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Metalmammoth

What caught my eye, What is lacking, and What makes me wary.

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Greetings.

 

I'm fresh in after watching the gameplay video, and reading around a bit here - and digesting it for a couple of days for good measure.

 

I'd like to share my impressions with you all, as probably everyone else does, since there's precious little else to do with this game as of yet.

 

 

First off, what I liked:

 

 

The scale. The sheer scale and the level of detail, with seemingly free curves, angles and block sizes, which leaves me to believe it's possible to build near-perfectly detailed smooth-surfaces, as opposed to what any other building game allows the player:

 

Meaning, be stuck with 1 (or in an extreme case 3) meter sized blocks, and jagged slopes if you want a curve or a flat angle.

 

That is amazing, and so is the thought of an eight kilometer long structure that doesn't wreck the game into 1FPS hell, especially since guess how long is an Imperial Retribution Class Battleship?

You guessed it. Eight kilometers, plus ramming spike. And here I am stuck for the past couple of years, begrudgingly yet lovingly building a 1:7 scale bastardized mini-replica in Starmade, all the while wishing it was 1:1, better detailed, and not pixelated.

 

However, for that to work, prefabricated blocks (a.k.a. cockpits, thrusters, weapons) NEED to change; So far the current system merely seems to be copyin what Space Engineers does, yet their method was faulty to beging with:

 

No matter how well detailed and good looking prefabs you add to the game, and no matter how many varieties, they can't fit every design:

Clearly, what tech we see now would have no place on a voidship from Warhammer: 40.000, or for that matter Stargate, Star Trek, Star Wars, or any other franchise, or any even partially talented builder's own designs.

 

 

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What NEEDS to happen, is the ability to build custom prefabs in-game, just like building the ship itself, then assigning functions to them through some menu, marking attachment and animation points, etc, so everyone can have the perfect part that perfectly fits the vessel he likes, and not just one general, bland sci-fi design!

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That one is important. If nothing else happens until release, it needs to be made a reality, unless you're fine simply aping Space Engineers.

 

 

.... And with that done, we reach the cause of my wariness.

 

The game's nature as an MMO, and it's planned payment mode-OHGODNOTANOTHERONEOFTHOSEPOSTS!!!!!!!!!

 

Bear with me please. I'll try to make it entertaining.

 

-MMOs lock everyone together. Smaller private servers allow for replicas of Different universes, different ways of playing, or gatherings of people with different mindsets. Lock all that together, and you unleash all the horror of every "which faction would win in a cross-franchise battle" forum flamewar ever written in the history of the internet, with all the grief attached to it.

 

And, there'll be no way to avoid the kind of players you'd rather not mingle with; Did you spend 300 hours lovingly building a masterpiece? Tough luck when the powergamers fly in with their literally 8-polygon cubeships and manage to trash it because they didn't waste space on something as trivial as accurately replicated interiors.

 

Does your six year old son enjoy flying the very first, and superest spaceship he ever built? It's like 20 blocks long, and looks like a clay dinosaur someone stepped on, but oh the innocent fun he's having! However, that smile will quickly turn into disappointment when cannon shells a thousand times larger than his ship start raining in from fifty-thousand meters, or just, more prosaically, encounters his first really sick griefer, (Don't get me wrong, I firmly believe we grow through pain, and no child should be pampered, but neither should we expect the little ones to face all the evils such an online community can throw at them all at once.)

 

What I'm saying is: Smaller, dedicated servers are better, with closer communities, which in turn are closer to the people running the show, thus are better served, and better able to find a virtual home they can enjoy themselves the way they want.

 

 

That was the reason against a centralized server.

 

Now for the dirty financials:

 

I personally think it's robbery to pay a monthly fee. I can buy the things I like, and then they'll be mine forever, or at least until they decompose. Buying a game once, then having to pay ANY fee just so I can keep accessing it is the definition of evil, and the lazy company's way of getting rich.

