Proxie

First let me say I support PVP completely. But its gotta change and asap in DU. Right now PVP in DU is nothing more than griefing other players, for the sake of griefing. I've watched a few streams of people get destroyed today in PVP. In all 12 encounters I saw, they were all dead before they knew what was happening. This is not fun. Fun PVP is a fight, where ships and skills are tested against one another. Someone wins and someone loses. The PVP moments I've seen and experienced in the game are not that at all. In all cases I've seen, PVP has been utterly one-sided and over in moments. There was so little opportunity for response, that I wouldn't even classify it as PVP at all.
 
There's no way in DU to understand or become experienced in ship-to-ship combat other than PVP. The people who got into PVP before you are so much better, with ships so much more focused on your death, that there's no real ramp up. You just die, and then get set back days or weeks. And the only way to improve is to do it again. That's if it's consensual. You might just want to progress in your projects, and need copper. Too bad. You're now engaged in PVP. Oh - you didn't dedicate yourself to learning PVP? Reset 2 weeks. Reset 10 days.
Nothing is engaging about this. It's so one-sided and bereft of interaction, it might as well be a bug or a glitch destroying your ship.
This has to change. If it stays like this, DU will be catering to an extreme niche of people who aren't nominally there to make use of all the creative tools - but instead will min/max ships designed for the sole purpose of murdering other people as efficiently as possible. That's fun only for those people. There aren't enough of those people to support the success of an MMO. No one watches two weeks of work put into a ship build disappear in an instant and thinks, "this is so much fun!"
 
Things that absolutely must be changed for the game to be successful.
Weapon ranges needs to be reduced to no more than 2.5k. This forces all parties involved to have to actually fight each other in a proper battle. Weapon damage needs to be reduced by 75%. Right now it frankly doesn't matter what material you build your ship out of, because weapon damage is too high, and chews through everything. It makes building anything other than a layered box ship pointless. Space safe zone should be permanent and never removed for any reason. This will allow trade and civilization to grow. Players should not be forced into PVP if that's not what they are interested in. Planets in space safe zone should never have PVP either. For the same reasons as above. Players should not be forced into PVP if that's not what they are interested in. Having a single safe moon, is frankly a stupid idea. Lets put everyone to a moon, force them to deal with lag, over population, etc. Nope...people will legit just leave the game. Ship and Base shields need to be a thing. So players have proper defense. Ships moving over 10,000 should not be able to fire weapons.
Unless some serious changes are made to PVP in DU. The game will not be successful. As the CEO of NQ has stated on many streams this is a civilization game, not a PVP game. The Devs need to start making players fully aware of this. Unregulated PVP will completely ruin the game we all want.
 
Just look at what's happening now, players building walls at warp points to grief players using warp. This also needs to be fixed, and the players suspended for 30 days for doing it. NQ you need to draw a line in the sand when it comes to these issues now and set the place. 

That's the thing. They never actually have proper suggestions to fix the real issues at hand. They just want everything one sided, and the game completely dead with just a bunch of niche PVP like you said. The thing is the PVPers here are the VAST minority. And even the CEO has stated on stream that DU is not a PVP game. It has PVP yes, but it's not even the man focus. He wants to see player cities, shipping, etc.

The suggestions I provided while extra, are actual balancing measures that would keep the game a live and teaming. I've played EvE for over 10 years. I can tell you first hand if it's not fixed now in early beta, the game is RIP.

First let me say I support PVP completely. But its gotta change and asap in DU. Right now PVP in DU is nothing more than griefing other players, for the sake of griefing. I've watched a few streams of people get destroyed today in PVP. In all 12 encounters I saw, they were all dead before they knew what was happening. This is not fun. Fun PVP is a fight, where ships and skills are tested against one another. Someone wins and someone loses. The PVP moments I've seen and experienced in the game are not that at all. In all cases I've seen, PVP has been utterly one-sided and over in moments. There was so little opportunity for response, that I wouldn't even classify it as PVP at all.
 
