Anonymous

I'm going to use very short and simple sentances to underscore this point.
 
Regardless of the options in play - ALL OF US need to be aware of a fundamental key, immutable fact:
 
The success of the game determines the value of the DAC.
 
Let me say that again slowly in a different way.
 
NovaQuark provides Platform as a Service (PaaS).
 
They do not do content.
 
They do not make the community.
 
That is for us and us alone.
 
If the game tanks, DAC's are effectively worthless.
 
If the community is shit, divided and un-inclusive, and the emergent gameplay doesn't occur, the game tanks.
 
EACH AND EVERYONE ONE OF US HERE WILL DETERMINE THE SUCCESS OF THE GAME.
 
IT IS ON US TO MAKE OR BREAK THE BUSINESS MODEL.
 
Regardless of the option you may vote for above - remember this immutable fact.
 
The technology may be NovaQuark's, but the experience we make as a community is ours and ours alone. That is the real value DAC's reflect and what should be of highest concern to each and every one of you.
 
*end rant* 

I'm going to use very short and simple sentances to underscore this point.
 
Regardless of the options in play - ALL OF US need to be aware of a fundamental key, immutable fact:
 
The success of the game determines the value of the DAC.
 
Let me say that again slowly in a different way.
 
NovaQuark provides Platform as a Service (PaaS).
 
They do not do content.
 
They do not make the community.
 
That is for us and us alone.
 
If the game tanks, DAC's are effectively worthless.
 
If the community is shit, divided and un-inclusive, and the emergent gameplay doesn't occur, the game tanks.
 
EACH AND EVERYONE ONE OF US HERE WILL DETERMINE THE SUCCESS OF THE GAME.
 
IT IS ON US TO MAKE OR BREAK THE BUSINESS MODEL.
 
Regardless of the option you may vote for above - remember this immutable fact.
 
The technology may be NovaQuark's, but the experience we make as a community is ours and ours alone. That is the real value DAC's reflect and what should be of highest concern to each and every one of you.
 
*end rant* 

Oh yeah, that's something OP and his brother should know.
 
OP, JC has said that all physical goods in the game will have to be moved physically and manually. So if someone orders anything physical from your market, it'll have to be either picked up or delivered.

@yamamushi I hear you.
 
In defence of @GalloInfligo - I read his use of the word "scum bags" not as muck slinging in the debate, but rather, a term referring to real life, out of play people who are seeking to literally steal what is effectively real money.
 
If that's not the context in which he meant it - well - then @GalloInfligo - I must disagree - there must be a means or mechanic (community driven or otherwise) that allows for "friendly" in-game "redistribution of wealth" (piracy/covert ops between corps/outlaws etc), but in no way makes things a simple gank-fest (sorry Twerk n co) - there has to be risk on both sides, and reward, and more importantly, a feeling that even if one side or another loses, that the experience was FUN and not something that will make players rage-quit, or otherwise constitute RL actions which anywhere else would be considered pure cyber-bullying or predatory activity.
 
As you were.

Is this really what we've come to? Slinging insults back and forth at one another?
 
We're trying to have an open discussion about this to find a way that makes both sides happy, because there are passionate people on both sides of the issue (you wouldn't be calling people scumbags for disagreeing with you otherwise). 
 
Regardless of if you agree with their playstyle or not, those "scumbags" are going to be in the game one way or another, and they are just as much paying customers as the rest of us. Trying to exclude things that appeal to that style of gameplay simply because they make us uncomfortable thinking about isn't the right way to go about it. 
 
It's not like I don't have anything riding on this if they were lootable items, I'm getting 80 DAC's with my pledge and if I lost them all in-game that would be on me.
 
I mean really, look at at my posts here, do I really seem like the kind of person that's going to be a pirate? I'm interested in much deeper gameplay than that. Though I understand that it's an important element and style of gameplay that needs to exist. 

i had a funny feeling i would regret involvement with this topic.  it really does bring out some very strong opinions and emotions which is understandable but I don't recall anyone being attacked.  I think I'm the newest person here and I certainly don't know how things should work, but I do enjoy reading (and sometimes taking part in the discussions) regarding the early evolution of this project.  There's a lot of knowledgeable and experienced ppl in here (much more than myself) and its interesting to see all the different viewpoints.
 
i'll elaborate on a couple things then i'll excuse myself from this topic forever more.  How do you justify DAC's existence if you want full emergent gameplay?  You don't.  We are discussing how we deal with DAC's being in the game (as a done deal) and how it should be handled.  That is a decision by NQ, for better or worse.  I would like to think that no one associated with this forum would be using the DAC shortcomings for stealing.  Maybe there are scumbags among us but personally I have had a very positive experience with everyone I've met in here so far, but here was the point regarding a lootable DAC:  No one wants to take anyone's lunch money so they cannot play DU next month.  Jeez, at least I hope not.
 
