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Asmodeus

Gambling and Banking

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I think we should have the ability to create interactive elements that make it possible to gamble such as slot machines or some kind of roulette wheel.

I think we also need to have some kind of lightly automated localized transfer system that can automatically move something from one container to another, maybe using LUA scripts.

 

I had this idea when I was thinking about how I want to play the game. I plan to build a bank for new players to store their goods in a single heavily protected area and having a side business would make that goal all the more feasible, specifically a casino. It should be possible to adjust the win percentage chance in any kind of randomized gambling system like a slot machine. It would also be nice if their were a way to force the machines to let a player win if the owner feels that no one is winning enough or is just feeling generous. This would clearly allow owners of gambling devices to cheat people but I can't imagine a lot of people would go to gamble at a place where they feel like they are losing too much.

 

As far as banking goes, it would be really nice if people could turn their money into an in game credit chit with a tag line reading (for example) made by Asmodeus. Two credit chits made by the same person should fuse together when stacked but if made by different people should swap places. When a credit chit is used it should be destroyed and the money it represented is then added to that player. This would protect players from having their money stolen by banks because if the banker took any money then the credit chit would no longer read that it was made by that player.

 

I really want to find ways to make the game more fun for new and old players alike and when the game comes out I hope to build the infrastructure that makes it fun for everyone.

 

I really hope this adds something new to the game discussion and that I am not just saying something someone else said first, I kinda find that notion rather terrifying.

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NQ has already provided what we would need to make casino games, the only thing missing is a module that accepts/dispenses money, but there are ways to work around that as long as there is a person-to-person trading system.

 

Also my understanding was that money will not be a physical object, but will already be in credit form, so banking would only make sense for protecting physical assets.

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We definitely need some kind of dispensing system to help automate trading and free up players time to do what they want to do although I worry about how much something like that might tax the servers.

It would also be really helpful if their were a way to link multiple containers together and automate storage and storage transference but I also worry about that being a big weight on the servers.

 

What I was thinking when it came to credit was that it was exactly what you said but I was suggesting that it could be turned into a physical object as a security measure. It would not necessarily prevent theft but rather make it easier for another player to spot it.

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This sounds like a great idea that could be a really fun addition on the game to play! However, I do believe there are restrictions to gambling in games that are distributed in the US (such as not being able to buy in-game gambling money/being able to pay to use gambling features) to people under 18. I know that this isn't a US based company but I believe it would have to follow certain guidelines not to be blocked by US gaming companies and systems. At least that is what I have heard.

Regardless I believe that this would be a great addition to the game! Who wouldn't want to fly their million dollar space ship to an orbiting, space station like, casino and leave completely broke and your spaceship belonging to someone else. (not complete sarcasm, I would like that feature)

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You make a really valid point I had not considered. Even though the gambling would not be real it would still be a suggestive theme that could have complications in availability.

 

This does raise the question though about how Dual Universe will approach gambling done independently between players within the game. So long as it is possible for players to trade and share items, gambling will be able to and probably will exist.

 

I personally really like the idea of a rich veteran of the game losing months of in game currency in a day or a brand new player suddenly becoming extremely wealthy in-game.

 

I am going to look up a bunch of laws on how the video game rating system works and try to learn how independent player interactions in this game might affect its availability. Thank you for bringing it up.

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On 10/1/2017 at 2:04 PM, Asmodeus said:

I think we should have the ability to create interactive elements that make it possible to gamble such as slot machines or some kind of roulette wheel.

I think we also need to have some kind of lightly automated localized transfer system that can automatically move something from one container to another, maybe using LUA scripts.

 

I had this idea when I was thinking about how I want to play the game. I plan to build a bank for new players to store their goods in a single heavily protected area and having a side business would make that goal all the more feasible, specifically a casino. It should be possible to adjust the win percentage chance in any kind of randomized gambling system like a slot machine. It would also be nice if their were a way to force the machines to let a player win if the owner feels that no one is winning enough or is just feeling generous. This would clearly allow owners of gambling devices to cheat people but I can't imagine a lot of people would go to gamble at a place where they feel like they are losing too much.