There's no way in DU to understand or become experienced in ship-to-ship combat other than PVP. The people who got into PVP before you are so much better, with ships so much more focused on your death, that there's no real ramp up. You just die, and then get set back days or weeks. And the only way to improve is to do it again. That's if it's consensual. You might just want to progress in your projects, and need copper. Too bad. You're now engaged in PVP. Oh - you didn't dedicate yourself to learning PVP? Reset 2 weeks. Reset 10 days.
Nothing is engaging about this. It's so one-sided and bereft of interaction, it might as well be a bug or a glitch destroying your ship.
This has to change. If it stays like this, DU will be catering to an extreme niche of people who aren't nominally there to make use of all the creative tools - but instead will min/max ships designed for the sole purpose of murdering other people as efficiently as possible. That's fun only for those people. There aren't enough of those people to support the success of an MMO. No one watches two weeks of work put into a ship build disappear in an instant and thinks, "this is so much fun!"
 
Things that absolutely must be changed for the game to be successful.
Weapon ranges needs to be reduced to no more than 2.5k. This forces all parties involved to have to actually fight each other in a proper battle. Weapon damage needs to be reduced by 75%. Right now it frankly doesn't matter what material you build your ship out of, because weapon damage is too high, and chews through everything. It makes building anything other than a layered box ship pointless. Space safe zone should be permanent and never removed for any reason. This will allow trade and civilization to grow. Players should not be forced into PVP if that's not what they are interested in. Planets in space safe zone should never have PVP either. For the same reasons as above. Players should not be forced into PVP if that's not what they are interested in. Having a single safe moon, is frankly a stupid idea. Lets put everyone to a moon, force them to deal with lag, over population, etc. Nope...people will legit just leave the game. Ship and Base shields need to be a thing. So players have proper defense. Ships moving over 10,000 should not be able to fire weapons.
Unless some serious changes are made to PVP in DU. The game will not be successful. As the CEO of NQ has stated on many streams this is a civilization game, not a PVP game. The Devs need to start making players fully aware of this. Unregulated PVP will completely ruin the game we all want.
 
Just look at what's happening now, players building walls at warp points to grief players using warp. This also needs to be fixed, and the players suspended for 30 days for doing it. NQ you need to draw a line in the sand when it comes to these issues now and set the place. 

That's the thing. They never actually have proper suggestions to fix the real issues at hand. They just want everything one sided, and the game completely dead with just a bunch of niche PVP like you said. The thing is the PVPers here are the VAST minority. And even the CEO has stated on stream that DU is not a PVP game. It has PVP yes, but it's not even the man focus. He wants to see player cities, shipping, etc.

The suggestions I provided while extra, are actual balancing measures that would keep the game a live and teaming. I've played EvE for over 10 years. I can tell you first hand if it's not fixed now in early beta, the game is RIP.

Agree'd. That's all I was saying. I just gave percentages based on my opinion.
If they don't want to decrease weapon damage then they need to find a way to prevent flying boxes in space completely, and increase voxel HP x20. I want actually skill based PVP. Not this current trash.

I think the 3 inner planets should remain pvp free.
But we definitely need atmo pvp on the other planets. (but please NQ warn us about the changes before those happen, and I mean US, all players, not just a few favorite players)
 
I think that any radar should have a bigger range than any weapon.
I think that weapons should not have an optimal range equal to max range. Weapon range should be big but with a near 0% CTH at max range.
And yea, damage could be a little lower.

I am pro PVP. But it seems to me that the PVP players here crying, want everything one sided, and want no one to have any defense at all. Everyone would just be a glass cannon, and all fights will continue to just be pure ganking for no actual purpose. I want PVP. But not that kind of PVP. That just boring and frankly griefing. Right now PVP is complete trash, and everyone is using silly Borg Cubes. There is no proper defense for players who don't want to PVP at all. Which is insane to me.

