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PolishFernix

Fernix's idea box #1

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Basically, this is something that is sort of a must have for a game that will be getting more and more complex as it develops.

 

Unless a huge game reset is planned when the game is released, it will be very important for new players to get their bearings, for this they will need some sort of tutorial, i'm not talking about game and interface tutorial, but a community tutorial, current political, economical and social landscapes explained in some degree.

 

For example, information about planets, cities, more powerful empires/organizations/corporations, explained basic stuff about procuring and selling resources, companies, but also information about jobs, since the economy is player driven, it means that a job board of sorts would have to be made available with information which organizations are hiring and what skills they require, that could be anything from pilots and soldiers, to miners or construction workers. Also information about distances and travel in-game would be a very welcome addition, so new players can better understand the game. Basically, an in-game wikipedia plus basic information about the current politics(this would require an algorithm or a human to write it as it changes).

 

Another thing that would be useful to new player when joining the game for the first time, would be newspapers. Written by players, for players. As the game develops, empires and politics will be established, newspapers will allow to inform people about current events in the galaxy, or a specific system, or a company, or even used as an Imperial propaganda machine.

Radios would be an addition to spaceships, bars, stations etc. allowing the owner to choose the station he wants to listen to. The range of said radio stations, that's what's tricky, it would require a specific architecture to be build, specific antennas, signal boosters, receivers in other systems etc. but it would also mean we can implement that into the in-game military forces.

For example, we have a Federation with a huge territory and a rival in the region, the radio system i'm proposing would allow a little laggy(the more stations and distance the signal goes through, the more signal lag you would get) all sensory data and positions would be sent to the sector command (i'm creating this structure while i'm writing this so don't go all "this is not how the game works now" on me, this is only an idea on new features in-game, which are not too hard to implement) and relayed to the high command for example, the in-game radio would mean that patrols can communicate with their higher-ups in the HQ by voice chat as well, or text if that's their policy.

Now, you want to start an attack, but there are enemy forces in the area, so you take out their comms relay, the Federation A looses it's contact with its forces in the region, and is virtually blind while Empire B is launching a full scale invasion. Before the word goes up the chain of command, Federation A can loose a lot of ground, or it can batter the Empire forces, no one knows, but being able to effectively knock out enemy comms and sensors is a vital part of waging war.

BEFORE some people point out that it can be substituted by discord, TeamSpeak, skype, whatever. It Can Not. Let's jump into the future, one year forward let's say, we have 1 000 000 players, and let's say there is an organization with 3000 people online on avg entire day, which is not really hard, good luck coordinating that by teamspeak. A military-like comm system is required in-game for the military fleets to function. This would also allow us a new aspect of game: hacking.

Hacking and spying to be exact, trying to infiltrate the enemy and get information from their systems, redirect some communication if you're attacking, making sure reports don't reach the main command for some time, or selling information to pirates about patrols in the region, so they can evade them, or getting blueprints and schematics for a military outpost you wish to invade, or hacking their comms and listening in, learning their secrets. It's natural that sooner or later, organizations will try to hide locations of some of their projects, bases, labs,(i'll write about developing new technologies some other day) mines, shipyards (take out those, the enemy can't replenish their numbers that easily) and hacking the enemy and infiltrating him will let you get the information. With hacking, we can actually base that on real life security and real life hacking, with improved graphics of course.

Jamming enemy comms would also be nice.

 

If we're trying to merge Space Engineers, EVE, Star Citizen, Stellaris (creating empires) and few other ideas, we need to have some sort of a system to introduce new players, and we need to expand the possibilities as much as we can, we need to make this game as realistic as it's possible, player-made radio stations and newspapers would certainly be an interesting addition, giving us dozens of new possibilities on what to do in Dual Universe world, this would allow to make kiosks with info, or radio stations, we would need people to speak on the radio, interview important people, and people would actually listen and read, because information is the key to many branches in economy, if there are reports of pirates in system A, people will react to that information, and move to system B where there are patrols established by some organization, or they will hire protection, so they can mine in that system or use it as a shipping lane. Flow of information is the key in establishing economy in space.