 

As far as banking goes, it would be really nice if people could turn their money into an in game credit chit with a tag line reading (for example) made by Asmodeus. Two credit chits made by the same person should fuse together when stacked but if made by different people should swap places. When a credit chit is used it should be destroyed and the money it represented is then added to that player. This would protect players from having their money stolen by banks because if the banker took any money then the credit chit would no longer read that it was made by that player.

 

I really want to find ways to make the game more fun for new and old players alike and when the game comes out I hope to build the infrastructure that makes it fun for everyone.

 

I really hope this adds something new to the game discussion and that I am not just saying something someone else said first, I kinda find that notion rather terrifying.

This makes sense. Such elements could also be used to manage minor bank accounts or maybe interact with software. 

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On 10/1/2017 at 2:04 PM, Asmodeus said:

I think we should have the ability to create interactive elements that make it possible to gamble such as slot machines or some kind of roulette wheel.

I think we also need to have some kind of lightly automated localized transfer system that can automatically move something from one container to another, maybe using LUA scripts.

 

I had this idea when I was thinking about how I want to play the game. I plan to build a bank for new players to store their goods in a single heavily protected area and having a side business would make that goal all the more feasible, specifically a casino. It should be possible to adjust the win percentage chance in any kind of randomized gambling system like a slot machine. It would also be nice if their were a way to force the machines to let a player win if the owner feels that no one is winning enough or is just feeling generous. This would clearly allow owners of gambling devices to cheat people but I can't imagine a lot of people would go to gamble at a place where they feel like they are losing too much.

 

As far as banking goes, it would be really nice if people could turn their money into an in game credit chit with a tag line reading (for example) made by Asmodeus. Two credit chits made by the same person should fuse together when stacked but if made by different people should swap places. When a credit chit is used it should be destroyed and the money it represented is then added to that player. This would protect players from having their money stolen by banks because if the banker took any money then the credit chit would no longer read that it was made by that player.

 

I really want to find ways to make the game more fun for new and old players alike and when the game comes out I hope to build the infrastructure that makes it fun for everyone.

 

I really hope this adds something new to the game discussion and that I am not just saying something someone else said first, I kinda find that notion rather terrifying.

Currently, my bank plans do what you say. We will allow players to having savings accounts, store goods, and exchange them on our own exchanges which will run on an IOU storage system. If you want you can join our org, as we are already the largest in this category and can help you with getting what you want done. 

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1 hour ago, Caesares said:

Currently, my bank plans do what you say. We will allow players to having savings accounts, store goods, and exchange them on our own exchanges which will run on an IOU storage system. If you want you can join our org, as we are already the largest in this category and can help you with getting what you want done. 

Awesome, I will put a strong consideration to joining you although I do plan on creating my own organization for other purposes I am really glad to see someone else who understands the necessity of item storage/transfer systems and banking which is honestly all I am really proposing.

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11 hours ago, Caesares said:

Currently, my bank plans do what you say. We will allow players to having savings accounts, store goods, and exchange them on our own exchanges which will run on an IOU storage system. If you want you can join our org, as we are already the largest in this category and can help you with getting what you want done. 

Savings account? Pretty sure each avatar gets their own savings account by default. Not sure why they would want to put their money into a potentially risky third parties account.

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1 hour ago, CoreVamore said:

Savings account? Pretty sure each avatar gets their own savings account by default. Not sure why they would want to put their money into a potentially risky third parties account.

There are a lot of personal reasons to use a shared account not the least of which being something like the guild storage in many other MMO's. Given that this game has large organizations in it, one would assume that at least some of those organizations might want to offer some kind of free stuff to new members or some kind of group storage between members in certain fields without having to personally transfer the money or items which could get very inconvenient very quickly. There are also more suspicious reasons that one might want to make a transaction indirect in order to keep secrets and such.

