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Omfgreenhair

WAR, what is it good for?

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WAR!

UGH!

What is it good for?

ABSOLUTELY nothing, say it again y'all!!


... except for the economy. And innovation. And social change. And progress. And ventilation of butthurt within a societal structure.


And yeah, these applied well in EVE Online wars. So much salt within an 8000 people alliance can be eradicated once you know "Hey, those guys next door who are attacking oru borders? Yeah, they deployed 5 Astrahus after they blew up our own yesterday, then Jumped in 2 Titans and about 500 people escort each, and they gonna siege us and take ALL YOUR HARD EARNED STUFF".

Guess what happens after that. Solidarity, unity and a lot of pew pew.

Also, don't ask questions like "What is a reason wars would start over in DU".

The only closest comparison is EVE Online, and EVE had wars start over the fact if Rainbow Dash is a pony or a unicorn.

So no, if you hope for "Epic grand reasons for war"... no, no there won't be. It will be just turbonerd ego, mixed with turbonerd debates.  In fact, I expect the first war to start between the Weaboos and the Geeks, over the age old (of 30 years) debate of :

"Who would win? Goku or Superman?"

Let World War DU Begin.

Cheerios to you.

P.S. : The answer is Superman. He literally has no limits, while Goku has to surpass his limits to begin with. Also, Superman has always been voiced by a male actor. :D

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English (Translator used)

 

The only thing missing is that the just war is called out (oh brain-dead zombies).

Conflicts can also be solved diplomatically!

 

 

German (orginal)

 

es fehlt nur noch, dass der gerechte Krieg ausgerufen wird (oh ihr hirntoten Zombies).

Konflikte kann man auch Diplomatisch lösen!

 

 

mfG Die Waldfee

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The mechanics for PvP are there, that is an incentive in itself.

 

The blade itself incites to violence.

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English (Translator used)

 

Learns to renounce. No PvP.
Just because you have to peel a knife to the potato, you do not have to commit suicide for a long time.

 

 

German (orginal)

 

lernt zu verzichten. Verzichtet auf PvP.

Nur weil man ein Messer zum Kartoffel schälen hat, muß man noch lange keinen Mäuchelmord begehen.

 

 

mfG Die Waldfee

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2 minutes ago, huschhusch said:

English (Translator used)

 

Learns to renounce. No PvP.
Just because you have to peel a knife to the potato, you do not have to commit suicide for a long time.

 

 

German (orginal)

 

lernt zu verzichten. Verzichtet auf PvP.

Nur weil man ein Messer zum Kartoffel schälen hat, muß man noch lange keinen Mäuchelmord begehen.

 

 

mfG Die Waldfee

 

Why would it be philosophically moral to avoid obvious game elements like PvP? The game is meant to be played in a many different ways - just because you have the freedom to do either or doesnt mean the one thing is better.

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English (Translator used)

 

I just want to share my opinion. Maybe others see it as the same way.

 

 

German (orginal)

 

Ich möchte nur meine Meinung dazu kund tun. Vielleicht sehen es andere auch so.

 

 

mfG Die Waldfee

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Luckily, if you don't want to participate in the wars around you, the world is fairly big. This will give room to people who, much like this part of the player base who doesn't enjoy fighting or partaking in it, then can provide the other players by hosting a hot feed that keeps up to date with current on-going conflicts and possible battle hotzones or other combat-like A.O.'s. This does line up nicely with the cartagrophy thread and the 'How to prevent  basic "griefing"?' thread.

 

Do realise that you are joining a sandbox that is much like the Wild West of ye olden days before the formation of U.S.A. This entails that you agree to the risks and dangers of traveling outside safe-zones. This would also be another plee to the developers to trust it's community to solve these types of issues. Rest assure that there will be a low level of toxicity amongst players, though it's a healthy ammount. It's healthy, because it keeps the mind sharp and not fool yourself that the game purely cathers to your expectations. This counts for both warmongers and carebears/bob-the-builders alike.
 

I'm confident that, although skirmishes and wars will definitely take part in DU, that there will be place for everyone. If you're dedicated and creative, you will blow your own mind on the possibilities.

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35 minutes ago, Kuritho said:

I am a top scientist working for "asdf Industries" and after many years of quantum computing and formula solving, we figured it out:

War = Loot

...and there in lies one of the less honourable trades: plundering and scrapping battlefields. Also known as "Junking". It's a concept I learned from Freelancer game.

There's a Dutch saying: "De een zijn dood is de ander zijn brood." which would translate to "One's death is another's bread and butter."

 

Almost sounds like a player driven ecology, building things, the death of things and corporial remains recycled to it's base components to begin again. Maybe player's corpses could be recycled too? Soylent Green anyone?

Ehm, I think we're too deep. I guess we can conclude this thread?

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War and conflict will be especially beneficial for me/Vanguard, it will be (presumably) one of our main sources of incomes contract wise. So no conflict makes it considerably harder to thrive or earn cash. Why the war happens doesn't matter do a lot of people, only how it affects them and the outcome.

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21 hours ago, huschhusch said:

The only thing missing is that the just war is called out (oh brain-dead zombies).
Conflicts can also be solved diplomatically!