 

-Some idiots who think they can act all cool and cinycal write stuff like "yeah, how dare they ask money for their product"

 

Which is BS and makes you sound retarded. I'm perfectly fine paying for the product ONCE, as they deserve it. I'm also willing to pay for an expansion, as that has a fair amount of work put into it, and as such, has worth.

What doesn't have worth, is not pulling the plug from the server, and waiting for your paycheck.

 

-Some people say it takes money to run the servers.

 

It does, but take the initial price of the game, say 60 Eur for an AAA title. Most companies go rich simply by selling a succesful game. Some companies even turn some of that money back into the game, and keep releasing patches and content for their game out of love, duty, and for making you interested in buying an expansion or a sequel.

 

Take then, say 15 Eur a month sub fee.

 

Sell just a million copies. That's ( 1KK x 60 ) + ( 1KK x 15 ) if everyone only ever just pays for a single month and quits. That's 75 million euros. That alone is enough to pay a decent salary for all your employees, cover your expenses, buy and maintain your own server park and keep a decent profit for the rest of all the lives of everyone involved. For the next 20 years, which is an extremely long time both for a game to still be played and for a studio that doesn't disband not to secure another round of income, these costs become less than trivial.

 

There can be only two reasons for this amount not being enough: - Attempting to run a space program, or being greedy.

 

But surely not everyone quits after one month? And the income keeps racking up.

 

But, as I've said, I don't even want their servers. I'd run my own as long as I'm interested. As would countless others. Boom, no server costs, no maintenance for the company. Just keep patching for a year or two until things become solid enough to call truly finished. (Hells, a finished game on release day is a far off dream these days.......)

 

That's all there is to it. They don't need your monthly payment to keep the operation running. They just want it.

 

Take WoW for example: Their players pay their monthly sub fee, yet still have to pay full Tripple-A price for every expansion that comes out. Boom, double profits.

 

Next point.

 

Some of you believe, and even the dev blog claims, a P2P system with a monthly subscription fee protects the player more because..... reasons?

 

In a truly F2P game, yeah, any moron can grief away with dozens of new accounts every day, true. But how does a monthly fee offer more deterrence from bannable behaviour than a buy once model?

 

I already don't want to lose access to what I bought once, can I somehow don't want it more? I understand I would have spent more money on it, but in exchange for that money I received playtime, which I used up, and is impossible to take away without a brainwash, even if the account itself is lost forever. After a while you'll max out either way, and it can't take that long to start anew from scratch once you know how the game works.

So I either care or I don't. There are no further magnitudes.

And that's a true cause to worry about: Evil people write dev blogs like that, and stupid people believe them.

 

Edit: Almost forgotten last point:

 

In the end, it doesn't even matter what kind of payment model You, I, the next fellow, or the company want:

Name a monthly-sub MMO that isn't WoW or EVE and didn't vanish or become F2P, because most of the people willing to be robbed monthly got hooked on those two way back when it was new and hip - And the only reason they won't quit, because that'd make a lie of their past 10 years and probably prompt some dark deeds now.

Probably some fresh and sustainable MMOs exist out there with a P2P model, but I sure as hell am unaware of them.

 

 

TLDR:

 

-Exbawkshueg. Yay!

 

-Let players build custom prefabs in-game!

 

-Custom private servers cater to different needs and negate server costs for dev. company. Like Starmade.

 

-P2P is bad 4 u, phat lewt for company. You stooooopid if you believe otherwise.

 

-Buy once is decent, respectable.

 

-Yer not WoW, yer not EVE, P2P ye won't succeed.

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iWKad22.jpg

Sums up my line of thought exactly, after reading this post. 

 

Let me see if i remember how this was quoted from yet another similar post.  = This is not meant to be WOW with dungeons and multiple shards, this is a freaking sandbox. Not a care bear daisy simulator. Which amazing as it is, what most of the younger school of MMO players are used to, and believe the norm is. 

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That's good old Picard for you, helpfully indicating which posters are lacking in intelligence.

