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Guest Dubble

Crime in Dual Universe

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Guest Dubble

Introduction

 

Dual Universe is often described as a massive single-shard MMORPG with great potential to rock the space MMORPG genre and it more than likely will. To get there however, the game needs to make sure it doesn't forget the RPG in MMORPG. NQ pride themselves in creating the "First online civilization", a civilization, our civilizations, contain countless aspects ranging from philosophical ideas, to pure science to the people living in it. Capturing every single one of these aspects will be incredibly hard and won't happen. It is simply just not possible with our current knowledge. However, one aspect of real civilizations that is possible to add, with ease, is crime.

 

The current stance of NQ and some players seem to go against this idea, but it will add to the RPG aspect of the game heavily. Right now, we have the good, but every story needs the bad to be good, we might not like it, but we gotta admit, it adds to every story ever created. 

 

What crime will do for Dual Universe

 

Crime will create a new branch to the game, one may initially think this only involves criminal activities, which I will talk about later, but this would eventually also add law enforcement, a better reason to be bounty hunting and the practice of Dual Universe law. Law enforcement, lawyers and judges need someone to pay and educate them, this is where large orgs come in, this will encourage a more realistic state-like infrastructure from organizations furthering the job possibilities in Dual Universe, which is desperately needed.

 

Examples of criminal activities

 

Now that we understand the effects crime will have on Dual Universe, let's talk crimes.

 

Crime comes in many forms, everything from corporate crime to gang crimes and crimes commited by singular people. 

These crimes could be:

Trapping people and asking them or their friends for a ransom to release them.

Scamming people, setting up a trade and not following through on your end.

Murder (Especially when AvA is released)

Stealing, forces people to make actual closed up secure bases to store loot.

Extortion (Purely on an in-game level; Example: "If you do not give me 1 Million quanta I will give your clan members evidence that you have been dealing with the enemy", or maybe even more violent extortion, threating to take over someone's territory, when TvT is added)

Gambling (Probably already allowed, but laws may be created by big orgs to dissallow any unofficial gambling)

Betrayals and within this, social engineering (This goes against rule 15 of the COC, but the rule should be changed or removed in my opinion)

Kidnapping, a lot like trapping. 

I thought about spamming too, but that would just be outright annoying, though also a possibility with a block feature.

Or even various corporate crimes such as pyramid schemes

These are just a handful of crimes that can be commited currently given the permission from NQ. NQ could also support a crime underworld by adding items like drugs, animals that get endangered and die out if hunted too much along with other features.

 

Closing statements

 

Generally, I think this would add to the RPG element of the game, add multiple branches of things to do and complexify the infrastructure of large organizations to a point where they closely ressemble real life countries making true online civilization.

 

Hopefully I can ignite a spark in my fellow sinister people or people who can see the benefit of this for the law-abiding citizen.

 

- Dubble, the man, the myth, the devil himself

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While this was probably posted by an alt.

 

Here is a news flash for you.

 

Most of that already happens in game.  There is already murder, scams, robbery, ship theft, destruction and all of the fun of bad things.

 

Laws are made by the largest organization in that area... So don't expect one over arching set of laws for the whole universe.

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laws can only be enforced if there are tools to do so. as of now there is not.  No rep system, No bounty system, and very vague rules on whats allowed and whats not. Im not particurly for or against such activity, it does add a little drama and conflict but ... Why am i even, its not as if NQ reads this stuff lol. 

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Good luck with that the magic childish gods will rise from heaven and ruin whatever you did in hindsight. Then perma ban you probably for playing the game. Planning anything at this point is pointless as its subject to be subjective.

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Well I've been told that various of my suggestions are against the rules of the game currently, the COC. I discussed the COC in another post, because there are some clarification issues with it. Rule 15. for example states that you are not allowed to scam or social engineer people. Aka. you can't join an org in hopes of turning it inside out, you can't scam people for things (despite there being a scammer role in the discord amusingly enough). Rule 5 in the COC is also incredibly vague and is the driving factor against criminal activities. Trying to create awareness on the issues, made a ticket for the issues, wrote in the tech channel in discord and was told to try my luck on the forums.

