malteins

it contradicts pretty much the spirit of the game. Single shard universe. If they lose this one, then this game is dead 100%.
 

Okay, bye. ?
 
checking the kickstarter, what about this goal: 
did that get cancelled? 
 
edit: what about this promise: The economy in Dual Universe is realistic and under player control

Lies. The bot orders buying t1/t2 ores and selling schematics are a blatant betrayal.

Is it just me or do the responses seem to show frustration, with just a hint of resentment? Each answer seems to show an increasing level of anger, like he's mad at the players for what they've done with his game. ?
 

F**K!!!

"Sell order of 1 Container fulfilled on Market market." Thanks!
 
What container? S, M, L?
Which market? (this info was there before infamous 0.23)
What price?

Is the discord still moderated by self-appointed players who let their friends get away with all kinds of abusive crap while coming down hard on players they don't like? smh
 
Nothing wrong with that joke, imo. And there's an element of truth - working at any start-up is precarious.

I don't get it, I understand the changes and why they're attempting it, but it still makes absolutely no sense why the market sells elements cheaper than you can make them.

As an ORG member calculated;
 
 
So if the item is 3 times the cost to produce, than purchasing, where is the sweat shop running with child labour and how do we get this setup, still not seeing a schematic for that anywhere?

I have said it for a long time, the economy does not make sense, bots that sell cheaper than you can make them will kill the game. Get rid of the PERIOD, let the players and their actions set the price as it will pan out.

After listening to the video on the patch release with JC interview, I see his mission, but no reasoning.
Maybe an economist needs to be hired.

We pay tax on everything, where does this tax go?
IRL these taxes mean something, here they're just a s@#$hole sink for the sake of it. My taxes build roads, pay for public buildings, emergency services, and so on.
Do you see anything other than Markets as Public Buildings, no, where is our emergency services when we crash and be rescued.....

We need to make DU great again, I hear Trump is looking for a new job, anyone....

imho the problem with industry isn't solved by schematics, it's just pushed back.
 
The problem was the "zero cost" of producing: once you have your machines (refiners, smelters, ..., assembly lines) you don't need power , fuel or whatever to use them. You have no upkeep at all. You just need to input ores.
 
That's why even a solo player could gradually build and use a huge industry: what he already has cost nothing to run.
 
That's why ores were more valuable than their contribution in final products: because it cost nothing to transform them once you have the industry so for instance 10L of hematite are worth more their ratio in <whatever is made with 10L of hematite> because they are less 'specialized'. 
 
Schematics don't solve that. It's a band-aid, a bad one. Their timing is bad. The implementation is sloppy and it adds unneeded complexity (talents and tiers of machines). In a few weeks the situation will be the same but a lot of players will be gone.
 
Running costs (power, fuel, fees, whatever) was what was needed. And they said it's planned so why not wait till then ?
 
 
 
 

Look, the majority of your player base does not like this patch. and you should be more than aware of it. There were things that could have been done, things that have been suggested on here a multitude of times in the past. This patch... despite your Discord Q&A, and all of your live streams, all it showed us is that you simply did not listen to your player base, or their ideas. We are the beta testers, and we have given our feedback on so many, if not all of the currently available  aspects, and tools of the game which could increase the enjoyability for everyone.
 
your testers are leaving. I've seen several people  cancel their subscription, myself included. My sub ends on JAN 11 2021, and from how things are looking, I do not think Ill be resubbing after that date. However it isn't too late. There are other updates which could fix this, patches that can draw DU's community back to the game. After watching your discord, the forums, and talking to so many other players from in game, and on other discord servers. I think I can summarize the changes needed which could bring some the faith back to DU's community.
 
1: SCHEMATICS: Now I want to say this first. Schematics are not inherently bad, however the way it has been implemented is the biggest problem we have here. It was implemented to bring value to intermediate parts, and to suck money out of the world. You want to have players buy them off of the market. you want the market to be used, correct? There were better ways to handle this problem. 

