Anonymous

This is what I have been saying since day one. Politics aren't going to function as most would seem to think it would in game. You can try to keep everything in character, but you'll fall short every time if you relegate yourself that much. The meta game/politics outside of the game itself are what wars and agreements will be made over. I'd be willing to bet money on that too.
 
And just to add more from my personal opinion, real world politics are a mess. Keep that shit out of Dual Universe. Just play the game, and adapt to the meta game as it progress'. Keep things simple and to the point.

I believe membership in organizations and the appointment of legates are ultimately under the power of the founder, so unless the founder voluntarily shares or surrenders control, all organizations are autocracies at the moment.  And I'm sure if there are additional options made available in DU for organizational, er, organization, the founder would have to approve that transfer to a new organizational model.  Even if legates are able to accept and eject general members, I don't see any way they can do the same with other legates.
 
That raises the question, what happens if the founder stops playing?  If the founder fails to log in for several weeks and doesn't return messages from the other legates or members, will DU transfer control of the organization?  To whom?  What if there are no other legates?  Will organization assets be eternally frozen in their accounts?  Will the RDMS for objects managed by the organization be forever locked?  
 
I hope that NQ has a plan to address the maintenance and inheritance requirements of organizations and provides alternative governance models.  I could imagine different models such as Monarchy, Republic, Democracy, Syndicalism, Corporation and Dictatorship having advantages and disadvantages in terms of stability, as well as the satisfaction of the membership in terms of participation in the government.  Once the RDMS is in place, we may see Republics and Democracies appearing, as well as the existence of Boards of Directors for corporations, but unless NQ wires control of the organization and its assets to the RDMS, whatever gets voted on can be rejected at the whim of the founder and the only choice members would have would be to vote with their feet.
 
Developing business rules for civil wars could be very interesting too, as well as regional governments at the planetary/system level, or even at the city level.  It all depends on how big things get.  I can't see one person effectively managing the affairs of a 10,000 member organization.

I don't think so - otherwise you need to start thinking about aging characters - if the game ran 10 years (which it could), any 18 year old character would be 78...
 
 
True - that will really determine (staying on topic) the logical number of "hours" in a day once we know that measurement.
 
 
It's better English than a lot of native speakers on the forums (Only correction I'd make - it is "get it" - not paste tense in this particular case as "get" is a synonym of "understand" - (you can test this by substitution - "I didn't quite understood (got) it" makes no sense, so we leave it as "understand (get) it". But I digress.
 
In terms of Role Play - implementation is by consensus - we use these dates in our background stories etc.
 
For visual display in game, on the forums etc - we do a simple transform using seconds.
 
All modern computing / digital systems generally use seconds, converting to different time/calendar formats (for instance, the Gregorian calendar we use, or US date format, or Japanese Imperial Calendar format, Stardates etc) as required. It's actually quite simple to customise or use these same bits of code/common functions in a range of programming languages, or write your own, to format the seconds into a date / time pattern that you like.
 
 
As an SI second is "the time that elapses during 9,192,631,770 (9.192631770 x 109 ) cycles of the radiation produced by the transition between two levels of the cesium 133 atom" , and these rate of these cycles are unaffected by gravity, Earth, the Sun etc - the second is a non-derived unit measured relative to something that is unaffected by the presence of the Solar System or indeed, gravity or pyhsics on Alioth. So SI seconds are unaffected.
 
Stardates are completely made up to suit each TV show in the franchise. There is no "standard" or consistency - it's a pure TV convention with each show in the franchise having it's own "Stardate creation rules". The MMO probably follows the rules for one of the shows.

Alternatively go a lore route and say that the cockpits or enclosed spaces simulate sounds so as to not hinder the sanity of a pilot or crew or to allow for indicators or something along those lines. There is a few ways around it but there hasn't been an official statement as to how this is going to work. 
While realism is nice, I prefer having sound.

How would the game engine know if someone has a reason to attack someone else or whether that reason is a good reason?  Maybe the reason is he doesn't like the color of his helmet, or maybe it's because they're both running to stick a claim beacon in the same resources-rich hex.  Or maybe they had a nasty argument in a bar.  What reason is good enough for wanting to kill someone if not self-defense and how could a game engine determine criminal intent?  If someone is aiming a weapon at me but hasn't fired yet, am I allowed to shoot first?  
 
