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“Marketplace Heist” Response

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3 minutes ago, ColonkinYT said:

 Naturally, the developers had to react to this. And they reacted harshly. If there was no reaction, then everyone decided that they can do this and continue without any consequences. 

You're making it sound like the devs only had two options.

 

Permaban - Or - Do Nothing.

 

That's hardly the case. There are thousands of things they could have done instead of a perm ban.

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5 minutes ago, ColonkinYT said:

Sometimes it seems to me that half of the people in this discussion live in some kind of unreal world where there are unicorns and they fart like a rainbow.
1. NQ is the owner of this game. And it is this company that sets the rules of the game. And can change them by the way. I'm not making excuses for them, it's just a fact.
2. The guys were not banned because they pressed the B button. They were banned for what was done later. Namely, the ruin of the market. But that's half the trouble. They were smart enough to brag about it! That's for giving themselves up and getting banned! Even in real life, people are judged for 2 things. a) They got caught. b) They confessed. And then there's the aggravating factor. They trumpeted it on Reddit. Naturally, the developers had to react to this. And they reacted harshly. If there was no reaction, then everyone decided that they can do this and continue without any consequences. Perhaps, if there was no publicity in Reddit, the guys would have gotten off easier. This will be a lesson for everyone.

No one is doubting that NQ owns the game. If the company who owns a product is contradictory in behaviour and shifting morals that where the issue starts. People will defend it as long as theyre not affected by it. But this is a mistake, because this behaviour will be seen on every level and layer of the management.

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1 minute ago, Atmosph3rik said:

Which country's laws?  Or are we talking Maritime law? Or maybe the Pirate's Code? AAARRGH☠️

Consumer protection laws of France and the European Union as most european countries agreed to the same legal constructs made by the EU.

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19 minutes ago, ColonkinYT said:

Sometimes it seems to me that half of the people in this discussion live in some kind of unreal world where there are unicorns and they fart like a rainbow.
1. NQ is the owner of this game. And it is this company that sets the rules of the game. And can change them by the way. I'm not making excuses for them, it's just a fact.
2. The guys were not banned because they pressed the B button. They were banned for what was done later. Namely, the ruin of the market. But that's half the trouble. They were smart enough to brag about it! That's for giving themselves up and getting banned! Even in real life, people are judged for 2 things. a) They got caught. b) They confessed. And then there's the aggravating factor. They trumpeted it on Reddit. Naturally, the developers had to react to this. And they reacted harshly. If there was no reaction, then everyone decided that they can do this and continue without any consequences. Perhaps, if there was no publicity in Reddit, the guys would have gotten off easier. This will be a lesson for everyone.

Yes, they are the owner and they can set the rules. But they can't ban you if you didn't break those rules. The players involved didn't. They tried to message the Devs through modern ways of contacting people, so the statement that they didn't report the "bug" is a lie. And the company is not allowed to act against their own rules. If they do, they have to compensate for any loss endured by their customer. Here they clearly acted against their own rules after they failed to protect dev constructions and/or places for the public community, something they have to do if they state that it is a safe area for anyone. And it that regard they are violating consumer protection laws in the combination with unruly bannings, because the players paid for the service the company allegedly provides.

As for any beta: It is normal to make glitches or exploits public. And this here wasn't even one of them, it was simply the devs fault not to lock editing-rights. As goes for that again: The company is not allowed to ban you for something you didn't do in their property, so making a permaban out of it because they posted it on reddit, is another act of consumer violation. It's like saying you are not allowed to buy in Walmart, because I heard you talking about how easy it is to steal there at the bus stop. It is not in their rights to act this way.

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This argument is just silly.  Since about 1999 i've known that in a persistent online game, if you find an exploitable bug, you report it, or you risk getting banned.  And if you share the knowledge publicly, you get banned.

 

This is common knowledge.  Everyone knows this.  It was in the TOS.  It's been in every TOS for 20 years.

 

The idea that NQ should have specified that they aren't players and aren't included in PVP is hilarious.  

 

This sounds like a bunch of children trying to talk their way out of bedtime by pointing out that their parents get to stay up late.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, carijay766 said:

If there is a bug. Mismanaged RDMS are not a bug period.

So if someone at NQ mistakenly sets all your RDMS to ALL, is that a bug?

 

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1 minute ago, carijay766 said:

Clearly not. Thats someone failing at their job and if its me setting RDMS accidentally to all its my failure. You dont seem to know what a bug is.

So you're saying the difference is, when a player sets RDMS that's part of the game.  But since NQ has the ability to make changes to the game, that aren't inline with the intended gameplay.  Like giving away all your stuff, or a market, when NQ makes unintended changes to RDMS that's.... a bug?

