FalloutWB
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Posts posted by FalloutWB
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On 12/19/2021 at 10:08 AM, Zarcata said:
This is only one point of view, there are certainly many, but I would like to mention another in fairness:
There are players who have put a lot of time and money into the game, but who don't like the current state of the game or simply don't have the nerve to endure this alpha/beta any longer.
But these players would come back when the game is released, provided that there is a positive development until then.
So do you want to just take everything away from these players or force them to sign up for a 1 month subscription to set their tiles as HQ?
Allowing these players to automatically assign their own territories and constructs there was a right decision, also because they will be potential customers to come back later.I can understand every player who currently has no more nerves for this state of the game and just wants to wait for it to improve drastically with the release. So they themselves are quitting now...so would they like it if in two weeks NQ decides that their buildings will just disappear and be released for looting? If they never come back, they certainly can't care, but if they still have hope that the game will still develop positively from the current testing phase, it would certainly be a painful loss.
You also have to remember that not everyone has free BetaKeys, but has to pay fixed subscription fees, as if it were already a finished game and not a construction site.
I was of this frame of mind for a while. I've been watching, and waiting for a reason to come back. However, to Mega's point, I don't trust NQ either. I'm still watching for that miracle, but after what I've seen since I've left, I don't see them pulling this one out. There are quite a few former players that called this game "a scam" when they left. I argued with them for a bit, but yeah, NQ is showing these players may have been right. Really sad.
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With all the feedback over the last couple of weeks, I can't believe NQ actually went through with this update. Still laggy, buggy and unstable to boot!
- Bollox and JohnnyTazer
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Will the HQ option, in regards to taxes, be implemented in time for the Demeter release? This is the "make or break" as to whether or not I will return.
- Aaron Cain, CptLoRes and Selena
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18 hours ago, Jake Arver said:
Overal thoughts.."Not expected outcome" on PTS changes was funny. It just shows NQ does not know their own product or their community very well
Geometry reset not main issue. Of course not, it is fairly minor and really roo small an action
The argument to not allow respec of talents is silly, NQ is basically still in alpha and making big changes here which justifes a full respec. The argument that you do not want to allow a respec every patch is not valid here as this is a major patch with deep changes.
Why is NQ saying the scans remain valid when they will not be as per this QA.
Unlimited ore now? That ends the need for many to ever leave Alioth and will make big orgs and those with deep pockets thanks to exploits mass claim tiles from their existing infrastructure and availability of ships. Also, with T4/T5 ore now beiong nore sparse and on outerplanets, once big orgs grab them they have unlimited supply. This change pretty much undermines the core of DU from my POV
The typical "you do not understand" dismissal of valid concerns about mining (locations). "once you understand it wil lbe easy" mean you do not actually listen to yoru communities concerns.
Lovely how Pann pretty much describes alpha state game development (put something out htere and see how it works). NQ should really readjust their develolp;ment state an dbe honest about it.
Wipe/no wipe should not be a matter of discussion for NQ, changes like coming now during development ask for a wipe and NQ should grow a pair and pull the trigger on a wipe.TAXES
- Of course taxes are a big issue. It's a sensible idea, badly designed. Again, NQ being seemingly surprised by this shows they really do not hink these things through on a level beyond their own bubble.
- Taxes "to avoid land grabbing" was funny, I laughed so hgard. It will actually drive it as people with a lot fo currency will do exactly that to secure their unlimited supply of ore. Which is the very reason why a full wipe is needed on such a massive shift in core game design.
- Aquisitioning static constructs on a tile once the ownershipo expires and is claimed by another player makes sense but there needs to be a longer period for which you can pay taxes. If people have to be absent for longer they need to be able to not have to get back to the game while they can't OR be able to assign others to pay the tax while retaining ownership.
- Allowing one tax free tile per player will allow big orgs to combine tile ownership of members and own massive swats of tiles at no cost. This needs to be addressed/balanced.
PRICING:- Frankly.. I called this one and do not see much of an issue with it. I do not expect it to make much of a difference now though, it woudl have if these prices were what NQ started with
- The spin on the price increase is hilarious "you can still pay $7/month but you need to pay for a year in advance". In other words, "please make a long term commitment to the game"
- The pricing uses insane exchange rates in some cases
COST CUTTING- The spin from Pann on the cost cutting by NQ is silly and shows a complete misunderstanding of the comments she refers to. It pretty much also exposes the massive disconnect there is between NQ and the community.
- NQ needs to stop making excuses and trying to spin their need to cut cost as a positive.