 

 

Soon i will follow with more ideas, this time about medical sciences in-game.

 

Also, i would love to hear what you guys think about my idea, i do like constructive criticism, so feel free to criticise.

And, this language is NOT my native language, so sorry for grammar and spelling errors, but it shouldn't be more than a little annoyance.

 

 

Fernix

 

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First of all, the game servers will be wiped before main launch.


As for the tutorials covering current politics and such, that's just not NQ's job. There will be plenty of things on the internet that will tell you everything you will need to know at the time. Same goes for travel time and distances, the most NQ needs to do for that imo is maybe a current distance between planets (Sorry guys, cant remember if they change or not) on a system / star map IF they implement that. Newspapers would also fall into the category of not NQ's job and a thing that will come about in various forms on the internet anyways.

 

You don't need an in game communications capable of coordinating ~3000 players, things like discord and teamspeak CAN be used for that through groups, roles and different channels, i would like to see you explain how they couldn't. If discord integration is supported, then you can change voice channels from in game as well. An in-game radio communication system would just add extra unneeded complexity, as well as meaning the devs have more stuff to work on that they don't 100% need. Also, there is no way that an empire would have no way of communicating with it's members if an in game comms system went down. Any organisation that has got as big as you are saying wouldn't be sane if they only relied on an in game thing that CAN be disrupted over an external thing that CAN'T (excluding alts and traitors/defectors here) be disrupted. That leads me on to how 'hacking' and spying to disrupt will exist anyways even if an in game thing wasn't implemented, through those alts and traitors and all that stuff.


 

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While i can somehow agree about in-game comms and tutorials, when i talk about newspaper and radio, i mean giving us the possibility, as mentioned, by players, for player, simply allowing us to create a newspaper and sell it in game, NQ wouldnt write it, they only would have to add a possibility to do it, same with civilian radios, they would be a nice addition to the game.

I know we're talking theory, but if this game DOES kick off, such things will be in relatively high demand, because politics, policies and conflicts will influence economy and by that, everyone. And forums in this case won't cut it, it's simply ain't gonna be good enough or fast enough.

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while NQ wouldn't put content in an in game newspaper, it would still cost them time and manpower to do and maintain. Also, in game newspapers and radios wouldn't be in demand at all. Reddit, the forums and just the general internet (think sites such as outpost zebra) would be used over an in game one 99% of the time as it would cover more stuff, and not cost the person wanting the news anything, and if a player needs to know something specific relating to their organisation, then they will use messaging within the involved parties. Same thing with the choosing a free, external option over an in game option that costs in game money for the radios, there won't be much demand for them at all. The only situations I can see someone using the radios for are as a novel item to use among friends for a few minutes, or if someone with an extremely low end pc relative to DU specs couldn't run DU while any major applications are open apart from DU.

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35 minutes ago, Evil_Porcupine said:

while NQ wouldn't put content in an in game newspaper, it would still cost them time and manpower to do and maintain. Also, in game newspapers and radios wouldn't be in demand at all. Reddit, the forums and just the general internet (think sites such as outpost zebra) would be used over an in game one 99% of the time as it would cover more stuff, and not cost the person wanting the news anything, and if a player needs to know something specific relating to their organisation, then they will use messaging within the involved parties. Same thing with the choosing a free, external option over an in game option that costs in game money for the radios, there won't be much demand for them at all. The only situations I can see someone using the radios for are as a novel item to use among friends for a few minutes, or if someone with an extremely low end pc relative to DU specs couldn't run DU while any major applications are open apart from DU.

