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Zekarsis

Standardizing construction

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Hello everyone i first want to start by saying im really exited to be involved with dual universe and its development. i'm making this post because i believe it would be very helpful in the future to standardize things like hangars and platforms. what i mean by standardizing is that as a community whole i believe all small ships and hangars should have a set value of space per ship. for example cars. many of us drive cars and all of them are built to meet a certain length, width and height. To clarify i'm not asking everyone to limit the size of their ships what i'm asking is that there should be a recommended size limit so that your ship can land on all hangars and platforms across the universe.  By standardizing our hangars it will encourage others to build their ships to a size that will fit allowing that same ship to fit in another hangar from another faction just like our cars fit inside garages.

 

(Just to make sure I've clarified what i'm asking a single ship landing pad could be a 5x5x5 cubed space. so if your hangar will have 4 landing pads then it would be a 25x25x25 cubed space to allow enough room for those ships to land and maneuver with ease.)

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Well once again, this will be player decision. Well according to the market law, all standard will depend on the org who produce the most of it. For example in the beginning period of the game, all org will compete to be the best and take most share in the market so there wont be any standard that time until the economic become stabilize and then who have the most share in the aspect will be the standard and all new join the compete will follow that standard.

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while that is true you will also have other builders who will design their landing pads in a different size than someone else. in doing so some ship designs will be forced to land outside the base or structure due to its size being too large. this is why the decision to standardize landing pads would be driven by the community otherwise it wouldn't work. one org may have a smaller landing pad than another making deliveries more difficult between the 2 org. standardizing would be more like a "recommendation" not really a limiting factor but would be more effective if used universally.

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Everyone will want their "standard" become the standard ... for profit purpose of course. So Market Law will do the job when the game economic is stabilize . So it maybe wont be in game from the begining but who know what would happen, human always make surprise did they ?

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This would only be useful for a trading hub anyway. 

 

Bases, outposts and org stations in space are mostly org specific and not for public use. Those will have org specific standards anyway.

 

Cities might enforce a no-fly zone for obvious reasons (PvP,  clutter, order,..) but may gravitate towards some kind of DU wide standard. 

 

So we're only talking about public markets really. And those will be dictated by supply and demand, services available and taxes. 

 

It's up to players and what kind of ship meta will prevail in DU. Lots of smaller platforms for single seaters do make sense, because I doubt ppl will take out their big toys to Go to a city/market to shop. Also bigger ships will need a Crew, which won't be easy to organize for someone just to go shopping 

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especially if your housing a space hub to allow large ships to dock at. there has to be some kind of standards or it will hinder supply flow.

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I got to agree with the OP. There must be Standards!

An Org will have a Recognized Body (an Org or a group of people that is accepted by the Minister as having the expertise and experience to set Standards).

 

Standards come from Industry Experts. Industry Experts will get together to form a Technical Committee to craft a Standard (it doesn't take a single Industry Expert to develop a Standard, it takes many Industry Experts to do that). This created-Standard will be recognized only by this Technical Committee so far. We call this a "Consensus Standard". Consensus Standards are developed in cooperation with all parties who participated in the development of that Standard.  

 

The 3 steps are: 

1.) Development of a Consensus Standard by a Technical Committee.

2.) Recognition of a Consensus Standard by a Recognized Body. (this now becomes a "Recognized Standard" of an Org)

3.) Conformation to Recognized Standard by the local Industry or the local requirement (designing based on the Recognized Standard's specifications).  

 

Just because a Standard exists, doesn't mean that it is recognized by an Org. This is a Consensus Standard.

 

When an Org recognized a certain Consensus Standard, it becomes their Recognized Standard (meaning it is recognized by that Org. It is their set-Standard).

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so the most important part of this is getting the comunity to recongnize that the problems we would face in the future without a recognized standard.

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A Technical Committee is independent of any Org. It's not part of a government. 

 

A Recognized Body is part of a government (it is part of an Org). They can recognize a certain Consensus Standard developed by a certain Technical Committee. If that happens, it becomes their Recognized Standard.

 

This is what I want to see from the community of this game! So, what the OP is proposing is ofcourse very feasible and I highly support the idea.

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You won't get such a thing in DU imho. I doubt that players will do that in this particular way. 

 

The way I see it ppl will just do whatever they want until they recognize there is a problem. Then ppl will just look at the prevailing shipmeta: what ships do land in our market? How long are most ships? Then actand build platforms accordingly. For special guests who might pay higher fees they can even get better/bigger pads. As I said, markets will provide services too. If most ppl can't land properly there, less ppl will use it. 