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2 minutes ago, Atmosph3rik said:

So you're saying the difference is, when a player sets RDMS that's part of the game.  But since NQ has the ability to make changes to the game, that aren't inline with the intended gameplay.  Like giving away all your stuff, or a market, when NQ makes unintended changes to RDMS that's.... a bug?

Correct. There are bugs, as in code issues, and then there are user errors, when a user fails to use the software correctly.

 

It is not relevant if the user is a player or admin or dev. Their failure to correctly use the software does not indicate that there is a bug in the software. You can argue that the software failed to have sufficient guardrails, but you can't call it a bug.

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Since youre having trouble of understanding basic things if NQ set MY RDMS thats their extra power they use and thus their responsibility. Its on top of what a player can do. I, nor any other player, can set NQs RDMS.

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Players aren't supposed to have access to your stuff, correct? 

 

Players aren't supposed to have access to a market, correct?

 

NQ staff have the ability to make any of these changes any time they want.  Are you saying that if NQ mistakenly gives me everything on Alioth.  Then it's mine, forever?  Finderz Keeperz

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9 minutes ago, Atmosph3rik said:

Players aren't supposed to have access to your stuff, correct? 

 

Players aren't supposed to have access to a market, correct?

 

NQ staff have the ability to make any of these changes any time they want.  Are you saying that if NQ mistakenly gives me everything on Alioth.  Then it's mine, forever?  Finderz Keeperz

Wow your logic is so flawed I dont even know where to start. You make no sense whatsoever.

 

Players dont have access to my stuff as long as I dont make a horrible mistake, which would be my fault and my fault only unless NQ abuses their power and interferes with the game. In this case it would be clearly NQs fault and not the players.

 

"If NQ uses admin power to purposely change your RDMS and ruin your base thats your fault."

 

If they accidentally make alioth avaible to everyone its their fault. They either have to fix THEIR mistake by hand or rollback. Not perma ban every who has been on alioth.

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What if right now someone at NQ just shuts the game off.

 

Is that PVP? Did we all just lose?

 

Can they never decide to turn it back on again?

 

🤡

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🤦‍♂️ Yep thats about as reflected as youll get I guess. Knowing youve ridiculed yourself you try to distract with something even more ridiculous. Good job son.

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7 minutes ago, carijay766 said:

If they accidentally make alioth avaible to everyone its their fault. They either have to fix THEIR mistake by hand or rollback.

 

25 minutes ago, carijay766 said:

Mismanaged RDMS are not a bug period.

 

Pick one. 

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1 minute ago, Atmosph3rik said:

 

 

Pick one. 

What? Why?

 

The two are not the same. When I run the wrong linux command  and accidently grant users perms they shouldn't have at work, I don't get to claim "bug"!  

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1 minute ago, Mordgier said:

What? Why?

 

The two are not the same. When I run the wrong linux command  and accidently grant users perms they shouldn't have at work, I don't get to claim "bug"!  

 

Do you think bugs, are like real bugs?  Like there's a spider inside the computer?

 

Not mistakes in code?

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4 minutes ago, Atmosph3rik said:

 

Do you think bugs, are like real bugs?  Like there's a spider inside the computer?

 

Not mistakes in code?

Mistakes in code are not the same thing as user error.

 

Failing to correctly set permissions isn't a bug. It's user error.

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13 minutes ago, Atmosph3rik said:

 

Do you think bugs, are like real bugs?  Like there's a spider inside the computer?

 

Not mistakes in code?

Why are you so bad at trolling my dude, like this is not even childish anymore thats just sad. But I guess thats as much as you can expect from a white knight. 

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8 minutes ago, Mordgier said:

Mistakes in code are not the same thing as user error.

 

Failing to correctly set permissions isn't a bug. It's user error.

 

Even when it's not their stuff?

 

The market wasn't theirs to give away.  NQ has access to everything.

 

If they mistakenly set all your RDMS to ALL, is that a bug or PVP?

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6 minutes ago, Atmosph3rik said:

 

Even when it's not their stuff?

 

The market wasn't theirs to give away.  NQ has access to everything.

 

If they mistakenly set all your RDMS to ALL, is that a bug or PVP?

Why are you moving the goal posts?

 

User error isn't a bug. 

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Mordgier said:

Why are you moving the goal posts?

 

How have i moved the goal post?

 

How is NQ making changes to a market's RDMS any different then them making changes to yours?

 

Was NQ playing the game when they made the changes?  Was the purpose of the RDMS change to benefit them personally in the game?  

 

Or was it maybe, part of their job, to make the market services available to all of us, so we can enjoy the game.

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