PVP has to be balanced for both PVE players and PVP players. Or this game will fail. Period. The PVP we currently have and what is planned will ensure that DU is a niche game barely anyone at all actually plays. It will basically become Ark Survival in space and be pure trash. The suggestions provided by the OP are valid and actually address current problems. If you don't have the skills to fight ship vs ship...You don't need to be playing. Period.

I hate to break this to you all, but Economies do better without war in real life. The same applies to games. Maybe some of you need to go back and do basic High School Econ.

How would the suggestion not be healthy for the game? EvE uses similar rules. They have permanent space safe zones for players. All the other suggestions are valid and actually address issues. You people are just trying to completely ruin DU with niche gank style PVP. And god forbid when planet warfare starts, it will just become RUST in space and people will leave the game in mass. Not everyone wants to build shitty boxes and keep repairing shit 101 times when they spend weeks making stuff.

Right now the cost of building is too high to replace things. And voxels are basically paper, even if you build them out of pure gold.

First let me say I support PVP completely. But its gotta change and asap in DU. Right now PVP in DU is nothing more than griefing other players, for the sake of griefing. I've watched a few streams of people get destroyed today in PVP. In all 12 encounters I saw, they were all dead before they knew what was happening. This is not fun. Fun PVP is a fight, where ships and skills are tested against one another. Someone wins and someone loses. The PVP moments I've seen and experienced in the game are not that at all. In all cases I've seen, PVP has been utterly one-sided and over in moments. There was so little opportunity for response, that I wouldn't even classify it as PVP at all.
 
There's no way in DU to understand or become experienced in ship-to-ship combat other than PVP. The people who got into PVP before you are so much better, with ships so much more focused on your death, that there's no real ramp up. You just die, and then get set back days or weeks. And the only way to improve is to do it again. That's if it's consensual. You might just want to progress in your projects, and need copper. Too bad. You're now engaged in PVP. Oh - you didn't dedicate yourself to learning PVP? Reset 2 weeks. Reset 10 days.
Nothing is engaging about this. It's so one-sided and bereft of interaction, it might as well be a bug or a glitch destroying your ship.
This has to change. If it stays like this, DU will be catering to an extreme niche of people who aren't nominally there to make use of all the creative tools - but instead will min/max ships designed for the sole purpose of murdering other people as efficiently as possible. That's fun only for those people. There aren't enough of those people to support the success of an MMO. No one watches two weeks of work put into a ship build disappear in an instant and thinks, "this is so much fun!"
 
Things that absolutely must be changed for the game to be successful.
Weapon ranges needs to be reduced to no more than 2.5k. This forces all parties involved to have to actually fight each other in a proper battle. Weapon damage needs to be reduced by 75%. Right now it frankly doesn't matter what material you build your ship out of, because weapon damage is too high, and chews through everything. It makes building anything other than a layered box ship pointless. Space safe zone should be permanent and never removed for any reason. This will allow trade and civilization to grow. Players should not be forced into PVP if that's not what they are interested in. Planets in space safe zone should never have PVP either. For the same reasons as above. Players should not be forced into PVP if that's not what they are interested in. Having a single safe moon, is frankly a stupid idea. Lets put everyone to a moon, force them to deal with lag, over population, etc. Nope...people will legit just leave the game. Ship and Base shields need to be a thing. So players have proper defense. Ships moving over 10,000 should not be able to fire weapons.
Unless some serious changes are made to PVP in DU. The game will not be successful. As the CEO of NQ has stated on many streams this is a civilization game, not a PVP game. The Devs need to start making players fully aware of this. Unregulated PVP will completely ruin the game we all want.
 
Just look at what's happening now, players building walls at warp points to grief players using warp. This also needs to be fixed, and the players suspended for 30 days for doing it. NQ you need to draw a line in the sand when it comes to these issues now and set the place. 