Schematics can stay, but not for everything. By placing them on absolutely every item that we can produced through a factory unit, you have effectively placed a ransomware on your own game. We cant do anything anymore without forking over absurd amounts of cash to get access to the game. This is not a model for any level of play. New comer's will be turned away from this, and more experienced players will simply give up on the game, which they have done.

Basic Items of all types should be free of schematics. Doing this allows everyone to at least experience the core  aspects of DU. we can build, fly around and explore. DU can feel like a game again, and not a second virtual job. 

Schematics can be on everything else. Military engines, advanced, or uncommon parts, advanced weapons. Everything that isn't tier 1 should have a schematic in order to give your player base a goal, a reason to want to improve, to invest time into DU. (but maybe release tier 1 weapons as civilian weapons that need T1 and T2 ores only.  just so that newbies can get the feel of how combat works in this game, yea?)

2:RECYCLERS AND SCRAP: recyclers are sitting In a weird spot, right? they only have 2 uses. To make scrap, and to pump out gasses. These two simple jobs makes recyclers relatively useless in the grander scheme of the game when compared to all of the other industry elements. What if they didn't have to be? what if they could be redesigned to be one of the most important industrial units in the game, and provide a way to fuel the economy in way we currently cannot reproduce on our own through emergent gameplay? What if.... they could... Recycle? 
 
Scrap as it stands now was an OK Method to repair our elements in the earlier days of this game. but those days are long gone, and you need a reason for the market to exist, you need a reason for people to sell small parts, intermediate parts on these markets! Ok. We can do that, and recyclers are the answer. Allow recyclers to break down elements, and damaged elements with less that 3, or 5 repairs left. Allow the amount of "lives" of an element determine how many intermediate components a recycler can pull out of any particular element. Allow it to be random in which parts are chosen. For example, if you recycle one space engine, you get the ionic chamber, and a few screws. If you recycle a second one, you could get the reinforced frame, and a burner or two. It could also produce scrap still!  Scrap can come in the form of a useless item that needs to be further broken down to remake pure metals. But wait. what will we use to repair our elements if  scrap becomes useless? INTERMEDIATE PARTS!

look at Space engineers for inspiration. we use components to repair their broken blocks. You do not need to equip the parts you need, the welding tool simply pulls the correct parts out of your inventory, and applies them to the damaged block until it is repaired! Its simple, its elegant, and immersive. Doing this creates not only an actual engineering role for crew members, but it creates salvagers, recycling plants dedicated to breaking down old parts. It creates jobs in DU that people can take their roll in, and  enjoy. This can be even furthered with skills to make recyclers more efficient at pulling out parts, and breaking down elements faster.
 
Intermediate  parts will be in high demand  on the markets after this because they are NEEDED to repair elements as opposed to scrap. 

PS: make cores repairable with intermediate parts too. larger dynamic cores are already hard to make, having the ability to restore them with the rare parts they require would be a nice thing to have. 

 

Why are those 2 checked? Because of "Salvageable ships"? lmao
 
Does NQ want to obviously be deceptive here and post more "examples" but check it as done as soon as ONE item on that list makes it to the game? Like....Really?

Mega-corps get more Mega, the "little guy" solo player gets squeezed out even more. Poor decision, NQ. In addition, now tons of trained talents are wasted.

NQ is losing it's vision on what they promised the game would be...
Not just these changes, but everything i saw during the last few years...
They are taking the fun out of it, i do more work in DU then my actual RL work...
 
No banana for NQ!

Absolutely pointless patch... adding tedium for the sake of tedium. This won't change anything in the long-run, but it will make life harder (and even more boring) for those who work for a living, the solo player,  those that don't sell finished ships, and those who don't exploit the various bugs in the short run. You already had to spend most the game underground mining to do anything in this game and increasing the cost of one of the very few alternatives (which STILL requires mining a lot to get started) only serves to make this game worse. Those already rich and those that exploit various bugs won't even bat an eye at this unless you make the prices so ludicrous that it exempts solo players and small orgs from taking part in industry at all... and if that's the case you just made the largest portions of a games population in any MMO alienated.