Lastly;
People saying a NQ staffer should "die in a fire" in any sort of way should result in an insta ban and it should not be laughed off during a Q&A. I've been berated and threatened by NQ staff with bans for far, far less. Pann should kow better with her background and experience than to put that out here and downplay it.I think you nailed every part of this spot on... including the stupid comment someone made to Pann.
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There is a big part of me that wants this game to succeed. When Demeter was announced, however, I pretty much wrote this game off. Just watched the video, and here is my feedback:
1.) LOVE the idea of the "headquarters" on each planet idea that won't be taxed. Thank you for listening to the massive feedback. The video explained a great point that there would a lot of land grabbing. While I do agree with this, If tiles pay for themselves with the auto mining, I'm not really sure how that's going to discourage or stop the land grabbing. Think that idea needs to be a little more fine tuning... but NQ is headed in a better direction there.
2.) I'm not a big fan of paying a sub to be a beta tester. There was a point in game history that game companies actually paid their beta testers, not the other way around. Sure, I understand that NQ needs money, and with all the recent news and updates, NQ looks to be screaming that they are running out of money fast. However, I'm not sure why NQ is the only beta game I've played that is charging a sub. Can someone correct me if this is a common thing in beta games?
Given that the players are creating the content in this game, and a lot of people are sitting on the sidelines waiting for the devs to create something more to do in the game, I kinda think the price increase is another smack in the face to players. I get it... NQ needs money desperately. How do other small game companies pull it off with their games without charging a sub for beta games?
3.) Mistake or covering your ass, I'm just happy the airbrake change isn't being lumped into the Demeter patch! Pretty sure you would have another exodus had that been included.
4.) I do appreciate the vlog updates giving more insight and communicating these things to the players. Glad to see NQ is interested in feedback and getting closer to getting on the same page as the players.
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On 10/21/2021 at 4:30 PM, CMDRTaco said:
Because they have built something no other game studio has created before. They also were not able to predict how players would exploit the game. Almost all traditional MMOs take 5+ years to develop, so 7+ for a groundbreaking game like DU is not surprising. Would you have preferred that they just keep an unsustainable system in or fix it like they have. I for one think this system is a good solution. The only change I would have made would be to make the ore resources shift once a month like SWG did.
You mean they created a single shard, unstable, less in depth version of Empyrion? Pretty surprised they haven't been sued for that!
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7 hours ago, blundertwink said:
Every successful sub-based MMO has only one interest when it comes to inactive players: get them to resubscribe.
Why do you think Netflix makes it so easy for you to pause or cancel? They know that at some point you'll come crawling back and don't want to piss you off in the meantime.
I get that they need a way to reclaim tiles to save money....but they are severely limiting the appeal of resubscribing. Even if their churn rate were low, that would be a problem long-term.
Without AvA or territory war, opening these dead tiles to first-come salvage is a weird idea -- make a way for the owner to reclaim (most) of the mats and delete it, don't just throw it into the wind and shrug at the concept of resubs.
Majorly counterproductive for NQ's bottom line.
Not going to re-sub just to save items in a game that is likely to die after this patch goes live. The people that think this is great because of all the salvaging are not thinking this through. Short term fun at the cost of paying players returning. Game over.
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On 10/30/2021 at 3:08 PM, Tional said:
Can I have your stuff? Oh, right, I can. I just have to wait for the taxes to eat your hexes.
Enjoy my stuff... you and the other 8 players left should have a wonderful time with it for the time the game has left. Too few players don't pay the bills at NQ. This game was on borrowed time as it was.
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Here's the way I see this on a basic level. The voxel changes and automated miners probably should be an update... but with just those two changes alone, the devs will likely have their hands full with bugs they didn't expect. I know THAT has never happened in this game before, but just hear me out.
The taxes and airbrake changes at the same time? Not sure why NQ wants to smush that into the same patch and drive the remaining player base out. Casual players, that already have a job won't stick around, and I feel for the ship builders that just went through having to fix all of their designs due to the stacking issues. One day their ships are awesome... the next, they fall out of the sky. I know if I was a designer selling blueprints, I wouldn't stick around. How's that going to look, to the rest of the players, when major ship designers suddenly leave?
NQ seems to be missing the point all around and doesn't seem to have a finger on the pulse of the players. What's currently there is a good start, but the current players, as well as former players are waiting for you (NQ) to DESIGN! Show us something. People like to build ships to "pew pew"... whether it's pvp or pve pew pew, that kind of thing kinda ties it all together. Some players may not want to go out and shoot things, but a torn up ship gives the industrialists more stuff to make and sell. More for the miners to sell to the industrialists.
Show of hands... how many players out there are looking for the next Eve online? I know I'd love to see a modern version of the best features of that game in it's hay day. Anyone else want to go exploring space with your heart pounding because there is likely someone around the corner that could jump out at any second? No? How about selling your ships to those types that do?
