Xarius

NQ: We want your feedback!

Players:  Ore yields are too low, taxes too high. Here are several different ways to make this update viable. 

NQ: PTS Open again! With no changes to anything players were worried about not being changed.

I mean, I have to give credit where credit is due, they are freaking experts at just ignoring feedback and pushing things anyways. 

NQ: We want your feedback!

Players:  Ore yields are too low, taxes too high. Here are several different ways to make this update viable. 

NQ: PTS Open again! With no changes to anything players were worried about not being changed.

I mean, I have to give credit where credit is due, they are freaking experts at just ignoring feedback and pushing things anyways. 

NQ: We want your feedback!

Players:  Ore yields are too low, taxes too high. Here are several different ways to make this update viable. 

NQ: PTS Open again! With no changes to anything players were worried about not being changed.

I mean, I have to give credit where credit is due, they are freaking experts at just ignoring feedback and pushing things anyways. 

NQ: We want your feedback!

Players:  Ore yields are too low, taxes too high. Here are several different ways to make this update viable. 

NQ: PTS Open again! With no changes to anything players were worried about not being changed.

I mean, I have to give credit where credit is due, they are freaking experts at just ignoring feedback and pushing things anyways. 

NQ: We want your feedback!

Players:  Ore yields are too low, taxes too high. Here are several different ways to make this update viable. 

NQ: PTS Open again! With no changes to anything players were worried about not being changed.

I mean, I have to give credit where credit is due, they are freaking experts at just ignoring feedback and pushing things anyways. 

NQ: We want your feedback!

Players:  Ore yields are too low, taxes too high. Here are several different ways to make this update viable. 

NQ: PTS Open again! With no changes to anything players were worried about not being changed.

I mean, I have to give credit where credit is due, they are freaking experts at just ignoring feedback and pushing things anyways. 

NQ: We want your feedback!

Players:  Ore yields are too low, taxes too high. Here are several different ways to make this update viable. 

NQ: PTS Open again! With no changes to anything players were worried about not being changed.

I mean, I have to give credit where credit is due, they are freaking experts at just ignoring feedback and pushing things anyways. 

Welcome!

I hope this change means you will start listening to player feedback more, stop pushing changes that are not ready or poorly implemented, and you actually respond to feedback as opposed to pretending it doesn't exist.

But that is your choice to PvP.   It's your choice to waste fuel and time.

Just like it's a PvE players choice to only stay in PvE zones and be limited by them.

So, you would be choosing to pay the Taxes by PvPing. You've won me over. I am all for the taxes in this scenario. 

1: The numbers are way too low. They need to be upped significantly to be viable even without taxes. To make up for this you would need to up Asteroid Ore Nodes a lot, and greatly increase the number of safe zone asteroids, and start including rare ore spawns into the safe zone. There is a problem if you can mine more ore in less than a minute by playing cookie clicker surface mining then what using a powerful technological mining marvel can pull out in an hour.

2: The ore Market is already inflated, and that's with the ability to mine more Ore in an Hour Currently than you could in a couple weeks with a mining unit.  As it stands with current values, you will continue to wreck the player economy and market.

3: What's the point of adding adjacent territory bonus of 10% per territory, if you have to pay a heavy territory tax for that small boost to ore extraction. As with point 1, the numbers are way to low to justify this.

4: While I am a fan of using some elements in ship design to give them that rugged Sci-Fi look, forcing people to have to show every single element on a ship is just a bad decision. Some elements it makes sense. Hovers, Boosters, Engines being obstructed, makes sense. But when you need 50 brakes, and 100 wings to make a large ship flyable with cargo, not being able to hide some of those elements is just dumb.

5: I am glad the Space Industry not working is a bug. Taxing PvE Space Industry/Activities is another way to drive off more players. 

I see you are quite adept at ignoring any opinion that isn't yours, regardless of how it's displayed. Good to know. 

But okay, let's Tax PvE content and hamstring the economy even further by reducing the amount you can earn through mining. 

So how about we go further and make it fair. Let's Tax PvP.

Let's levy a flat tax each time you initiate PvP, of course this should be based on the core size you are attacking.
 
How about a tax when you remove an element on a cored ship, and of course if you decide to re-core it, you should be taxed on the value of the ship based on the current market price of the components used to build it. You would of course also need to pay a tax valued on the contents of the ships containers as well.

Of course we also need a weapon tax, scaled per weapon, and tier of weapon.

I mean, you could always place some miners to supplement income, or just find ships to kill to make your loss in profit, or risk getting ganked yourself to run the missions or asteroids.

I mean, it only makes sense. 

QUESTION: 

Are you trying to punish PvE, New, and Solo players? First the miniscule number of PvE Asteroids, and now the taxes on territory that yield less ore per hour than you can mine per 5 second scoop currently. 


Comments on question.