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1 minute ago, Asmodeus said:

There are a lot of personal reasons to use a shared account not the least of which being something like the guild storage in many other MMO's. Given that this game has large organizations in it, one would assume that at least some of those organizations might want to offer some kind of free stuff to new members or some kind of group storage between members in certain fields without having to personally transfer the money or items which could get very inconvenient very quickly. There are also more suspicious reasons that one might want to make a transaction indirect in order to keep secrets and such.

I would think a corporate wallet  would be handled by the game and shared items would be handled by the RDMS system without any need for a centralised 'bank' type organisation.

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Banks in such games are usually scams anyway. There's no real need for them but hey, maybe you do your job well enough that ppl trust you and you find your niche. 

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15 hours ago, CoreVamore said:

Savings account? Pretty sure each avatar gets their own savings account by default. Not sure why they would want to put their money into a potentially risky third parties account.

For gain mien friend. I do not believe that there is interest on normal accounts, which would make them just bank accounts, not savings accounts. 

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8 hours ago, Lethys said:

Banks in such games are usually scams anyway. There's no real need for them but hey, maybe you do your job well enough that ppl trust you and you find your niche. 

Yah but if I do that I kinda ruin my reputation and I don't really want to do that considering I have put so many Euros into this game. 

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4 hours ago, Caesares said:

Yah but if I do that I kinda ruin my reputation and I don't really want to do that considering I have put so many Euros into this game. 

Oh you could also just Go for the long von, 2years+ and then scam ppl with one big move. 

But the thing is, do it. Try it. Make it work. Or scam ppl in the end. That's all legit here so Go for it

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I do believe the majority of you seem to be failing to understand that wealth is not just an accumulation of currency. The big haulers that Dual Universe has shown off would become purely decorative and pointless without some kind of storage system similar to banking in most MMO's. One does not need to store money externally in order to store wealth and personally I would find the game a lot less fun to play if a single player could hold an entire planet of resources in their inventory. The banking system we are talking about does not really need to exist for new players or solo player in general but would make the game far more interesting as far as corporations and other organizations go, especially with intermediary  organizations who exist to facilitate interactions between other organizations.

 

If Dual Universe does too much of the resource protection and storage for us then it will ultimately harm the idea of Emergent Game-play which is the staple point idea of this game. Everything I promote about methods of gambling and item storage was conceived of with the goal of facilitating Emergent Game-play and minimizing the amount of interference required by the developers in creating drive for players to play the game.

 

It is entirely possible for banking systems and advanced currency exchange systems to simply not exist in the game but I truly believe that it would only hurt the player experience and diminish the value of our decisions.

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2 hours ago, Asmodeus said:

. The banking system we are talking about does not really need to exist for new players or solo player in general but would make the game far more interesting as far as corporations and other organizations go, especially with intermediary  organizations who exist to facilitate interactions between other organizations.

buuuuut, the larger organisations will likely have their own corp accounts, that DU provides, which doesnt have a need for any player run bank. This assume NQ follows how Eve Online does things - which is one of the games they have admitted to wanting to emulate.

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3 hours ago, CoreVamore said:

buuuuut, the larger organisations will likely have their own corp accounts, that DU provides, which doesnt have a need for any player run bank. This assume NQ follows how Eve Online does things - which is one of the games they have admitted to wanting to emulate.

Buuuuut, as I stated earlier, such a thing would make any resource transportation system meaningless and make the very Idea of in game piracy and such utterly pointless which would really hurt the game by removing a massive amount of Emergent Game-play and would make our player decisions be barely capable of affecting the games economics.

 

A strong economic system capable of wild fluctuation would be the driving force behind larger organisations, the ability to have in game currency or other resources lost or stolen by pirates would be a massive force driving Emergent Game-play and without such a force this game will lose a large part of its long term survive ability on the gaming market by making the player choices matter less and diminish the quality of the gaming experience.