By your logic, irl radios and newspapers are not in demand and we might just as well not have them, because we have youtube, spotify, and twitter/fb (political forum) not everyone want to go through dozens od threads regarding the in-game politics, looking for a fresh one. Not everyone will be in an organization, there should be something akin to a newspaper(it wont really be that hard to do really, i mean allowing people to do it) because forums and reddit while they more or less support a DEBATE they wont really be a good substitute for a newspaper. Unless you create a section devoted only to in-game community news, but who would run it? How would we choose people to run it? In a free market, the better newsteam will crush the others, and if they don't provide the content people look for, someone else will rise to the top. And there can he different press leaders focusing on different topic.

 

Pls tell me how to subtitute that with the forums which half the platers wont read at all.

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Your first problem, is that's not my logic. You cant alt tab to discord while deployed in the middle east in an active combat zone. Irl not everyone has access to alternatives to newspapers, e.g. Lack of tech knowledge, not wanting to use data while doing something. Any political information that concerns you will be easier to access for you than having to go through dozens of threads to find it. How does someone not being in an organisation have anything to do with it? There might be something like a newspaper for DU, just on the internet. Not in DU.exe. Forums and reddit etc will fall into this category, as they have content on a topic with a viewpoint from the author, but they are better than newspapers because of the debate they bring, which shows all sides of an argument, with all the points from every side, leading to a less tunnel visioned view of the political landscape. What you are saying about how a free market would lead to the prefered source gaining more use is true, however this in no way is something that would only happen on a dedicated in game news service. And to answer your last question, if a player doesn't want to read stuff on the forums, then they can read it literally anywhere else that covers it. And who is saying more people would read something from an in game news thing than from the forums or any other place that they could get a wider range of viewpoints on the news for free compared to the in game cost?

 

This will be my last reply to this topic as it seems I cant quite get you to grasp my point on some of these things, so wasting any more effort would be useless if its going no where.

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I do understand your point, but the matter of fact is, in game newspaper are an awesome feature, there is a reason they were added in Red Dead Redemption, they are quite fun to read, if the editor is worth his money, radios in Fallout also served a purpose while they could ge substitiuted by internet sources, besides, i'm just throwing ideas that can be implemented someday, i do realise how low of a priority adding this feature would be, but i think letting the people decide if they want to do it or not, read it or not, it's not that they are vital, they would just be fun and if players write them like they should, pretty sure that some would buy them.

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You can have all that, that's his point. You can make a radio and you can have newspapers. They're only OOG and not ingame, so what? 

You could have that even on the community portal (maybe that transfers over to DU, or you can link a site there with lua to in-game screens. So there you have your newspaper. Just organize it and start writing

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@PolishFernix

 

Having NQ store unneccessary files - like "newspapers" - is a waste of storage. Scripts beign saved on the server, makes sense, its' needed so the blueprint system to work. Newpapers? I look up news on my Note's debrief every morning, I don't buy newspapers.

NQ has HTML UI customisation already showcased, you could just as well open up "DU-Drama.com" on your in-game "terminal" so to speak and read it there if you feel as much inclined. Or as Lethys said, NQ might just allow people to link their community page feed with a screen in-game, so, there, be a forum warrior IN-GAME. MAke an org, name it Fernix News, name your in-game toon Bill O'Rly and just spread all the propaganda you want.

 

However "politics" is not something NQ should be bothered with. They can't claim "oh, the evil empire did this and that", that's bias, that's unprrofessional, it's not NQ's job to determine who's "evil". I can gank you for 100 times in a row, bomb your base and then claim "he deserved it, here are som, TOTALLY LEGIT discord convos between me and him" and paint oyu as a bad guy who had it coming". Politics, is not something simple and you clearly - so far - lack any and all journalistic ethics with the mindset "politics can be put into nifty 140 characters twitts.

 

Fallout's radio stations are a singleplayer feature. And here's your problem, you think DU is a singleplayer game. It's not. If you are not in an org, you won't enjoy the game, it's that simple, it's not a singleplayer friendly experience. And the guys you are familiarised with in an org, will have a certain history behind them and against other people. See, culture, is not something you can put in context. Goonswarm in EVE Online see themseles as "good" so does anyone out there for that matter. Truth? Goonswarm is a bunch of ...well, goons.