Based on the numbers from PTS, you need 20-30 territories and many more miners to yield a steady flow of resources

All this is going todo is assure is that the inflated ore market becomes more inflated, and that smaller orgs, solo players, and new players have virtually no chance to ever progress, and force people into just doing hauling missions, which in turn forces them to risk PvP Conflict, which with the new changes increases the chance of now being not able to replace what you lost.

I understand this is a civilization building game. To have a civilization you have to have groups, large groups, even nations or mega corporations. But if you remove the ability to make an impact as an individual, or even be able to function self sufficiently to a good degree, what's the point? 

What is the attraction for a new player?  "Welcome! Now pick one of 5 mega organizations to join, or spend the next month collecting your daily reward to build your first ship. By the way, if you want a Territory not on Sanctuary, you are going to need to find a way to make more money, because the daily reward won't even pay for your taxes for one territory."

Honestly I have rarely said anything about the game updates. Even schematics. I enjoyed the challenge of working hard to build something. But honestly, if these extraction numbers stay anywhere in the neighborhood where they are now, I honestly think my time will be better spent elsewhere. This is not a threat, or me generally just whining. I love this game, I truly do, but this will literally suck the enjoyment of the game right out of me. 

You have the ability to create and maintain what is likely the best MMO in a generation - Don't waste it on bad  decisions. Listen to your player base, what remains, learn from the many people who have left. When Beta hit, the first couple months were amazing, despite the bugs. When you looked at Dual Universe on a streaming site, it was loaded with people building, PvPing, exploring, and enjoying the game, with thousands of people enjoying watching them.. But if you look now, you see the same few streamers, with maybe a couple dozen viewers, if anyone is online at all.

Listen. Learn. Debate. Act. Do better.
 

10 million Quanta says they won't address the major concerns people are voicing in the Q/A. They'll pick the softball questions and opinions that align with their will. Any takers?
 
Also, I guess this means well received.

QUESTION: 

Are you trying to punish PvE, New, and Solo players? First the miniscule number of PvE Asteroids, and now the taxes on territory that yield less ore per hour than you can mine per 5 second scoop currently. 


Comments on question.

Based on the numbers from PTS, you need 20-30 territories and many more miners to yield a steady flow of resources

All this is going todo is assure is that the inflated ore market becomes more inflated, and that smaller orgs, solo players, and new players have virtually no chance to ever progress, and force people into just doing hauling missions, which in turn forces them to risk PvP Conflict, which with the new changes increases the chance of now being not able to replace what you lost.

I understand this is a civilization building game. To have a civilization you have to have groups, large groups, even nations or mega corporations. But if you remove the ability to make an impact as an individual, or even be able to function self sufficiently to a good degree, what's the point? 

What is the attraction for a new player?  "Welcome! Now pick one of 5 mega organizations to join, or spend the next month collecting your daily reward to build your first ship. By the way, if you want a Territory not on Sanctuary, you are going to need to find a way to make more money, because the daily reward won't even pay for your taxes for one territory."

Honestly I have rarely said anything about the game updates. Even schematics. I enjoyed the challenge of working hard to build something. But honestly, if these extraction numbers stay anywhere in the neighborhood where they are now, I honestly think my time will be better spent elsewhere. This is not a threat, or me generally just whining. I love this game, I truly do, but this will literally suck the enjoyment of the game right out of me. 

You have the ability to create and maintain what is likely the best MMO in a generation - Don't waste it on bad  decisions. Listen to your player base, what remains, learn from the many people who have left. When Beta hit, the first couple months were amazing, despite the bugs. When you looked at Dual Universe on a streaming site, it was loaded with people building, PvPing, exploring, and enjoying the game, with thousands of people enjoying watching them.. But if you look now, you see the same few streamers, with maybe a couple dozen viewers, if anyone is online at all.

Listen. Learn. Debate. Act. Do better.
 

But that is your choice to PvP.   It's your choice to waste fuel and time.

Just like it's a PvE players choice to only stay in PvE zones and be limited by them.

So, you would be choosing to pay the Taxes by PvPing. You've won me over. I am all for the taxes in this scenario. 

No, I want the ability to pay for the things I have, without having to play annoying mini-games, and own 36 auto-miners to run a simple factory. 

I want a mission system that can't be exploited by having 20 alts AFKing and VRing into missions by limiting the number of mission packages a core can hold.

I want the players building the "civilization" to define the economy, not have it sucked away by an invisible entity with no gain. 

I want the developers to listen to the majority of people who have said at the current rate of tax and ore collection, this is a bad idea and is going to lead to less people enjoying and playing the game. Rather than the two or three people that align with their idea of "We do what we want and you'll get over it".

I want a new player to be able to log in and not feel like they are stuck on Sanctuary surface mining, mindlessly clicking ores like it's Cookie Clicker and not Dual Universe, to be able to pay for the over-priced components to build decent ships, that don't look like works of art covered in brake stickers.

