Dygz_Briarthorn

That's still saying that character skills compensate for player skills. I as a player may suck at hiding or detecting players who are hiding. But, character skills in an RPG can compensate for that. My Bounty Hunter character in an RPG should have Stealth skills and Detection skills. Same thing for aiming. If my character's role is to be a Sniper, my character should have the skills that make my character excel at Sniping, even if I as a player don't have those skills. As a player, I may suck at deciphering languages, but in an RPG a Scholar/Wizard/Linguist/Diplomat should have skills for Decipher Language.

An MMORPG is different than an MMOFPS. "Traditional" isn't necessarily a factor. But, the primary difference between an RPG and an FPS is that an RPG focuses on the skills of the character while an FPS focuses on the skills of the player. In an RPG, my character skills can compensate for my lack or precise aiming in an FPS. That could be via more skills that rely on AoEs or skills that provide Stealth or Roots or Snares, etc. In No Man's Sky, I think Phase Cannon upgrades provide soft-locks that aren't available without the upgrades. I like the various upgrades I can add to my multi-tool for greater combat efficiency with the Mining Beam and especially the variety of ways I can alter the speed or impact or field of damage with the Bolt Caster. Dual Universe will have a "lock and fire" system. I haven't heard the devs discuss how we will aim to achieve that lock. They haven't mentioned tabbing through nearby enemies to lock a target. These days, many people prefer action combat aiming like that in NWO or even Wildstar over tab-targeting.

I don't understand the obsession with money. The devs should not be enforcing some capitalist world view on everyone. Some orgs may want to incentivize membership with money - other orgs may be hippie communes that don't care about money. Costs should not be "imposed" on orgs. Guild mebership as a form of covert ops isn't a concern for me. I'm not planning on having secrets that could be hindered by that form of covert ops. Plus, I expect a lot of out-of-game communication that couldn't be managed by in-game mechanics.

I play with people I like and people who have a similar playstyle. For me, Bartle score and D&D alignment are critical assessments. I couldn't care less about money or "quests". Size doesn't matter. The BCO and PSO concepts have no value for me.

Well, I found the action combat of Neverwinter Online to be a lot of fun. Action combat but not at the level of an FPS. It's somewhere in the middle. Dual Universe is an RPG that has a skill tree. There's no point in having an RPG skill tree if character combat skills are trumped by player twitch skills. Dual Universe isn't an FPS.

News is great if you want to do news. I might end up doing some "news" on my YouTube channel similar to Extreme Awesome. I think FrigoPorco was doing news for a whiile. I'm sure there's room for multiple news sources - each will likely have a different focus or spin.

Kickstarter isn't always about the actual funds acquired during the Kickstarter. Those funds -almost no matter what could be reasonably pledged in one month- will only be a drop in the bucket for an MMO. A successful Kickstarter can be a PR tool that shows private backers that there is enough public interest to warrant investment. One thing I really loved about Revival development was their use of Stages of development rather than Alpha and Beta. Alpha and Beta are really obsolete terms. I'm pretty sure NovaQuark is using Agile development and no longer have true Alpha and Beta - they're just still using obsolete terms. Staged development is really the better model for what JC described: Alpha/Stage 1 - Beta/Stage 2 - Launch/Stage 3 - Expansion 1/Stage 4, etc Then it's easier to discuss what is planned for each stage and when. And we will have a clearer view that this is ongoing development rather than "Launch" being a finished product. Each Stage will allow more people in but, while Stage 3 is open access with a sub... it's still just one stage in an ongoing development that will probably include ship-to-ship combat in Stage 4 or Stage 5.

1: Kiklix left because he felt compelled to defend the reputation of COPS against people who thought having "pirates" inherently meant that the org was comprised of griefers. Post like the one started by OutlandishRep drove him nuts. 2: Robin of Locksley fought against a tyrant - the Rebels of Star Wars fought against the Empire. That sounds like the type of Alliance vs Alliance wars ChipPatton mentioned. If there is some form of elite Alliance using DAC to hire mercenaries and you're against them, why not just form a rebel band who bands together simply because they hate the tyrannical misuse of DAC? Kiklix didn't form COPS to fight against anyone - he just formed an org that would act as a loose band of lone wolves who might group together for a common goal - when/if a common goal presented itself. Btw, the tyrant that Robin Hood fought against was Lawful. Robin Hood was Chaotic. That was Chaotic Good vs Lawful Evil. (Or, sometimes Neutral Good vs Lawful Evil.) 3: Yes. Seems to me that people can also barter or give surplus away for free or use other forms of diplomacy. Seems to me there will be a variety of ways to acquire allies and items.