 

I'd be making the same expression if I was forced to take part in a moron's post in order for him to appear witty.

 

And don't forget, he's contributing to keep the topic alive, even if you have nothing of worth to say.

 

Let's see how many we can get.

 

 

 

Oh! The last one has words.

 

So who said it has to be a carebear simulator? Yet what does it matter if someone wants to run such a server half a globe away and completely secluded from you?

It wouldn't affect you any way, unless you're already planning on grand griefing sprees.

 

And that's just one of the many reasons against a single centralized server.

 

Can you imagine how confusing it is to find yourself surrounded by people who's language you don't understand?

Can you find common ground with someone half, third, or quarter your age?

What about those who'd prefer to play according to different rules, or those who would use the game as a platform for a themed environment?

 

I'll be the first one to acknowledge Starmade does almost everything wrong, but they got this aspect right.

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That's good old Picard for you, helpfully indicating which posters are lacking in intelligence.

 

I'd be making the same expression if I was forced to take part in a moron's post in order for him to appear witty.

 

And don't forget, he's contributing to keep the topic alive, even if you have nothing of worth to say.

 

Let's see how many we can get.

 

Let's just assume you actually did any research in to this project for a second.

 

The only thing that even remotely makes any sense here is the prefabs. That can certainly be a topic in it's own. Everything else - no. There is enough information released to realize private dedicated servers is not an option. And again, the whole P2P subject being brought up constantly. I understand you have an opinion on it, and want something else, and you are more than welcome to post about it here, but be prepared for people to respond like this when we have countless other threads dedicated to it.

 

Now, because I don't think you spent anymore than 10 minutes in to researching, I will post this thread again which answers just about every topic you brought up - https://board.dualthegame.com/index.php?/topic/1122-dual-universe-faqsources/

 

And welcome to the DU community.

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Sums up my line of thought exactly, after reading this post. 

 

Let me see if i remember how this was quoted from yet another similar post.  = This is not meant to be WOW with dungeons and multiple shards, this is a freaking sandbox. Not a care bear daisy simulator. Which amazing as it is, what most of the younger school of MMO players are used to, and believe the norm is. 

Exactly. WoW is a Theme Park MMO, everything in it are predefined and in dungeons you play that crank-catcher machine to catch pretty new toys to fiddle with until you get a new series of toys to work your crank-catching machine skills in getting. A sandbox doesn't need "variety" of cockpits. Varieties of cockpits defeat the point of the game entirely which is varieties of arranging the cockpit in a different place as you build your spiffy jet. In fact, large ships won't even HAVE a cockpit, they have a bridge you gotta build from scratch and assign monitoring stations for the bridge staff.

 

 

It's just that people don't even bother reading the FAQs and turn the whole forum into a depressing, repetitive dystopia.

 

 

 

And to the OP themself, Space Engineers suffers from the fact they didn't build a stable netcode for their game, because they started from a simple Minecraft clone in space and ended up wanting to build an MMO without having invested in the server tech itself. The DUAL devs have instested in the tech itself, a revolutionary system of cloud-processing which CAN in fact allow for variety of cockpits. But hey, you seem to think games in pre-Alpha got all the features set to go. Pffft, what? Game Designers are actually designing a game and have to take some step-by-step approach in developing the game? Nah, just ask for cockpits in Alpha.

 

 

 

This is why I'm afraid of Alpha Access in Steam. First month in Alpha Test uninitiated people will ask for cockpit varieties, instead of helping the devs with any bugs or issues.

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Nearly similar reasons why I no longer go through Steam Early Access, too many times burned on the proverbial rear. 

 

Anyway enough of yet another troll - attention grabbing post for me - back to writing html code and working on a alliance constitution for me. 

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Let's just assume you actually did any research in to this project for a second.

 

The only thing that even remotely makes any sense here is the prefabs. That can certainly be a topic in it's own. Everything else - no. There is enough information released to realize private dedicated servers is not an option. And again, the whole P2P subject being brought up constantly. I understand you have an opinion on it, and want something else, and you are more than welcome to post about it here, but be prepared for people to respond like this when we have countless other threads dedicated to it.