"Why did X-Org went after Y-Org" , according to you "Y-Org was bad, cause Y-Org is bad, you don't need the details". That's not how poltiics work. Nothing is ever simple.

Also, you just disgust me, your mindset of "people don't got time to dig through dozens of sources to determine politics, so let's feed the what we ddeem important" is why a bankrupt used cars salesman is having the nuclear missile codes. You seem to ENJOY your ignorance, that's what disgusts me.

 

Go do your newspaper thing on reddit, that's where people go when they don't want context and only want an echoechamber of "them bad, we good, zugg-zugg".


Cheers.

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    I don't personally have an interest in newspapers per se, but to have the ability to share and communicate in different ways could have plenty of benefits to players.  Whether that is producing types of periodicals that you can send to other players in game, or communication feeds that can be sent out and displayed on monitors.

 

    I can understand that this may not be important enough to actually make it into the game, but I do believe there is some value to the ideas.

 

    It doesn't benefit any attempt of communication to make assumptions of what other peoples reasons or motivations are for the views they express.  That is a way to shut down conversations, and build division.

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55 minutes ago, Felonu said:

    I don't personally have an interest in newspapers per se, but to have the ability to share and communicate in different ways could have plenty of benefits to players.  Whether that is producing types of periodicals that you can send to other players in game, or communication feeds that can be sent out and displayed on monitors.

 

    I can understand that this may not be important enough to actually make it into the game, but I do believe there is some value to the ideas.

 

    It doesn't benefit any attempt of communication to make assumptions of what other peoples reasons or motivations are for the views they express.  That is a way to shut down conversations, and build division.

And again, no one ever said anything against doing it. It's just not NQs job to do this - people should and will do it. So yeah, basically it's already "in the game"

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I'm totally sold on the idea,ingame news reports would give this game a whole new layer of immersion.

And perhaps if it's possible in the future,NQ could code the ability for radio transmits through people's screens via LUA.

Just imagine,Channel 9 in DU ))

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23 hours ago, CaptainTwerkmotor said:

@PolishFernix

 

Having NQ store unneccessary files - like "newspapers" - is a waste of storage. Scripts beign saved on the server, makes sense, its' needed so the blueprint system to work. Newpapers? I look up news on my Note's debrief every morning, I don't buy newspapers.

NQ has HTML UI customisation already showcased, you could just as well open up "DU-Drama.com" on your in-game "terminal" so to speak and read it there if you feel as much inclined. Or as Lethys said, NQ might just allow people to link their community page feed with a screen in-game, so, there, be a forum warrior IN-GAME. MAke an org, name it Fernix News, name your in-game toon Bill O'Rly and just spread all the propaganda you want.

 

However "politics" is not something NQ should be bothered with. They can't claim "oh, the evil empire did this and that", that's bias, that's unprrofessional, it's not NQ's job to determine who's "evil". I can gank you for 100 times in a row, bomb your base and then claim "he deserved it, here are som, TOTALLY LEGIT discord convos between me and him" and paint oyu as a bad guy who had it coming". Politics, is not something simple and you clearly - so far - lack any and all journalistic ethics with the mindset "politics can be put into nifty 140 characters twitts.

 

Fallout's radio stations are a singleplayer feature. And here's your problem, you think DU is a singleplayer game. It's not. If you are not in an org, you won't enjoy the game, it's that simple, it's not a singleplayer friendly experience. And the guys you are familiarised with in an org, will have a certain history behind them and against other people. See, culture, is not something you can put in context. Goonswarm in EVE Online see themseles as "good" so does anyone out there for that matter. Truth? Goonswarm is a bunch of ...well, goons.

"Why did X-Org went after Y-Org" , according to you "Y-Org was bad, cause Y-Org is bad, you don't need the details". That's not how poltiics work. Nothing is ever simple.