If he wants emergent politics, I think he has to allow emergent law and order as well.  He'll do what he wants of course, but I think safe zones and arkship AI-enforced property rights are a sufficient foundation for civilization.  Beyond that, if the AI is setting and paying bounties for the bad guys, then the AI effectively is the government, and I don't think he wants that.  By definition, a government is the only entity allowed to legally employ violence for any purpose other than self-defense.  Any organization that can only do so under conditions determined by the AI godmind won't be a government.

That's because we don't actually have any instruments capable of measuring mass directly. We have instruments capable of measuring force, and of measuring acceleration. So the prototype would still mass 1kg, it just wouldn't exert a force of 9.81N on Alioth.
 
This means that shaving the prototype down and redefining the kilogram would cause utter havoc all across the board in derived values. If you redefined the kilogram, then the Newton would no longer be the force required to accelerate 1kg by 1ms-2.
 
Redefining SI units is... not a good idea.

It doesnt matter at all, its just for RP purposes. 
And we would still use hours and units. I think people would just like to know what the conversion rate is.
 
Thats how I understand this thread.

FYI - our (Sohan Deckers) Arkship was built only two-three years before the Final Collision. If that helps.

Novaquark, could you please do following things?
 
1) add community portal and devblog button to top bar on forum (so we can get there more easily)
2) add option so we can receive news from devblog to our emails
3) post "Weekly Update" on devblog (and send to email) where you can tell us what are you working on, what troubles are you facing, what you are planning,... communicate with us:) I'm sure you are planning such thing, but now it's about week after KS campaign with no news. We can't wait to hear and see more stuff so we can post about it on forums, chat on discord, etc.
 
Thank you,
Danger + another 3000+ forum users :-)

That's up to each player and organization or loose group however then.
 
My point being: "Don't complain about it the more crazy your own "gap filler story" becomes."
 
Your best or safest bet is to keep it rough. We can't really tell how the world may develop in roughly 500 years and especially in the face of doom. We know there's some large conflicts and problems that we will face in the next decades or century but ~500 is still a lot of time.
 
Until NQ provides more specifics, I'd keep it roughly as it is or rather dynamic. For example it should be fine to refer to existing countries or weave one's backstory around them, but I can also imagine coming up with fictional groups or up to moderate-scale events within - after all it's unlikely things would remain static for about 500 years, excluding technology advancements.
 
I honestly think this is a smaller problem, even for RPers. You (as character) were born in that time of departure anyway so you'd have to focus on that area if you wanted to refer to something - the ~500 years of history before that until this modern day would be tertiary - for me anyway.
 
The situations where filling this would become necessary should be slim on average. My point being that it won't be an everyday topic for RPers.

What about penal battalions? That could be fun AND profitable.
 
(I'm had that idea as part of my background FWIW - so happy to provide the precedent you need that it was a common thing in 26th century Earth)

Ironically the creation for this "project" is a bit like outsourcing, just for the purpose to avoid another mercenary force for hire, and the intention isn't to make money. This is explained in the larger context, however, and surely not visible on first glance I suppose, due to still being referred to as mercenary cops. Perhaps I have to tweak the OP further to make it stand out.
 
Let's go from the top however.
 
 
 
You seem to cover what I mentioned in the OP already - a classic player led nation or empire. It is therefore no surprise that you have no interest in this or similar offers as you rather try to rely on your own forces. That is to be expected (not saying it is bad).
 
It has pros and cons in my opinion. You have direct oversight, influence and control over anything that is internal or part of it. But you have to build it up first. You plan to go for an empire after all and for me, all player led nations, empires, governments etc. need a minimum size to be able to really fill all the positions that come with that unless you plan to multitask a lot. An external entity is just that - external. You don't have as much direct influence or power over it initially in most cases, but you could have later depending on how deep trust and cooperation is.
 
To give another example on how this could be useful: Say you are of moderate size and intend to build a large city now - on your own. That is probably resource heavy and time consuming already. Now let's say you're far enough that you have to worry about a police force - you'd have to build it up for your own whereas there's already a few out there from which you could learn (training) or request personnel (seems like mercs now, more on that below however). You could bolster ranks almost immediately after a few discussions and agreements - or you still rely on your own security forces but use additional forces elsewhere or in certain parts of a larger city.
 
As for "security is a national problem" - that is the mindset today but even in most nations security is bolstered by private companies that protect private property all over the place. Nations may all regulate it but they certainly resort to companies to help with inner security.
 
 
The idea for this project is to not be mercenaries. The only "for hire" component would be initial as we try to find a place that accepts a dedicated police force that is 'external' initially but is then integrated into the city, the structure and those who manage it. The core idea is to add stability to a major urban center with a dedicated police force where units are citizens of the city.
 