As for the "You would be better off going to the market to buy at minimal cost from specialized producers competing against each other. " bit you have in the blog? You obviously don't realize people are going to add the cost of those schematics and other start-up costs to the product. The economy in this game is shit, yes, with nearly everything being at, or near, production cost on the market right now. The increase in market cost will be a welcome change for those like me who sell product on the market so I don't have to mine... but you're fooling yourself if you think it will be more cost-effective to buy off the market in the near future.

Worse yet is the introduction of the skills... as if industry didn't take to long already! I've got 700+ days qued right now and thats only for the - cost and + product skills for tiers 1-3 to finish off the last two levels to get to level 5!

This is truly frustrating for me... I love this game and it's the only one with the building system currently in existence, but you seemed damned determined to kill off your game with the trajectory that this and previous patches have followed... much less the rumors of future patches. Stop nerfing everything into the ground and fix your bugs! THEN focus on adding content. Nerfing and making things harder like this should be LAST on the agenda, not first.

making it to hard to produce is the same reason i left EVE after 12 years. So after Tier 4-5 become impossible to find you now want to make it really hard to build. im thinking that your shooting yourself in the foot

I think this change is garbage. I really liked that I could jump into this game and do anything, with skills just making my chosen activity more efficient. If I had wanted to deal with schematics and skills to use machines I'd have just stayed playing Eve Online and dealt with their mess of skills. Your industry is already monotonous with an insane number of clicks need to create any part and limited by the number of links you can have. Should have just added higher tiers of machines for the different tiers of parts so the new folks could still easily build basic parts to fuel their creations and have to be more dedicated to build giga factories.

Illogical Wrong decision!
 
Add something new to the game that gives both small and large entrepreneurs a task.
 
What this can be is electricity, both sides have to provide their industry with electricity as far as possible they have it in hand.
 
greeting

I'm a pretty new player and spent a few weeks getting to grips with the game and finding my way around.  Its taken a long time and a lot of work to build a ship, lots of money repairing after learning to fly through smashing up on Alioth time and time again, and spent hours looking for T3+ ores, which have been totally unsuccessful. Even after 3+ hours each way flying to other planets to hunt, only to find that theyve been stripped bare.
Im not interested in joining an org, I want to play the game as an individual, but this step seems to make it even more impossible for new players to get to grips with Dual universe, and I honestly think that it will totally ruin the game for players like me.  Ive worked really hard to build a small factory to produce a Territory Scanner with ores that Ive laboriously mined, which has taken weeks.Without the ability to generate decent income you are effectively stuck, unable to be able to move forward.  It not even possible  to mine for decent ore to generate income as its been completely hoovered up everywhere.  Wouldnt it be better to somehow impose a levvy on larger factories to limit their output or profits rather than punishing small fry like me?
I still havent been able to afford a warp drive, and building a factory seemed like the only sustainable way to acheive this - so I hope you put things into place to help newbie players, who, by the time they have learned the game will be doomed to a poor, boring life on Alioth & Sanctuary!  And what happens to all the industrial units Ive slowly purchased that I will now need a huge investment to use? I honestly think that I will lose interest, just at a point where I felt I was getting somewhere....... .   .     .        .           .                   .                                             !
 

This update will only work if there is a full wipe or else big orgs just buy all recipes and dominate the game while the game gets even harder for small groups or solos who are struggling even now.

When are you going to introduce a Contract or a Mission mecanic ?
We also need cleaner or wider market, with a system to put away annoying things like advertised ship taking the whole landing zone for nothing, or adverts surrouding the elevators.
That would be a positiv factor for people to actually WANT to go to markets..
 

Add some Parking Fee for those who trashes their ship next to market. Or do some administrative to permition only for good constructs and ban tons of crapy containers.