That's what I want.

What do YOU want? Besides paying a useless tax.

1: The numbers are way too low. They need to be upped significantly to be viable even without taxes. To make up for this you would need to up Asteroid Ore Nodes a lot, and greatly increase the number of safe zone asteroids, and start including rare ore spawns into the safe zone. There is a problem if you can mine more ore in less than a minute by playing cookie clicker surface mining then what using a powerful technological mining marvel can pull out in an hour.

2: The ore Market is already inflated, and that's with the ability to mine more Ore in an Hour Currently than you could in a couple weeks with a mining unit.  As it stands with current values, you will continue to wreck the player economy and market.

3: What's the point of adding adjacent territory bonus of 10% per territory, if you have to pay a heavy territory tax for that small boost to ore extraction. As with point 1, the numbers are way to low to justify this.

4: While I am a fan of using some elements in ship design to give them that rugged Sci-Fi look, forcing people to have to show every single element on a ship is just a bad decision. Some elements it makes sense. Hovers, Boosters, Engines being obstructed, makes sense. But when you need 50 brakes, and 100 wings to make a large ship flyable with cargo, not being able to hide some of those elements is just dumb.

5: I am glad the Space Industry not working is a bug. Taxing PvE Space Industry/Activities is another way to drive off more players. 

10 million Quanta says they won't address the major concerns people are voicing in the Q/A. They'll pick the softball questions and opinions that align with their will. Any takers?
 
Also, I guess this means well received.

QUESTION: 

Are you trying to punish PvE, New, and Solo players? First the miniscule number of PvE Asteroids, and now the taxes on territory that yield less ore per hour than you can mine per 5 second scoop currently. 


Comments on question.

Based on the numbers from PTS, you need 20-30 territories and many more miners to yield a steady flow of resources

All this is going todo is assure is that the inflated ore market becomes more inflated, and that smaller orgs, solo players, and new players have virtually no chance to ever progress, and force people into just doing hauling missions, which in turn forces them to risk PvP Conflict, which with the new changes increases the chance of now being not able to replace what you lost.

I understand this is a civilization building game. To have a civilization you have to have groups, large groups, even nations or mega corporations. But if you remove the ability to make an impact as an individual, or even be able to function self sufficiently to a good degree, what's the point? 

What is the attraction for a new player?  "Welcome! Now pick one of 5 mega organizations to join, or spend the next month collecting your daily reward to build your first ship. By the way, if you want a Territory not on Sanctuary, you are going to need to find a way to make more money, because the daily reward won't even pay for your taxes for one territory."

Honestly I have rarely said anything about the game updates. Even schematics. I enjoyed the challenge of working hard to build something. But honestly, if these extraction numbers stay anywhere in the neighborhood where they are now, I honestly think my time will be better spent elsewhere. This is not a threat, or me generally just whining. I love this game, I truly do, but this will literally suck the enjoyment of the game right out of me. 

You have the ability to create and maintain what is likely the best MMO in a generation - Don't waste it on bad  decisions. Listen to your player base, what remains, learn from the many people who have left. When Beta hit, the first couple months were amazing, despite the bugs. When you looked at Dual Universe on a streaming site, it was loaded with people building, PvPing, exploring, and enjoying the game, with thousands of people enjoying watching them.. But if you look now, you see the same few streamers, with maybe a couple dozen viewers, if anyone is online at all.

Listen. Learn. Debate. Act. Do better.
 

No, I want the ability to pay for the things I have, without having to play annoying mini-games, and own 36 auto-miners to run a simple factory. 

I want a mission system that can't be exploited by having 20 alts AFKing and VRing into missions by limiting the number of mission packages a core can hold.

I want the players building the "civilization" to define the economy, not have it sucked away by an invisible entity with no gain. 

I want the developers to listen to the majority of people who have said at the current rate of tax and ore collection, this is a bad idea and is going to lead to less people enjoying and playing the game. Rather than the two or three people that align with their idea of "We do what we want and you'll get over it".

I want a new player to be able to log in and not feel like they are stuck on Sanctuary surface mining, mindlessly clicking ores like it's Cookie Clicker and not Dual Universe, to be able to pay for the over-priced components to build decent ships, that don't look like works of art covered in brake stickers.

That's what I want.

What do YOU want? Besides paying a useless tax.

No, I want the ability to pay for the things I have, without having to play annoying mini-games, and own 36 auto-miners to run a simple factory. 

I want a mission system that can't be exploited by having 20 alts AFKing and VRing into missions by limiting the number of mission packages a core can hold.

I want the players building the "civilization" to define the economy, not have it sucked away by an invisible entity with no gain. 