To rephrase: we could do all that. Anyone could do a lot. But that's not the intention. We intend to pick one city or a connected hub of moderate settlements and protect them, not be all over the universe as cops for hire. The focus remains on select areas that we then try to focus on and stick with.
 
Besides even if we went along with the "mercenary for hire" part, how bad would it look if we "betrayed" anyone?
 
 
 
I like to highlight that making money is not the primary goal. It's secondary or tertiary and at least just to the point to cover all expenses. A police force costs money as all know. We'll actually lower costs by outsourcing some demands (repairs, ship designs, etc) to the affiliated corporation that will try to provide some of these things. The rest of expenses that make it through somehow? Shrug. Donations or a portion of taxes.
 
 
 
If all works as intended we won't be serving different orgs that might be enemies. The idea is to focus on one larger city or a set of connected cities or settlements in the end as we work under / with an organization or a set of organizations that maintains those cities or settlements. If the area is rather large that will demand most of the attention anyway and as there would be no other organizations, there would be no conflict of interest.
 
I also like to highlight that we'll likely only work with specific organizations that have specific mindsets. So far we don't intend to work with more autocratic governments or groups. That's another potential conflict of interest off the list even if we were to serve different groups in different areas.
 
--- --- ---
 
I hope that clarified some aspects. More questions or doubts? Did I forget something? Throw anything my way. The more the merrier!

OOC: Great effort, and great example of the community really taking off!
 
IC: Armed thugs for hire, do not a police force make.
 

When I saw the title I thought you were already trying to set a date for a DU convention. Lol

For feedback and/or community/NQ endorsement.
 
Proposed terms:
 
BCE - Before (the) Collision Era
CE - (Post) Collision Era
AE - Alioth Era
 
 
Key Dates:
 
0 CE |  (-9854 AE ) -  August 8th, 2538 - The Final Collision - Earth is destroyed
 
(0 CE - 9,854 CE) - "The Long Second" - The Arkship is in transit for 9,854 years (310,968,590,400 seconds) before it enters the system containing Alioth.
 
9854 CE | 0 AE - "Year 0" - Landing on Alioth - Game "Launch" (could be Beta if that's when "Alpha Teams" enter play.) In real life terms, the year 12,392 A.D. Dates after this point will progress as a measure of seconds (Unix style) since the server goes "live".
 
Why?
The Gregorian calendar is based on the Earth's rotation around the sun - .
The sun no longer exists, making the Gregorian calendar essentially irrelevant at best, and stupidly complicated to implement on a new world at worst.
Astronomy (and logically by extension, the astronautical industry) uses the Julian calendar.

In astronomy, the Julian year is a unit of time; it is defined as 365.25 days of exactly 86400 seconds (SI base unit), totaling exactly 31557600 seconds in the Julian astronomical year.


As a game mechanic - using a static Julian system is a nice way to deal with the idea that Alioth may or may not rotate at game launch. It then becomes a universal reference standard, with any given planet's rotation (if rotation is implemented) being able to, depending on how the game implements objects in space, be measured in seconds and turned into a local Julian (i.e. fixed length) calendar.

Feedback welcome.
 

(Actually, almost all the SI base units would change. (Don't get me started )
 
Anything that actually uses the sun as a reference point (AU, parsecs, light year) are all derived values that are irrelevant to a degree once Sol is destroyed. FWIW - The simplest would be to use light year, based on a Julian Year measured in seconds.
 
Falstaf - yes - there is no reason we would take replicas of; or indeed, the actual, SI kilogram. The only weirdness this would result in is that an Alioth kilogram would be different to an Earth kilogram, as mass, due to gravity not being exactly that of Earth's (however close), would change. For all intents and purposes however, it would only matter when converting, and that would be easy enough once we know the gravity delta.)
 
This date idea however is one that we can implement without too much thought - the SI second will not change in nature and the year length isn't important at this time - just an agreement on the reference start date and a basic convention for referring to dates pre-Collision as humans on Alioth referring to events which really, "now" have almost no meaning, and to the dates of our own history which we will create.