 

There's a pretty simple example why your statement is kind of naiv/wrong. Everyone has different playstyles, there will be organisations focused on adventuring, trading, ship building etc. Now i imagine you would be in a basebuilding/shipbuilding organisation, lets assume your org built a splendid base with an efficient industrial part (assuming its possible), other organisations like traders or adventures might want to have a strong ship building economy too, without setting up their own base (because they don't feel like it or started late due to their focus on adventuring/trading etc.).

The easiest solution? Conquer the base of a basebuilding/shipbuilding organisation.

The diplomatic solution? They wont kill you and might let you keep some small ships if you give up the base without resistance.

A peaceful solution? Why would you look for a peaceful solution if you have the might to get much more benefits if you chose the violent way? It's a game afterall.

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I don't want to break it to you all guys who spoke about wars in Alpha but: "Combat mechanics are scheduled among the last gameplay mechanics that will be implemented ( currently scheduled around end of Alpha, beginning of Beta )..." A response I got from the devs in the comments section in the May dev diary.

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8 minutes ago, Ataren said:

I don't want to break it to you all guys who spoke about wars in Alpha but: "Combat mechanics are scheduled among the last gameplay mechanics that will be implemented ( currently scheduled around end of Alpha, beginning of Beta )..." A response I got from the devs in the comments section in the May dev diary.

Good reminder there, but we don't talk about alpha. 

Alpha and beta don't matter at all for the final release (gameplay wise). Both stages are only in place to help the devs (especially alpha) to get rid of bugs and balance the game.

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English (Translator used)

 

Hello vylqun,

Not warfare does not mean helpless.

 

 

German (orginal)

 

Hallo vylqun,

nicht kriegsführend heißt nicht wehrlos.

 

 

mfG Die Waldfee

 

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Like Lethys said, this topic is about post-release. There won't be enough people in the testing phases to properly conduct "wars" anyways. Battles, sure, once combat is implemented in Beta. But not Alpha

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8 minutes ago, huschhusch said:

Not warfare does not mean helpless.

 

At the end of the day, you are either helpless or you aren't. Maybe you have friends who will protect you, but that still means they have to fight. Eventually, someone has to have the power to fight. All you can do is defer it to someone else. And if you can't do that, you are helpless.

 

(Edit: Sorry for double post)

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English (Translator used)

 

Hello Lord_Void,

There are still many possibilities, let surprise you (I do not tell anything).

 

German (orginal)

 

Hallo Lord_Void,

da gibt es noch viel Möglichkeiten, lass Dich überraschen (ich verrate nichts).

 

 

mfG Die Waldfee

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18 minutes ago, huschhusch said:

There are still many possibilities, let surprise you (I do not tell anything).

 

 

If a group is coming to attack you there are two scenarios that do not involve fighting: 

  1. You can persuade them to not fight. This usually will not work, especially if you have no muscle to back it up.
  2. You can prevent them from fighting, either through espionage or propaganda. This is not always possible either, and it takes time to set up and implement so it can't do anything against surprise attacks or unknown groups. 

Most of the time, the above will not work for various reasons. If those don't work, there are three possible outcomes:

  1. You fight.
  2. You get someone else to fight for you. Either a mercenary group or allies.
  3. You die.

So, my argument stands but I will expand upon it: At the end of the day, either you can defend yourself (through someone fighting), or you are helpless and have to rely on luck to not die. 

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English (Translator used)

 

Hello Lord_Void,

Why do not Swiss need wars?

 

 

German (orginal)

 

Hallo Lord_Void,

warum brauchen Schweizer keine Kriege führten ?

 

 

 

mfG Die Waldfee

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3 minutes ago, huschhusch said:

English (Translator used)

 

Hello Lord_Void,

Why do not Swiss need wars?

Because of the second reason, which in turn leads to the first. They've created reasons for them to not have to fight, most prominent is their neutrality. But not everyone can afford the cost of neutrality though. Especially if the one aiming to be neutral offends someone who has the capabilities to attack them.

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Rl != DU.

 

Don't compare a real life situation with a game. Always a bad idea because no rl situation can be applied to a game. 

 

You can't die in DU

You don't have to fear vengeance, cause nothing can happen to you (except losing all your stuff - so what)

There's a higher chance that parking lots/banks/rich orgs get raided because of more loot

You can just ignore treaties in a game and backstab people with ease.

As a country/nation in DU you're not dependant on anyone else

And many more.

 

So yeah, you'll have to fight, or get roflstomped by larger ones

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12 minutes ago, huschhusch said:

Why do not Swiss need wars?

 

Like Lethys said, Real Life and DU don't always compare well. However, in the case of the Swiss their main advantage has been that they are not a very valuable location. Secondly, they have managed to ingrain the idea of neutrality into their history and image, so groups are discouraged from attacking them. This is point 2 from the non-violent section. If someone were to attack them, they could easily run to the other side for help and support. This is point 2 from the violent options. So you see, it is not an exception to what I said

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English (Translator used)

 

Hello Lethys,
Then you should take care of the Chinese.

 

 

German (orginal)

 

Hallo Lethys,

dann solltest Du auf die Chinesen aufpassen.

 

 

mfG Die Waldfee

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