 

If Novaquark wishes this game to be entirely driven by Emergent Game-play, they will have to at least consider putting in some kind of banking system and think very carefully about what they ultimately employ. Of course players need a safe way to store resources without the risk of those resources or money being stolen but they have already solved that problem by creating the permanent safe zones, so creating a banking system along the lines of what we are proposing would only enhance the games viability and add to Emergent Game-play. It should be risky anytime you travel outside the safe zones or choose to transport resources outside the safe zones because this forces players to create personal police forces or organizations to think about protection, pvp without resource risk is utterly meaningless in a game like this and would only hurt this games capacity to earn and maintain long term players.

 

It really is a balancing act, protect too much and Emergent Game-play dies, protect too little and players get board and lose interest. I really do believe that the system we are proposing would be the best chance for this game to survive and thrive.

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9 hours ago, Asmodeus said:

Buuuuut, as I stated earlier, such a thing would make any resource transportation system meaningless and make the very Idea of in game piracy and such utterly pointless which would really hurt the game by removing a massive amount of Emergent Game-play and would make our player decisions be barely capable of affecting the games economics.

 

A strong economic system capable of wild fluctuation would be the driving force behind larger organisations, the ability to have in game currency or other resources lost or stolen by pirates would be a massive force driving Emergent Game-play and without such a force this game will lose a large part of its long term survive ability on the gaming market by making the player choices matter less and diminish the quality of the gaming experience.

 

If Novaquark wishes this game to be entirely driven by Emergent Game-play, they will have to at least consider putting in some kind of banking system and think very carefully about what they ultimately employ. Of course players need a safe way to store resources without the risk of those resources or money being stolen but they have already solved that problem by creating the permanent safe zones, so creating a banking system along the lines of what we are proposing would only enhance the games viability and add to Emergent Game-play. It should be risky anytime you travel outside the safe zones or choose to transport resources outside the safe zones because this forces players to create personal police forces or organizations to think about protection, pvp without resource risk is utterly meaningless in a game like this and would only hurt this games capacity to earn and maintain long term players.

 

It really is a balancing act, protect too much and Emergent Game-play dies, protect too little and players get board and lose interest. I really do believe that the system we are proposing would be the best chance for this game to survive and thrive.

I think you are confusing bank with market. Markets, which will physically contain materials/items, are markets, not banks.

 

Eve Online has corp wallets and internal corp trading and emergent gameplay on the public markets is more than fine. One does not hurt the other.

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2 hours ago, CoreVamore said:

I think you are confusing bank with market. Markets, which will physically contain materials/items, are markets, not banks.

 

Eve Online has corp wallets and internal corp trading and emergent gameplay on the public markets is more than fine. One does not hurt the other.

I was talking storage, as in storing currency or materials in what is referred to in nearly all MMO's as banks which is an item storage depot that in some cases allows the players to store in game currency. In video games which do not function by the laws of real life, banks mean item storage depots so that is what I meant and I thought I was being clear on but apparently not.

 

Novaquark has already stated that they plan to make it so that players can have their stuff taken if they are killed, how far they implement that is up to them and is ,like I said, a balancing act.

 

You can talk semantics all you want in regards to how the words apply to the majority of video gamer's versus the actual definition but what I am talking about is not having some magically untouchable item storage system. I am talking about the exchange of items from game to players inventory and the types of inventory and system exchanges to be used beyond that point and if you want to get technical about it, yes in game currency is an item no different than something else harvested in the game or one of their elements.

 

I am not saying what they are doing but what I believe they should do in order to maximize the games viability and chance of long-term success. I am very aware they are emulating Eve Online and it is a great game to emulate but I will remind you that emulating something in no way means a straight up copy.

 

Even if I never actually play this game I want it to be a success, the Novaquark team is brilliant and what they are trying to do is truly visionary in the world of MMO's.

 

As the thread states very clearly, this is an Idea thread for what they could do, so even if they already have a banking/storage/market and general item/resource exchange system then this thread is about coming up with ideas to improve it.

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