 

It's a game, no need to make things more complicated then they need to be. Also, I doubt ppl from different orgs will agree easily or at all to some consensus. I certainly never have the mood to sit in such s comittee

 

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while i understand what your saying, you would be surprised how involved people are willing to be in a community. take ECO for example. ECO is a game that is heavily based on community cooperation similar to the way this game is being developed. there are many side effects involved in the game that continue to encourage players to work together to strive for efficiency and quality within the game. while DU is set up differently, there will still be problems created by the community that can be resolved. and it is a lot easier to resolve them now than to have player re conform their hangars and landing pads to a new regulation.  of course there will always be some players who do not wish to follow these guidelines, we can save most of the problems that would occur in the future if we develop them now. as long as we have the mass of the community recognizing these guidelines it would encourage others to follow them as well through natural selection.

 

if we can make this forum popular enough we might even be able to get the devs involved to help encourage players to follow this "recommendation." i dont mean as in rules set by the dev. i mean something more like a foot note in the start of the game that everyone will see allowing them to read these "guidelines". by doing this it not only would help with recognition, but also conformation.

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26 minutes ago, Zekarsis said:

and it is a lot easier to resolve them now than to have player re conform their hangars and landing pads to a new regulation.  of course there will always be some players who do not wish to follow these guidelines, we can save most of the problems that would occur in the future if we develop them now. as long as we have the mass of the community recognizing these guidelines it would encourage others to follow them as well through natural selection.

 

if we can make this forum popular enough we might even be able to get the devs involved to help encourage players to follow this "recommendation." i dont mean as in rules set by the dev. i mean something more like a foot note in the start of the game that everyone will see allowing them to read these "guidelines". by doing this it not only would help with recognition, but also conformation.

Gl talking to all orgs then. By all means, try to do that. Try to get everyone to agree and work for a global solution. That's DU - if you feel the community needs smth then work for it and do smth about it.

 

I disagree on the footnote of the devs though - this game should be run by players alone. No need for the devs to promote any one initiative over another 

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4 minutes ago, Lethys said:

Gl talking to all orgs then. By all means, try to do that. Try to get everyone to agree and work for a global solution. That's DU - if you feel the community needs smth then work for it and do smth about it.

 

I disagree on the footnote of the devs though - this game should be run by players alone. No need for the devs to promote any one initiative over another 

so how do you recommend we grow this post in popularity?

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48 minutes ago, Zekarsis said:

so how do you recommend we grow this post in popularity?

Idk and honstly idc either right now - it's just too soon for that kind of stuff imho. Beta would be best for that kind of talk imho, once all mechanics are implemented.

 

Create an org, talk to ppl on discord, get ppl to work with you, build relations and make them aware of the situatuon or problem that you see. 

 

I don't think it's rly a problem because It'll be regulated organically once we know what kind of ship will be prevalent, once we get player run markets, once we get RDMS to regulate our territories and once we know what kind of products will be bought. Too soon rn imho, but you can try ofc. It's a player driven sandbox  - go for it 

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Lethys has covered every pertinent point, perfectly.

 

Also plenty of players will want replica/antique SC, SW or ST etc et al ships with their owns standards of design, don't forget. The odd name change and appearance tweak to suffice.

 

Likewise scavenging appeals to me but there's zero indication at present it would even be a feature. So let's see what problems arise then players will find solutions as opposed to solutions looking for problems. As said orgs will probably have most need to mass produce to a standard that is effective in use and efficient in production. Public will want all sorts of crazy designs no doubt, which is a good thing: Personal expression and aesthetics will often have personal value beyond in-game economic value.

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I believe the only useful feature may be some sort of translator, that can be configured to send you details about form and size of landing zones. It can be placed by the owner of a construct and can work like parking guide for trading hubs. But I'm against mandatory standardization.

 

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2 hours ago, MaltoSigma said:

Sorry, I meant Shrink-Rays of course. ^^

I dont see anything I DU with shrink Ray's. Also that would be completely ineffective in something like this post. On top of that it would make construction even harder to unify when you can change the size of a ship constantly 

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15 hours ago, Zekarsis said:

I dont see anything I DU with shrink Ray's. Also that would be completely ineffective in something like this post. On top of that it would make construction even harder to unify when you can change the size of a ship constantly 

how about using some butter, if a ship is too large for a hangar? 😕

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