 

(Yeah I finally bothered to log in, I'm quite lazy)

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In my experience even if it was tolerated before or even fully legalized NQ is very prone to spontaneously doing a 180° turn and you'll get punished out of the blue. So even if they'd say ingame scamming is okay or the like, you're always at risk to become a victim of their randomness at any time. 

Judging from the posts no one here has an actual clue about what goes and what not, due to the indeed insanely vague rules and NQs inconsistency and despotism. They're all waiting for some made up excuses from NQ to tell you "that was obvious" in hindsight. 

So much for the boundless limitless civilization sandbox world that the game was pitched as. At this point the game is more crippled by the overlying shadow of terrorism from the Devs than your average theme park game and on top of that you got random acts of nonsense by the devs. 

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We need law to be part of the RDMS, so org, nations, factions can set there own laws, law and order is a pillar of civilisation.

16 hours ago, Maxnano said:

laws can only be enforced if there are tools to do so. as of now there is not.  No rep system, No bounty system, and very vague rules on whats allowed and whats not. Im not particurly for or against such activity, it does add a little drama and conflict but ... Why am i even, its not as if NQ reads this stuff lol. 

We need the tools to make our own systems and players need to be prepare to group up, even if only to share the same things like laws.

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@carijay766 They should define clearer boundaries, I usually ask staff or a GM on discord if I'm unsure. Sometimes it takes time for them to respond and sometimes they even provide bad responses, because they may be unsure themselves. But sometimes they do respond and it's a good way to have something to back-up your claim if you wanted a ban appeal.

I was trapping for a while, because I had gotten no answer whether it was allowed or not (Asked a minimum of 5 times over a long period of time) and only after people had been complaining about me, a GM removed my trap, so I knew to stop trapping. tbh people shouldn't walk into a building with a massive sign saying "Free" xD

@Moosegun Well, laws of civilization are just words we decided to write down on a piece of paper. It's not a part of the "code" in our world, they can be broken. Laws are to be enforced and passed on by organizations themselves, not enforced through a system like RDMS. They could maybe make it easier for organizations to communicate these laws, but that's about the only thing NQ would need to do. The main things NQ could do for crime would be hunting animals, drugs and stealing. Drugs could have cool effects like faster sprint for x amount of time or when AvA comes out, more damage or health for x amount of time.

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14 hours ago, Dubble said:

@carijay766 They should define clearer boundaries, I usually ask staff or a GM on discord if I'm unsure. Sometimes it takes time for them to respond and sometimes they even provide bad responses, because they may be unsure themselves. But sometimes they do respond and it's a good way to have something to back-up your claim if you wanted a ban appeal.

I was trapping for a while, because I had gotten no answer whether it was allowed or not (Asked a minimum of 5 times over a long period of time) and only after people had been complaining about me, a GM removed my trap, so I knew to stop trapping. tbh people shouldn't walk into a building with a massive sign saying "Free" xD

@Moosegun Well, laws of civilization are just words we decided to write down on a piece of paper. It's not a part of the "code" in our world, they can be broken. Laws are to be enforced and passed on by organizations themselves, not enforced through a system like RDMS. They could maybe make it easier for organizations to communicate these laws, but that's about the only thing NQ would need to do. The main things NQ could do for crime would be hunting animals, drugs and stealing. Drugs could have cool effects like faster sprint for x amount of time or when AvA comes out, more damage or health for x amount of time.

There you have it. Even the most reasonable sandbox mechanics like trapping are forbidden. This is turning into a carebear theme park. Why give the player options just to cripple them again completely in hindsight. Exactly my thought why would you run into someone's property with a big sign on it or buy from a dispenser that says AGG 5k quanta... 🤣 It's like you're getting punished for the stupidity of others. Not what I call sandbox. 