 

Now, because I don't think you spent anymore than 10 minutes in to researching, I will post this thread again which answers just about every topic you brought up - https://board.dualthegame.com/index.php?/topic/1122-dual-universe-faqsources/

 

And welcome to the DU community.

 

Well. Thanks for the welocme.

With respect, what you linked is a worse textwall than mine with links to more textwalls.

I'd appreciate if you'd name the specific reasons why do you think what I say is wrong. I've scanned it and the main site's FAQ BEFORE posting, and once more now. It wasn't thorough, but I see no good reasons, nor do I believe there is one. I can be proven wrong of course.

 

 

Exactly. WoW is a Theme Park MMO, everything in it are predefined and in dungeons you play that crank-catcher machine to catch pretty new toys to fiddle with until you get a new series of toys to work your crank-catching machine skills in getting. A sandbox doesn't need "variety" of cockpits. Varieties of cockpits defeat the point of the game entirely which is varieties of arranging the cockpit in a different place as you build your spiffy jet. In fact, large ships won't even HAVE a cockpit, they have a bridge you gotta build from scratch and assign monitoring stations for the bridge staff.

 

 

It's just that people don't even bother reading the FAQs and turn the whole forum into a depressing, repetitive dystopia.

 

 

 

And to the OP themself, Space Engineers suffers from the fact they didn't build a stable netcode for their game, because they started from a simple Minecraft clone in space and ended up wanting to build an MMO without having invested in the server tech itself. The DUAL devs have instested in the tech itself, a revolutionary system of cloud-processing which CAN in fact allow for variety of cockpits. But hey, you seem to think games in pre-Alpha got all the features set to go. Pffft, what? Game Designers are actually designing a game and have to take some step-by-step approach in developing the game? Nah, just ask for cockpits in Alpha.

 

 

 

This is why I'm afraid of Alpha Access in Steam. First month in Alpha Test uninitiated people will ask for cockpit varieties, instead of helping the devs with any bugs or issues.

 

Well. Did read on the main site. ... Skim the forum's one. Probably more thoroughly than you skimmed my post; I didn't ask for 40k themed cockpits. I asked for the ABILITY to BUILD a cockpit fitting of any theme. Because not everything is huge enough to be straight-out block built.

I guess it's easier to be straight out dismissive? In no way did I imply I'd believe I'm seeing the features of the finished game. I merely mentioned one that haven't been seen so far, and declared it important.

 

Nearly similar reasons why I no longer go through Steam Early Access, too many times burned on the proverbial rear. 

 

Anyway enough of yet another troll - attention grabbing post for me - back to writing html code and working on a alliance constitution for me. 

 

Right. I don't care about your attention. I care about a potential for a good game.

 

To any who doubts my reasons, or which poster is a troll here, I ask you to think: Which one of us put more effort into his post? Do trolls offer valuable ideas often in your experience?

Or do they attempt to discredit their perceived opponent by an off-hand remark that may or may not be slightly connected to their first impression or a snippet of information picked out of context?

 

Worry not, I recognize that smell.

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Meaning, there are no good reasons other than "well, it's not red because it's blue".

 

The site's FAQ will have to do then.

I'd also like to remind you I was kind enough to provide a TLDR of my own ramblings.

 

Won't preach water while drinking wine, I am willing to read through anything of up to a similar length of what I unleashed if it doesn't completely suck, and isn't quite as jumbled as what you so smugly referred to.

 

Well, at any rate the ideas are out there and they either take root or don't. Seen enough forums to hold no illusions, but here's hoping.

 

Would have enjoyed some proper responses, counterpoints even, but as so often before, the first ones to strike were less than capable of that.

 

Maybe someone still bumps in before this topic devolves into a comlete sh!tstorm.

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alright. being lazy but i answer atleast 2 things. maybe three.