Territory warfare... Atmo pvp... avatar combat, and more! All these possible things to be working on, and NQ is thinking "Taxes". It's like you're getting ideas from American political news channels!
While the game is a sandbox, and players do generate the content, the players shouldn't be responsible for ALL of the content! You (NQ) want to get players off the sidelines and start paying subs again? CREATE! Show us something new in the game. Penalties, Nerfs, Taxes... and giving them named releases? Give the players a reason to play, and THEN start gradual tweaks closer to release... like territory taxes and actual airbrake functionality.
However, yes... I agree 100% with the thread title. If this goes live, the game will start a tailspin that it won't recover from.
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On 10/30/2021 at 11:10 AM, loaded said:
seems to me you quit long ago and your one tile on alioth could be paid by your daily login alone, i for one want the taxes system and get rid of all the quiters that have left there shit everywhere about time we had a clean up
Too many quitters means no sub money and even less for the remaining PVP crowd to shoot at. No people to shoot at, remaining PVP leaves... even less sub money. Too little sub money, no game! The cash grab no longer worth it... game over.
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4 hours ago, Cergorach said:
Sorry, but with all the changes on PTS for Demeter, that will NEVER happen. We saw a ton of builders leave after 0.23, DU never recovered from that. Even the last couple of months many long time builders have gone on a break from DU. When their subscription expires and they try to return, all their bases will be gone. Folks in the know already will not resubscribe (EVER) and folks that didn't know will charge back their subscription fee via their credit card company (besides the subscription fees there are added costs for that for NQ).
NQ might eventually wind up with a monthly active player-base of maybe a few hundred-thousand, just like EVE. Just like EVE, DU is a niche MMO. But if that would ever happen, they'll need to be around for a decade and a half, just like EVE. Development of DU goes slow, has many ups and downs, many winding paths, and many backtracking. The strength of EVE was always that you could come back, your stuff would always be there, except of course if you build in PVP space, but all your stuff in npc stations would always be there. Your ships would always fly, the meta might change, you might not have the most optimal fits, but it would work. With the Demeter changes we would only have the stuff left on your starter tile (if they don't change that as well) and any ships there might very well no longer fly and any scripts on it might be broken, even if it flies, it might crater at any moment... But wait you say, what about Space Core Units? Currently they might be fine (but also broken on PTS), but if everyone moves to space, NQ is going to do the same thing to Space Cores as they are doing now to Static Cores...
You can't really compare this game to Eve. Eve is a fully developed game that has been around for years, and at one point, was worth the sub. It's been circling the drain for a while now and only being kept alive by the infusion of Chinese players that have already killed their own server. DU is a far cry from what Eve was.
I want to agree with you, but if they are relying on subs to keep this game going, then I highly doubt they will make it to release. The ship builders are likely to leave rather than do another fix to their ships. People who left but want to come back, won't if their stuff is gone due to territory taxes... as well as poor decision making by the devs. And most people on all sides will likely lose faith in NQ development and will maintain the belief that they have absolutely no idea what they are doing. Demeter will be the nail in the coffin.
The only way I see this game actually making it is if NQ can find a way to sell this game to a real game company that knows what they are doing... while they still have a product to sell.
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For people who have been waiting to come back to this game, I think you have pretty much wrapped it up for them with the airbrakes and taxes. These are things that should be done at a later time, not mashing in a bunch of changes all at once. This many "shocker" changes at once is what led to so many leaving the game during the schematic debacle.
Mining unit idea is great, as it is on the roadmap and creates something new. Work with that.
Voxel change... good, and I hope it works. In theory, should reduce lag and improve performance. Those two alone should keep your devs busy for months with the bugs likely to come about. However, the taxes and airbrakes, will definitely reduce the lag as more players leave, and no way old players, like myself, will be returning. Players are going to be busy enough having to dig out their structures as it is! Having to rework or even scrap current ships due to the airbrake thing is not a way to keep players. Implementing taxes on our territories on top of all of this? Are you serious???
Please reconsider this. Add things to do rather than penalties and nerfs. Taxes on territories should be a release time "tweak", not a named patch feature.
- DontPanic, DogMinion, Billy_Boola and 3 others
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Took you long enough. Maybe in about 2 years you'll figure out what to do with the 20km tall unnecessary towers surrounding those markets too!
DEVBLOG: CONSTRUCTION SLOTS AND STACKED ELEMENTS - discussion thread
in General Discussions
Posted
lol! Eve meets Minecraft? Have you played Empyrion? They pretty much took Empyrion, put it on a single server, and broke the shit out of it.