Gottchar Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 First off, before even starting with this, in the past sometimes schematics were changed with major unfair consequences for people already owning or producing the item, so the following mostly make sense in case of a wipe, or when creating new items: Tier changes: These are very simple, require litte thought as they can pretty much seen as bug. Some items have an inconsisten tier, if you look at the machines needed for them and the materials used. Examples -Territory units -ScreenXL -Rocket engine L Nanocraftable: Similary a no brainer like above, if one type of HC can be nanocrafted, they all should. I strongly think more of the simple electronics parts should be t1 and nanocraftable, this includes: XS lights, operators (NOT, AND, etc), counters. Rename headlights to "small headlights", make them XS and t1, too. They are the only part on the starter speeder that can not be nanocrafted. I would also argue detection zones and VR pods should be reduced to t2. These are small QoL items that people should have easy access to, this doesn’t unbalance anything. Cost: These item cost an oddly high or surprisingly low amount compared to similar items. These are very open to discussion and I post my opions here: Primer: Usually if you go bigger or smaller, but stay "in the tier", the price is the same for the performance. Examples (using production prices at full talents and actual ore prices as of now, schematic prices not included in any way.) Normal items: A wing M has 4x the power of a wing S, and costs 6x as much, the wing S however is easier to place. A basic atmo engine L costs 6x as much as M with 6x the power, and is somewhat easier to place. A Gate XL is 9x as big as a gate XS and 8x the price. 4 glas panels S are as big as one M, 4xM are as big is one L. The prices are ~100q, 400q and 600q. All screens just cost the same, plants are in groups of either 100q or 600q depending on size. All makes kinda sense. And now, to the stuff that needs to have a look: Canopy windshield. Easiest to compare to glas panels of the exact same size, these cost far far more. 40 000q for L, 6000q for M, 1000q for S, compared to 600q, 400q and 100q for the glas panels. What you are paying for is the fact that canopy, unlike panels, do not have the Z fighting (that glitchy flickering) on the edges when placed on flat surfaces, and they do not look like they are coated in grease. Metal canopy cost about the same as windshields. A steel panel however costs only 140q. How to cover a 16x16 voxel sized hole (2x2 meters): 900 quanta with actual steel voxels (4 cubic meters, no tricks) 1120 for 8 steel panels 16 000 for 16 metal canopy S 24 000 for 4 canopy M 40 000 for 1 canopy L Winner is voxel, as usual, followed by the elements, and you pay more if you want to spend less time repairing. Pipes, they all cost the same, no matter the size. A, B, C and D are not different models, the A and B are different models, C and D are the same model, but twice as long. They also weigh 4t each and cost 36k to make. For a decorative item with no purpose. And unlike a bonsai, or hologram L, pipes are not pretty or give instant braggin rights. Who came up with the price for pipes? Control units: Command seats can link more stuff but are much heavier, fair enough. EMC, programming board and remote control should have their price increased to match that of hover seat and command seat though. Something being quite cheap is usually not seen as a problem and nobody complains, but I think it would make sense. Type of material needed. These are a bit different. Just be aware this is not about realism in any way, this is about roughly balancing the types of ore needed. It is also not an issue with individual items. This may also be a hard read for people who do not do industry. All engines need reinforced frames of their tier, which means heavy metal (yeaah!), and screw of a 1 lower tier, more heavy metal (doubleyeaah!) Atmo also needs: Injectors, which means plastic of all tiers including the tier of the engines, and screw, up to one lower than the tier of the engine, Combustion chamber, which is mostly heavy metal and some light metal. This is pretty damn metal overall. Space engines use conductor metals instead of plastic And the same is true for other ship parts that you need multiple of, hovers/boosters, containers, and maybe eventually t1-4 wings, brakes. I very much welcome the higher tier version of some ship parts and hope many more come, like wings, adjustors and brakes. However, while the t1 versions are still somewhat balanced, the higher tier versions are less so. A move towards more "metal" parts of higher tier should therefore aim to increase the use of plastic, glas and conductor metals. Examples: -Increase the need for high tech which already uses more of those 3. Like by introducing different sizes or even tiers of warp drives, adding other high tech like the AGG, this could be an "AGG light", which just generally reduced the gravity force on your ship, without need to adjust a singularity. Make your M core ship behave on Alioth like it would on Sicari, with the new Göde-drive, which needs a shit ton of Pyrite and Kolbeckite to produce. -Change part materials needed. eg the advanced burner from 2, 2, 2, 2, 2 (screw, screw, light metal, light metal light metal) to 1, 1, 1, 3, 3, and injector similary to need less screws, but more plastic. Magnets to use more connectors. -When introducing a new tiered version of an item, let’s say t2+ adjustors, change their frames into casings. -More items where you can chose. Currently space fuel and scrap are the big equalizers. If one t2 ore costs drastically less for a while, people switch their space fuel and it equalizes. However only for t2. Scrap equalizes all items, but is not used in the same volume and heavily favours higher tiers anyway. Easiest thing would be to introduce more fuel schematics (and making the final product the same thing, so it mixes). It is a hard sell lore wise though. Alternative items are the most surefire way to keep stuff balanced though, keep it in mind if you ever introduce a new consumable like for an energy system. -Make non-vital parts of ships take no PvE damage, drastically increasing the use of screens, lights, holograms, canopy, and opening a want for more, bigger and higher tier vanity items. I want to stuff my ship with t3 M sized plants, a t4 crystal bar and a holodeck-like room with a unicorn fountain and a rainbow projector. And that doesn’t work with voxels and vert lights. Closing: This was a long wall of text for an addendum to another forum post. I am aware that some are a bit on the nitpicky side. I also want to mention that the currently high prices on some items mean more profit for me. So this is not coming from somebody who wishes he could afford more things, I just think canopy are stupid expensive and same-tier ore should be more same-price. Many of these things said could lead to nice discussions about other things, please start a new topic for those. space_man and huschhusch 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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