 

1. being able to create our own elements such as cockpits and the like is great. probably wont be seen in alpha or beta. possibly a post release update.

2. reasons im against the private servers, putting personal feelings aside here. 

   a. takes away from the first m in mmo. most iv seen on a private server is maybe a few hundred. at this point maybe its possible to get a few thousand on a player run one but still when a org has the potential of thousands of players i just dont see how this is viable.

   b. takes away from what the devs actually want which is emergent gameplay.

 

 

edit: done with this thread. good day folks

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Ok first this is an mmo not Rust or whatever so for it being an mmo private servers are a big NO(not trying to be harsh),you should of atleast read the Devblogs for information of this huge game and would of learned that private servers are againts the Devs thinking of a single shard sandbox mmo.

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alright. being lazy but i answer atleast 2 things. maybe three.

 

1. being able to create our own elements such as cockpits and the like is great. probably wont be seen in alpha or beta. possibly a post release update.

2. reasons im against the private servers, putting personal feelings aside here. 

   a. takes away from the first m in mmo. most iv seen on a private server is maybe a few hundred. at this point maybe its possible to get a few thousand on a player run one but still when a org has the potential of thousands of players i just dont see how this is viable.

   b. takes away from what the devs actually want which is emergent gameplay.

The problem is, unlike an image, a 3D mesh takes a lot of memory. Memory which will be have to be stored in the servers, so to deter backdoors for malware into the server. Having an image editor in-game, could happen, giving each player up to, let's say, 500 MB of storage to create their own flags or whatever. A cockpit on its own would a tenth of that and a lot of loading on other players to load said texture. Which is why the prefab cockpits on the devs part are a good thing. You would already have the cockpit on your client, you won't have to download it in real time..

 

 

And setting up a WoW server with functional A.I. is difficult. Can you imagine some guy trying to set up a DUAL server on a traditional server blade? The thing would crack into splinters. The devs had to pretty much invent a new tech to host the game.

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Wow, I don't really agree with OPs assessment either but the level of sarcasm and condescension in the replies is kind of disproportional. 

 

I'm a little embarrassed to be part of the community right now 

Would you prefer us to explain reason to a guy who hasn't read any DevBlog and wants DUAL to become a Space Engineers clone with all its crashing glory instead? He hasn't even seen the ideas the devs have on customising a cockpit on the inside to make it more personal. He probably thinks the game is FPS combat as well. Care to explain that part to him?

 

Or would you like to explain why EVE and WoW got a P2P model with WoW even mimicking the PLEX system for their game from EVE?

 

Could you at least expain to him why Private Servers won't even exist for the game, since the tech they got for it is patented and owned by the NQ's CEO and Lead Dev of the game, JC Baillie?

 

 

The original post I made, was a reference to all those things he didn't bother to read or research for that matter.

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Now we're going somewhere.

 

Ultimately they'll make the game they want to make, and it'll either sell or it won't.

 

But does it absolutely HAVE to be "Massively" multiplayer? I listed my reasons why I think there's virtue in smaller communities.

A single large one, true enough, will offer more chances to meet more people, see more creations, and always run into someone.....

 

Except, you can also do that simply by checking out another server and keep the benefits of a smaller group, and as for population density, I usually get deeper interactions out of the average NPC than the average player who's in a rush to do his daily farming and questing and whatever. I sure won't expect someone to drop his prioritiesfor my sake.

 

 

As for creating a 3D mesh; No. Think the same voxel based construction as building the ship itself. That takes storage as well.

In fact, this way a ship's file could become SMALLER by not having to build every repeating shape individually, rather calling on pre-made objects, which is the original goal of using prefabs.:

 

Let's say there's a ship made of 100k polygons total. It has 4 big old thrusters, each made of 10k polygons. Since they are prefabs, you didn't have to build them four times individually; the ship's file actually only contains the data for 60k polys, and calls another file containing the other 10k; Instead of 4 times 10k coordinates, the system uses 4 coordinates for the 4 prefab units, and 10k coordinates once to determine the shape of that prefab.

