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[Poll] wipe or no wipe


m0rrty
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FUD is usually spread by "bad actors" but in this case it feels like NQ themselves are the ones filling us with Fear for the future, Uncertainty as to which way the wipe hammer will fall and Doubt whether or not NQ can pull this game off when the servers go live.

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They could also wipe nothing - You let players move to solar system 1 without items, they keep talents, money (or a max amount of money) and blueprints. The difference - once moved you can't get back to the current one (solar system 0). No matter how you spin it, you're going to have to cut back to find a compromise without feeling screwed for the monthly money you paid. And new created characters start in solar system 1.

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On 5/17/2022 at 6:38 PM, SirJohn85 said:

They could also wipe nothing - You let players move to solar system 1 without items, they keep talents, money (or a max amount of money) and blueprints. The difference - once moved you can't get back to the current one (solar system 0). No matter how you spin it, you're going to have to cut back to find a compromise without feeling screwed for the monthly money you paid. And new created characters start in solar system 1.

 

This is the only scenario that actually makes any sense, and which serves both goals of allowing new players to start on a (more) level playing field, and allowing existing players to retain their hard-won stuff.

 

I would do it slightly differently, but it's the same principle:

 

- add a new solar system

- new players start in the new system

- existing players remain in the old (legacy) system with all their money and stuff

- allow free travel between new and old systems; but you can only take blueprints with you - not property, and not money

 

That allows existing players to blueprint their stuff and recreate it in the new system if they want to, but they have to bootstrap themselves again financially. As discussed elsewhere in this thread, they will still have a large advantage due to the skills they've got etc - but at least they won't start with vast cash or equipment reserves.

 

Crucially, it also allows existing players to still visit, use and modify their stuff in the old system. Which means they don't instantly lose years worth of investment in creative endeavour. It also means that they can customise things before blueprinting them, which makes it a lot easier to just take the bits they want to recreate.

 

Over time the legacy system could be deprecated and maybe even removed, but it should be in the order of years and not months before that happens.

 

 

Could NQ do this in a reasonable timeframe? In theory, the two systems are pretty much two parallel setups of the game, so it ought to be pretty easy to bring up a new solar system. They would probably want to change names and maybe configurations of planetary bodies, so that's some work. The main new bit of code would be a mechanism for "travelling" between the two, which I think essentially means logging out of one, into the other, whilst preserving / moving any blueprints in their nano pack. That's obviously some work, but it is work that would be very valuable as it could also be used to allow people to share blueprints with the PTS - which makes the PTS a lot more attractive as a place to try things out, prototype, build, etc.

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17 hours ago, Samedi said:

 

This is the only scenario that actually makes any sense, and which serves both goals of allowing new players to start on a (more) level playing field, and allowing existing players to retain their hard-won stuff.

 

I would do it slightly differently, but it's the same principle:

 

- add a new solar system

- new players start in the new system

- existing players remain in the old (legacy) system with all their money and stuff

- allow free travel between new and old systems; but you can only take blueprints with you - not property, and not money

 

That allows existing players to blueprint their stuff and recreate it in the new system if they want to, but they have to bootstrap themselves again financially. As discussed elsewhere in this thread, they will still have a large advantage due to the skills they've got etc - but at least they won't start with vast cash or equipment reserves.

 

Crucially, it also allows existing players to still visit, use and modify their stuff in the old system. Which means they don't instantly lose years worth of investment in creative endeavour. It also means that they can customise things before blueprinting them, which makes it a lot easier to just take the bits they want to recreate.

 

Over time the legacy system could be deprecated and maybe even removed, but it should be in the order of years and not months before that happens.

 

 

Could NQ do this in a reasonable timeframe? In theory, the two systems are pretty much two parallel setups of the game, so it ought to be pretty easy to bring up a new solar system. They would probably want to change names and maybe configurations of planetary bodies, so that's some work. The main new bit of code would be a mechanism for "travelling" between the two, which I think essentially means logging out of one, into the other, whilst preserving / moving any blueprints in their nano pack. That's obviously some work, but it is work that would be very valuable as it could also be used to allow people to share blueprints with the PTS - which makes the PTS a lot more attractive as a place to try things out, prototype, build, etc.

You can't allow travel between them as NQ aren't going to invest time and money (they have neither) on creating a mechanism and building systems to allow only some things to move between them.

 

You're far better off (as has been discussed many, many times previously) just having 2 systems very far apart that allows people to travel between them if they choose to fly for 12 months at max speed. People who want to wipe/restart go to the new system with whatever setup, people who don't stay in Helios. You're allowed to VR anywhere (to keep the playerbase together), but can't transfer money to any entity in the new system, unless you 12-month slowboat it there.

 

Then at the end of the first year there is an event to build stargates between the two systems with the old system paying the most. After this, they are joined and connected populations again.

 

There are posts on this elsewhere in these forums.

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4 hours ago, Distinct Mint said:

You can't allow travel between them as NQ aren't going to invest time and money (they have neither) on creating a mechanism and building systems to allow only some things to move between them.

 

I agree it's unlikely, and I've no doubt that the problems right now are greatly amplified by NQ running out of money.  However, in effect the two systems in my suggestion would just be two instances of the server (dare we say "two shards"...), the investment in time would actually be minimal. In what you're suggesting you'd still need to add some new assets and modify some aspects of the game (eg the map), and to enforce the money transfer rules etc you'd need to make a distinction between the two locations that's more than just spatial; I suspect the sum result of the work would be similar either way.

 

I'm not sure I understand the fly-for-12-months idea. Nobody is actually going to do that.

 

Quote

as has been discussed many, many times previously

There are posts on this elsewhere in these forums.

 

Sure. I've been reading these forums for years too. They're inevitably a tangled swamp which nobody in their right mind has the time to catch up on - that's how this sort of forum works. If someone didn't happen to be part of those discussions, they might not know. If we stop saying things because they might have been said before, there's not much point saying anything...

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3 hours ago, Samedi said:

They're inevitably a tangled swamp which nobody in their right mind has the time to catch up on - that's how this sort of forum works.

 

Which is yet another odd choice by NQ, to be honest.

 

NQ pays a third party for this forum that they rarely use...anything from $1k/year to $6.5k/year depending on their package -- which means they've paid at least $6,000 for this forum over the last six years...which they don't use for customer interaction and really never have. 

 

Almost all their interaction has been through videos or podcasts with very rare replies here...so what's the point?

 

I strongly suspect these forums won't live forever -- wouldn't be surprised if they are shut down for release. 

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1 hour ago, blundertwink said:

 

Which is yet another odd choice by NQ, to be honest.

 

To be fair, what I was getting at was just that any forum like this becomes impossible to catch up on after a while through sheer weight of posts. So the notion that things keep coming up even if they've been discussed many times before is fairly inevitable.

 

You might be right about NQ's use of the forums, but in that I personally would cut them some slack (for once!). There are so many channels right now, that it's a bit of a nightmare for any company to know where to engage. I engage about DU mostly here and Discord, and it annoys me intensely that those two places overlap a lot and I can't quite decide which one to use (and I'm not consistent when I do choose!). Add all the socials into the mix and it's a nightmare...

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