Also, you just disgust me, your mindset of "people don't got time to dig through dozens of sources to determine politics, so let's feed the what we ddeem important" is why a bankrupt used cars salesman is having the nuclear missile codes. You seem to ENJOY your ignorance, that's what disgusts me.

 

Go do your newspaper thing on reddit, that's where people go when they don't want context and only want an echoechamber of "them bad, we good, zugg-zugg".


Cheers.

First of all, i think you completly misunderstood my argument, i never claimed that NQ should have anything to do with in game politics.

 

Second, radio stations, deosnt matter if thats multi or single, music is music, hence why while driving in a car you can either listen to what you put togather, or you can listen to one of dozens radio stations. Again, completly missed my argument.

 

Third.yes, some people don't have time to dig through dozens of of sources, THAT IS WHY YOU HAVE TV NEWS AND NEWSPAPERS, and yes, they cover stuff they deem important! How dare they! Giving us stuff that we might find interesting and useful! That's disgraceful!

 

4th. I never said that DU is a single player, in fact, i proposed a feature because it's multiplayer, at this point i'm not sure if you actually read my post, or did you read some twisted version of it.

 

5th. "Why did X-Org went after Y-Org" , according to you "Y-Org was bad, cause Y-Org is bad, you don't need the details". That's not how poltiics work. Nothing is ever simple."

Der fack is this? And how is that "according to me?"

you seem no to be able to understand how news reporting works.

So, i will try to explain it to you real fast. An unaffilated with either side newspaper might report it like this.

"Border dispute has turned into a full war after weeks of mounting tensions bewteen Y and X, both sides accuse each other of attacking each other through indirectly sponsored pirates, in the opening battle, X have crippled the Y defense fleet in system Z, but when reinforcements arrived, X fleet has been pushed back from the system's colony. Mining guild K has issued a warning to all civilian ships mining within close proximity to not approach system Z." This is one way to cover it, a very short way, but it is as unbiased as it can be and it conveys the message, plus i don't have time to write a full story on theoretical event just to strenghen ny argument, my point is made. I said that newspapers could be used as propaganda by organizations, not that ALL will BE used as propaganda.

 

6th. Text does not take much space, your argument about the server having to store few thousands line of tex is ridicolus, and if it would only store the current edition of the newspapers, it would be difficult for it to take up more than the files related to one planet. this argument is simply moronic.

 

7th point.Why are you so hung up on newspapers not giving any context, did you ever even read a newspaper? Your last aegument doesn't make ANY sense.

 

8. Your argument about the clan from EVE at least has some logic. So i'll go with Orwellian thinking here a little.

If the majority of players think something is good, that means 2 thing, either it is good, or they are misinformed, if it's the latter, then there should be means to explain that they are wrong, change their opinion. If you're unable, that means either people are idiots or your argument isn't good enough. Some would say 'So what if they sometimes act like goons, when x happens, they do Y' every opinion is subjctive, people focus on stuff that matters to them, not you, hence why appearently some like them, because there is something about them to like.

 

All in all, your arguments seem to be based on some completly misrepresented form of my arguments and my idea, i do not understand why or how, because i'm fairly sure that except for my slight grammar and spelling errors, my arguments were decently made.

 

Fernix

 

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17 hours ago, Lethys said:

@PolishFernix to come back, again, to the main point: all of that is already done and possible.

 

People already write news

people already write history

people already compile information

people already (tried) to do a radiostation

Yep, i got it, but reply my was directed at captaintwerkmotor, just had to respond to that post.

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I don't see a reason why it shouldn't be added.

 

I'm not sure about voice chat but i think we can assume there will be at least text chat in the game.

with that already done it's like one or two afternoons to code radio stations.

 

As for newspapers it's pretty easy too but i'm not sure if it's necessary to add. I don't know how extensive lua scripting is but it's perfectly possible that it's possible to make a news terminal by players.

 

But i don't think military orgs ever use these exploitable radios instead of teamspeak or discord.

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