In no way does it create more data to be stored than in does to create a ship without using any prefabs.

 

Naturally, no new texture is created, simply uses the same stuff anything you build from regular blocks does.

 

 

 

Would you prefer us to explain reason to a guy who hasn't read any DevBlog and wants DUAL to become a Space Engineers clone with all its crashing glory instead? He hasn't even seen the ideas the devs have on customising a cockpit on the inside to make it more personal. He probably thinks the game is FPS combat as well. Care to explain that part to him?

Or would you like to explain why EVE and WoW got a P2P model with WoW even mimicking the PLEX system for their game from EVE?

Could you at least expain to him why Private Servers won't even exist for the game, since the tech they got for it is patented and owned by the NQ's CEO and Lead Dev of the game, JC Baillie?


The original post I made, was a reference to all those things he didn't bother to read or research for that matter.

 

And you're back to square one.

 

Could YOU pull your head out of your furry rear and stop making wild assumptions?

 

How is it not already an SE clone? There are obvious improvements, but the similarities are staggering.

 

What's this about FPS? Do I also think mole people live beneath the surface? That Santa is real? Tell me, what else do I think that I didn't know I do?

 

What did I write about WoW and EVE? That only those two still survive with that payment model. They too COULD be different, and the only thing stopping it is human greed. There is nothing to explain there.

 

As I've written about why red's not blue: No private server because they patented their stuff? Well, duh. Don't fuss about it and it's suddenly not a problem.

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Hi !

Welcome around.

You mentioned some interesting points, however I beg to differ on most of them.

 








What NEEDS to happen, is the ability to build custom prefabs in-game, just like building the ship itself, then assigning functions to them through some menu, marking attachment and animation points, etc, so everyone can have the perfect part that perfectly fits the vessel he likes, and not just one general, bland sci-fi design!
 
That one is important. If nothing else happens until release, it needs to be made a reality, unless you're fine simply aping Space Engineers.

 
It would be COOL, but absolutely pointless regarding gameplay mechanics, and add over-complexity for the devs to implement this purely cosmetic feature.
 
COOL, not NEED.
 
 
 

Did you spend 300 hours lovingly building a masterpiece? Tough luck when the powergamers fly in with their literally 8-polygon cubeships and manage to trash it because they didn't waste space on something as trivial as accurately replicated interiors.

 
On this one I do think this what will happen.
This is a Game Designer task to think of an incentive for the player to add richness to their ship.
 
And ... Blueprints happened.
 
Since you can make a design and store it for replication upon destruction of the first prototype (or else).
The PvPers will, too, make some efforts into building their ships; because nobody likes flying in a piece of junk and will now their effort is not truly lost after a fight (so as yours).



 

Does your six year old son enjoy flying the very first, and superest spaceship he ever built? [...] oh the innocent fun he's having! However, that smile will quickly turn into disappointment when cannon shells a thousand times larger than his ship start raining in from fifty-thousand meters, or just, more prosaically, encounters his first really sick griefer

 
As in any MMO, and especially in a sandbox PvP-oriented one, this is to be expected, as it should.
Knowing this, you can always monitor and prevent your child to access the game if you think this will be a prejudice for him to experience this.
 
If you want your son to play a casual space MMO where nothing of the sort will happens, please introduce him to "No Man's Sky", as I think it is more oriented toward the "innocent" gamer (it is not even truly multiplayer, so no pvp)
 
If your son want to enjoy ship building, please try the plethora of titles that already offer it today. (SE, etc...)
 
To my opinion, none of them are satisfying, and Dual Universe represent hope of a true sandbox game, which is a rare commodity these days. So rare in fact, that most of the current generation of MMO player doesn't even know what it truly means.
 
For me, it means freedom.
 