Ideas are not necessarily perceived as neutral by gamers who view everything through a filter of competition and "advantage". People with different playstyles often view the same mechanic very differently.

The less wealthy won't necessarily have to "farm first" in the manner you seemingly suggest. People with time rather than money could very well have surplus. In Landmark, many of us were giving away resources and equipment for free to newbies because we had tons of surplus. Seems to me that if you add pirating to that (or rebellion smuggling), it might not be as much of an issue as the OP thinks. I agree it could be a game changer - I just think it's too soon for us to assume it will be like Eve or other non-voxel games.

Let me know if you think this is a derail and I'll start a new thread, but... I joined COPS because I know Kiklix from Landmark. he's a fantastic voxelmancer who specializes in building spaceships and I'm interested sharing the resources I've harvested with him for free to help with his projects. I'm and explorer. I often explore solo. And I'm Chaotic. So, I loved the concept of a loose band of rogue "pirates" who sometimes group together to achieve common goals - not because of the demands of strict rules, but because we want to. I view COPS as a sci-fi version of Robin Hood and his Merry Men. I hope Band of Outlaws will be the same now that COPS has been disbanded due to forum drama. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- I'm wondering why we'd have to hire allies. I don't think Robin Hood had to hire his Merry Men. I don't think the Rebels in Star Wars had to be hired. And, I guess I am wondering about looting defeated ships for tech and fuel and looting defeated opponents for implants (maybe we can loot implants and other treasure stored in ship inventory?) In DU, is in-game money the only way to obtain implants, etc? I mean, we can build our own ships and harvest our own resources for the materials, so will replacing ships be the same kind of issue it is in Eve? In a voxel game, does Pay2Win mean the same thing as it does for a non-voxel game like Eve?

@Cornflakes Yep. I agree with what you wrote.

my 2 cents If you post something on the forums, expect opposing views to be shared. That's what the forums are for. If Nyzaltar felt this discussion should be handled via PMs, he would have stated that and locked this thread. When Nyzaltar feels the opposing responses have turned into detrimental flaming, he will give warnings and lock the thread. Perhaps he has already deleted offensive threads, so I'm missing the problem. But, I haven't seen any flaming in the quoted posts. Strong opinions should be fine. That's what the forums are for. We can try to be helpful by reminding people about tone when an obvious line has been crossed, but really... Let Nyzaltar handle it is the best solution, there - that's his job.

(Again - definitions drift. Tab-targeting is now what you call tab-cycling. Doesn't matter what the meaning might have been in the 80s. The devs consistently say "lock and fire".)

My expectation is that Alpha and Beta organizations will come up with aesthetic guidelines that will be prepared for the starting city. Some of that will be governed by the aesthetics of the dev-designed Elements affixed to the buildings. We will be able to give permissions for other players to deconstruct what we build, but it's not automatic. No. Not in the safe zone around the Ark. Outside of the safe zone, players could probably blast your buildings to bits.

I'm telling you that players will not be able cover enough of the 525 KM volume for this to be a problem. Because there are no tunnels or bottlenecks. And we can fly in any direction above ground to safely leave the safe zone.

haha But, I don't see how anyone can camp the safe zone perimeter. We'll be leaving our personal territories by ship. It's not really possible to camp the entire 2K bubble. There is no tunnel.

I think what continues to be demonstrated is that the devs have not used the term tab-target. The devs refer to lock and fire. "Lock and fire" does not inherently mean "tab-target". I don't think the origin of the meaning for tab-target is as pertinent as current common usage. Especially for an MMO. I prefer to use the terms the devs use. But, the OP can draw his own conclusions from the perspectives we've shared.