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On 10/25/2020 at 3:55 AM, Dubble said:

 Well, laws of civilization are just words we decided to write down on a piece of paper. It's not a part of the "code" in our world, they can be broken. Laws are to be enforced and passed on by organizations themselves, not enforced through a system like RDMS. They could maybe make it easier for organizations to communicate these laws, but that's about the only thing NQ would need to do. The main things NQ could do for crime would be hunting animals, drugs and stealing. Drugs could have cool effects like faster sprint for x amount of time or when AvA comes out, more damage or health for x amount of time.

I agree they are 100% down to the parties that agree to them, but the RDMS comes into play when it is combined with whatever system comes in to control relationships betweens orgs / factions and players.  For example, if the law states that is anyone damages the property of a citizen living under those laws then the RDMS and relationship management can automatically update, adding to enemies list or restricting access to market terminals etc.  This could even be linked into radars or security systems, where information off security breaches would be shared across networks until those security units are destroyed.  I just want the tool to implement law and order, I dont want NQ to implement it for us.

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1 hour ago, Moosegun said:

I agree they are 100% down to the parties that agree to them, but the RDMS comes into play when it is combined with whatever system comes in to control relationships betweens orgs / factions and players.  For example, if the law states that is anyone damages the property of a citizen living under those laws then the RDMS and relationship management can automatically update, adding to enemies list or restricting access to market terminals etc.  This could even be linked into radars or security systems, where information off security breaches would be shared across networks until those security units are destroyed.  I just want the tool to implement law and order, I dont want NQ to implement it for us.

The devs don’t even want automatic turrets, and you’re asking for something even more complex like automatic RDMS updates.

 

 

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Just now, HangerHangar said:

The devs don’t even want automatic turrets, and you’re asking for something even more complex like automatic RDMS updates.

 

 

They arent more complex though.....

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23 hours ago, carijay766 said:

There you have it. Even the most reasonable sandbox mechanics like trapping are forbidden. This is turning into a carebear theme park.

I don't know where to begin with this, but I already know that this user is just here to troll pretty much lol. 

 

I don't know how in the world you'd think trapping players is "the most reasonable sandbox mechanic". A new player exploring the market wanders into the wrong place then is stuck forever or forced to respawn...and that's a "good" gameplay concept...? 

 

Playing in a sandbox doesn't mean you get to throw sand in people's eyes just for the hell of it. Crime must be balanced because it's a game, not real life. Being stuck in jail until you die because you had the gall to enter a door around a market simply doesn't make sense as a gameplay mechanic and never will.

 

It makes zero sense to design a civilization game, then actively discourage players from ever entering a building for fear of being trapped. 

 

The other thing I want to point out is that every time I've seen someone throw out the term "carebear" they are doing it in a tantrum and seem to be some of the most sensitive people willing to resort to insult and shouting. It's a wicked and wonderful irony that I truly relish. How about discussing game mechanics without pejorative value judgements...? Wouldn't that be great...

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On 10/24/2020 at 5:11 AM, carijay766 said:

In my experience even if it was tolerated before or even fully legalized NQ is very prone to spontaneously doing a 180° turn and you'll get punished out of the blue. So even if they'd say ingame scamming is okay or the like, you're always at risk to become a victim of their randomness at any time. 

Judging from the posts no one here has an actual clue about what goes and what not, due to the indeed insanely vague rules and NQs inconsistency and despotism. They're all waiting for some made up excuses from NQ to tell you "that was obvious" in hindsight. 

So much for the boundless limitless civilization sandbox world that the game was pitched as. At this point the game is more crippled by the overlying shadow of terrorism from the Devs than your average theme park game and on top of that you got random acts of nonsense by the devs. 

Role play that NQ is a whimsical god. Enqueism.

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