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Hi guys,

 

I have been wondering about a problem that might arise regarding multiple Players occupying a large Ship/Station. Now, as far as we have been informed, players that are far away from you will be updated less frequently. 

 

My question is, how are Players going to behave in a Large movining object. In some games (like Space Engineers)  this causes the player to experience rubber banding and lag spikes , generally walking normally in a moving ship is quite hard to achieve in multiplayer. 

 

For example - Some ships might be as big as 2-3 KM in lenght , containing hundreds of players. How will the game handle the position update for everyone, without causing the above stated issues.

 

I would really love to get your feedback/opinion on this, hopefully some of the Devs can have a look at the post. 

 

 

Sorry if the case has been discussed already and thanks in advance.

Kind regards,

 

Yamamoto

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Heyo

 

Hm... I think space stations will be stationary objects because the starting planet will be in a fixed position.  Then as far as having a huge km or larger ship would be moving slowly enough to be able to render all players without much difficulty.  I'm also sure that the devs are hoping people try all these crazy ideas during development to test out the physics of the engine/servers before launch.

Good thought tho!

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Hi again,

Basically this is what I mean - https://youtu.be/Rg3Jo-Ul4Qw?t=1047 . The players are non stop rubber banding even at low speed - Of course this is a completely different game , I am totally awere of that and the Vehicle does have wheels (JC mentioned that wheels might be difficult do add as they bring a whole new set of challanges for Multiplayer) , however this same issue persists in almost every multiplayer game - ARK Survival - Another good example for huge rubber banding when stuff is moving.

 

I really hope the devs found a way to get around that issue, especially when we can expect to have HUGE ships moving really fast with lots of players on board.

 

Of course, the best way to know is wait and see, hopefully someone more competent can share His/Her knowledge on the matter even sooner.

 

Regards,

 

Yamamoto

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In case you haven't watched the video, or read their AMA.

 

 

And...

 

 

The server synchronization is done transparently in the cluster side. You, as a client, will not see any change. There might be a bit of delay internally for the different actors to synchronize within the cluster, but it will most likely be unnoticeable by the user, as the typical Internet latency will be ways beyond the kind of latency your have in a high performance cluster. You, as a player, get regular updates about what is going on around you, not mater which physical server these updates are coming from. As you fall in the shopping mall, your avatar will register and de-register from several zone several times, and people subscribed to these zones (the people “living” on each floor) will get a notification of your passage. Well, that’s the theory and what we get from our first testing scenarios.

 

And here are some threads to gloss over...

 

https://board.dualthegame.com/index.php?/topic/19-devblog-a-single-shard-continuous-universe-one-world-no-boundaries/page-1

 

https://board.dualthegame.com/index.php?/topic/10270-lets-get-technical-nuts-and-bolts-behind-du/

 

https://board.dualthegame.com/index.php?/topic/9959-how-will-du-handle/?hl=%2Bserver+%2Btechnology#entry31411

 

Tons of other information and discussions about this, so hopefully I pointed you in the right direction.

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Players get updated to you less frequently by the servers (if they're far enough), but the servers still get updated at the right rate by each client. This means that the server has the right positions of each players, while each player has a different positions configuration relative to their own position. 

 

This means that you could see a guy falling through a contruct, even if that's not really happening, but only if he is far from you and on the same construct (so there's need for a huge construct or in a few other cases for that to happen). Still not really a problem, most of the time you wouldn't even notice.

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Layman's terms.

If a cluster in the server is a ten cubic kilometers worth of space, and a person is 10 clusters away from you and the update rate between adjacent servers is 0.1 second (it's a figurative number, get off my back nitpickers, I know that's really slow) , that means that if a person is ten clsusters away from you starts moving, it will take 1 second for that action to be communicated to your cluster.Given that this is not 1995, I bet it's safe to assume the "delay" can only be felt at Astronomical Units' worth of distances, where it will be 10 or 15 seconds of delayed updating. And you know, if it's 15 AU's away, it's probably not your problem :P

However, depending on the density of playercount, the clsuter gets bigger, to accomodate a far greater update rate per cubic space. That means that if you are alone, you may have a 1 to 10 cubic km cluster, but if there are 10,000 people around you, the cluster may be boosted up to 100 cubic kilometers, so there's space to move in high update rates.

That station you mentioned in a sense, is a transparent instance and the updates from it are snapshots of what's going on on the station. From afar, the bilateral nature of the updates makes sure the people in the station are having an up to real time update frequency, while you get delayed updates as you close in to the station's mega cluster.

Your 3 Km ship, is in essence a 3 Cubic Kilometer moving cluster for all the players it contains. Once the server detects more ships in an area, it "combines" their clsuters to form a much bigger one so they can operate in optimal times and updates. More shis, bigger cluster.

That's in fact, something Star Citizen tries to attempt as well in their expected Netcode update, making each ship its own "instance", and having a server shard contain up to 100 instances-ships, with each instance powering up to 64 players (I think, don't quote me on that).

It's not a new idea, it's just that the NQ devs are doing it in a far larger and insane scale. Maybe because they build the game as an MMO first and foremost. Who knows.

Cheers.

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Greetings, 

Thanks for all the replies, I went through the info and indeed it all makes a lot of sence. I guess that the devs got around that issue as well (since that aspect is going to be a huge part of the game).

 

Although I'm now pretty confident, the final confirmation will be when the game is actually out or when we see some footage from Alfa/Beta testing.

 

Can't wait , I hope that there are hundreds and thousands of players that are gonna play the game.

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