Freedom NOT to destroy your ship if I decide to have pity or simply does not care !
or...
Freedom to destroy your son's ship just because I can. (size do matters ^^)
If I feel I can, it is because I am prepared for this fight.
In the process, your son may just learn that, to be prepared.
He may take the challenge and think of a better design for his ship, and (much) later love to PvP and not living in fear, because too, he will think he is prepared.
 
Freedom to NOT love PvP and be prepared to defend your "life" at a high cost !
 
All of this is not griefing. This is Freedom.
this freedom will ensure countless encounters, none of them the same, this freedom will make sure Dual Universe will not bore you after a few hours.
 
PvP is just an example, but the same logic applies to other aspect of the game.
 
Also, you will be free to reject civilization and be on your way to the edge of the (infinite procedural) universe .. never to cross path with another human again ... That can be a challenging goal actually.
 
 
 

What I'm saying is: Smaller, dedicated servers are better, with closer communities, which in turn are closer to the people running the show, thus are better served, and better able to find a virtual home they can enjoy themselves the way they want.

 
 
Smaller server means more rules required by the close proximity. More rules means less freedom and less emergent gameplay;
In short: a game able to die quicker, and a large amount of player deterred.
 
If I want a small community, I can find myself a nice server of .. SE, or Rust, or even WoW.
 
This is just not what DU is aiming for.
 
In DU, you will have freedom to make friends with other player wanting the same as you.
You will be able to team up and play together or just be neighbors  ! You can define your own "high standard" and go evangelize it into the verse (or not, again, you are free).
 
Build or join a community like-minded and just play together. You will find that the journey will bring you to places and situation you could have not even thought of before. You will be able to count on other players to "defend" your 300 hours masterpiece, or to hunt down whoever tried to smash it.
 
 

 

That was the reason against a centralized server.
 
Now for the dirty financials:
 
I personally think it's robbery to pay a monthly fee. I can buy the things I like, and then they'll be mine forever, or at least until they decompose. Buying a game once, then having to pay ANY fee just so I can keep accessing it is the definition of evil, and the lazy company's way of getting rich.

 
I would agree with you for a solo game.

Again, DU will be a true Massive Multiplayer Online game
It will run on cloud servers. Be it Amazon S3 or Google Cloud, this cost money. A LOT OF money.
 
So, a "maintenance fee" is required.
It is only normal as a player, and user connected to those servers, to participate to the cost.
NovaQuark must pay employees to keep improving the game, and to pay server bills. Lets not forget rewarding investors who made the whole journey possible.
 
So no, sorry, this is not robbery at all from my point of view.
 
No Man's Sky DO APPEARS to be robing their customers from my point of view... $70 for a procedural, soloplayer, tamagotchi simulator...err .. why not .. but .. well ... they do have servers to maintain the live database but ... the game is not even multiplayer.... (I have just seen a 2h long leaked gameplay video)
 
Back to the fee: in DU, you will be able to pay using PLEX-like item, using in game currency. So, even with razor blade in your pockets, you will be able to enjoy the game ^^.
 
 
 

I'm perfectly fine paying for the product ONCE, as they deserve it. I'm also willing to pay for an expansion, as that has a fair amount of work put into it, and as such, has worth.


Optional buying of expansion do divide communities. =/= freedom of a sandbox
It might be the best model for another game, but for DU, this makes no sense.
 
 
 
 

Evil people write dev blogs like that, and stupid people believe them.


Just as people play games not intended for them and go and bitch to the evil dev who made it because it is too hard for their non-experimented taste.
 
 
 
 
Conclusion
 
Lets agree to disagree on almost every point ;)
 
I sincerely hope you will be able to enjoy DU if it comes out as promised, you might just surprise yourself having the blast of a gamer-lifetime.

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Now we're going somewhere.

 

Ultimately they'll make the game they want to make, and it'll either sell or it won't.

 

But does it absolutely HAVE to be "Massively" multiplayer? I listed my reasons why I think there's virtue in smaller communities.

A single large one, true enough, will offer more chances to meet more people, see more creations, and always run into someone.....