Buy your DAC, put it safely away (NQ needs to ensure this is possible), and use the dam thing to cover your monthly fee.  End of Story right?   However....  if you are going to use the DAC for another purpose (actually I can think of many) such as transporting a bunch of it somewhere so you can make a huge profit with another corporation or player... then yes, imo it's fair game.  
 
I hope that no one gets too stressed or assumes the worst regarding gameplay ideas and opinions.  If so, then I will bet that was not the intent.  Have a good evening everyone.  

Im tired of hearing about emergent gameplay concerning DACs, if you want emergent gameplay, how do you justify DACs existance in the game world? Its a real thing to sell,trade that gives you game time to play. Your emergent play should only care about real game items that you use. All of your arguments to promote the stealing of someone elses game play time are completely ridiculous.
 
I honestly hope they do not go to this play style, and if you guys drop over i wish ypu well in eve where you can do this.
 
I am sick of seeing this community attack the new members, and i am also sick of you all thinking that your idea is the only way this game should work. Guess what, a lot of people dont want to steal a 12 year olds month of game play, and we think it should be protected from scum bags trying to steal it.

Build a big spaceship, label it a city.
Done.
:shrug:

"They do not do content."
 
Yea... I think they do.  They created the DAC.  In effect, they created a commodity for the game.  In fact, they labeled it a 'Dual Access Coupon' commodity.  It was not created just for a coupon game time ticket.  I had to think about this today after taking a very small part in the DAC debate via Discord.  Initially, I was very much against having this item lootable if acquired from the KS but there's no difference between purchasing the DAC via KS or doing an advance purchase or whatever method.  A purchase is a purchase.  
 
I think it should be a fully lootable item and one that can be destroyed.   When there is little to be lost, people don't care.  We see this over and over in other games where actions have no consequences.  Would you be driving through a really bad neighborhood in your shitty Jeep that has no working tail lights and have a paper bag of 20k sitting next to you?  As long as there is a way to safely store the item...   If I want to take a chance and transport a cargo of DAC's with the possibility of losing it, well give me the freedom to make that decision. 
 
There will be other features that will come up on our radar that we won't agree with or will think that NQ has lost their minds over.  We have a responsibility to give the company feedback and tell them if we are not in agreement with a game feature.   If it makes sense and the feedback is vocal enough, they will listen because they don't have to answer to a big publisher and so far this company has demonstrated an open door policy to fan based feed back.

AVAST YE!!!!!
 
Happy International Talk Like A Pirate Day BOO, love Anonymous.
 
http://talklikeapirate.com/wordpress/

- Rather OOC so far by the way -
 
No need to get the pitchforks out (yet).
 
We will so far favor de-escalation and applying soft measures first. I also would not overestimate the "for hire" part - they won't be classic mercenaries.
 
This isn't intended as some sort of corporate security force or PMC with a more official touch for hire, always quick to change affiliations or whatnot - despite being ironically initiated by a corporation.
 
Perhaps consider it a project rather? The idea is to eventually tie them all to one major city, a large district of one or various moderate settlements. Officers deployed would at the same time be inclined or required to become citizens of said city or alliance. This means anyone can take part but it could also mean this force becomes part of something once there are 'deals' in place. Due to how it is set up so far this would work best for neutral or alliance cities where basically several parties take part. If a major urban center is given, this could remain 'standalone' (but still tied to it).
 
On another note we so far plan to create a website for this if interest increases. If you are interested, whether as someone to request this force or to join this specific force, send a PM.

I'm a unique snowflake. Still reckon I'll have a larger impact on politics in this game than some large orgs
 
Dhara's right - quality, not quantity.

Be careful however. Things can change quickly when you are "on top" or further up on the ladder. Things may seem different or "tempting" then and you could be inclined to act more offensive and care-free when dealing with others. Sometimes it can be fine, often depending on how you react to others you simply make yourself new enemies.
 
Some self restraint would seem suitable. Heck, it is suitable in general.

Yes if push to talk is default that would fix most of it.
 
But you'd be surprised to discover how common it is for people to be annoying with in game open mics.
 
Like I said I'm not against VOIP perse.
I just feel it needs some extra attention if its to be done right.

kill'em to mute'em

Where to start - I guess IMO - no free kills (you're gonna have to work for it )
 
If we're going to talk about this, we can't limit ourselves to the idea that it's all pure PvP only. DU's setting (whether or not it's reflected IN GAME) literally will have millions of people in it.
 