I want the developers to listen to the majority of people who have said at the current rate of tax and ore collection, this is a bad idea and is going to lead to less people enjoying and playing the game. Rather than the two or three people that align with their idea of "We do what we want and you'll get over it".

I want a new player to be able to log in and not feel like they are stuck on Sanctuary surface mining, mindlessly clicking ores like it's Cookie Clicker and not Dual Universe, to be able to pay for the over-priced components to build decent ships, that don't look like works of art covered in brake stickers.

That's what I want.

What do YOU want? Besides paying a useless tax.

K, So - by your logic. Race to all the PvE Asteroids when they spawn. Don't worry about work, family, or other obligations. Sit ready, with DSAT in hand, scanning the universe and waiting for a node to pop up, so that you have a chance of getting ore before it's mined out. But if you can't do that, it's okay, because you can go back planet side and play aforementioned annoying mini-game in hopes that you squeeze out a tidbit more ore, which by the way, you'll need to sell most of it to keep up on the tile upkeep, since you are going to be needing so many claimed tiles. Now, that's not including the cost of the mining units, whatever that may be. Basics will likely be cheap, just like engines and other elements, but each level you go up you are investing more and more quanta to mine a slightly more expensive selling ore. But of course, you are going to need to buy more tiles. Let's say okay, it's viable to do. Let's go with your logic. 

There are 20 different ores you can mine. So at minimum, you are going to need to have 20 mining units, just to mine a bit of each ore. 

Which will require you, if you are lucky, to only have to mine on what, 7 different planets/moons with well thought out tiles and good ore values that cover everything you can get on that planet. Though most planets for a good ore value, you'd probably need a few different locations. But let's stick with 7 is a lucky number.

To get the max benefit for the mining unit on that tile, you'll need all the tiles around it. So 7 planets, 7 tiles per planet. Unless math fails me, that's 42 tiles. So 42 million a week just to mine every single ore in the game efficiently, with just 20 mining units digging out 1 kind of ore each at a rate of 100-150ish/l per hr if you are lucky. and have talents etc. Maybe a bit higher. We'll go on a optimistic median though end and say you are getting 150 l/hr. That's 3.6kl per day, per ore, or 25kl per ore, per week. I can literally mine 25kl of ore by flying out to a random tile, use my scanner, and spend 20-30 minutes mining.  A weeks worth of auto-ore, in the time it would take to VR to all the different planets and play that god-awful mini-game, every two days, 20 times,  to make sure I can pull the same amount of ore out of the ground, as if I were mining it by hand. 

Perhaps I am misunderstanding - But how is this a change for the better, when ore prices are already sky-high while it's easy to mine to the ore in greater quantities then autominers will allow?

So we are back to the Asteroids, and praying that you happen to be on the right time that one of the maybe 20 safe zone asteroids spawn, and have time to make it to one before it is mined out. 

 

They talked about it in the DevBlog.

I see you are quite adept at ignoring any opinion that isn't yours, regardless of how it's displayed. Good to know. 

But okay, let's Tax PvE content and hamstring the economy even further by reducing the amount you can earn through mining. 

So how about we go further and make it fair. Let's Tax PvP.

Let's levy a flat tax each time you initiate PvP, of course this should be based on the core size you are attacking.
 
How about a tax when you remove an element on a cored ship, and of course if you decide to re-core it, you should be taxed on the value of the ship based on the current market price of the components used to build it. You would of course also need to pay a tax valued on the contents of the ships containers as well.

Of course we also need a weapon tax, scaled per weapon, and tier of weapon.

I mean, you could always place some miners to supplement income, or just find ships to kill to make your loss in profit, or risk getting ganked yourself to run the missions or asteroids.

I mean, it only makes sense. 

1: The numbers are way too low. They need to be upped significantly to be viable even without taxes. To make up for this you would need to up Asteroid Ore Nodes a lot, and greatly increase the number of safe zone asteroids, and start including rare ore spawns into the safe zone. There is a problem if you can mine more ore in less than a minute by playing cookie clicker surface mining then what using a powerful technological mining marvel can pull out in an hour.

2: The ore Market is already inflated, and that's with the ability to mine more Ore in an Hour Currently than you could in a couple weeks with a mining unit.  As it stands with current values, you will continue to wreck the player economy and market.

3: What's the point of adding adjacent territory bonus of 10% per territory, if you have to pay a heavy territory tax for that small boost to ore extraction. As with point 1, the numbers are way to low to justify this.

4: While I am a fan of using some elements in ship design to give them that rugged Sci-Fi look, forcing people to have to show every single element on a ship is just a bad decision. Some elements it makes sense. Hovers, Boosters, Engines being obstructed, makes sense. But when you need 50 brakes, and 100 wings to make a large ship flyable with cargo, not being able to hide some of those elements is just dumb.

5: I am glad the Space Industry not working is a bug. Taxing PvE Space Industry/Activities is another way to drive off more players.