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CvC is a 600K Euro stretch goal. Go up your pledge if you want it :P

 

I'll be smuggling just fine without it, but you pirates will be SOL.

 

Seriously, I don't think there's any chance that this won't be in the game shortly after launch... maybe delayed long enough for us to build some ships and get the hang of flying them before we have to fight.

 

My ship will probably be unarmed in favor of a couple of extra thrusters or maybe some pivots so all thrusters can thrust in the same direction for escape. (Of course that working is dependent on the flight model).

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I'll be smuggling just fine without it, but you pirates will be SOL.

 

Not really smuggling if no one can stop you, and if no one can stop you, why would anyone ever hire a smuggler?

 

"you pirates" lol

 

 

....

 

My ship will probably be unarmed in favor of a couple of extra thrusters or maybe some pivots so all thrusters can thrust in the same direction for escape. (Of course that working is dependent on the flight model).

 

This is an interesting idea. Catching people could (in the initial days of the game) be based on speed, so the preferred type of ship for "you pirates" could be "go fasts" which are nothing more than a bunch of engines attached to a cockpit.

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Not really smuggling if no one can stop you, and if no one can stop you, why would anyone ever hire a smuggler?

 

"you pirates" lol

 

 

 

This is an interesting idea. Catching people could (in the initial days of the game) be based on speed, so the preferred type of ship for "you pirates" could be "go fasts" which are nothing more than a bunch of engines attached to a cockpit.

It's smuggling if the ruling org would arrest you if they caught you. It's just that the arrest would take place on the ground. (If you were violating an export restricting rather than an import restriction, yes, the authority would have a hard time stopping you.)

 

I guess if cockpit+thrusters+weapon catches on with the pirates, I won't be able to get enough thrusters on my ship since I'm carrying cargo and I'll have to arm up. Or just make sure you don't find me.

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I think in the first few months it'll be something like this:

 

Hauler:

- cargo is heavy

- needs thrusters to even achieve a reasonable velocity

- outrun / hide

- fast, small and light cargo or slow, heavy lots of cargo

 

Pirate:

- small, fast

- big, slow, but manned with death squad

 

when CvC is introduced, some mechanics would be nice...like (if i may take eve example here) scram and warp core stabilizers.

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Also since there is a common theory that it will take the collective populace a while to get the tech to leave orbit, there is a good chance that hover vehicles will get a "speeder" style open-top cockpit. planetside, you may be able to just pop someone out of their ship.

Uh. Grand Theft Speeder announced.

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What if you can dock on another ship's surface? Then you would have to match the target's speed, get within docking distance, and connect. After that it shouldn't be too hard for your crew to blow a hole in the hull and board.

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What if you can dock on another ship's surface? Then you would have to match the target's speed, get within docking distance, and connect. After that it shouldn't be too hard for your crew to blow a hole in the hull and board.

Actually if the ship or station you want to dock onto is big enough and your ship small enough, you'll get stick to it by gravity. Else, a sticking system for small ships should be cool, like the 'connect' you said.

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Actually if the ship or station you want to dock onto is big enough and your ship small enough, you'll get stick to it by gravity. Else, a sticking system for small ships should be cool, like the 'connect' you said.

Not sure it will work out like that.

I'll be very surprised if mass affects gravity in space.

 

On planets gravity will matter but in space? I dont know man...

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Not sure it will work out like that.

I'll be very surprised if mass affects gravity in space.

 

On planets gravity will matter but in space? I dont know man...

You see the Death Star? Well it's big so of course we could land on it. But let's say an Empire cruiser, very big it is, with a tiny ship you should just be stuck to it, the cruiser is like 1000 to 10,000 times bigger than you are. I don't think these number could be achievable, but only 100 time bigger, you get stuck to it, or you just need to be fixed a little bit.

For ships to create gravity it would be great but I don't expect it, I rather expect the planets to have their gravitational field also occurring into space...

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For ships to create gravity it would be great but I don't expect it, I rather expect the planets to have their gravitational field also occurring into space...

Exactly but while we are speculating, JC said that from a game engine point of view there is no difference between a planet and a construct. So speculate on that with the gravity question.

 

Food for thought?

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Exactly but while we are speculating, JC said that from a game engine point of view there is no difference between a planet and a construct. So speculate on that with the gravity question.

 

Food for thought?

He could make a difference because of the calculations. The ships are in one or multiple gravitational fields from the planets, if they create gravitation themselves it would mean bending the space again, and mean more complexity in the gravitation prospect.

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He could make a difference because of the calculations. The ships are in one or multiple gravitational fields from the planets, if they create gravitation themselves it would mean bending the space again, and mean more complexity in the gravitation prospect.

Very good point.

I did not look at it like that.

 

Have a like.

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