 

Except, you can also do that simply by checking out another server and keep the benefits of a smaller group, and as for population density, I usually get deeper interactions out of the average NPC than the average player who's in a rush to do his daily farming and questing and whatever. I sure won't expect someone to drop his prioritiesfor my sake.

 

 

As for creating a 3D mesh; No. Think the same voxel based construction as building the ship itself. That takes storage as well.

In fact, this way a ship's file could become SMALLER by not having to build every repeating shape individually, rather calling on pre-made objects, which is the original goal of using prefabs.:

 

Let's say there's a ship made of 100k polygons total. It has 4 big old thrusters, each made of 10k polygons. Since they are prefabs, you didn't have to build them four times individually; the ship's file actually only contains the data for 60k polys, and calls another file containing the other 10k; Instead of 4 times 10k coordinates, the system uses 4 coordinates for the 4 prefab units, and 10k coordinates once to determine the shape of that prefab.

In no way does it create more data to be stored than in does to create a ship without using any prefabs.

 

Naturally, no new texture is created, simply uses the same stuff anything you build from regular blocks does.

1) Would you build an Atom Bomb and then use it to kill a spider or two? No. No you wouldn't. Plus, YOU NEED CLOUD COMPUTING FOR THE GAME TO RUN PROPERLY. If you read the FAQ Cybrex shared, you would know that, but hey, reading ain't the easiest thing for some I guess. 

 

2) Do you even know how voxel games even operate? My guess is no, it involved reading "walls of texts" called development kit instructions, hmmm, yes, too much for a hassle to gain any knowledge. It's easier to speak out of ignorance. Saves the trouble of filling your head with FACTS. On that part, do you even know how client-server conversations are being carried out? Or why you even have a 10 GB game in your PC when you play online? No, I guess that would require a CSD Major's degree or the ability to read a few "walls of texts". I guess you know better than me on that as well, I only got the degree, you got ignorance by your side. I guess you think games are streamed to you online and the 10GB in your PC are there so your SSD or HDD won't feel neglected and unloved.

 

Keep talking. Nobody is taking you seriously. Read the DevBlogs. Read the Ask Us Anything responses and Git Gud at reading "Walls of texts".

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Meaning, there are no good reasons other than "well, it's not red because it's blue".

 

The site's FAQ will have to do then.

I'd also like to remind you I was kind enough to provide a TLDR of my own ramblings.

 

Won't preach water while drinking wine, I am willing to read through anything of up to a similar length of what I unleashed if it doesn't completely suck, and isn't quite as jumbled as what you so smugly referred to.

 

Well, at any rate the ideas are out there and they either take root or don't. Seen enough forums to hold no illusions, but here's hoping.

 

Would have enjoyed some proper responses, counterpoints even, but as so often before, the first ones to strike were less than capable of that.

 

Maybe someone still bumps in before this topic devolves into a comlete sh!tstorm.

 

Unfortunately you are a bit late for the proper responses and counter points. At this time we have already done this on all the topics listed at least 5 or 6 times each. This is why you were linked to the post by Cybrex. All the quotes in that post are official from the developers all you need to do is just read what you care about and if you want more info on the subject then click the link. There are no short answers. so yes you will have to consume alot of info.

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-Some idiots who think they can act all cool and cinycal write stuff like "yeah, how dare they ask money for their product"

 

Which is BS and makes you sound retarded. I'm perfectly fine paying for the product ONCE, as they deserve it. I'm also willing to pay for an expansion, as that has a fair amount of work put into it, and as such, has worth.

What doesn't have worth, is not pulling the plug from the server, and waiting for your paycheck.

 

The problem with you logic here is, Servers do cost money to run, so if you don't want to pay a monthly fee to play a game, I suggest you stick to the ones that don't have this set-up.  MMO's on the other hand HAVE this set up, and you can expect to pay a monthly fee to keep their server going.  All of these BS arguments about not wanting to pay can be boiled down to that simple idea.  I am glad they plan to charge monthly, and will have no problem paying them.

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