So Lone Wolf's aside (having been one myself in games - it's the risk you take against reward in PvP)... Let's look at some basic realistic principles - NPC's are a good starting point. In ANY RL environment, you have consequences to an action.
 
If you show up to blat some player's city (or even an org's city) when they are "AFK", reality would point out that PEOPLE LIVE THERE. And they won't just be passive about things. The NPC populace would react - some would fight back, some will run (causing attackers and defenders logistical headaches) etc. Other orgs and NPC's would also move to take advantage - you'll get White Knights joining the defence. You might get other Orgs or NPC's attacking your bases while you're blatting the AFKer.
 
Sieges and attacks on settlements (as opposed to pure raiding - in and out) should take MONTHS. Really. Unless you want to nuke the place from orbit. (It's the only way to be sure after all). They should not be lightly entered in to. They should be expensive endeavors. They need to be planned, you need intel and stuff.
 
IT SHOULD BE HARD, and it SHOULD be rewarding if you succeed.

Where to start - I guess IMO - no free kills (you're gonna have to work for it )
 
If we're going to talk about this, we can't limit ourselves to the idea that it's all pure PvP only. DU's setting (whether or not it's reflected IN GAME) literally will have millions of people in it.
 
So Lone Wolf's aside (having been one myself in games - it's the risk you take against reward in PvP)... Let's look at some basic realistic principles - NPC's are a good starting point. In ANY RL environment, you have consequences to an action.
 
If you show up to blat some player's city (or even an org's city) when they are "AFK", reality would point out that PEOPLE LIVE THERE. And they won't just be passive about things. The NPC populace would react - some would fight back, some will run (causing attackers and defenders logistical headaches) etc. Other orgs and NPC's would also move to take advantage - you'll get White Knights joining the defence. You might get other Orgs or NPC's attacking your bases while you're blatting the AFKer.
 
Sieges and attacks on settlements (as opposed to pure raiding - in and out) should take MONTHS. Really. Unless you want to nuke the place from orbit. (It's the only way to be sure after all). They should not be lightly entered in to. They should be expensive endeavors. They need to be planned, you need intel and stuff.
 
IT SHOULD BE HARD, and it SHOULD be rewarding if you succeed.

Where to start - I guess IMO - no free kills (you're gonna have to work for it )
 
If we're going to talk about this, we can't limit ourselves to the idea that it's all pure PvP only. DU's setting (whether or not it's reflected IN GAME) literally will have millions of people in it.
 
So Lone Wolf's aside (having been one myself in games - it's the risk you take against reward in PvP)... Let's look at some basic realistic principles - NPC's are a good starting point. In ANY RL environment, you have consequences to an action.
 
If you show up to blat some player's city (or even an org's city) when they are "AFK", reality would point out that PEOPLE LIVE THERE. And they won't just be passive about things. The NPC populace would react - some would fight back, some will run (causing attackers and defenders logistical headaches) etc. Other orgs and NPC's would also move to take advantage - you'll get White Knights joining the defence. You might get other Orgs or NPC's attacking your bases while you're blatting the AFKer.
 
Sieges and attacks on settlements (as opposed to pure raiding - in and out) should take MONTHS. Really. Unless you want to nuke the place from orbit. (It's the only way to be sure after all). They should not be lightly entered in to. They should be expensive endeavors. They need to be planned, you need intel and stuff.
 
IT SHOULD BE HARD, and it SHOULD be rewarding if you succeed.

Indeed. How very astute of you.

Make the personal AI, an actual real AI/chatbot. That smacks talks you. All the time.

Besides my or rather our support, I think it is a good idea. While combat will of course be tested somehow once it's integrated, this gives the community more focus on actual bug fixing and giving ideas compared to a larger portion just trying to smash each other's skulls in.
 
I think that if a larger part of the community focuses on features, mechanics and errors rather than pure combat then we all benefit.

I suggest increasing the amount of featured posts by about 5. From my observations so far, new posts tend to be among the featured posts, in theory giving you the ability to somewhat flush out existing posts, replacing them with your own.
 
Don't get me wrong, I get the idea of new posts being visible so they are seen, but as some also tend to release several and not just one post, I suggest that the amount of featured posts is raised by a bit.

Good idea, pity it is needed.
 
I'm in, in the event I make Alpha.

Well met

probably going to be pretty close to scale. But we will have better engines in the game given that it is set in the future. Im kind of hoping that the devs dont tell us. I would love for it to be up to us to figure out how far the next planet is given that when the game first goes live no one will be flying to space atleast for awhile.