+1 There is already precedence for this in the game, with the frontal areal of a construct deciding atmospheric drag.

This is simply numbers, math if you will. The real question is Are there enough PvP’ers to need the entire solar system as a PvP zone and can they solely support and provide the income necessary to continue to develop and run the game? 

If you leave only one moon for everyone that don’t want to PvP (This is what the PvP’ers want, only Sanctuary Moon as PvE), the game will fail, hands down. Lag will be unbearable, and no one will leave the moon for fear at getting destroyed the second they reach space, it just don’t work and subs will start to drop. People need space to build, fly ships, build space stations without the need of someone coming and destroying everything when the person is offline. The current safe zone is 3 planets, everything else is on the PvP zone, that’s 8-9? Planets and their moons, that sounds like a fair balance to me.
 
Disclaimer: cause every time I say this I have to also say that support the PvP part of the game and I’m in no way against it. I’m just looking at this from outside the picture and I want the game to be successful, but a full PvP game, this type of game, will not work and it will eventually die.

I agree pvp needs some love, but most of your points are off or over corrections. We still need more info and mechanics implemented for better balance passes. But I do agree in theory, once things get rolling after release, slow boating should be safer than warp in most instances. Not impossible but ya if you hit max speed I'm ok with guns not working. That ship has to slow down at some point, or if you catch it before max speed, etc.  I'm on the fence about current safe zone staying though.  It all really depends on how the pvp unfolds.
 
As for the borg cubes, there has been good ideas kicking around where like in eve, sig radius matters, so the guns can calculate voxels and cross section, so if a large gun aims at a cube, it can so perfect hits on it, obliterating it very quickly, while "normal looking" ships with Lowe sig and cross section will receive more glancing blows, and reduce damage applied.

In DU 30K represents light speed, which is why it is impossible to get past 29,999. So if a rocket is able to track and hit you at that speed, it is doing something impossible. Or something that has an astronomically small chance of success to be more exact if the rocket is traveling towards the ship, instead of trying to catch it from behind which would be actually impossible (for any type of weapon, including laser).
 
And for me it keeps coming back to one word incentive. In the sense that DU has a pillar more important then any others, it is that it is a building game. That is the core technology of the game that everything else is built around. And so it makes sense that this game will attract more of the creative type people then your typical MMO. People from Landmark, Second Life, Minecraft etc. looking for something to bridge the creative side with a MMO. Which brings us back to incentive. Why would anyone put effort and energy into creating, when it can be easily torn down by anyone with a gun wanting to kill some spare time?
 
So don't misunderstand me. I am not arguing against PvP. But the rules of engagement has to be clear. And there has to be a balance of creation vs destruction. Having PvP weapons bend the laws of physics as established by the game, while builders (potentially in the near future) are limited to a single resource scarce sanctuary moon and a single STU per player. Is not an example of this.

The only thing I will add here for now, it’s that future PvP updates are way off, according to the roadmap, they are listed all the way at the end, so around 6-12 months from now, if nothing else breaks.
 
Also, I have to agree with the current space PvP outside the protection zone is silly, I mean, all anyone has to see it’s the few videos of people traveling at 30,000 km/hr and getting pummeled by rockets from a ship that’s not even there. So before they even work on atmo PvP, safe zones etc etc, this needs change massively. Again, way off the radar according to the roadmap. 
 
PvP is 1 of the 4 pillars of this game and it needs love too but right now it’s the weakest and silliest of the four. Hopefully they will make good decisions in the future and have it work better than what it is presently.

Yeah the box thing was a given, of course PVPers are going to take the easy win 100% of the time. People used to remove the textures from CS 1.6 back in the day to make it easier to see the enemy, they do anything to win doesn't matter if the game looks like ass, fuck PVPers that think like that man, I wish I would see cool designs fighting each other but not, make a box with a weapon and kill people just for the thrils is what they go for...