Hello everyone, I was reading the CvC thread yesterday and towards the end the topic drifted towards the technical aspects of DU. https://board.dualthegame.com/index.php?/topic/10219-no-construct-vs-construct-at-launch-a-good-thing/page-4#entry36897
 
Its not my area of expertise but I find it fascinating regardless. As such I went back to the space game junkie podcast, in it JC gets a bit technical. https://gaming.youtube.com/watch?v=m8Kw1Af6LKk&list=PLiCvVJzBupKmHXCYnDrUZ-q3RPvUDv_fA
 
He explains that they are using "actor based programming" wich JC says comes from the telecom industry. Here I'm hoping some of you can explain more about it. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Actor_model I hope this is the correct wiki.
 
"The actor model in computer science is a mathematical model of concurrent computation that treats "actors" as the universal primitives of concurrent computation."
 
In the same interview JC explains that "actor based programming" comes from "erlang" if I understand it correctly but I could be wrong. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erlang_(programming_language)
 
"Erlang is a general-purpose, concurrent, functional programming language. It is also a garbage-collected runtime system. The sequential subset of Erlang supports eager evaluation, single assignment, and dynamic typing."
 
JC said they are not using erlang because its a bit exotic. But he says they use the same framework. In the end they are able to provide the continues single shard universe because of the "dynamic space splitting" with the advanced LOD system.
https://youtu.be/QeZtqoydXpc
 
If you want to hear JC explain it himself listen to the space game junkie podcast, its in the first 15 minutes.
 
I hope this helps some of our more technical minded members. And in turn I hope to stimulate some discussion on it so the rest of us can understand it a bit better.
 
Thank you for your time.
 
PS: I do all of this on my phone, I'm sorry for the primitive links.

For feedback and/or community/NQ endorsement.
 
Proposed terms:
 
BCE - Before (the) Collision Era
CE - (Post) Collision Era
AE - Alioth Era
 
 
Key Dates:
 
0 CE |  (-9854 AE ) -  August 8th, 2538 - The Final Collision - Earth is destroyed
 
(0 CE - 9,854 CE) - "The Long Second" - The Arkship is in transit for 9,854 years (310,968,590,400 seconds) before it enters the system containing Alioth.
 
9854 CE | 0 AE - "Year 0" - Landing on Alioth - Game "Launch" (could be Beta if that's when "Alpha Teams" enter play.) In real life terms, the year 12,392 A.D. Dates after this point will progress as a measure of seconds (Unix style) since the server goes "live".
 
Why?
The Gregorian calendar is based on the Earth's rotation around the sun - .
The sun no longer exists, making the Gregorian calendar essentially irrelevant at best, and stupidly complicated to implement on a new world at worst.
Astronomy (and logically by extension, the astronautical industry) uses the Julian calendar.

In astronomy, the Julian year is a unit of time; it is defined as 365.25 days of exactly 86400 seconds (SI base unit), totaling exactly 31557600 seconds in the Julian astronomical year.


As a game mechanic - using a static Julian system is a nice way to deal with the idea that Alioth may or may not rotate at game launch. It then becomes a universal reference standard, with any given planet's rotation (if rotation is implemented) being able to, depending on how the game implements objects in space, be measured in seconds and turned into a local Julian (i.e. fixed length) calendar.

Feedback welcome.
 

Likewise, welcome! ????

Saturday night was the 6th celebration of the FrogSwarm anniversary in Lyon / France !

https://twitter.com/FrogSwarm

GREETINGS FROM FRANCE DU !




 

French BBQ?!?!?! Looks and sounds amazing!
Wow Frogstorm is very well organized group!

Goals right here.
 
Looks like it was fun guys!

My name is (drum roll, please...) Joakim.
I'm a 30-something year old guy from the northern parts of Sweden, who's a huge sci-fi and space buff (again, no suprises there).
 
I stumbled upon the Kickstarter campaign for DU by chance, I think from a Facebook add or review by someone, really can't recall. While a bit hesitant after buying the flaming disaster that is No man's sky, I still pledged for DU and crossed my fingers.
This game looks like it may very well be what I was looking for when I pre-ordered NMS, but I am trying really hard not to get too hyped up about it!
 
Anyway before trying the beta I'm not sure what playstyle I will aim for, but I've always enjoyed creating things so I think I'll attempt to get in on a gigabuild at some point, at least, and I'll probably explore quite a bit as well. That is unless it proves to dangerous (which would likely bore me, eventually).
 
I'll be skulking around the forums and dropping oppinions and suggestions here and there until time comes to beta test the game, trying to keep up on the news and so on.
 
 
 
Cheers and I'll see you around, and above all in game - the question is if you'll see me! 

Stranger in a strange land - we are the aliens...

A Leroy Jenkins reference AND and understanding of the fundamentals of international relations and law?
 
I like you already.