http://www.gamespot.com/forums/pc-mac-linux-society-1000004/mmo-combatmanual-action-vs-tab-targeting-29390792/ Tab Targeting: Typically called such because you can use the tab key to cycle through the available targets to lock on, click or hotkey your skill and it magically affects the target you selected, no aiming required... all you typically need to do is be facing in that general direction. These games typically feature a HUGE assortment of skills/abilities for you to choose from for your combat needs. Pretty much every old school MMORPG used this as well as later ones such as WoW, Rift, SWOTR, and pretty much any other one pre-Tera you can think of. http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/938738-guild-wars-2/63800380 What is the problem with tab targeting exactly? it is simply pressing a button to toggle through targets. http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1322649-Tab-Targeting-popularity-skill-and-the-future-of-MMO-combat-systems Out of the other big fighting games, The Old Republic kept tab targeting as did Rift, and Guild Wars 2 has a sort of hybrid system wher you tab target your enemy and don't have to aim abilities... https://eu.portal.sf.my.com/comments/5592fd05ac72e41b4e430531?page=17 TAB target destroys any reason at all to usee other forms of targeting. It ensures that you will always shoot at what you want. Why actively aim when you may miss when you can just tab to them and always fire at them? it cuts out a large portion of what makes action combat desirable in MMOs. https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/3341/recent-feature-or-mechanic/view/page/2 Tab targeting (automatically aiming your attacks at an enemy) http://massivelyop.com/2016/02/14/mmo-mechanics-eight-annoying-mmorpg-mechanics-that-grind-my-gears/ 1: Tab targeting This one made it to the top of my fiancé’s list, and I can’t say I disagree: Although I do appreciate hybrid systems that employ tab targeting to a smaller degree, I don’t think I’ve often found such a bland, just-because mechanic as tab targeting. There’s nothing intuitive or imaginative about tab targeting, and I’m kind of glad that more exciting action combat mechanics are now in vogue. I feel as though action combat is more immersive, and I understand the geography and the nature of enemies much better when I am required to navigate fluidly around them to avoid hits and take aim. The popularity of tab targeting might be dwindling, but it’s still common enough to have made our list. http://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/16283909065 This is the main problem with tab target. Sometimes you have to tab four or five times to get to the mob right next to the one you were just hitting and sometimes the mobs you tab to aren't even on your screen yet.

Around mark 7:45 of the Kickstarter vid, Jean-Christophe says, "...combat will be a lock and fire approach..." "The ship battle system will be a lock and fire system, as well." It could be a translation issue, where they are translating the French term for tab-target as lock and fire when they speak English.. But, for me tab-targeting is using the tab key (or some other key) to cycle through nearby targets rather than some form of manual aim. For instance, in NMS, there seems to be a lock assist. I don't have to be precise about my aim to lock onto a target, but I do have to move the reticle reasonably close by. With tab-target, the enemy could be behind me. I don't have to aim at all. I just hit the tab key and cycle through whatever is near me. If you know of a different moment where the devs mention tab-targeting specifically, please share.

Lock and fire does not necessarily mean that you cycle through nearby targets in a manner similar to tab-targeting. @Falstaf I'll double-check the Kickstarter vid. Thanks!

I get harassed considerably more in games that allow PvP combat than I do in real life. Because unlike in real life, people who enjoy PvP combat tend to hold the belief that it's OK to attack other anywhere that the game mechanics make PvP possible. Lots of people use games as an opportunity to be cruel to other people - because it's not real life. DU will have safe zones and areas that can be turned into safe zones. A major focus for me will be maintaining the tech that activates safe zone bubbles. In addition to limiting your endeavors to safe zones, you could try to be a hermit and adventure far away from the beaten paths. I think you'll have to wait to hear feedback from players during pre-launch gameplay to get a feel for how disruptive PvP combat might be for your enjoyment.

It would be very strange to have ships than can leave a planet and travel seamlessly to any world in the universe that fuel and time would allow, but have people barred from leaving ships while in space. The specific questions seem to be: Will players have provisions for space-walking, running on the outside of ships and/or have some form of jet pack to maneuver in space if jettisoned off a ship while in space? Will we have to manage oxygen in-take while space-walking? How will the survival aspects of DU impact space-walking? (Also has me wondering about distress calls to help find people stranded in space. Can we craft one-person spacecrafts in space the same as we could on a planet if we have the necessary materials in our inventory?)

Yep. Thanks for the link. I'm not completely ruling out tab-targeting. It seems common for people to assume targeted combat inherently means tab-targeting. I've never seen the devs state tab-targeting, so I'm anticipating that the devs may have some other form of targeted combat in mind. I'm trying to keep my eyes peeled for the devs to mention tab-targeting, specifically.

I've seen the devs say combat will be targeted. Do you have a quote that states it will be tab-targeting, specifically?