People are not just going to deal with the server issues. They'll just leave. That's how this works, and you end up with a failed game. And don't get me started on the Discord. If you aren't a troll or a mega fanboy they mute you. Any feedback given is instantly shutdown. I was personally muted for reporting someone to the Mods for name calling, just because the Mods knew them. So you have no idea what you are talking about.

Work on making a solid sentence and we'll talk.

People are not just going to deal with the server issues. They'll just leave. That's how this works, and you end up with a failed game. And don't get me started on the Discord. If you aren't a troll or a mega fanboy they mute you. Any feedback given is instantly shutdown. I was personally muted for reporting someone to the Mods for name calling, just because the Mods knew them. So you have no idea what you are talking about.

Work on making a solid sentence and we'll talk.

This needed to be said. I completely agree with you. Enough is enough. This is by far the worst Beta release I have ever seen, and they are charging us for it. And we have no way to unsubscribe. All their is to do in the game is build and mine. And you can't currently do either. I wish I hadn't given them money. My community is giving them till Friday to get this sorted out.
 
Also, having one big server was a terrible idea. There needs to be two servers to split the population and keep things running smoothly.

People are not just going to deal with the server issues. They'll just leave. That's how this works, and you end up with a failed game. And don't get me started on the Discord. If you aren't a troll or a mega fanboy they mute you. Any feedback given is instantly shutdown. I was personally muted for reporting someone to the Mods for name calling, just because the Mods knew them. So you have no idea what you are talking about.

Work on making a solid sentence and we'll talk.

People are not just going to deal with the server issues. They'll just leave. That's how this works, and you end up with a failed game. And don't get me started on the Discord. If you aren't a troll or a mega fanboy they mute you. Any feedback given is instantly shutdown. I was personally muted for reporting someone to the Mods for name calling, just because the Mods knew them. So you have no idea what you are talking about.

Work on making a solid sentence and we'll talk.

well said Tiberius and I totally agree.  20 + days I have owned the game with only 4 minutes actual gameplay. A ticket that's open for just as long with gaps of up to 6 days in reply. (currently at 4 days) The amount of times I have actually filled out the refund request but not actually sent it in is crazy.  We all want the game to work so very badly and its very difficult to watch it unfold as it is. I just started a topic regarding the #help-troubleshooting channel in discord, organising that hot mess could go a long way to at least making people feel like something is being done. However, as Tiberius_Theron says, server issues are the priority. If people cant get into a game, Beta or otherwise, that they have payed cash to get into, then they will leave,  and not only will they leave, they will tell everyone they know NOT to join. A real shame since this game could be all that its advertised to be. I don't know why it was pushed out as Beta in this condition, but for whatever reason, now is the time to fix it, or, at the very least, STOP charging new people money to join, sling it back into closed Beta and then FIX it.

Dear NQ,
While I am sure you are working steadily and extremely focused on dealing with the current server issues. I feel it's warranted since it's been nearly a week dealing with these issues, that server issues need to come to an end. And sooner than later. All Betas have a rough start. However this is the worse my community and myself have ever seen.

Server issues for much longer are simply not going to be accepted by the DU community. We are starting to lose players, because they have a bad taste in their mouths, and most will not return.
Players are spending hours and in some cases days on loading screens. Players are dealing with the constant pending operation, computing data, and terrain that doesn't load.
Players can't voice their concerns on Discord, due to the Mod Staff actively silencing discontent, and issuing unwarranted mutes. Which I assume you have directed. And on top of all this we get no communication at all. Just random restarts that actually make game play worse.

Regardless, the server issues need to be wrapped up and soon. You are charging for a Beta, that has no current way to cancel the subscription, and you expect players to just keep dealing with these issues. That's not how this works. Deal with the server issues, even if you have to schedule employees around the clock to get it done. There is no more time on this issue. NQ you are killing the game in the first week of Beta. There is only so much to do in the game, and currently players can't even do it.